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2016 Postmortem

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Algernon Moncrieff

(5,790 posts)
Tue Feb 23, 2016, 02:43 AM Feb 2016

So, DUers - What are we doing here in GD:P, and why are we doing it? [View all]

My question to all of us - at this point, what are we doing?

Earlier tonight, I conducted a highly unscientific survey of DUers, and in results that should surprise no one, over 95% of us have pretty well made up our mind on who we are voting for. So whenever we post about how great Hillary or Bernie is, we are officially just preaching to our respective choirs. True-to-DU-form, we make post after post after post about: how third-way Hillary is; Hilary's IWR vote; Bernie's love of the gun lobby; I - VT or D- VT. And I'm as guilty as any of us -- my intent is not to claim to be holier-than -thou here. But we are spending much energy pointing fingers and name calling against one another while ignoring our broad areas of agreement -- about women's rights; about the need to improve the ACA/move toward single payer; about keeping the next three SCOTUS judges from being clones of Sam Alito; about sane immigration policy; about some sense of racial justice in this country.

Another poster (Cali, I think) made a post basically saying (and I'm oversimplifying and paraphrasing) Hillary and Bernie supporters aren't speaking the same language. They just aren't interested in the same things. In a broad sense, I'd agree with that. We tend (again -- making a simplistic generalization) to have differing views on what we want in a President and from the party.

There's nothing wrong with enthusiasm for a candidate. Go Bernie! Go Hillary! However, However, it's pretty clear that both sides are getting on one another's nerves. I'm not a Sanders supporter, but I imagine Bernie supporters are tired of being told their candidate's chances are slim and his supporters are delusional. I am certain that Hillary supporters are really sick of hearing that our candidate is little-better than Ted Cruz.

So, if we've all made up our minds, fine. If we're all going to gloat and vent about primary and caucus results - fine. Here's where I'm coming from: in 2008, Hillary v. Barack got pretty acrimonious; however, we all agreed that the Bush policies had to end. We all got behind President Obama, and he won. It has not been a perfect Presidency, but it's been pretty good, especially considering the congressional headwinds and the mess he inherited in January 2009. I'm probably being overly pessimistic, but I just don' see that now. I see two sides that are pretty embittered with one another.

So I have no idea how the rest off the primaries play out. Will we pretty much know by Super Tuesday? Will this go until June? Whatever it is, I'd like to ask these questions:

If we can't come together on who should be President, can we set aside our differences to get Dems elected to the House and Senate?
Can we at least try to agree that either Clinton or Sanders would be an improvement over Rubio, Cruz, or Trump?
Can we be honest enough with ourselves to admit that both of our candidates, Bernie and Hillary, have some imperfections, drawbacks, and flaws?

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Judging by your OP, I guess "we're" posting meta and calling out other DUers? merrily Feb 2016 #1
We're being hard on one another. Some of it is worthwhile discussion. Some of it is just ugly. Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #14
While I strongly agree with the OP ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #56
That makes too much sense to go over well here. Thanks for the thoughtful OP though . . . brush Feb 2016 #2
Thanks for reading it! Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #8
This is a revolution RobertEarl Feb 2016 #3
Well, if Bernie is elected, hopefully he'll ship me to a FEMA camp in Vermont Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #4
We have taken note of your requests RobertEarl Feb 2016 #11
LOL! FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #5
Whether we want to be assimilated or not? 72DejaVu Feb 2016 #34
And revolutions tend to shoot dead those that don't get behind it Blue_Adept Feb 2016 #41
Destroying the party, mostly. Happens every open primary. Recursion Feb 2016 #6
I remember '08; I remember the Lounge Wars; I remember the '09 Purge Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #10
I do. This is probably worse than '08. I came here in '06, so I missed 2004 Recursion Feb 2016 #12
I was someone else before I was Algernon Moncrieff (it's all legal) Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #17
2008 was a lot worse than 2004 LisaM Feb 2016 #29
2008 was a lot worse than 2004 LisaM Feb 2016 #30
And 2020/2024 will be even worse nxylas Feb 2016 #32
I'm hoping perhaps America Fererra vs. Donnie Wahlberg Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #37
Or Martin Shkreli (sp?) vs Tim Kaine nxylas Feb 2016 #42
For the most part, it is the same people over and over again who are causing all the drama. demmiblue Feb 2016 #38
That really was a bad time at DU, as well as for the party generally. Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #51
Yes, yes and yes... Rebkeh Feb 2016 #7
That sums it up nicely - We probably should take it down a notch Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #9
The discourse is part of the process, Rebkeh Feb 2016 #19
For anyone who hasn't quite figured it out yet .. Fumesucker Feb 2016 #13
This is "being hit on the head lessons" Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #15
Or fish slapping. CentralMass Feb 2016 #28
They fight. They bite lovemydog Feb 2016 #18
Perfect! 7wo7rees Feb 2016 #31
Yeah, I like your reasonable posts. lovemydog Feb 2016 #16
Thanks. I'm not always reasonable. Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #21
Yeah, go Tammy Duckworth! lovemydog Feb 2016 #23
No, that is not a fair description of Sanders supporters. TTUBatfan2008 Feb 2016 #53
Thanks. I appreciate your response. lovemydog Feb 2016 #61
Sorry Algernon Moncrieff, but there are *contradictions* between the candidates. delrem Feb 2016 #20
Bill Clinton got in trouble for comparing Sanders supporters to the Tea Party Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #22
You make no sense to me. So sorry, I'm leaving this thread. nt delrem Feb 2016 #25
Generally speaking, Hillary stands for more wars, fracking, the TPP, increased H-1B visas, djean111 Feb 2016 #33
Discussion is only useful if there is someone to convince or persuade Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #36
That's a good observation - but your dismissal of Bernie and Hillary as being pretty much the same djean111 Feb 2016 #39
Clinton's camp is on a belittling marathon, but somehow Sanders supperters have to be the first Betty Karlson Feb 2016 #24
Yes. It's plain as the nose on your face. delrem Feb 2016 #26
Damn fine question! 7wo7rees Feb 2016 #27
I'm here for the lolz nt firebrand80 Feb 2016 #35
DU performance art featuring the Lord of the Flies. nt hack89 Feb 2016 #40
This is a non-productive food fight. Nothing more, nothing less. Agschmid Feb 2016 #43
As long as we all realize that. Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #47
Excellent post Dem2 Feb 2016 #44
Problem is ---we are still continuing the Bush policies, even worse. kgnu_fan Feb 2016 #45
Here, we can argue. JustABozoOnThisBus Feb 2016 #46
I think you'll win the pool. Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #49
There's also the most important use of an Internet discussion board in a functioning democracy: Orsino Feb 2016 #48
Like fourth grade, but without references to "your mama" Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #50
I come here for information, not to persuade other DUers. Waiting For Everyman Feb 2016 #52
Answers EdwardBernays Feb 2016 #54
Answering the question of what are we doing here artislife Feb 2016 #55
There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge. Bertrand Russell Tierra_y_Libertad Feb 2016 #57
With regard to this ... NurseJackie Feb 2016 #58
I confess I only come here to read when there are big current events meadowlark5 Feb 2016 #59
Oh I agree so, so much... N_E_1 for Tennis Feb 2016 #60
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