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Catherina

(35,568 posts)
67. I understand what prompts your concern but she can't control the timing, it's not a choice
Thu Aug 22, 2013, 02:12 PM
Aug 2013

I'm grateful for Chelsea that it's 2013 and not 1983 when my cousin killed himself during his transition because society was so vicious at the time.

I understand your concerns which I think come more from a fear she'll be attacked but every day she puts this off is intense psychological torture with a high risk of depression and a higher risk of suicide. The timing is only *bad* because it makes her more vulnerable to abuse in a homophobic military environment but where it's *good* is IF they allow her hormone therapy, it will help her be non-depressive and stay balanced.

If Chelsea were in a Federal Prison, she'd be better off because DOJ finally got around to writing some vague legislation for the Prison Rape Elimination Act of Congress passed 10 years ago. It vaguely states that, in order to eliminate prison rape, prison officials need to evaluate each transgender prisoner on a case by case basis and house them appropriately (to reduce prison rape). Their anatomy, pre or post op, and where they are in the transition have nothing to do with it, just their vulnerability to abuse and where they'd be safest. Unfortunately, this act doesn't extend to military prisons.

There's already a very determined and dedicated network in place to push the archaic military prison system for her.

The military has already flat out stated they won't accommodate this, much less hormone therapy and surgery, but they'll provide psychological and psychiatric counseling.

Thankfully her attorney, the LGBTQ network that has been supporting her since the beginning and the ACLU are on it.


Here is what the ACLU had to say this morning. It's only a brief statement for now but expect more.

ACLU statement on Chelsea Manning
Submitted by sosadmin on Thu, 08/22/2013 - 12:33

The following can be attributed to Chase Strangio, staff attorney with the ACLU's Lesbian Gay Bisexual and Transgender Project:

In response to Chelsea Manning's disclosure that she is female, has been diagnosed with gender dysphoria, and will be seeking hormone therapy as a part of her transition during her incarceration, public statements by military officials that the Army does not provide hormone therapy to treat gender dysphoria raise serious constitutional concerns. Gender dysphoria is a serious medical condition in which a person's gender identify does not correspond to his or her assigned sex at birth, and hormone therapy is part of the accepted standards of care for this condition. Without the necessary treatment, gender dysphoria can cause severe psychological distress, including anxiety and suicide. When the government holds individuals in its custody, it must provide them with medically necessary care.

The official policy of the Federal Bureau of Prisons and most state agencies is to provide medically necessary care for the treatment of gender dysphoria, and courts have consistently found that denying such care to prisoners based on blanket exclusions violates the Eighth Amendment of the Constitution.

http://www.privacysos.org/node/1157


The ACLU, her attorney and her LGBTQ network are already gearing up for a fight because gender reassignment surgery is now available to transgender inmates who did not begin treatment prior to entering federal custody (<<the link is to the prison memo).


Gender reassignment surgery, along with hormones and specialized mental health counseling is now available to transgender inmates who did not begin treatment prior to entering federal custody, The Associated Press reports.

The decision is based on new rules adopted by the U.S. Bureau of Prisons as part of a court settlement for inmate Vanessa Adams, formerly Nicholas Adams, who was diagnosed with gender identity disorder in 2005, and, after being denied treatment, tried to castrate herself with a razor and attempted to and ultimately succeeded in amputating her penis.

A May 31 memo issued to wardens at the nation's 116 federal prisons and made public by gay rights groups states: "current, accepted standards of care" will be applied to inmates who believe they are the wrong gender.

Under the bureau's previous policy, issued in 2005, only federal inmates with a preexisting diagnosis were eligible for transgender-related care, which was limited to treatments that would maintain them "only at the level of change which existed when they were incarcerated."

"The (new) treatment plan may include elements or services that were, or were not, provided prior to incarceration, including, but not limited to: those elements of real life experience consistent with the prison environment, hormone therapy and counseling," the memo from bureau medical director Newton Kendig states.

http://www.thirdage.com/news/surgery-while-in-prison-now-an-option-for-transgender-inmates_10-04-2011


Here's a press release from GLAD about the Sept 2011 policy change.

". . . the pursuit of happiness." another_liberal Aug 2013 #1
I thought this was from the Onion. TheCowsCameHome Aug 2013 #2
That was my first thought as well. nt avebury Aug 2013 #10
I was really hoping it was NoMoreWarNow Aug 2013 #11
While I support her decision on this Hayabusa Aug 2013 #15
Agreed. Sadly. Myrina Aug 2013 #20
Yep, agree so much, the timing is really bad. n/t RKP5637 Aug 2013 #29
It is clear that Manning has been on the end of some very poor advice. grantcart Aug 2013 #39
SHE & HER are the proper pronouns when talking about a woman. I am sure you know that. idwiyo Aug 2013 #134
good catch thanks for bringing it to my attention. grantcart Aug 2013 #152
Not New 4Q2u2 Aug 2013 #42
I understand what prompts your concern but she can't control the timing, it's not a choice Catherina Aug 2013 #67
It's not as though it was a secret. And the proper pronoun to use is she. Luminous Animal Aug 2013 #71
Will Manning be in a women's prison? ... Wernothelpless Aug 2013 #3
I'm pretty sure Manning's "transition" will have to wait until parole Blue_Tires Aug 2013 #6
HER transition. Please, edit your post. idwiyo Aug 2013 #122
No, unless he gets to post-op davidn3600 Aug 2013 #7
But who pays for medical care? djg21 Aug 2013 #55
we the taxpayers pay for everything our Gov does or contacts for. Including heathcare, therapy, Sunlei Aug 2013 #66
"Hormone treatment is a part of the therapy and Manning has a right to it." Not according to the cstanleytech Aug 2013 #95
not the surgery, the medication. The military can't discriminate anymore. Sunlei Aug 2013 #103
Considering he is male atm though they will probably cstanleytech Aug 2013 #109
She is a female, not male. Below is a link to the article from WHO with some basic info. idwiyo Aug 2013 #126
Far as the military is concerned he is a he, what "he" does after he serves his sentence cstanleytech Aug 2013 #135
What military believes has nothing to do with how one should address Chelsea. She is a woman, idwiyo Aug 2013 #137
I am explaining what I believe the military is probably going to do idwiyo cstanleytech Aug 2013 #145
Sorry if I misunderstood you. idwiyo Aug 2013 #146
That changed just last year in Federal Prisons Catherina Aug 2013 #74
SHE is a proper pronoun to use when one talks about a woman. Unless one is a transphobic bigot. idwiyo Aug 2013 #124
I work as a nurse in a county jail not far from Leavenworth Kansas Seedersandleechers Aug 2013 #52
The US Disciplinary Barracks (where Manning is going) is for male prisoners only jmowreader Aug 2013 #106
A mixed-up young man tabasco Aug 2013 #4
Bullshit. n/t loudsue Aug 2013 #5
Thank-you! robinlynne Aug 2013 #32
Message auto-removed Name removed Aug 2013 #35
So he should have kept quiet and let the war criminals continue their fun and games unimpeded? RC Aug 2013 #8
Oh well, I better change my opinion based on what the mob wants! tabasco Aug 2013 #46
Or expose domestic law breakers in our government. RC Aug 2013 #47
And which lawbreakers are those? Surely you don't mean our president. Pterodactyl Aug 2013 #130
Do war crimes count, or not? RC Aug 2013 #136
I like how you called him "the Obama". Pterodactyl Aug 2013 #147
That was a typo I didn't catch, from rewording the sentence. RC Aug 2013 #163
why would you do that? you don't change your opinion to what he says about his gender CreekDog Aug 2013 #144
Bad decisions??? .... truth2power Aug 2013 #9
The choice of name seems like a bad decision to me customerserviceguy Aug 2013 #157
unlike the soldiers in the Apache helicopter Enrique Aug 2013 #13
WikiLeaks Reveals That Military Contractors Have Not Lost Their Taste For Child Prostitutes Ash_F Aug 2013 #30
Thank you for posting this. idwiyo Aug 2013 #127
Bullshit Luminous Animal Aug 2013 #34
But if he had gone to Iraq and strafed a bunch of children from an Apache Downtown Hound Aug 2013 #40
And that's a very biased account of the situation. nomorenomore08 Aug 2013 #82
What do you mean by "mixed up"? morningfog Aug 2013 #101
It's very likely that someone who was just sentenced to 35 years in prison tabasco Aug 2013 #114
You think stress causes gender identity? morningfog Aug 2013 #116
Try to keep up ... GeorgeGist Aug 2013 #117
Below is a link to info about Gender Identity Disorder. I hope you read it and apologise for your idwiyo Aug 2013 #128
I think you are the one who is mixed up Bjorn Against Aug 2013 #107
Did you see the poster predict a renouncement? morningfog Aug 2013 #123
I missed that, but wow. Just wow. Bjorn Against Aug 2013 #125
A bigot or ignorant? oberliner Aug 2013 #129
Someone who is ignorant can be taught and can learn. Jamastiene Aug 2013 #151
Projection? donheld Aug 2013 #149
Does any know if military prisons are required to provide gender reassignment treatment to mulsh Aug 2013 #12
According to the new reports this am and comments for her lawyer maddezmom Aug 2013 #16
No, they're not. dgibby Aug 2013 #17
Veterans Admin does provide HRT for retired sgsmith Aug 2013 #23
Manning is being dishonorably discharged. totodeinhere Aug 2013 #24
Good question. At the very least I suspect that there will be powerful forces totodeinhere Aug 2013 #18
Good for her. Ghost Dog Aug 2013 #14
I thought that picture of him they released at the trial was kind of cute. bemildred Aug 2013 #19
Manning is a straight female FreeState Aug 2013 #60
I know that. And I know I have to start calling her "her" too. bemildred Aug 2013 #63
:) It will be a transition for all of us FreeState Aug 2013 #65
I've worked with trans people before, twenty years ago. No problem. bemildred Aug 2013 #68
Interesting... the apologies, sexual reassignment/hormone therapy, many things to discredit Manning salib Aug 2013 #21
Yes. Also, by changing genders, he is threatening to undercut closeupready Aug 2013 #26
Why would he want to name himself after a football club ? dipsydoodle Aug 2013 #22
'cause Mourinho's back? n/t VWolf Aug 2013 #45
Great answer dipsydoodle Aug 2013 #72
Because "Young Boys" isn't quite applicable anymore... Blue_Tires Aug 2013 #162
What is this, Mayberry RFD? closeupready Aug 2013 #25
I wish Manning well and Whisp Aug 2013 #27
Ive seen more bad taste here on DU now than anything from Fox 7962 Aug 2013 #161
And who's paying for this procedure? SummerSnow Aug 2013 #28
What is your point? enlightenment Aug 2013 #31
Yeah, I'd like to know, too theHandpuppet Aug 2013 #36
Hopefully, if his lawyer is successful the US gov't maddezmom Aug 2013 #37
I am. Why should the tax payers pick up the tab? Bacchus4.0 Aug 2013 #38
Hmmm, I don't believe it is a choice any more than being gay is a choice maddezmom Aug 2013 #41
Gay people aren't medically treated for being gay Bacchus4.0 Aug 2013 #43
It is not a choice was my point maddezmom Aug 2013 #44
and my point is if that is who he is then that is who he is Bacchus4.0 Aug 2013 #48
Your disgusting transphobic comments really need to stop now. enlightenment Aug 2013 #54
oh please, get lost Bacchus4.0 Aug 2013 #56
Bull. enlightenment Aug 2013 #57
then since she is a female there is no reason to pursue medical treatment is there? Bacchus4.0 Aug 2013 #59
Bacchus is being purposefully offensive but he does have a point. n/t SylviaD Aug 2013 #69
Which would be what? enlightenment Aug 2013 #70
I was not being purposefully offensive, and I do not believe that reassignment surgery Bacchus4.0 Aug 2013 #89
We agree on the substance of your post, but I can't help thinking you are slyly baiting. n/t SylviaD Aug 2013 #105
Agreed, what if a busty woman born in a flat chested body, should the gov't pay for that? bamacrat Aug 2013 #92
agreed, a much better analogy Bacchus4.0 Aug 2013 #96
You honestly don't understand it at all, do you? enlightenment Aug 2013 #102
Bacchus and Bamacrat are basically correct in their point IMO, but they could use more tact. n/t SylviaD Aug 2013 #104
+1 FreeState Aug 2013 #62
A jury let it stand 2-4. Luminous Animal Aug 2013 #73
I alerted it. ForgoTheConsequence Aug 2013 #81
This isn't the first time I've seen it. Neoma Aug 2013 #86
Oh please get over your self-rightous name calling DontTreadOnMe Aug 2013 #153
Can you explain how posting on a anon. message board drives away supporters of LGBT rights?? maddezmom Aug 2013 #158
Sick. Please, forward your alert to Skinner. This is pure bigotry and should never be allowed on DU. idwiyo Aug 2013 #113
I clicked the TOS violation so presumably they will see it. Luminous Animal Aug 2013 #115
Not sure admins will see it if it was allowed to stand. If you have a look at the results of the idwiyo Aug 2013 #119
I wasn't the first to alert. I only received the summary of the results of the original alert Luminous Animal Aug 2013 #120
You are welcome. I hope admins will not let this bigoted BS slide. This is sick beyond beleif. idwiyo Aug 2013 #121
When people are incarcerated it is the moral and legal obligation of the totodeinhere Aug 2013 #88
May be true for civilian life, but not so for military life sgsmith Aug 2013 #90
The military should have no right to override morality. totodeinhere Aug 2013 #98
necessary care absolutely. But many inmates' health would benefit from being freed from prison Bacchus4.0 Aug 2013 #93
True, but not becoming a woman will not kill him. n/t bamacrat Aug 2013 #94
There is a higher threshold than that. Inmates should be given treatment deemed necessary totodeinhere Aug 2013 #97
Agreed, however there are more cases of necessary mental health interaction needed than his. bamacrat Aug 2013 #99
This post is disgusting in its naked bigotry against transgender man and women. Sick. idwiyo Aug 2013 #110
10 hours later. ForgoTheConsequence Aug 2013 #132
Because Fed. Courts have ruled denying treatment is torture. Evasporque Aug 2013 #80
Should taxpayers pick up the tab for breast removal? joshcryer Aug 2013 #143
I would rather my tax dollars go to help Chelsea than fly around the Presidents dogs Autumn Aug 2013 #53
Maybe this is a way to avoid the male persecution SCVDem Aug 2013 #33
He should have said he was gay to begin with. RebelOne Aug 2013 #50
Their gender identification questions have been public since Adrian Lamo. joshcryer Aug 2013 #141
Keeping an open mind polynomial Aug 2013 #49
Best wishes to her... Mike Nelson Aug 2013 #51
That one's on the president, not the system RZM Aug 2013 #118
How Will This Be Handled? gussmith Aug 2013 #58
Some of these responses are terribly sad. ForgoTheConsequence Aug 2013 #61
+1 n/t FreeState Aug 2013 #64
There is a depressing amount of ignorance being spewed today. Luminous Animal Aug 2013 #75
They will attack anyone or anything to defend this administration U4ikLefty Aug 2013 #85
+1 Catherina Aug 2013 #111
Can't believe the people thinking her gender identification is a bad thing. joshcryer Aug 2013 #140
I wish Manning the best! hrmjustin Aug 2013 #76
I wish her well, and I hope she doesn't have serve her whole sentence. ZombieHorde Aug 2013 #77
Same here. On all counts. n/t nomorenomore08 Aug 2013 #83
Manning really needs to start thinking about some deal-making. nt msanthrope Aug 2013 #78
Manning is not going to make any deals. joshcryer Aug 2013 #139
It ain't done 'til the grand jury sitting in the rocket docket says it's over. msanthrope Aug 2013 #164
Beautiful. jessie04 Aug 2013 #79
Good luck Chelsea. Neoma Aug 2013 #84
Okay............ Dyedinthewoolliberal Aug 2013 #87
This whole story gets weirder by the moment WhoWoodaKnew Aug 2013 #91
How is this story weird? Luminous Animal Aug 2013 #100
I agree. Pterodactyl Aug 2013 #131
Bad timing? When would be better? Nine Aug 2013 #108
Very well said. deurbano Aug 2013 #138
My best wishes to Chelsea. I would also like to apologise to all transgender man and women idwiyo Aug 2013 #112
I support Chelsea Harmony Blue Aug 2013 #133
Kudo's to Wikipedia for diligence on Chelsea Manning's Wikipedia page. joshcryer Aug 2013 #142
Help me out here. In what sense is Manning "a female"? Pterodactyl Aug 2013 #148
legally I don't think so. Niceguy1 Aug 2013 #150
DU is slipping over the edge... people are being called Transphobic for following the law DontTreadOnMe Aug 2013 #154
tell me about it. Niceguy1 Aug 2013 #155
Some of us think prisoners deserve Medical treatment maddezmom Aug 2013 #159
they broke him pretty well.. Alamuti Lotus Aug 2013 #156
What does this mean exactly? oberliner Aug 2013 #165
I'm happy for her that she has decided to do what is best for herself davidpdx Aug 2013 #160
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