A Florida mom put her 10-year-old in a timeout. Then came the gunshot, police say

[IronLionZion]

Source: Associated Press

Fifth-grader Ian Sevostjanov was getting ready for school Thursday morning when he got himself in trouble.

The 10-year-old boy was sent to a room by his mom, Olga Grusetskaja, 49, in the apartment where their family lives in Clearwater, Fla., authorities said. Grusetskaja was “addressing a behavioral issue,” according to police.

In the room, Ian found a gun, authorities said, which he used to fire a “lone shot” at himself.

First responders did “everything they could” to treat the boy, Clearwater Police Chief Dan Slaughter said at a news conference Thursday morning, but their lifesaving efforts were unsuccessful. Ian was pronounced dead at the scene.


Read more: http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a-florida-mom-put-her-10-year-old-in-a-timeout-then-came-the-gunshot-police-say/ar-BBxXBGW?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartanntp

---

We are only 6 days into 2017 and already a young child dies by his parent's gun. Florida Mom

the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence released a jarring PSA in October with a satirical message: “Guns don’t kill people, toddlers kill people.” It featured fictitious mug shots of children in diapers and onesies, cast as criminals who must be locked up — a way to make a point about gun safety.

“This PSA is satire,” Dan Gross, president of the Brady Campaign, told The Washington Post at the time. “But the public health crisis it calls attention to is anything but. Whether the trigger is pulled by a toddler, a convicted felon, domestic abuser or terrorist, we have a problem in America with guns too easily falling into the wrong hands. And that translates to hundreds of lives lost or changed forever every single day.”

The boys’ parents, Olga Grusetskaja and her husband, identified by the Times as Leonid Sevostjanov, were described as caring parents.

“They’re very protective of their kids,” Patricia Rudd, who knows the family, told ABC Action News. “Shocking, I cannot imagine what they’re going through right now.”

Watch the Trumpers blame this on immigration or some such nonsense, since it's obviously not the gun's fault. The gun didn't do it. The kid could have just as easily had the exact same result if he grabbed a kitchen knife, or a hammer, or an iron, or a hot tea kettle.

They always claim that liberals are sitting ducks for violent crime, but I think there is less child death is gun-free houses. Maybe if the GOP didn't ban the CDC from collecting data on gun deaths we could quantify and measure the problem.

[Cracklin Charlie]

1. GOP is killing us.

[iluvtennis]

9. Currect amundo. nt

[LanternWaste]

8. twenty dead six and seven year grade school students is merely a small price to pay

"There are always some casualties necessary to defend the right of Americans to own firearms..."

Yup, twenty dead six and seven year grade school students is merely a small price to pay so we may own a Bushmaster XM15-E2S rifle. No longer is it a problem... or even a concern. It is instead, reduced to merely a small price for our freedom to own stuff, if not theirs.

[demigoddess]

37. I agree with you. Some people pay for their right to have fun guns with the lives of

other people's children and that should not be allowed. I feel for those whose guns kill their own children but when it spreads to other people who wisely choose not to own guns, that is unforgivable. The old saying "your freedom ends at my nose" comes to mind.

[malchickiwick]

16. Did you forget a "sarcasm" indicator??

I hope so. I hate to think anybody, especially a DUer, actually believes such sentiments...

[Javaman]

41. exactly my same hope...

when we're all dead, the guns will have inherited the earth. As they rightly should.

[Hoyt]

3. How soon will the Gungeoneers appear to trivalize this by saying NRA safety training encourages

locking guns in a safe when not in use? They know darn well that lots of gunners don't do that, but we get to read that BS anyway.

[IronLionZion]

5. Locked guns are not much protection from bad guys

Very few bad guys with guns might politely wait while someone enters in the combination for the gun safe.

So it really depends on whose life matters. Are people prioritizing the threat of bad guys or kids?

[sarisataka]

14. 1.63 seconds

using a biometric gun safe. I consider that an acceptable compromise between safety and access.

[Hoyt]

18. Maybe you guys should support legislation that each gun purchase requires one of those.

Gun fanciers would go berserk, and you know it.

[sarisataka]

23. I do support such legislation

Maybe "you guys" should support such legislation rather than focusing on bans that would affect a far smaller number of fatal injuries. But that's not enough for the true believers, and you know it.

[sarisataka]

13. No need

for any "Gungeoneers" to trivialize this. In the eyes of gun controllers it is simply "thinning of the herd"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10141657464#post7

As for me, I subscribe to the "thin the herd" philosophy. The more gun owner's toddlers kill their parents and themselves, the fewer nuts of breeding age are left and the higher the average IQ of the nation will rise.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=1649445

[Hoyt]

17. Come on, you know many trivalize these tragedies, trying to blame it on gun owners who

should have known better and none of the truly "responsible" gun owners would have a gun lying around. Yet, they carry guns everywhere they go, have them by their bed, etc. Heck I think some of them keep one in the shower and hidden under the toilet because they are just convinced someone is going to break in their house intent on tying them up, butchering them and raping their wives and children. But, they'll still sit here and post about how the gun owners whose children get shot really shouldn't be considered as included within the "responsible" gun owner group. It's funny at times.

[sarisataka]

21. Failing to properly secure a firearm

is pretty much the definition of irresponsible.

[Hoyt]

24. And lots of people who consider themselves responsible don't secure their lethal weapons, preferring

to have them nearby in the unlikely event they actually need it.

[sarisataka]

27. And lot's believe otherwise

self perception is a tricky thing.

You may have noticed a discussion here a couple days ago about one state's proposal to reduce DUI BAC from .08 to .05. Many people were upset by this "nanny state" action even if they do not live there. They maintain they are perfectly safe drivers and don't need such laws threatening their ability to drink and drive.

So to create parallel questions, is a gun owner a "responsible" owner if they fail to secure their firearms; is a person a "safe" driver if they are willing to operate a vehicle while somewhat impaired?

I would like to see safe storage laws and an allowable BAC of 0.00.

[DashOneBravo]

48. What sir

Did you think of the "thinning the herd " comment?

[sarisataka]

54. Sometimes silence

is the loudest answer of all

[DashOneBravo]

58. I'm certain

It was just a mistake.

[madokie]

52. Apparently this gun wasn't locked up

The people I know who lock up guns still keep a gun or two that is easy to get too

Argument is a gun is no good if its locked up, you'd be dead before you could get to it shit

68 YO 15 month in-country Vietnam and I own ZERO guns. A couple bb guns to keep my eye and to kill snakes with when they get too close to the house but otherwise no guns to be found here.

Cotton mouth moccasins is our kind of snakes mostly and they are an aggressive snake

[Hoyt]

53. My best friend is a Vietnam vet (Marines) and he can't stand guns.

[Drahthaardogs]

4. I don't understand why people keep loaded guns

I grew up on a ranch in the West and guns were kind of everywhere. We never had one loaded in the house. It is sooooo stupid to do this.

[cstanleytech]

15. Because depending on the type of gun it takes time to reload it probably

and people being people get tired in their opinion over having to waste time doing something like that.
In this case though the gun should have been put up and locked away as soon as whoever owns it woke up for the day or until they were ready to leave at which time it then should have been taken out and put in a safety holster for the rest of the day that should not leave them for a second.

[Drahthaardogs]

26. I can load any gun except a muzzleloader in under three seconds

Sorry but you are wrong. It's dangerous and stupid, especially if you have kids in the house

[cstanleytech]

39. "It's dangerous and stupid* Hey I am not disagreeing I am simply pointing out

the most likely reason for why people are so fucking stupid when it comes to leaving loaded weapons around where a kid can get ahold of them.

[hamsterjill]

40. This!

I grew up on a ranch in South Texas and as you indicate, guns were everywhere. But never loaded in the house. Never.

Never pointed at anyone or anything unless the plan was to fire to kill. Never. They were respected for the killing instruments that they are. Never a joke. Never sarcasm. Always the serious instrument that they are.

If you cannot load your gun in a reasonable amount of time, you are not proficient enough with your gun to have it. Especially if you have kids in the house.

[cstanleytech]

42. No disagreement there but unfortunately the Constitution wasnt

written to take into account that issue thus alot of idiots who should not have a gun have one.

[Akamai]

6. Since John Lennon's death by a gun, more than a million Americans have been killed by guns in

this country. Many, many more Americans have been killed in this country by guns than have been killed in all wars fought by this country.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/1-15-million-americans-have-been-killed-by-guns-since-john-lennons-death-20151208

The gun industry is waging war on the American people and that industry is winning! Meanwhile, 90% of Americans want common sense gun reforms such as background checks.

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2016/jan/05/laura-ingraham/laura-ingraham-say-claim-90-support-gun-background/

One of these days, this gun madness has to die in the US.

[cry baby]

10. Kind of a shitty thing to say about the death of a little kid. nt

[HAB911]

11. I'm an asshole............n/t

[malchickiwick]

19. True Dat.

Another herd in need of thinning?

[johnp3907]

28. Yep.

Straight to my "fool" ignore list with that one.

[Throd 2.0]

30. No, you're much more that that.

[HAB911]

35. Oh no, I've disappointed you?

Yes I am much much more than that. I like stating the facts not feelings.

Welcome to DU BTW.

[Throd 2.0]

43. Nah, you're a maverick who says edgy things.

Carry on.

[DashOneBravo]

46. What did you do in HQ company?

[CrispyQ]

12. This: "Maybe if the GOP didn't ban the CDC from collecting data on gun deaths..."

"...we could quantify and measure the problem."

I'm having difficulty with the fact that she put him alone in a room where there was a gun. I don't own guns, but I can't imagine having a gun in the house & not knowing every minute where it's at. Maybe you get casual about shit like that when you have them around all the time?

[sarisataka]

20. *sigh*

The CDC is NOT banned from collecting data on gun deaths-
Firearm Mortality by State
Deaths: Final Data for 2014 -firearms are mentioned 130 times with many data entries broken down by state, age, gender...

[IronLionZion]

22. Quietly, Congress extends a ban on CDC research on gun violence

http://www.pri.org/stories/2015-07-02/quietly-congress-extends-ban-cdc-research-gun-violence

“The original concern from the National Rifle Association back in 1996, which Dr. Rivara mentioned, made that very implication,” says Zwillich. “The NRA complained to Congress that the CDC was using the results of its research to essentially advocate for gun control. They called it propaganda. And back at that time, Congress slashed the CDC’s funding by the exact amount that was used for gun-related public health research.”

Rivara and his team discovered that having a gun in the home is associated with a threefold increase in the risk of a homicide — they released this information in a series of peer-reviewed articles that appeared in the New England Journal of Medicine. The CDC both funded Rivara’s original research and stood by the findings.

But after Congress seemingly retaliated against the CDC for publishing Rivara’s findings, Zwillich says researchers with the agency have shied away from conducting gun research.

[sarisataka]

25. The claim was that the CDC

was not allowed to collect data. Clearly that claim is false.

Isn't a report that studies the perpetrators of gun violence still a study of gun violence. IIRC the reason the 1990's reports were called out as propaganda was that they failed to consider any factors but the guns. The perpetrators of the violence were considered unimportant.

Properly a comprehensive report would consider both the perpetrators and legal/illegal access to firearms. The closest we have come to that is the PRIORITIES FOR RESEARCH TO REDUCE THE THREAT OF FIREARM-RELATED VIOLENCE ordered by President Obama in 2013. This report gets ignored by gun control advocates as it skewers some of gun control's most sacred cattle e.g. the effectiveness of armed self defense, frequency of defensive gun use, the "gun show loophole"... To be fair it also is quite critical of several NRA arguments such as concealed carry reducing crime.

[branford]

29. Feel free to cite the actual law *banning* all CDC research on firearms.

I'll wait. The CDC is largely barred from advocacy, and this is because of sloppy and extremely partisan work in the past. Complaints about the purported CDC research ban amount to little more than gun control advocates complaining that Republicans cut-off a former significant source of advocacy funds.

In any event, the CDC has indeed published gun violence research in recent years, and the CDC is hardly the only federal agency capable and willing to perform firearm-related research. In fact, the federal government collects significant amount of firearm data and engages in related research, mainly through the Department of Justice, specifically the Bureau of Justice Statistics, and my former employer where I personally engaged in such research, the National Institute of Justice.

The history and basis for the CDC funding restrictions and it and other federal agencies gun violence research is readily available with little more than a simple Google search. Repeating propaganda that fits a particular narrative, no matter how sincerely held, does not actually make it true.

"Priorities for Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence," The National Academies' Institute of Medicine and National Research Council, published in 2013"

https://www.nap.edu/read/18319/chapter/1#x


http://www.forbes.com/sites/paulhsieh/2016/06/22/why-i-dont-trust-government-backed-gun-violence-research/#2a8064c867a3

http://www.forbes.com/sites/larrybell/2013/02/12/why-the-centers-for-disease-control-should-not-receive-gun-research-funding/#232174dc2eb5

[SecularMotion]

34. Why the Dickey Amendment, a Potent GOP Weapon to Shut Down the Gun Debate, Must Go

Why the Dickey Amendment, a Potent GOP Weapon to Shut Down the Gun Debate, Must Go

Republicans, conservatives, and the National Rifle Association (NRA) have another weapon for shutting off debate even before it starts: the Dickey Amendment. In short, the Dickey Amendment, since its passage in 1996, cut off federal funds for research into guns, gun deaths, and gun safety. Even its eponymous sponsor, a mild-mannered former Republican congressman from Arkansas, Jay Dickey (pictured), regrets the abyss he helped create. The victims of gun deaths since 1996 and, especially, since the expiration of the Assault Weapons Ban certainly regret it. The only people that don’t seem to regret it are Republican members of the House and Senate and the leadership of the NRA. It’s time for the Dickey Amendment to go. And the only way to do that is to vote Republicans out of office.

http://www.towleroad.com/2016/06/dickey-amendment/

[sarisataka]

38. On this, we are in agreement n/t

[itcfish]

31. I had a Big Argument

with a co-worker yesterday. He said that it is his right to have the same arms the government has including assault weapons. I spoke about children dying and he said that is collateral damage and cannot infringe on his rights. I just could not take his nonsense anymore. I could have shot him myself. Good thing I did not have a weapon.

[Sancho]

32. It happens I live in Clearwater...and the carnage continues everyday.

People Control, Not Gun Control

This is my generic response to gun threads where people are shot and killed by the dumb or criminal possession of guns. For the record, I grew up in the South and on military bases. I was taught about firearms as a child, and I grew up hunting, was a member of the NRA, and I still own guns. In the 70’s, I dropped out of the NRA because they become more radical and less interested in safety and training. Some personal experiences where people I know were involved in shootings caused me to realize that anyone could obtain and posses a gun no matter how illogical it was for them to have a gun. Also, easy access to more powerful guns, guns in the hands of children, and guns that weren’t secured are out of control in our society. As such, here’s what I now think ought to be the requirements to possess a gun. I’m not debating the legal language, I just think it’s the reasonable way to stop the shootings. Notice, none of this restricts the type of guns sold. This is aimed at the people who shoot others, because it’s clear that they should never have had a gun.

1.) Anyone in possession of a gun (whether they own it or not) should have a regularly renewed license. If you want to call it a permit, certificate, or something else that's fine.
2.) To get a license, you should have a background check, and be examined by a professional for emotional and mental stability appropriate for gun possession. It might be appropriate to require that examination to be accompanied by references from family, friends, employers, etc. This check is not to subject you to a mental health diagnosis, just check on your superficial and apparent gun-worthyness.
3.) To get the license, you should be required to take a safety course and pass a test appropriate to the type of gun you want to use.
4.) To get a license, you should be over 21. Under 21, you could only use a gun under direct supervision of a licensed person and after obtaining a learner’s license. Your license might be restricted if you have children or criminals or other unsafe people living in your home. (If you want to argue 18 or 25 or some other age, fine. 21 makes sense to me.)
5.) If you possess a gun, you would have to carry a liability insurance policy specifically for gun ownership - and likely you would have to provide proof of appropriate storage, security, and whatever statistical reasons that emerge that would drive the costs and ability to get insurance.
6.) You could not purchase a gun or ammunition without a license, and purchases would have a waiting period.
7.) If you possess a gun without a license, you go to jail, the gun is impounded, and a judge will have to let you go (just like a DUI).
8.) No one should carry an unsecured gun (except in a locked case, unloaded) when outside of home. Guns should be secure when transporting to a shooting event without demonstrating a special need. Their license should indicate training and special carry circumstances beyond recreational shooting (security guard, etc.). If you are carrying your gun while under the influence of drugs or alcohol, you lose your gun and license.
9.) If you buy, sell, give away, or inherit a gun, your license information should be recorded.
10.) If you accidentally discharge your gun, commit a crime, get referred by a mental health professional, are served a restraining order, etc., you should lose your license and guns until reinstated by a serious relicensing process.

Most of you know that a license is no big deal. Besides a driver’s license you need a license to fish, operate a boat, or many other activities. I realize these differ by state, but that is not a reason to let anyone without a bit of sense pack a semiautomatic weapon in public, on the roads, and in schools. I think we need to make it much harder for some people to have guns.

[HAB911]

33. You're gonna piss off the barrel strokers..........n/t

[MindPilot]

36. Guns, gunz GGGUUUNNNNZZZZ!!

But not one word about exactly what the fuck is wrong in our society that makes a 10-year-old want to kill himself. That may be the larger issue.

[taught_me_patience]

44. This is why I refuse to have my kids be in a house with guns

It's awkward, but I ask other parents if there is a gun in the house. If so, my kid is not allowed there.

[raccoon]

49. Good for you! nt

[Initech]

45. Oh don't blame the guns! Never ever blame the guns!

Last edited Sat Jan 7, 2017, 05:18 PM - Edit history (1)

Guns are absolutely to blame here, and the parents who should have got rid of their guns didn't. There is no one else to blame for this. I can't say this enough - fuck guns, fuck gun nuts, and fuck the NRA.

[ManiacJoe]

55. You would have been so accurate without the sarcasm tag.

the parents who should have got rid of their guns didn't. There is no one else to blame for this.

[Initech]

56. Fixed it.

[Blue_Tires]

47. Actually, this isn't even the first of 2017

6-year-old girl killed by gun that 11-year-old cousin received for Christmas


A 6-year-old girl is dead after her 11-year-old cousin accidentally shot her with his new shotgun.

According to WBTW-TV, the incident occurred in Pinetown, North Carolina. The young girl was visiting her cousin’s home along with a 12-year-old girl.

The boy was showing the girls a gun he had just gotten for Christmas when it went off accidentally. First responders arrived on the scene shortly after and pronounced the young girl dead at the scene.

According to the Washington Daily News, the death has been ruled an accident by the Beaufort County Sheriff’s Office.

“He’s a good boy,” neighbor Kaliff Moore told CBS North Carolina. “But, phew, I just can’t imagine how the family is now. We just need prayers up there for them.”

The shots also injured a family dog, which was also treated for minor injuries.

http://www.kshb.com/news/national/11-year-old-boy-shoots-and-kills-6-year-old-cousin-with-gun-he-got-for-christmas

http://www.thewashingtondailynews.com/2017/01/03/6-year-old-dies-in-accidental-shooting/

[IronLionZion]

51. Doesn't look like this year is off to a good start

disappointing

[ileus]

50. On your person or locked up.

Safety first.

[ManiacJoe]

57. This.

There is no excuse for an unsecured firearm.