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Jim Lane

(11,175 posts)
42. You're both right.
Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:43 PM
Dec 2012

The answer to your true-or-false question is, AFAIK, "True."

What Yo_Mama wrote was: "SS current income from taxes is currently not covering outgo." That also is, AFAIK, true, even if you add in the transfer from the general fund that erases the impact of the payroll tax holiday.

As for the future, projections are always subject to some uncertainty, but I think there's no reasonable doubt about one fundamental point concerning the role of the Trust Fund: Barring a radical change in revenues or expenses, there will come a time within the next several years when current outgo exceeds all sources of revenue (revenue from payroll taxes plus interest payments from the Trust Fund plus any general-fund money transferred to make up for any future payroll tax holidays). That means that the Trust Fund will hit a peak size and will then start to decrease in size. This doesn't represent a problem; it's how the Trust Fund was designed to function, to enable the system to cope with the demographic bulge of the Baby Boom.

The question that's difficult to answer is whether the Trust Fund will be depleted down to zero before the system regains its year-to-year equilibrium (which occurs a few decades from now, when enough of us Baby Boomers have died off). That's where the different projections make a huge difference.

You're certainly right that there are reasons to question the pessimistic assumptions. Nevertheless, to me it makes sense to give those assumptions heavy weight in planning. If the weather forecast is for a 30% chance of rain, I stuff an umbrella into my backpack. That's one reason to favor raising or eliminating the cap on income subject to FICA taxation -- that step would improve the system's fiscal picture.

Of course, talk of Social Security going "bankrupt" is hype. There are Gen X'ers and Millennials who are convinced that they'll never see a dime of Social Security benefits, which is a completely wrong view. Even on the worst-case assumptions for the depletion of the Trust Fund, Social Security would still be able to pay about three-quarters of all benefits due under current law. Furthermore, I very strongly suspect that the political will would exist to fix the problem out of the general fund.

Social Security on Facebook [View all] ashling Dec 2012 OP
Beautiful Eddie Haskell Dec 2012 #1
I am not sure that the notes in the "SS trust fund" are adequate for 60 years Kolesar Dec 2012 #2
Actually, it's at least 75 years, as far out as has been reviewed MannyGoldstein Dec 2012 #3
Countries with "no population growth" are the ones in trouble Kolesar Dec 2012 #5
The entire planet is in trouble with any population growth. MH1 Dec 2012 #9
Zactly xtraxritical Dec 2012 #12
Thank God for you, Manny..... plethoro Dec 2012 #6
Bottom line here: D.C. doesn't want to pay back the trillions of dollars borrowed/embezzled savannah43 Dec 2012 #26
well now, Dyedinthewoolliberal Dec 2012 #51
I hope you are right, but I think the fix is in..........nft plethoro Dec 2012 #52
The language in the linked Facebook post is misleading. Jim Lane Dec 2012 #7
Really? So there is one standard for the USPO, but not for any other governmental savannah43 Dec 2012 #27
Yes, that's exactly right. Jim Lane Dec 2012 #43
The shortfalls were based on pessimistic projections and go clear back duffyduff Dec 2012 #8
Here is the Trustees report for 2012, which disputes your assertion Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #18
That report is from Timmy Geithner MannyGoldstein Dec 2012 #22
If We took all of Mitt Romney's Assets out of the equation PrMaine Dec 2012 #11
SS current income from taxes is currently not covering outgo Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #16
That little slight of hand goes right over the heads of many people. savannah43 Dec 2012 #31
Are you forgetting interest on the Treasury bonds purchase by the SS Trust Fund? nt MannyGoldstein Dec 2012 #35
No, I'm not Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #37
Sorry, I'm a bit tired tonight MannyGoldstein Dec 2012 #39
You're both right. Jim Lane Dec 2012 #42
Yes, that's correct, Manny Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #46
The problem is that there are no external financial assets in the trust fund Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #20
So, what you are saying is that US Government is about to default on one sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #25
No, I"m not saying we are about to default. We don't need to Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #36
But are you saying it's more OK to default on SS payments MannyGoldstein Dec 2012 #40
Depends on your perspective, I suppose Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #45
The US Govt has never and will never default on its obligation to any of its sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #48
US Gov has defaulted multiple times. In the modern era, with Liberty gold bonds Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #54
Lol, I've read all that before. And it's interesting how it neglects the actual sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #47
The bonds in which the trust fund is invested say "backed by the full faith and credit of the US" lumberjack_jeff Dec 2012 #29
You are wrong Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #38
The SS trust fund is part of the public debt. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2012 #41
Thank you. Amazing to see this garbage on DU, seriously. The decades old sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #49
Not a complete red herring. Look how BushCo used it. savannah43 Dec 2012 #32
But Ronnie Raygun needed the money to buy more bombs! WhoIsNumberNone Dec 2012 #4
As did, unfortunately... awoke_in_2003 Dec 2012 #10
Yeah, but Ronnie got the ball rolling WhoIsNumberNone Dec 2012 #13
Very true... awoke_in_2003 Dec 2012 #53
And they (Rethugs) laughed at Al Gore's Social Security Lock Box. n/t Fla Dem Dec 2012 #23
I forgot about that. Al? Write something about that, please? savannah43 Dec 2012 #33
The change was made around 1960 Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #15
History will not be nice to Ronnie. He cut taxes and then A Simple Game Dec 2012 #17
Incredibly inaccurate Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #14
Current SS trust fund receipts are $837,827 LastLiberal in PalmSprings Dec 2012 #19
SS will always be mostly funded by current income Yo_Mama Dec 2012 #21
You know Lordquinton Dec 2012 #28
You are not factoring in that this "fund" is earning interest Curmudgeoness Dec 2012 #34
How many more decades is this false narrative about SS going to persist? sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #50
Amen. The truth is out there! savannah43 Dec 2012 #24
This is worded badly. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2012 #30
the biggest problem social security faces is.... madrchsod Dec 2012 #44
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