General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDo you have any idea of how much DU's changed in the past year?
Last edited Wed Feb 12, 2014, 11:15 PM - Edit history (1)
March 2013: Quick 2016 Poll: Hillary or Elizabeth?
December, 2013: Hillary or Elizabeth?
My belief is that DU is simply the Democratic Party's vanguard: what happens here happens en masse in the party a year or two later. Witness, for example: Did you hear Crystal Ball's rant on the Cycle asking Hillary not to run?
The Third Way est morte. FDR Democrats, the future is ours: if we grab it, fast and tight.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)Absolutely DRENCHED in the stench of desperation.
Oilwellian
(12,647 posts)rug
(82,333 posts)She had just left it in March.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)BENGHAZI!!!!
Note to jurors: I'm joking. BENGHAZI!!!! is a fully-fake scandal.
aquart
(69,014 posts)We need to hold hearings about it.
And then they back away slowly. And very very quietly.
ut oh
(895 posts)Tourette's...
Any GOP'er: "So the other day...*BENGHAZI!*... I was talking to the barber... *BENGHAZI!*..."
hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)But as I sa7d before I hope their is a competitive primary. I like Brown of OH.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)a lot of money.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)liberal_at_heart
(12,081 posts)People are finally starting to talk about it. I think you're right in that we have to find a left leaning democrat to run quick before the centrist democrats put up a candidate who will promise to do something about income inequality when they really have no intention of doing anything about it.
aquart
(69,014 posts)So let's run and grab a lefty Dem because you have a barn and Jonesy can play the piano and Edna knows her way around a lightboard?
Were you trying to be funny and I missed the emoticon?
fadedrose
(10,044 posts)Clinton has all the key Dems lined up for her, and has skads of money, and as she stands, no Dem in his right mind would try to go up against her and her support groups.
Before any will try, there has to be a slippage in her poll ratings. Right now, she could beat any Rep, but after they're done with their ads, her ratings will fall. Someone behind the scenes has to be ready to step in and save the day...
We have a qualified, liberal, personable, and experienced pool to pick from, and Hillary may decide to step aside and help that candidate, maybe even be Vice President. Strange stuff happens all the time.
Demeter
(85,373 posts)Get real. She's damaged goods.
fadedrose
(10,044 posts)They are sick with expectation and nobody can go up against her for the nomination...The election, that's a different story. When the Reps settle down on one candidate who is not as insane as the others, and he gets the money, things will change. They are moving their convention up so this could happen..
No sloppy mistakes like that Romney private speech this time...they will be very careful.....
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)I remember a lot of them revealing that their true goal was just to make sure the black guy didn't get elected, when they declared themselves Pumas, screamed about the democratic party's "affirmative action nominee" and started pitching support for John McCain. Matter of fact i remember them making a big huge public break from DU to go run their own site, where they mostly bitched about us "leftists" and our "black ass-kissing."
I don't judge a candidate by their fan club, mind, but I find endorsements from such people to be very... unconvincing. And even if the pumas are a faded artifact of campaigns past, many of her current supporters are no less nasty in their own way.
boston bean
(36,221 posts)You really like the guy, no?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4485254
fadedrose
(10,044 posts)He may be gay, but I think he's sexy. Do ya think 75 is too old for this atttraction?
Be honest, Bean, you won't hurt my feelings.
ProSense
(116,464 posts)focus on policy.
Urges Congress to Refinance Student Loan Debt in Floor Speech
Video; Full Text
Washington, DC - In a floor speech this morning, United States Senator Elizabeth Warren joined Senators Dick Durbin (D-Ill.), Jack Reed (D-R.I.), and Kirsten Gillibrand (D-N.Y.) on the floor of the Senate to address college affordability. Senator Warren spoke about her plan to introduce legislation that would allow student borrowers to refinance their old, high-interest rate loans at the lower rates that are being offered to new student loan borrowers this year under the new Bipartisan Student Loan Certainty Act of 2013.
A graduate who took out an unsubsidized loan before July 1 of last year is locked into an interest rate of nearly 7 percent. Older loans run 8%, 9% and higher. "Refinancing those old loans would lower interest rates to 3.86% for undergraduate loans," Senator Warren said. "This is real money back in the pockets of people who invested in their education. Real money that will help young people find a little more financial stability as they work hard to build their futures. Real money that says that America invests in those who work to get an education."
The senator discussed how the government could pay for refinancing by closing tax loopholes for the wealthiest individuals and corporations. "Right now, this country essentially taxes students - by charging high interest rates that bring money into the government - while at the same time we give away far more money through a tax code riddled with loopholes and let the wealthiest individuals and corporations avoid paying a fair share," Senator Warren said. "We can close those loopholes and put the money directly into refinancing student loans."
"We can start with the Buffett Rule-a rule that would limit tax loopholes for the wealthy and ensure that billionaires pay at least as much as their secretaries. For every new dollar we bring in by stitching up this loophole, it can go directly to lowering the cost of student loans."
Senator Warren highlighted the $1.2 trillion in total national student loan debt that is burying graduates, preventing young people from buying homes and cars, and putting a drag on economic growth. "Tying students to a lifetime of financial servitude as a condition of getting an education does not reflect our values," she said. "These students didn't go to the mall and run up charges on a credit card. They worked hard and learned new skills that will benefit this country and help us build a stronger middle class and a stronger America. They deserve our support. They don't deserve to be buried in debt."
http://www.warren.senate.gov/?p=press_release&id=393
democratisphere
(17,235 posts)MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)democratisphere
(17,235 posts)Clinton trounces any democratic challengers in other national polls.
http://www.euronews.com/2014/01/30/new-2016-polling-hillary-clinton-sails-to-victory-chris-christie-dives/
http://www.masslive.com/politics/index.ssf/2014/01/2016_presidential_poll_hillary.html
http://www.cnn.com/2013/09/16/politics/2016-poll-deep-dive/
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)Turns out that feeding your name to the media has this sort of effect, but in the actual race, your results may vary.
Remember when Fred Thompson was the Republican headliner? Yeah.
democratisphere
(17,235 posts)Hillary has stronger appeal to some of those to the right of center and independents; democrats want her by HUGE margins! With the REAL POTENTIAL THREAT of RepubliCONS taking over the Senate and retaining the House, we absolutely must have a democratic president with a track record of working with the other side of the isle. Democrats can not afford to get this wrong.
JI7
(89,248 posts)on DU and who ended up on top in the actual results ?
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)It would be interesting.
JI7
(89,248 posts)MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Historic NY
(37,449 posts)really. Reality here sometimes doesn't match the real world.
Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)Perhaps talents could be put to better use going after Republicans and GOTV 2014...
Elections matter:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024490191
JI7
(89,248 posts)Scuba
(53,475 posts)840high
(17,196 posts)sowing division.
Capt. Obvious
(9,002 posts)the ones sowing division among Democrats.
L0oniX
(31,493 posts)Autumn
(45,066 posts)sowing division among Dems. It might bother you but since this is a discussion board, people do like to discuss stuff. It is not campaign season so no special rules are in place prohibiting the comparisons.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)Autumn
(45,066 posts)Bernie has said he might run. Just thinking about that gets me excited though.
totodeinhere
(13,058 posts)process and unless we have unanimous consensus on who that candidate should be then naturally there will be disagreements. I don't know any way around it. But I do agree that now should be the time to concentrate on the upcoming midterms which will be very important elections. There will be plenty of time to fight over our presidential nominee after that.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)That's way too easy and you should be suspicious. The Republicans are a bunch of clowns put up by the Powers To BE to make everyone feel good about voting for their corporate friendly Democrat. There is really no choice.
H. Clinton has already pocketed $400, 000 from Goldman-Sachs for having tea with them. Do you think she will reform Wall Street?
Elections dont matter if your choice is between a corporatist and a clown.
Response to rhett o rick (Reply #76)
Post removed
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)of goodness (as they define it) then why do they disparage others? I think it's a self-righteousness that comes from an authoritarian upbringing that did not encourage open-mindedness.
Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)"Why do they disparage others?" "Self-righteousness?"
Are you kidding? How do you post this kind of massive projection with a straight face??
Wow....what an utter lack of self awareness.
Stunning.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Enough of these divisive crap threads.
Progressive dog
(6,900 posts)11 Bravo
(23,926 posts)the convention. Once we had a nominee, the crapfest had to cease. Then, if we were fortunate enough to elect the Democratic candidate, the pile-on could begin anew.
Of course, the new jury system, coupled with the cult of personality some DUers (especially those with cute multiple usernames) have established, may prove me wrong in the long run.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)the elections.
Well, that's actually not true - only since 1992.
NAFTA, the repeal of Glass-Seagall... etc.
Enough!
JI7
(89,248 posts)interesting you use that date. but then again you also would rather overturn 2008 than 1980 election.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Corrected.
Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)Then the OP creates post after post trying to pit Dems against each other.
Really makes you hmmmm.....
JTFrog
(14,274 posts)Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)Never insults a Republican.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)people than Bill Clinton and Barack Obama ever did.
Capt. Obvious
(9,002 posts)Reagan would have been a one termer and Bushes never in the White House.
11 Bravo
(23,926 posts)If so, here's a clue for you. I left the Army in 1972 with a gut full of frag and Sergeant's stripes. Then I taught public school for over three decades, and am now a retired teacher who substitutes every day.
If I'm part of the 1% I wish someone would inform my fucking bank account.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)But as someone said on DU, I forget who: "If you're not part of the 1%, then why vote like one?"
That being said... thanks both for your service in combat, and in the military. (That was probably a bad joke). In all seriousness, those are probably the two endeavors most critical to our nation remaining a nation, and neither is appreciated nearly enough.
11 Bravo
(23,926 posts)I have to tell you, if the election was held again tomorrow, and I know everything that I know today, I would still vote for President Obama.
I have always thought that the "If you're not part of the 1% why do you vote like it" meme was aimed at poor and middle class (and mostly white) Southern and Midwestern voters who tend to vote Republican.
Maybe I'm wrong. Or maybe I'm just so fucking old, tired, and jaded that I've allowed pragmatism to rein in that fiery young radical that I used to be (honest!)
In any case, I enjoy your posts, and even when I disagree with you it's impossible to deny that you're thought provoking and funny.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)In 2008 with pleasure.
So I get your point.
But, dammit, let's take back the American Dream.
Regards,
Hastened Manny
Pretzel_Warrior
(8,361 posts)Chastened Manny.
Fixed it for you.
LordGlenconner
(1,348 posts)And that's what it is, too. Schtick.
Be sure and tip your waitresses folks!
Also, anyone who dares or bothers to save for retirement is part of the 1 percent with some here on DU. It's pretty sad, actually.
joshcryer
(62,270 posts)lots of trolls banned but the sneaky ones managed to tone it down
MineralMan
(146,288 posts)I looked at who voted in both polls. That tells the story. Sorry, but it's not a good comparison.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)You think there's self-selection bias? Could be, but probably works both ways.
MineralMan
(146,288 posts)with the list of people who DUrec one of your other threads. You have a following here. The poster of the other poll does not. Skewed results, I think.
My opinion only.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)These poor souls probably don't have processing memory sufficient to hold a thought in their noggin long enough to pull something off along th lines you're suggesting.
That being said, there's also a swarm that loves to vex me. Probably cancels out, more-or-less.
MineralMan
(146,288 posts)That's just one of the reasons. DU polls are not very useful in predicting anything outside of DU, anyhow.
bemildred
(90,061 posts)They mean exactly as much as being voted "Most Improved Student" in the 6th grade.
People say what they think other people think they should say, not what they think, much less what they will eventually do. And those are the ones being honest.
How many times have we said "DU this poll"?
joshcryer
(62,270 posts)get working manny
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
MineralMan
(146,288 posts)blue14u
(575 posts)with you Manny.. The third way
centrist is over!!!..
Senator Elizabeth Warren POTUS 20116
zeemike
(18,998 posts)And hope like hell it is true, because I think it is the last gasp for this country.
But I am also a cynical SOB and know the power of money, and Hillery has lots of it, and is the GOP choice for the Dems because they have a lot of ammo stored up from last time to use.
And I think the GOP will run someone new...probably a woman and will sound like a great reformer...they are probably grooming her now.
See the depths of cynicism I have sunk too?...but money owns us lock. stock and the proverbial barrel.
ChiciB1
(15,435 posts)AND CYNICAL? Wow, never thought I would know the depths of this feeling, and I mean NEVER!
I HAD to leave here for quite some time because the posts hit a deep nerve inside me and it was affecting my life so negatively. Still does, mostly because I have to realize how HOPELESS I feel. I feel like I sit in front of a screen and can almost hear screaming from inside it.
And before, SOMEONE attacks me again and calls me "too lazy" I'll just say this one time... From the time I was very young I believed from the get go that my activism throughout many years starting back in the 60's was essential and my duty as a citizen of this country! As I'm sure it is with so many here, we've spent years in the trenches fighting back at injustice and causes that are too long to list here.
Even now, this very day, I'm unable to escape from my core beliefs. Still at the same time I feel I'm wandering in a foreign wilderness and I don't know which way to turn.
Ideas and suggestions run rampant but what is the winning way?? I can point to the wrongs I see and how they are mounting, but it's become almost impossible to motivate anyone long enough for the good fight. APATHY & CYNICISM is taking it's toll. Sorry to go on and on, but I really thought those who came after me would pick up and keep the activism going. Surely it has to resurface! My physical and financial situation impedes me in many ways, not to mention the care giving that many of us feel is our obligation to our loved ones who sacrificed for us. Our families.
Once again I know I don't bring any answers that are sorely needed, but my gut makes me continue to join the fray!
zeemike
(18,998 posts)And I wish I did not.
And I think there are a lot of us out there just like us...to quote Jackson Brown...we started out so young and strong, only to surrender...that is how I feel a lot of the time.
But I do see young people that want to take up the struggle but they seemed to be overwhelmed by the ones that are struggling to keep things the same...and even here they are few but have a loud voice and use it.
And I don't have any answers ethier...and the ones I do give would be attacked anyway.
ChiciB1
(15,435 posts)JACKSON BROWNE! While I love music and I LOVE too many artists to name, it's JACKSON BROWNE who took my heart way way back when! Was lucky enough to attend 3 of his concerts, the last one in Tampa where he performed his "Solo Acoustic Tour!" Right up front, I blew a hole in my savings, but it was worth it.
On my desk, I have the words of 2 of his more activists songs... Lives In The Balance & For America! I printed them out and put them in clear plastic so I can see those words every day.
I don't care what rumors are out there or what others might say about him, to me the depth of so many songs he's written captured my soul from day one.
You could have just written the words you quoted without saying who it was and I would have known right away who it came from.
And he too asked many questions through his music and many needed answers... and like you & I we "would be attacked anyway!"
Pretty heartbreaking as we stand on the brink!
mikekohr
(2,312 posts)Same as with President Obama.
But without a Democratic House and Senate, with fillibuster reform, disapointment will follow.
The Presidency is but one branch of government. We need the Congress also. And if so, we will get the Supreme Court too in time.
marble falls
(57,080 posts)DonCoquixote
(13,616 posts)because people realize that if, at the very least, Hillary does not have some pressure to run to the left, she will be pulled to the right, and frankly, that is not the sort of thing that will make people risk getting arrested or beat up on election Day.
UTUSN
(70,686 posts)ReRe
(10,597 posts)... I hope you're right. Seems like I've been waiting till the next election all my life.
bvar22
(39,909 posts)Her time came,
and now it is gone.
There is a wave of Populism arising in our country,
a wave that Corporate Owned 3rd Way Republican lite Hillary can NOT ride.
She does not have the credentials,
no matter how many cartoon graphs show up at DU trying to BlueWash Hillary as a Liberal or a Populist.
If the money men and power brokers of the conservative, Corporate Friendly, establishment Democratic Party
are successful at buying the Democratic nomination for Hillary, it will tear our party apart.
[font color=firebrick][center]"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans.
I want a party that will STAND UP for Working Americans."
---Paul Wellstone [/font][/center] [center] [/font]
[font size=1]photo by bvar22
Shortly before Sen Wellstone was killed[/center][/font]
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Almost 2008, not quite.
Definitely not 2016!
2banon
(7,321 posts)This is a theory solely based on my intuition. This business of floating HRC's name in front for the 2016 PUTUS run is solely intended for the party to pull a rabbit out of the hat at the last possible minute, essentially in order to let the repukes throw all of their rotten eggs (intended to hit HRC with) in one basket. keep the opposition 'research' team energy, time and money focused on her.
In any event, she's not about to put herself through all that shite again. She just doesn't need to. She can happily find her self a hedge fund company, Lobbying firm or other corporation and start reaping in the $$$$, retire comfortably and call it a day.
That's my hunch.
zeemike
(18,998 posts)I hope your hunch is correct.
just the only thing that makes to me in terms of party strategy for that race. That's how I would play it..
woo me with science
(32,139 posts)They will try to sneak in another corporate Trojan horse who will promise to represent the 99 percent, and hope there is not sufficient time for him or her to be exposed.
joshcryer
(62,270 posts)hint: she pulls in 250k per speech
her book will likely earn tens of millions
your view is highly simplistic
JoeyT
(6,785 posts)She might be doing it because she doesn't like Republicans. Watching them scramble around like their asses were on fire while we ran a candidate they didn't have shit on would be enough reason for me to do it, were I in her shoes.
joshcryer
(62,270 posts)She can't openly say this, but I truly believe she wants to get back at them. Diane Blair's journals had some stuff in there about her time as First Lady, and the stuff we see is really a strong headed woman who wants to get shit done.
The best quote:
2banon
(7,321 posts)That may be the driving motivation if she actually does run. I just have this hunch that's it's all a ruse for very smart strategic purposes. But it's just a hunch.
2banon
(7,321 posts)That would be fun to watch if I were in her shoes, and that was the strategy. Watch those freaking bastards, the Karl Rove machine, Koch Brothers (especially) Faux news pundit asshats, only to be shown what stupid morons they actually are.
that would be sweet.
2banon
(7,321 posts)I'm not just talking about the job of the office which she knows more about than any other possible contender, (most likely) I'm talking about the race for the job will be just as brutal. Why do it? Power? She already has a lot of power in spades.
She can make even more money than she's raking in now. once she takes office, all of what she's invested in will come into extremely close scrutiny, possibly far worse than White Water and all that crap revisited.
Again, why do it?
joshcryer
(62,270 posts)2banon
(7,321 posts)I'm not sure if you're being serious with that question/observation. She will forever hold the position of power to influence in whatever realm she chooses to influence. She will forever have access to all manner of opportunities to do that and more......
joshcryer
(62,270 posts)fund raising for Haiti?
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Intriguing theory that you have, would explain some things.
bemildred
(90,061 posts)I'd have to know her a whole lot better than I do.
mzteris
(16,232 posts)It's completely different from the du of old.
I can't really vouch for the "past year" because s it surpassed my tolerance threshold some years back.
Oh I poke I now and again, but seriously, there is no comparison. None.
TomClash
(11,344 posts)The same as I ever was.
Unreconstructed Democrat. No third way, no first way, the only way.
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)That is why I think that Hillary may find that she is too out of touch to run successfully.
We used to be the party that fought for racial equality. We still are, but many of us now recognize that the racism that is most hardcore, most difficult to end, is deeply embedded in our culture and is reinforced by our economy which rewards the privileged without giving opportunity to those who do not enjoy privilege.
The political issues that we must deal with in the next years are to a great extent economic. Hillary would have to take a leap out of her comfy environment to come up with workable solutions. She is too dependent on Wall Street and big business to become a credible advocate for the changes that we need to make in our culture and in our economy.
It's one thing to advocate for equal pay, but it's quite another to advocate for free day care, paid maternity leave, and higher pay for all working people.
Hillary's stance on trade is not in sync with the Democrats in Congress or in the streets.
woo me with science
(32,139 posts)Now the contest becomes truth versus money.
Zorra
(27,670 posts)The bullshit has been exposed.
Kurovski
(34,655 posts)She was sick of it way back when, too.
"I'd like to make it clear to the people who run the Democratic Party that I will not support Hillary Clinton for president.
Enough. Enough triangulation, calculation and equivocation. Enough clever straddling...
What kind of courage does it take, for mercy's sake? The majority of the American people (55 percent) think the war in Iraq is a mistake and that we should get out. The majority (65 percent) of the American people want single-payer health care and are willing to pay more taxes to get it. The majority (86 percent) of the American people favor raising the minimum wage. The majority of the American people (60 percent) favor repealing Bush's tax cuts, or at least those that go only to the rich. The majority (66 percent) wants to reduce the deficit not by cutting domestic spending, but by reducing Pentagon spending or raising taxes.
The majority (77 percent) thinks we should do "whatever it takes" to protect the environment. The majority (87 percent) thinks big oil companies are gouging consumers and would support a windfall profits tax. That is the center, you fools. WHO ARE YOU AFRAID OF? "
http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0120-30.htm
zeemike
(18,998 posts)She was real.
Thanks for reminding us of her.
Kurovski
(34,655 posts)zeemike
(18,998 posts)That is what journalism should be and she personified it.
Historic NY
(37,449 posts)"What Murdoch introduced in this country was the always effective British combination ... where you marry T&A - sex, ... a lot of bosomy bathing beauties - with patriotism, jingoism, flag waving. And it's a VERY effective combination. He's introduced it here beautifully and it's taken hold, particularly on television." Molly Ivins...
but they are following the hype and gotcha tumble, to sell themselves in the manner the fits the Murdoch tabloids.
Kurovski
(34,655 posts)Newscasts with legs in the shot. No necessity for that, yet they all do it now.
woo me with science
(32,139 posts)*Press freedom under attack - the risks journalists face in order to report*
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024486945#post8
U.S. Plunges in Global Press Freedom Rankings As Obama Wages "War on Whistleblowers"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024488178
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Well done!
BelgianMadCow
(5,379 posts)the great unwashed are coming.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Such a ticket cannot include Hillary Clinton.
whatchamacallit
(15,558 posts)Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)Someone please alert the media.
FSogol
(45,481 posts)with 200 some responses, is representative of anything.