Minnesota boy, fed up with parents' pot, helps spur bust

[The Straight Story]

Minnesota boy, fed up with parents' pot, helps spur bust


HASTINGS, Minn. — An 11-year-old boy who said he was fed up with marijuana smoke in his house took pictures of the drug which led to a raid by authorities and sent his mother and stepfather to jail in Dakota County.

Drug agents served a search warrant on the house in Ravenna Township near Hastings last month and arrested Heidi Siebenaler, a Dakota County probation supervisor, and her husband, Mark Siebenaler. Both face charges in the case.

A criminal complaint says the boy told investigators he had complained numerous times to his mother about the smell of the marijuana. He finally took the matter to his biological father, who told his son to take pictures of the marijuana. The father then forwarded the photos to authorities.

Heidi Siebenaler told KMSP-TV that her husband smokes marijuana for medicinal purposes

http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/event/article/id/214830/

[geardaddy]

1. I'm betting the biological father was the one with the complaint.

[Name removed]

96. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[seabeyond]

97. making an accusation with no fact is reason to you? wow. nt

[JackRiddler]

153. It's not an accusation. It's a reasonable supposition. A bet, see?

Do you need a dictionary to distinguish between accusation and bet?

Besides which, the article says the biological dad gave the idea to his son. Read much?

Want to make this subthread go diagonal with bile? Because my comment was directed mainly at the ugly nonsense going on below.

[seabeyond]

176. it is a bettin.... accusation with no fact. lol. his son came to him with a problem

the son had the INITIAL complaint. read much?

[reggie the dog]

2. what a shitty kid

dropped the dime on his mom???? worthless fucking prick.

[MattBaggins]

26. Perhaps he didn't want to live with vegetables for parents anymore?

If this was the kids only way out of a crappy parenting situation than kudos to him.

[KamaAina]

28. Sure. All people who smoke pot are vegetables.

:sarcasm:

[MattBaggins]

32. Yes they are. Glad you agree.

Now I support your right to smoke as much as you want and feel the shit should be legal.

That said, pot heads are horrible parents and if a kid is living with dumbasses for parents they have the right to ask for something better. If that means showing how stupid your parents are then I'm all for it. Smoking in front of your kids is plain stupid and a sign of an idiot for a parent.


Edited for hostile and inflammatory word choice.

[EOTE]

33. What a disgusting post for a multitude of reasons.

First and foremost your unthinking and sickening use of the word "retards". You lose all pretense of a civil debate right there. If you feel the "shit" should be legal, then you shouldn't support a family being torn apart because of it. Also, there is nothing in that article about the parents smoking in front of the kid, just that he had complained of the smell. If you have any kids, they deserve better than a parent who'd casually toss the term "retard" around.

[MattBaggins]

37. I do have kids

and they are the reason I conduct myself as an ADULT and not a dumbass. I don't get drunk and I do not use drugs as I realize that part of my duties as a PARENT and an ADULT is to not be a dumbass.

Drugs are shit and use of them for recreation is stupid. People should be free to use them as they wish but should not expect sane folk to pat them on the back and tell them what a fine parenting job they are doing. If the kid is trying to get out of such a situation and hard evidence is the only way, then good for that child showing some courage.

Edited to remove hostile and inflammatory word choice.

[EOTE]

42. Well, I'll pray for them.

I happen to think that kids shouldn't be exposed to callous parents who would denigrate a massive group of typically caring people who did nothing to earn their condition. Those people were born the way they were. You made a conscious choice to become an intolerant, ignorant bully. Your kids deserve better.

[MattBaggins]

49. Put them pearls down

My kids will do fine. Sorry to break it to you but people do indeed choose to use drugs so they are not people "who did nothing to earn their condition". They may have an addiction and should get every possible medical treatment for that addiction but if they are that bad they should not be raising children until clean.

[EOTE]

72. Wow, you are in such ignorant bliss that you had no idea what I was referring to.

I was referring to the people who you so callously insulted, multiple times and without remorse. It doesn't surprise me in the least that you don't realize that. You're perfectly content being utterly oblivious.

Edited to add: And all without the assistance of drugs, too. See, some people can be worthless and don't even require the assistance of the evil devil's weed.

[reggie the dog]

100. i need medical treatment for smoking the weed i grow for free?

really? i spend ZERO on what i smoke, how many tobacco or alcohol users can say they spend NOTHING on their habits each year? some people just like to smoke weed, it doenst prevent us from doing anything.

[krabigirl]

165. But what about ignorant parents? Where are the treatment centers for them?

[Morning Dew]

44. Retard?? Really?

And in two posts as well.

[EOTE]

46. Can you believe it?

The people he would continually denigrate have magnitudes of order more emotional maturity than he does. And this person is a father, too.

[Morning Dew]

60. Amazing. The things you see here are sometimes pretty appalling.

[Codeine]

68. And yet you're not condemning the poster

who calls an 11-year-old a "worthless little prick." :eyes:

[seabeyond]

76. this is what i am seeing. nt

[Morning Dew]

77. Have at it!

I wasn't going to comment on the thread until I read Mr. Baggins denigration of people with disabilities.

[reggie the dog]

103. i stand by it too, worthless ratting out your own parents for grass

my parents taught me better than that and i teach my daughter better. she already knows that it is perfectly fine to lie but only to cops and judges.

ratting your parents for grass is like denouncing them to the gestapo, that is what i was taught and that is what i will teach, i already explain what culture wars are to my 3 year old, she will understand.

[zonkers]

161. And it's literally a scene right out of the book 1984.

[FedUpWithIt All]

220. Your posts are cringeworthy.

You are teaching your three year old child to lie to legal "authorities"? I can think of some other parent types who encourage their children to lie to these same people and to keep "family secrets". :puke:

[seabeyond]

221. and without realization because i came to it when kids were older. the parent is teaching child

rules dont matter. and THAT could very well bite a parent on the ass later years. lol.

[reggie the dog]

262. i teach my kid that it is not immoral to break unjust rules or laws

she sees that i follow just about every law and traffic rule out there except drugs prohibition, it is about teaching kids to act morally, not just follow rules put in place by other people, but to act morally.

[seabeyond]

263. i get that. but i also teach mine that when you choose to break the rule or law, be ready for

repercussions. and weigh it thoughtfully. cause i am not coming to your rescue.

do throw that one in. your daughter is young. when that age, you can get away with a lot more, and maybe not see the big picture, like when they are older adn start thinking for themselves.

that is all

[reggie the dog]

327. i do, that is why i tell her not to rat me out

because babylon still enforces their law over us, so we have to hide our true selves from the state.

[seabeyond]

353. lol. you are telling her you chose to break the rules and not willing to weigh repercussions

and then make the choice, but put the responsibility on her shoulders, lol.

i see it as shifting responsibility. it must be on my shoulders. not my children.

[reggie the dog]

356. if she rats me out she rats me out

at least i know who her loyalty is too

it is indeer her responsibility to either accept daddy as he is (i dont neglect or harm her) or being loyal to a state bacause that his what the cops and the laws say to do.

my kid will be way less likely to fall victim to programs like dare or the hitler youth.

[seabeyond]

359. NO. she has NO responsibility to you. it is the other way around. you accept her, regardless

that is the way it works.

and i am not even opposed to pot and parenting, per se. stuff matters, though.

[reggie the dog]

368. i accept her

but if she narcs me out i will no longer respect her and no longer trust her, i will accept that she is an authoritarian and try to convert her to the good side again but would never trust her again.

[seabeyond]

380. you have all kinds of conditions there. nt

[reggie the dog]

382. no conditions, acceptance and love she gets until i die

trust and respect are different

[seabeyond]

389. ok. i absolutely get that.

if you are connected and give the child what she needs then i dont see an issue.

but i will tell you something else you will deal with. i know for a fact that pot effects us. and though we are productive, it is the regular old adult productive adn mostly fun stuff. have a kid doing pot too you, and with school, something they dont like, and may run into problems. and that is what you set up. but then as you say, you were raised with it.

[Dorian Gray]

417. You are speaking about

your 3 year old daughter??????

Weird.

[Dorian Gray]

416. What about being loyal

to herself? To her own needs and wants?

Don't they matter? Where does she fit in? Or is it just loyalty to her daddy vs. the state?

[reggie the dog]

261. my parents told me to lie

aunts and uncles raised their kids to lie to cops

friends were raised and raise their kids as such, the family secret is that we grow and use illegal plants, my parents and those i mentioned told me and we tell our kids that you can rat out family for abuse, sexual touching, but not for the drugs they use.

in the usa they teach kids to rat out their parents in DARE, so you have to combat that with telling your kids that the state has no business regulating the appetite or minds of adults and that such laws are not immoral to break but that you lie about breaking them to avoid punishment.

[FedUpWithIt All]

295. Your parents put their use before your wellbeing and you are doing the same to your child.

patterns like this often repeat in families. It doesn't make it right. Teaching your child that they must determine what is an appropriate thing to "tell" and what isn't is unfair to the sensibilities of a young child. You teach a child to keep secrets and i assure you that the same child will be far easier to compel to keep secrets for ANYONE who might benefit from a child too afraid to speak out in their own defense. Dangerous but you seem to not realize this because your own parents placed you in a similar position.

Tell me, why does you child even need to KNOW about your use? There are countless things about my personal life my children do not know about. I keep a vibrator but i don't need to go threatening my kids should they tell others about it because they don't know about it. And if they did go and tell people about it, the blame would be on me for allowing them access to something that doesn't concern them and is not age appropriate or even comfortable for them to be part of. It isn't that difficult to keep adult and personal things from children. Why the need to involve children in the party? Where is their choice in this? Is it so necessary to be so open about your use? Because your own parents could not be bothered to protect your own childhood in that regard. Sad.

You choose to have your toddler know you smoke then one is left questioning your reasoning. Why?

[reggie the dog]

331. no, my parents didnt put their use before my wellbeing

mom stopped smoking for over 25 years beginning when she was pregnant with me, she didnt smoke in front of me unitl she smoked some hash with me when i was in my 20s already, dad only did it once a month or so and now doesnt anymore as he is afraid to fail a drug test within his last 2 years before retirement. My parents always told me that if an adult was touching me or something like that it was fine to tell other adults and the cops but that if the adult was smoking something that was their own business.

good question, why does the child have to know about my use.

1. kid sees alcohol people doing alcohol all over the place, i am not one of these people but i must accept this influence on my child
2. kid sees people doing up tobacco all over the place, i am not one of these people but i have to accept this influence on my child
3. i want my kid to see that daddy gets a little buzz but by smoking for free the green flower he grows.
4. (for france and europe not the usa) french people do not think it possible to smoke pure cannabis, they dont understand that you can smoke it alone in joints or a pipe, they think it will not burn on its own and that it must be mixed with tobacco to burn. no matter how many times you explain that you dont have to do tobacco to do cannabis they just dont get it. so i want my daughter to see that i never smoke tobacco mixed with weed, that daddy smokes pure, that way if she is tempted to try later she will know the proper way to do it.
5. i will not let the government determine that it is fine for a kid to grow up thinking alcohol and tobacco use are fine and what normal people do whereas pot use is for horrible degenerates. i want her to know that i am fine and normal and smoke weed like many of my friends and family members.

[FedUpWithIt All]

336. "I don't wannnnaaaa"

Got it.

[reggie the dog]

337. did you even read my multiple points i pointed out?

you asked why i smoke in front of my kid and i gave a detailed explanation of how i will not let the state win the culture war. the state will not determine that my kid will see alcohol and tobacco use as normal when i use neither of those two drugs without me showing her that cannabis use is normal and much less damaging than alcohol, about how i want her to see that you dont need to mix in tobacco to smoke cannabis like the people do in europe,

and all you get out of it is that i dont wanna hide it? i fucking explained to you why i dont wanna hide it an i think i have same damn good reasons.

[FedUpWithIt All]

340. Again, it is about YOU first and your daughter second.

You have a battle to fight regarding the drug war and want to place your own child on the front line of it to "prove a point?" Putting yourself, your interests and your desires before those of your child.

I feel for your little girl.

[reggie the dog]

343. did you see the point i make about mixed joints

if not for me my daughter will think it normal when french people tell her joints have tobacco and cannabis in them, tobacco is more addictive and worse for the health so i am doing harm reduction education

i dont put my child on the front line of the drug war, i will not let the state convince her that alcohol and tobacco use is normal and cannabis use is not seeing as cannabis is safer than alcohol and tobacco for both the user and society. once again this is harm reduction in the hopes that she will choose the safer cannabis as opposed to the dagerous tobacco and alcohol later in life.

the point i have to prove to my kid is that states may try to ban or harrass or bust peaceable subcultures of people but that it is possible for the persecuted cultures to endure.

where are my interests in front of my kids? you have no idea how much time i spend taking care of my kid, playing with her etc.

you are telling me to hide an aspect of my personality and my culture from my kid because the governments of the world hate my culture (hippie culture) whereas i say i will still show my daughter my culture and teach her that the govt's goal is to eradicate people like daddy (how often do drug warriors say that they want to eradicate drug use, that means eradicating users. getting rid of us. the goal is to turn all the hippies off of weed, lds, shrooms and getting them back on alcohol and i will not let them brainwash my kid into thinking that daddy's subculture and way of life are inferior to the culture of the alcohol people. fuck that.

[hifiguy]

372. My old man traveled the world as a civilian mechanic

attached to military projects for years during and after WW II. He was a union man until he was hurt on the job and couldn't do the work anymore. I remember him telling me two profound truths:

1. "If you get your paycheck from another man, you had better vote for Democrats because the rich can take care of themselves";

2. (applicable to this thread) "Son, NOBODY likes a snitch."

[reggie the dog]

392. and we understood that a snitch was someone telling the boss

that we were taking an extra break, or grassing somone for dope but that calling the cops when we were victim of a crime was totally acceptable. some people on this thread think it is too hard to understand this whereas i thought that most kids know the difference between tattling when some kid breaks the rules about climbing a tree and telling the teacher that a brawl has broken out.

[DiverDave]

414. LOL... your dad is cool

and it's true NOBODY likes a snitch. (or tattletale for the younger set)

[Dreamer Tatum]

223. You should have your 3-year-old taken away. You'll both be better off.

You're a shitty parent.

[reggie the dog]

260. taken away??? for what?

they dont take your kids away from you in france because you use cannabis because that is not child neglect. plenty of people let their kids see people use tobacoo and alcohol and you get down on me for showing my kid cannabis flowers?

[Dreamer Tatum]

287. to provide you with more time to devote your life to the enjoyment of weed

while freeing your child from their said immersion in your issues.

[reggie the dog]

332. i dont need to devote time to weed

aside from the several days work preparing and harvesting/drying my plants i probably spend all of 20 minutes a day smoking or rolling joints if that.

kid is not immersed in my issues, kid is just being raised by a neo hippy who never uses alcohol or tobacco and sees no reason to hide his cannabis use from his daughter when most of society uses tobacco and alcohol in plain view.

[hifiguy]

376. You, dude, have far more issues than Reggie does

Sanctimony/self righteousness being the primary one, false omniscience being the next.

[Dreamer Tatum]

377. You two should smoke a bowl sometime...and open a day care center.

:rofl:

[reggie the dog]

401. you think we cant take care of kids after smoking a bowl?

really? you truly believe that? as if! i can kick a soccer ball around, take my daughter to the park, on a hike, do coloring, read her books... please...

[Marrah_G]

64. Matt- please stop using the word retard in that manner

It's really offensive to alot of people. Maybe you could edit to use the word stupid or dumbass instead.

[MattBaggins]

70. Point taken I apologize for that particular loaded word

I will edit.

(But I still stand by my belief that drugs are dumb)

[Marrah_G]

75. Thank you

[reggie the dog]

104. drugs are just objects

some are tools, some are just mindfucks.

lsd, mdma, mda, mushrooms, cannabis are great tools for introspection, seeing things differently, empathizing and what not.

people that created huge computer companies have dropped acid and said it had a great influence on their lives. hardly dumb people at all.

[Ignis]

92. "Drugs are shit and use of them for recreation is stupid."

So, you're Straight Edge? You've never had a cup of coffee, a glass of iced tea, or a cocktail?

[reggie the dog]

98. you still do alcohol in front of your kids

you just dont "get drunk" *
well you know what, the "impairment" i get from reefer is no where near that of being drunk. I do plenty of playing, caring for, taking hiking and to the park with my kid. hell this weekend i took her to the beach twice, made sand castles and smoked joints while doing so.

you will probably bitch at your kids for smoking reefer and dropping acid too.... i would have hated to have been a kid in your home.

[krabigirl]

163. Hope you never take any pills, either. they impair you too! lol

But those are endorsed, of course, especially anti-anxiety pills, so no biggie! lol

Look, it's not good to expose a kid to smoke, but if an adult wants to do that outside, no biggie.

[Upton]

36. What an idiotic post

millions of Americans with kids use pot regularly. I know some myself. They're not vegetables or bad parents. If I were you, I'd be much more concerned about legal alcoholics with kids instead of benign pot smokers and their children. Why don't you go join the DOJ or DEA and spread you WOD propaganda around there...

[MattBaggins]

45. I wouldn't join them since I think drug laws are stupid

Do you not understand that a person can view drugs just as alcohol? I want your right to drink left up to you but I won't cheer and applaud public drunkenness are abuse of alcohol and just as a wife would have the right to stay or leave a spouse who abuses alcohol; so should the kids have that choice. I have the luxury of picking my friends and avoiding drug users. Is it so obnoxious to suggest children have that right?

I fully understand that some people have real problems with alcohol and drugs but I am taking the school of hard knocks approach and saying that their kids have the right to be protected from that shit. (yes I am still calling it shit)

Drugs are dumb. People are free to be dumb

PS... I did more than my fair share of drinking in drugging in my youth. Then I grew up.

[EOTE]

47. Like hell you've grown up.

You are a very, very far way from being grown up.

[MattBaggins]

54. Is personal attacks all you have?

[EOTE]

74. Is insulting others whom you don't even know all you have?

My comments are directed solely toward you. You're so clueless that you attack others without even knowing them. Sickening.

[MattBaggins]

79. I know those people very well

I put myself in a short hospital stay after managing to go on a nice little binge and shut my kidneys down.

I moved into a neighborhood that has slowly eroded into young parents who let their 5 year old kids run around summers at 10 o'clock at night while they are on the couch drunk and or stoned. Yes I am judging them but I feel my assessment of them is correct.

I have family members and old friends who still use. I support the addicts who try but I do avoid those who do it for fun. (sorry if that makes me an asshole but that is MY decision for MY family.)

I know all to well what drugs are about.

[EOTE]

84. Once again, you don't seem to have the slightest clue of which I speak.

I was referring to your thoughtless use of the term "retard" which you continued to use after I called you out on it. I don't know if you're being obtuse or if you still honestly don't get it. What you also don't seem to understand is that drugs, in and of themselves, are not bad. You clearly weren't able to use drugs responsibly, but that doesn't mean that there aren't millions of others who can. Those who wouldn't denigrate someone for a condition they were born with.

[Generic Brad]

253. "Responsible drug users"?

Now there's an oxymoron if I've ever heard one.

[reggie the dog]

264. are you crazy? most drug users are responsible

that is why most alcohol users are not alcoholics, most cocaine users are not addicts, most mdma users are not addicts, most cannabis users are not addicts. i could go on and on.

[Generic Brad]

296. Yep. I'm crazy

Stupid, insane, a 1%er and an agent provocateur, My personal experience should be totally discounted. Your opinion is the only valid one.
:sarcasm:

[reggie the dog]

325. look at the use to abuse ratio of drugs if you dont believe me

tobacco, heroin, crack and meth have a high rate of addicts as a percentage of people using the drug

alcohol has a lower rate of addicts, cannabis even lower and mushrooms and lsd have nearly no addicts

[Upton]

53. Yeah, you've grown up so much..

you're referring to other people as "retards". That pot free life of yours is working wonders.. :eyes:

[reggie the dog]

105. hell no kids dont get to choose their parents

[MattBaggins]

125. Yes they do if the parents are abusive or neglect them

that would be the question with drugs though.

[reggie the dog]

141. where is their abuse or neglect?

if this is abuse, exposer to odor, then tobacco smokers everywhere, even ones who smoke outside or in the garage, are child abusers too.

[snooper2]

57. I'm willing to bet I could do more high than you can sober...

We should have a competition..

Filling out taxes-
Then changing a transmission in a 1978 Pontiac LeMans-
Then configuring a Cisco IAD-
Then replacing 55' of 12" sofet-
Then making a pizza from scratch-

You can sleep and eat as needed--

First one to win gets 10 grams of Hydro


:rofl:

[seabeyond]

62. there were some i never smoked with. sat on ass and did nothing. i on the other hand took a puff

to clean house, dancing thru to the music, exercising, meditating, doing bills, cooking..... talking talking talking. lol

i got busy when i smoke. drug does opposite for me than most people, too.

[reggie the dog]

106. me too

i sit around and do fuck all when i dont smoke, a tiny bit of weed and i want to go biking by curiosity just to see "whats going on"

my friends also tell me i talk too much sometimes when i smoke....

[MattBaggins]

83. Again as a father of two little girls I must decline

Knock yourself out though.


You could easily beat me at that stuff. Diabetic with two stents and a bypass. I would get half way up the ladder for the soffets and stop for a nap.

[Ignis]

91. "pot heads are horrible parents"

:eyes:

Nice to see you support your wild claims with so very much data.

[Generic Brad]

254. And nice to see you support your claims with no data either

:smoke:
You totally made your case.

[reggie the dog]

265. i was raised by a reefer smoker

i have a master's degree as does my sister,

our father watched our soccer games, took us camping did all kinds of shit with us, so what did it matter if he smoked weed once in a while?

do you think that people that smoke cannabis automatically neglect their kids? that is foolish.

[Generic Brad]

280. Well, I have masters degree too

And my parents still drank too much. In my experience, parents who choose to abuse alcohol on a daily basis also neglect their kids. My parents indulged in alcohol liberally, but when you get past appearances, they were still drunks. My parents neglected me when the chips came down because they valued drinking more than me.

I'm glad you had a positive experience with your pot smoking parents. The rest of us with alcoholic parents cannot claim that. And we are not foolish in opposing it by any stretch of the imagination.

[reggie the dog]

324. alcohol and pot are not the same drug

alcohol is way worse both for the individual user and their entourage.

the episode of the simpsons when homer started smoking weed and gave up drinking may have been exagerated a bit but hell lisa said she like pot homer better than beer homer.

i dont neglect my kid to smoke, i spend NO money on cannabis, i take care of my kid and cannabis does not fuck you up as much a alcohol so you can still take care of your kids even if stoned.

[reggie the dog]

94. why is it stupid for me to smoke cannabis in front of my kid?

i think it is stupid that you do alcohol around your kids, and that you do caffiene in front of them, actually i dont but that is what you sound like.

how am i a horrible parent? i am a good dad. i venture that i could also out bike and out run you distance, endurance, altitude climbs etc. I can ride a mile up in altitude and 20 miles distance in 2 hours on mixed paved and gravel on a mountain bike, what can you do?

i teach at a university (my master's degree opened that door) what did your degrees get you?

[MattBaggins]

119. WTF does any of that other stuff have to do with it?

My daddy can beat up your daddy?

Seriously?

[reggie the dog]

142. no, you called me a vegetable

a vegetable cannot do all the shit i can

and where is the problem with me smoking weed on the porch or in the bathroom with the window open and the door shut? really?

[krabigirl]

167. you sound like an awesome Dad..and there's nothing wrong with it. People are just ignorant.

I don't agree with exposing any non-consenting individual to smoke, but smoking in a different room or outside is no biggie at all.

[EOTE]

211. You're the one who is bringing the conversation into juvenile territory.

You lambaste those who'd smoke a beneficial herb, talking about how they'd be unfit parents while it's clear that you have no authority to speak. You make horrible and bigoted comments which expose your ignorance and then have the nerve to attack far more open minded people than yourself. No one brought your daddy into this, they're just suggesting they could accomplish far more stoned than you could ever accomplish sober. I'm in that camp as well.

[frylock]

152. why don't you and i go for a little 20 mile mountain bike ride?

then we'll so who is the vegetable.

[krabigirl]

164. I see. so any kid living with parents who use any type of meds, should be taken away?

What about Xanax, vicodin, or anti-depressants? Those are given out like candy and soccer moms brag about using them. Hell, I got more "stoned" on Xanax and heck, even Lexapro than I have ever been after using cannabis. But it's a-ok to be a complete zombie, and also pump your kids full of those pills..it's almost expected.

[Politicalboi]

238. How do you know "pot heads" are terrible parents

I have know many pot heads, and none of them were terrible parents. I never had a kid, but I know I would not be a terrible parent for using pot even in front of them. It's a just a plant. It's no different than drinking alcohol in front of them. The only difference is the one that is legal shouldn't be legal and the one that is illegal in some states should be legal. It's just a plant, get over it.

[reggie the dog]

90. so what if there were carrots in the house

the fact is the kid is a shitty fucking narc, i raise my daughter better than that.

am i a crappy parent because i grow and smoke weed where my kid can see me? she thought the plants were really pretty, and she likes the smell of sativa and has frowned at indica since i started to show her the difference as a 2 year old.

my french family thought it was normal for her to smell and even suck on a wine bottle cork so i let her smell raw buds too

i am not a bad parent

i take my little girl hiking, do coloring, read stories, play stuffed animals, cook for her, take her to play with friends, to the park etc.

i am not a vegetable, i work 2 part time jobs to make ends meet, ride over 100km every week on a mountain bike, help friends work on their ranches

[KittyWampus]

239. LOL! You are calling an 11 year old a "shitty fucking narc". LOL!

[iamthebandfanman]

293. you sure you arent the one on drugs?

cause you sure sound like youve been smokin' somethin'.

[otohara]

339. Maybe He'll End Up At Michele Bachman's House

as a foster child!

[NashVegas]

374. +5,000

Some people just don't want to get it

[Brickbat]

30. Classy.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

39. The only "worthless fucking prick" in this scenario is the stepdad --

who wouldn't step outside to smoke his shit. It's called courtesy to nonsmokers. Children of 11 should not be getting contact highs.

[reggie the dog]

109. where does it say he breathed in the smoke?

smelling something and second hand smoke are 2 different things, like that you smell a smoker who just smoked. or it smelled of weed being broken up but not smoked.

rat out parents for a consensual crime out of loyalty to the state? worthless fucking cog.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

118. "..smelling something and second hand smoke are 2 different things,..."

Are you kidding me??? :crazy: If you are smelling it, it is entering your body via your nose and lungs. Period.

[reggie the dog]

135. that is bullshit and you know it

you know damn well that you can smell that someone just smoked tobacco outside, the smell follows them in on their clothing. also cannabis is very strong smelling so the whole house reeks just from breaking up a flower to roll a joint.

[EOTE]

213. The contact high is pretty much a myth.

The only way you can get a contact high is if you're in a VERY tiny room or closet and people have been smoking a large amount over a very long time. You honestly believe that simply smelling something means that you're susceptible to its effects? I don't think you've got a very good idea of how smell works. One has the ability to smell something in ridiculously minute and diluted amounts. I assume you also want to ban air fresheners so that kids don't get high off of propellants? If you were going to be logically consistent, that's what you'd do.

[Codeine]

48. Forcing an 11-year-old to breath pot smoke all day sucks ass.

Fuck that nonsense.

[chrisa]

95. This website is hilarious

Yeah, that evil kid! How dare he resent his parents for not parenting him, and just sitting there smoking weed all day!

The horror!

[reggie the dog]

110. what makes you think that they were just sitting there?

people do plenty after they smoke, like as soon as the joint or pipe is done. Build sand castles, go for hikes, cook, give bath to the kid, do coloring, play legos, read books to kids, play soccer,

i dont even own a fucking tv, what would i do sit and stare at the wall?

[chrisa]

114. Maybe they did or didn't, but they shouldn't be smoking inside the house anyways.

And for the kid to call the cops means that they were probably horrible parents to begin with.

Seriously, toking up inside a house next to a kid, and just letting him breath all the smoke in is pretty stupid and abusive. I don't have any sympathy.

[reggie the dog]

139. stupid yes, abuse no

it is not child abuse to expose kids to tobacco smoke so in should not be considered abuse for cannabis smoke, cannabis smoke actually causes less damage to the body than tobacco.

what if it is an apartment and the "smoking room" is the bathroom with the window open? the odor will go out into the house much farther than any smoke would.

[roguevalley]

237. no one knows that kid's life and the breaking point. he did what

he needed. No one else has to care one way or the other. I don't blame him if that is what he needed.

[KittyWampus]

240. This thread should have ended with your comment.

[WI_DEM]

249. look he's 11 and pot smoke isn't exactly the finest smelling stuff

perhaps his parents should not have been smoking around him.

[Crunchy Frog]

252. What shitty parents.

Making the home environment for a kid so unliveable that he finally had no choice but to bring in the authorities.

I've got nothing against people who smoke pot, but I wouldn't be able to live in a place where I had to smell it all the time either.

[11 Bravo]

404. If I ever talk about an 11 year old kid like that, I hope someone kicks my ass.

[Dorian Gray]

415. You say that about an 11 year old?

Wow.

I can understand this. If they were doing it all the time in front of him and he hated it. Imagine if they were drunks doing the same thing? Constantly drinking to the point of intoxication in front of him. It is wrong to abuse substances in front of children.

[dionysus]

3. what a little narc...

:(

[tridim]

4. Yet, complain about your parents drinking every night and nobody cares.

What a bong load of crap.

[sarcasmo]

11. +1

[Still Blue in PDX]

22. +1

I called the cops more than once when my drunk dad was beating up my mom. All that happened was my getting in trouble after the cops left--with my MOM mad at me.

:shrug:

[KittyWampus]

241. People DO care about alcoholic parents. It can put your custody in jeopardy.

[otohara]

341. I Wish My Mom Would Have Smoked Pot vs Alcohol

when we were young, she drank and got so ugly and belligerent, violent - later in life when she quit drinking, she took up pot to help her arthritis and she was mellow, pleasant, sweet even.

Alcoholic parents are the worst!!!

[piratefish08]

5. the true source of my endless patience when the kids were young..........

:hippie:

[Still Blue in PDX]

24. Yeah, I used to be intolerant of my husband's smoking pot when I thought the kids might notice..

I got him to quit and my kids (who I thought were unaware of it)told me they liked him better when he was smoking, so leave him alone.

Live and learn, I guess.

[piratefish08]

43. i NEVER smoked in front of them. or here the smoke could affect them.

i DID have open and honest conversations with them as young adults..........

about weed and other substances......

[Still Blue in PDX]

162. Him, too.

Having parents who drank too much made me scared half to death of any kind of mood-altering substances. I've a bit more informed point of view now.

[ieoeja]

6. I was in my 40s before I realized there was pot that did *not* make me sick.

Assuming they were smoking the same crap to which I was always exposed, I can't blame him. The stuff I was around always made me literally ill to the stomach. It was just horrible.

In fact, I used to argue that marijuana would never be legalized for that very reason. *I* used to be against full legalization for that reason. Then I discovered that not all pot is that disgusting. Some of it smells quite nice, actually. Certainly, better than tobacco.

[tridim]

12. I think that is why lots of people don't like Cannabis.

Legalization would change that perception since brick-weed would quickly become a pointless product.

I really wish anti-pot people could smell a high-quality cannabis plant before harvest. Mmmmmmm.. The odor of raw Cannabis resin is easily one of my favorite smells in the world.

[reggie the dog]

112. my 3 year olds natural reaction to seein my 6 foot tall outdoor

"wow, pretty daddy, pretty flowers"

here, smell them i said, its durban poison

"mmmm that smells good"

smells like tropical fruit.....


i live in a country where people let babies smell and suck on wine corks, so as the in laws and frenchies in my family introduced my daughter to alcohol at an early age, i thought she may as well smell good cannabis.

i didnt do it in the usa and here they dont take your kids from you for cannabis.

[hifiguy]

7. What an obedient little turd

this kid is. Ten bucks says his biological father put him up to it.

[Codeine]

50. Maybe he's just a kid who didn't want to breath that nasty-ass shit all day.

To some of us the smell is absolutely fucking nauseating.

[Dreamer Tatum]

178. How dare you smear the Holy Marijuana! nt

[reggie the dog]

113. mommy said no to a new x box 37???

[Dreamer Tatum]

175. So she could afford more weed, which of course is a necessity.

:eyes:

[reggie the dog]

266. they had 8 pounds in the house they dont spent ANYTHING on pot

when you have 8 pounds you are likely either someone who grows their own stash or a dealer, dealers spend no money on pot, you get 10 pounds for say 10 000 dollars then sell bags of 1 pound for 2000 dollars, you sell 5 pounds that way and you break even on money, as in you spent NOTHING on weed. then you sell 4 pounds and you just made 8000 dollars for your family, to celebrate you take your last pound of weed as free smoke and do it all over again.

[Dreamer Tatum]

284. But I thought the father a God-granted MM prescription. Why does someone in desperate need

of MM have THAT much laying around?

The fact that you blithely throw off the hypothetical that maybe the guy is simply a dealer burnishes my assertion that you are probably not parent material. Smoke all you want. Deal all you want. Grow all you want. Just keep it away from children. That basic ideal seems objectionable to you, so thank heavens you have nothing to do with my children.

[reggie the dog]

323. why keep it away from my kid?

my daughter saw my plants, that way she know that it is just a plant. i smoke weed pure in front of her because in france people think you have to mix tobacco and weed to make joints, i dont want her to smoke tobacco weed joints, i want her to see that you dont need to put baccy in the weed to smoke it.

raise your kids how you want to but dont get down on me for raising my kids in a way that does not harm them.

so what if someone deals pot that does not make them unfit parents.

also you know pot is a plant, it grows and if the growing season was good you can easily get 8 pounds off of 3 or 4 plants.

[Codeine]

193. That would cut into the weed budget. nt

[reggie the dog]

267. 8 pounds in the house, they spent NO MONEY AT ALL ON POT

either the 1 grow their own or 2 sell pot, when you buy in bulk and re sell the pot is a source of income and you can smoke for free too. so the pot in the house actually was BRINGING IN money in all likelyhood or was simply free if it was homegrown.

[KittyWampus]

242. yeah, there's no possibility that 11 year old "shitty fucking narc"

MIGHT actually be sick of dealing with a pot head loser of a mother.

Sometimes those who smoke pot ARE actually losers.

I've seen plenty of them.

[reggie the dog]

268. no possibility? they teach kids to narc on parents in kindergarden

it is called DARE, i was taught to narc out my family but asked them about it first.

fucking hitler youth like DARE is.

[fishbulb703]

8. To be fair, the smell can be unpleasant, especially to a nonsmoker. Parents should be respectful. nt

[Xithras]

9. Good for the kid. Hotboxing isn't cool.

If the kid didn't want to deal with the smoke and the mother made him suffer through it anyway, then she deserves what she gets. Good parents put the well being of their children BEFORE their own enjoyment. Even if it was genuinely medicinal, the mother was being negligent by exposing an 11 year old to the smoke against his will. Smoke outside. If you can't do that, give the kid up to the other parent if they will. Forcing ANYONE to inhale drugs against their will, even in minute amounts, is abusive.

And, before anyone asks, I DO hold the same opinions of parents who expose their children to cigarette smoke against their will. Sadly, the laws rarely permit THOSE children to do anything about it.

FWIW, I do smoke on occasion, and I have many 420-friendly friends who light up at my house during parties and get togethers...on my back patio. Nobody smokes ANYTHING inside my home. Not even me.

[jwirr]

21. I agree with you. I once saw a father hold his infant baby girl in his

arms and blow smoke (pot) into her face. I also know that it is very simple to deal with this problem - a friend has a fan in the window of his bedroom - when he wants to smoke he turns the fan on (even in the winter) and blows the smoke out the window. Their home smells just fine. Freedom does not begin at 21. By the way I don't think that MN has legalized medical marijuana.

[reggie the dog]

116. no medical but pot is decriminialized anyways

[Hell Hath No Fury]

38. +1

My whole family smoked cigs when I was a kid -- I could not get away from it if I tried. :cry: It was torture for me, truly torture. As an adult, I am so sensitive to the stuff my nose will get congested with just a few minutes of exposure.

When you smoke, you are sharing whatever it is you are smoking with whoever is around you. :( Not good for children, AT all.

[Codeine]

52. +1 nt

[reggie the dog]

115. it doesnt say hotboxing

i smoke outside generally but so what if i smoke in the bathroom with the window open and the door closed, no one gets second hand smoke but the odor does go throughout the house.

perhaps the odor was on their clothes?

perhaps it was just the odor of the grass being broken up?

[seabeyond]

10. over the last couple days, this board has tripped me in parental thinking.

who knows why the kid finally did this. contact high from pot is real. though i am or use to be into pot, i would never allow my kids to be around the smoke. maybe parents stoned and didn't take care of the kids.

or maybe the dad initiated it.

i dont know

but attack on kid would be humorous if i didn't see adults on this board readily throw kids under the bus if about their agenda. then lecture if that works with agenda.

[closeupready]

13. I know, right? It's more like a high school on some days, than an intelligent discussion board.

And I know precisely what threads you are thinking of. Cheers.

[seabeyond]

14. lol

i am still flabbergasted. this morning was thinking.... really? lol

[undeterred]

31. + 1,000

[reggie the dog]

120. is it throwing a kid under the bus

to think that having loyalty to the state at 11 to the point you rat out your mom for cannabis?

if this was a plot to be able to go live with dad then the dad is the prick for manipulating the kid (though i can understand why the father may do that)

[seabeyond]

180. you are defining the issue, so you can argue. the kid did not want to live in pot smoke and get

contact highs.... or smell it. it is against the law and the parent is asking the kid to do something no parent should expect of their kid. it is a KID. the parent is the ADULT. and the responsible one.

we don't agree on this. i parent differently than you.

regardless if you and i as adults agree, to attack the kid is absurd. you put more responsibility on a 10 yr old than you do adults. we dont know the story. we dont know who did what. we dont know if the kid was neglected or anything else.

[reggie the dog]

270. why is it absurd to attack the narc who made his parents go to jail

for weed? where does it say he got contact highs? where does it say he was in the same room as the smoke? the hitler youth, like DARE, teaches kids to rat out their parents for consensual acts that dont harm others, these parents likely told their kid, rightfully so , that such ideas are bullshit.

i am pretty sure that had i pulled something like this my dad would have stopped taking me out riding, stopped taking me out camping, as he would have no longer trusted me to not narc out his friends,

oh no, i was raised by a hippie and a biker, and i became a neo hippie and raise my kid as such.... and i dont like seeing kids going to the darkside of state loyalty.

[seabeyond]

302. i find it interesting on these issues that deal with things that be harmful, how du takes the

position that their rights exceed all others. and if anyone is bothered about it THEY must suck it up and deal with it quietly.

i know pot. i know behavior. and know the dealing household with the kid. i know contact highs. and i know 8lbs.

i am not going to stand up for the parents.

the best i can do is say... we dont know. as i did in my original post

what i do know, is i am not going to be all over the kid.

[closeupready]

310. Yes, I completely agree. Over the last couple weeks, I've seen the same M.O. play out over

issue after issue. You name it, people here demand 100% that they get absolutely everything they want RIGHT NOW, no ifs ands or buts about it. Or else you are "Stalinist", "authoritarian," God knows what other kinds of awful person you are for raising a concern about others in your life.

[seabeyond]

361. ya know....

i dont know if i dont get it, or i do get it and that is what is so troublesome.

[closeupready]

363. I also think, lol, part of it is simply part of the process of getting older.

When I was younger, I was probably also all about me, me, me. Then, kids happen, friends get sick and die, parents age, you get a mortgage, lose a job, whatever - shit happens, and you realize, life is about more than just what I want. There are others to consider. That's what probably happens to most people, like you and I.

[seabeyond]

364. maybe. probably. assuredly. i knew this and spent ALL 20's doing me me me

there was no question about that. i was 30, got a dog, took care of it and said, maybe.... lol, i can try beyond me, lol.

yes

you are right.

there is also a difference between having a 3 yr old and seeing how they change, and the rules change, lol

[reggie the dog]

322. fair enough, it still bothers me that the kid got the state involved

i never would have done that to my dad or his friends

[seabeyond]

362. probably because you had a lot fo good that gave you no reason to get state involved.

a kid can be abused and they will still go to the abuser to try to get the love. it takes a lot for a parent to alienate a child enough to cause them to do something like this to a parent. i could light up right now and my kids may not be happy, htey may not respect me, but they would not turn me in.

they were selling in the house. dont you get what a cruddy life that is for a kid. lack of security and safe environment to have strangers at all hours. and that is what happens with dealers.

this was not merely a parent lighting up

and you can say it is DARE or hilter, but odds are, it was crappy parents.

[reggie the dog]

412. most dealers just sell to family and friends

the kind of dealers that deal to strangers stand out on a street corner, the rest sell only to people they know. it is not an all hours think either, unlike crack or heroin dealers which often involve dope sick people coming at all hours of the night

[Dorian Gray]

419. Loyalty to the state?

Are you for real?

Doesn't it occur to you that maybe his parents were shitty parents? The pot smoking made them even more shitty parents? And he just hated the smell and their shitty parenting?

What about loyalty to himself and what he wanted? It sounds like he didn't want to live with his mom and step dad any longer, and their pot smoking exacerbated the situation. So he did what HE had to do. It has nothing to do with being loyal to the freaking state.

[laundry_queen]

15. Not the kid's fault

I'm guessing he wasn't the one who was 'fed up'. I'm guessing his biological dad was fed up with the mom and stepdad for some reason and manipulated his child into tattling on the mom and stepdad.

And I'll tell you something else - that biological dad, sticking his nose into his ex's business, trying to demonize that child's mother, getting her arrested and USING that kid to get back at his ex will cause FAR more harm to that little boy than marijuana smoke could. His bio dad is a POS.

[Marrah_G]

16. It's hard to judge the child when you don't know all the facts

There might have been alot behind it.

On the other hand. I lived with someone who's 1 year out of college child would sit downstairs in his basement apartment and smoke skunk weed constantly. It would travel through the vents and the whole fucking house would smell like a skunk. After a long day at work and a long commute I was tempted many times to go down there and bitch... cooking with that smell in the air is not a fun thing.

[Iggo]

89. Actually, it's rather easy to judge the child.

He's 11.

Absolved.

See? Easy!

[etherealtruth]

184. touché

[knitter4democracy]

17. The boy did the right thing, as did his father.

Pot exposure in a child isn't good for him, not for his schoolwork, not for his health. It's still smoke, and he can still get high from it, and if it's bad enough he's complaining and Mom and Stepdad aren't doing anything about it, then dangit, someone should. Dad gave the right answer, and he did the right thing, too. His son's health is at stake, and the mom wasn't changing her behavior, and so it was time for more drastic measures.

If you want to get high, that's your business until your behavior hurts someone else, especially a child. Pot is a drug, period, and I don't know any doctor who'd say that exposure at that age to such a powerful drug is okay unless there's a real medical need for it. It would be the same as slipping Tylenol 3 into his food every day or making him sit around cigarette smoke all day--drugs have lasting effects, especially with higher exposure, and at 11, he's young enough to still get the lasting effects but old enough to know he doesn't like it.

Mom should have protected her kid better from her habit, pure and simple. When he asked her to stop, she should have stopped, at least around him.

[Taverner]

18. Nancy Reagan would be soooo proud

Just say no!

Just say "I didn't know!"

[Codeine]

63. Oh please.

Kids shouldn't be subjected to non-stop hotboxing. People who have kids in their homes should step outside.

[Taverner]

81. Agreed - but turning your parents in???

It's a matter of response

Kind of like the death penalty for parking violations

[MattBaggins]

86. Some other examples

Hasselhofs daughter
The judges daughter who was being abused

If the child wants out they really have only one choice and that is to have hard evidence. The parents going to jail is really stupid but if this child didn't want to live with drugs do they have a right to demand an out?

[Taverner]

87. I see your point - but it still stinks of self-righteousness to me

The kid was in a bad situation, but turning your parents in for smoking pot is low. Especially when there were no reports of abuse.

[MattBaggins]

88. I agree it isn't the best

but an adult would have the right to leave a house with drugs but not a child.

[reggie the dog]

123. non stop hotboxing?

no, just the odor of cannabis, the article says smell. that can be mom and step dad smoking in their room with the door shut.

[msongs]

19. kid coulda just gone to live with his dad instead but the dad wouldnt get any revenge out of that nt

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

20. Who says they had joint custody?

Kids don't get to just decide who they live with, especially young ones.

[joeglow3]

25. Sometimes it would be nice if I could form a conclusion from nothing

Would make life much easier to know everything without ever having to look for facts to support it.

[NeedleCast]

23. In This Thread: Watch DU Beat Down An 11 Year Old Boy

Stay classy DU.

[Broderick]

67. Shaking my head

not surprised by some though.

[HughBeaumont]

78. Love for Weed > Health of Child, apparently.

Rights are rights, but should kids be subjected to contact highs (or in the case of tobacco, contact toxins)?

[Taverner]

101. I don't think its that...its about the reaction

Although I'm kind of split on the issue...

[NeedleCast]

111. In This Thread, The Kid Has Been Called "Turd," "Shitty Kid," "Narc" To Name A Few

He's an 11 year old boy. Pretty fucking sad reflection of some of the posters here.

[Taverner]

121. Well yeah, that shit is uncalled for

I just think his reaction was ill-advised and a bit harsh - but then again, I don't know the entire story

[hughee99]

228. Of course he has, he called the cops on his parents for smoking weed.

We all know that weed has NO negative effects and that people who smoke weed are NECESSARILY good people and good parents, so we can rule out the possibility that there's anything else going on here. His objections weren't to the weed itself (since we know it's ONLY good for you) and it wasn't to bad parenting (since, as smokers, we can rule out any possibility that they were also bad parents or assholes), so it must be because there's something wrong with this kid, or he's being manipulated by someone else.

[Taverner]

235. This is also true

He doesn't deserve the namecalling

But he IS wrong

[hughee99]

236. He's also 11. Eleven year olds sometimes make mistakes.

Though without more info, you can't tell if that is the case here.

[reggie the dog]

271. smoking does not make you a good parent

nor does it make you a bad parent,

if cannabis has negative side effects i still havent experienced any in the past 18 years of use.

did it ever occur to you that some of us get really pissed off to read that "potheads are shitty parents" when we were raised by reefers who were great parents?

[hughee99]

346. I completely agree that smoking doesn't make you a good or bad parent,

however it seems like some people get really pissed off at the suggestion that it's possible that these people were, in fact, shitty parents and that this call to the police was the child's best opportunity to get out of a bad situation.

People are crapping on an 11 year old kid for "narc-ing" on their parents without knowing the whole story. The possibility that these parents aren't doing a very good job seems to be dismissed as a possibility.

[reggie the dog]

348. if the kid was abused and ratted out his parents for abuse

i would have zero problem with it.

the article says the kids gripe was the smell of pot, hardly abuse...the newspaper article spoke of no abuse so i dont think the kid was abused.

then the anti pot comments started with "potheads are horrible parents"
and people saying i shold lose my kid because i show her what reefer looks like, show her the plants growing and smoke where she can see me smoke.

they assume i am unfit to parent because i dont do up the same dope (caffiene, alcohol, tobacco) that they do.


they also assumed that just because one of these 2 parents smoke reefer they are unfit parents, you and i agree that such an idea is bs.

[hughee99]

350. Nothing I saw in the article would give me reason to believe they are unfit parents.

But the article is really short, and I suspect there is more to the story. Without more information, I'm not prepared to start bad mouthing an 11 year old. I understand your point, though.

[reggie the dog]

358. and i understand your point too

i just would have thought that if there were abuse the article would have said something about abuse.

[hughee99]

391. I'd like to believe that's true, but given the state of journalism today... n/t

[reggie the dog]

393. true

the journalist may have hyped up the pot and not talked about other stuff, that is possible now that i think about it.

[FedUpWithIt All]

177. Seriously. n/t

[Union Scribe]

195. +1 They should be embarrassed

But they won't be.

[fishwax]

204. indeed

:wtf:

[Still Blue in PDX]

27. Any kind of smoke in the house is bad for kids. nt

[undeterred]

29. I hate marijuana smoke- it gives me migraines.

It makes a lot of people sick. So maybe this kid was one of them, and his parents were too high to give a shit.

[Codeine]

56. Exactly. Splitting screaming headaches.

My sympathies are entirely with the put-upon child. Some of these people shock the hell out of me.

[Spazito]

34. Wow, the posts verbally condemning an 11 year old child....

for reporting in this thread is astounding and disgusting. I don't give a shit what side of the debate on pot one has, condemning the 11 year old is beyond appalling and, imo, it is this attitude that keeps society from addressing issues regarding protecting children.

[Codeine]

58. But he's a worthless prick of a narc,

according to the douchebags around here anyway.

[Spazito]

65. Yep, beyond appalling n/t

[reggie the dog]

272. i may be a douchebag

but the kid is still a worthless prick for having more loyalty to the state than his own family, he grassed out his family for flowers, fucking flowers. kids have to put up with breathing tobacco smoke and there isnt a damn thing a kid can do about it, so why are you cheering for the inequality of the kid getting to call the cops because it is cannabis being smoked and not tobacco?

[closeupready]

80. A vocal few here seem less liberals and more narcisissts.

That is, not in favor of rights of individuals as a principle, but in favor of rights for themselves where, in an infantile way, they get to dictate to everyone else, no rules for them, no social mores, none of this stupid democracy stuff where you have to persuade others to come together and agree on things.

[Spazito]

85. Yep, the hypocrisy, whether conscious or subconscious,...

being shown in this thread is an eye-opener to me.

[reggie the dog]

127. you think it is good that kids are indoctrinated to rat out parents

at such an early age for a consensual act? and that kids follow through on it? this is hitler youth kind of shit, denouncing ones own parents

nowhere in the article does it say there was smoke in the common area of the home, the smoking area could be the garage but the smell would stay on the clothes.

i would be very angry at my own child for ratting me out to the cops like this in a plot with her mother, you dont rat out your family to the law over consensual crimes PERIOD, its like rule number one for guns, always assume a gun you pick up is loaded, then verify it, one of those rules from childhood that you just dont break.

imagine a child getting their parents thrown in jail for a flower, fucking disgusting,
i tend to think it is one of these stories where it has more to do with the kid not getting something they wanted and making up shit about the parents

[closeupready]

146. "consensual act"? The kid did NOT consent, and is incapable of doing so.

nt

[reggie the dog]

148. did the kid breathe in smoke or just smell odor?

8 pounds in walmart bags would let off quite a bit of odor.

"filling the house with smoke" to an 11 year old can be literal (not good for the kids health but arguably no worse than legal tobacco exposure) or mean that it smelled like a skunk several times a day when dude smoked in the bathroom or his bedroom.

[Dreamer Tatum]

174. You're amazing. I hope you don't have and never have access to children.nt

[reggie the dog]

273. I have a 3 year old daughter

i live with her every day until my ex walked out on me for a younger richer man but i still have split custody.

[Union Scribe]

196. People like you are the reason pot smokers get a bad name. nt

[reggie the dog]

259. because i dont hide it from my kid?

why should i hide pot from my kid? it is not normal that kids in the usa are taught to rat out their parents in school, kids are not indoctrinated like that here in france

[Dreamer Tatum]

173. Just proves that if it ever came down to their dope or their kid, some DUers choose their dope.

which surprises me not.

[Codeine]

187. Weed is always their first and foremost concern.

StonerUnderground.com

[reggie the dog]

274. bullshit, my kid comes first. to have more money for my kid

i started growing weed, now instead of spending 80 euros a month on cannabis i smoke for free.

i live in a place where the state cannot take your kid simply because you have, grow, use or even sell cannabis as it is not proof of child neglect.

[WI_DEM]

250. yes, because pot smoking is so much better than the safety and health of a child

if that child wants to smoke pot or inhale second hand pot--that is up to him. But he's only 11 and those parents should have done their pot smoking away from him.

[cbdo2007]

35. Good!! Wish I had the balls to go back and do the same.

Would have saved me from YEARS of abuse.

[Codeine]

59. You and me both. nt

[metalbot]

40. A slightly more complete story - 8 pounds seized

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/45321974/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/#.TsQF4kMr2nA

Eight pounds is a lot. Either they were dealing, or they were using ridiculously bad weed and smoking it all day.

[lumberjack_jeff]

51. Exactly. A relevant part of the story.

Kid should live with dad.

[reggie the dog]

275. why? because mom is responsable and deals so as to make money

for her family? to make ends meet? and to not spend any money on weed.

really? people who sell some pot to buy groceries, or glasses for their kid, are bad parents and dont deserve their kid?

you probably think that i shouldnt have let my little girl take a walk through my 5 weed plant garden.

[Broderick]

69. But according to some here

the 11 year old is the bad person.

[reggie the dog]

129. hello, they are, the ratted out their parents for a consensual act

with no victim, like a good little nazi

sickening that on a liberal board you cannot see this kid for the fascist tool he is.

big fucking deal the parents sold grass. none of your family sells pot? really? no one? you never had aunts or uncles that sold grass?

must have a family of angels

[hifiguy]

145. Indeed.

"Turn your friends in, turn your parents in, turn your kids in, turn your neighbors in."

A society that views that as normal is subscribing to a Stalinist state of mind.

[closeupready]

155. "Stalinist"! ROFL This forum gets goofier every single freaking day.

:rofl:

[hifiguy]

156. Ratting your neighbors, friends and family out to the government

was encouraged in Eastern Europe and the USSR for decades. It began with Uncle Joe. I take it you've heard of the East German Stasi and the Romanian Securitate during the Ceaucescu era.

There's not one damned thing funny about it.

[Broderick]

158. LMAO

Sometimes I think it is just people strolling around trying to make liberals look bad.

[closeupready]

183. I know, right? That thought honestly did cross my mind today.

Series-ly. :hi: I mean, if not, you can't make this stuff up. DU is worth the $42 membership for the entertainment value ALONE. :)

[Broderick]

185. I wish it were just entertainment

but frankly, it's rather disturbing. The vitriol towards an 11 year old who was struggling, and 8 pounds of pot (THAT IS A LOT) is really beyond me. I gather some aren't really progressive, but more driven towards selfishness at a minimum, but more likely it's an affront on liberals in general so they can go make fun somewhere else.

[reggie the dog]

276. as a liberal i think it should be legal to have pounds of pot

[closeupready]

282. Most people here would not dispute that argument in isolation.

But, as someone states below, when a person becomes a parent, things change.

[reggie the dog]

321. what changed? i must have missed the memo

if i follow your logic once we have kids growing weed, harvesting and keeping it for personal use which means the weed is free is wrong because too much of the plant will be in the house?

buying and reselling weed to make money for food or just to break even and smoke for free is wrong?

but spending 200 dollars a month buying a 50 dollar quarter ounce every week is fine because that way there is not a lot of pot in the house at once?


i should spend 2400 a year on weed so as to never have more than 7 grams to be a good parent but buy growing my own and keeping one to 2 pounds in the house after harvest i am a bad parent??????
it fucking saves me 2400 a year!!!!

[uncle ray]

245. this was a law enforcement family, mom's a PO.

i wonder how many people she's sent to jail for pissing hot?

[Crunchy Frog]

255. I think we just arrived at Godwin.

[Dorian Gray]

420. Fascist tool?

You have not once given consideration to the child's emotional state in all of this.

[riderinthestorm]

41. Nobody should be forced to take drugs against their will. The boy's parents are essentially forcing

him to get high with them in the house. I can't believe the number of people on this thread going after this kid. The PARENTS are the ones at fault. If their kid asked them to stop, that should have been the end of it (in front of him, or whenever it might affect him. Go ahead and do it while he's at school/soccer/boy scouts/music lessons - whatever. But NOT when he's there).

I don't care if the biological dad is behind it, it doesn't matter at all. Once the boy asked his mom and step dad to stop, that should have ended it immediately.

[seabeyond]

55. i agreee iwth you. but reality, the boy should never have had to even ASK parent to stop

lol

you know.

there is just some duh's in parenting.

[redqueen]

61. +1

It's not exactly rocket science here. FFS.

[Codeine]

66. Precisely.

Abuse is abuse.

[reggie the dog]

131. abuse? what abuse?

tobacco users can legally smoke all they want in the presence of their children and it does not constitute abuse and tobacco smoke is far worse for humans than cannabis smoke

secondly the articles does not say that they smoked it in the living room, it could just be the smell coming from the basement or garage.

what abuse?

[Codeine]

186. I'd certainly consider it abusive to smoke tobacco indoors with a kid.

It's vile, stupid, selfish, childish, and pathetically weak to expose kids to that shit just because someone can't function without being fucking baked all the damned time.

[reggie the dog]

130. stop because the kid doesnt like the smell?

if i smoke outside the smell comes in on my clothes, i should stop smoking because the kid doesnt like the smell of my clothes? really?

where does it say that they smoked grass in the common areas of the home? many people i know smoke in their garage only.

[seabeyond]

181. i read up above from you the parents are sellers. been to houses buying pot with kids around

not a pretty picture. people in and out, all hours....

nope

not buying it.

uncomfortable with it even when they were not my kids.

[reggie the dog]

278. what is wrong with a kid seeing someone buying or selling pot?

kids see parents buy alcohol at the grocery store.

i have friends who sell some hash and while the kids dont see the money for hash handoff he doesnt invite people over late to do that kind of business.

when i used to buy hash i would take my kid to play with his kid and we would have dinner too, i would bring cookies for the whole family

i really dont see the problem with this.

[Codeine]

188. Actually if the smell of smoke on my clothes bugged my kids

I'd probably take that as a good reason to quit.

Of course I've never smoked weed or tobacco and never will, but from a theoretical standpoint. . .

[Dorian Gray]

421. Yep

You should stop. If your child objects to your use of it, and the smell bothers him or her, you should stop. Or at least ensure that it won't bother your child again.

[closeupready]

82. But he's interfering with their freedom to smoke pot!

:sarcasm: :eyes:

[reggie the dog]

133. would you support putting people in jail for smelling like tobacco

in their own home and for running a tobacco shop?

where did you read that the kid was breathing in the smoke?

how do you know that dad doesnt smoke tobacco around the kid anyways?

you assume the worst from the get go.

[closeupready]

154. Smoking pot is illegal in Minnesota. So try again.

nt

[reggie the dog]

166. i know

you didnt answer my question, change cannabis for tobacco, you favor jail? or not? so why do you favor jail for cannabis?

[Iggo]

71. To be fair, he's 11.

Jeez.

[Broderick]

73. Doesn't matter it seems

some here will show their real colors, and do it on a daily basis.

[JVS]

93. Enjoy foster care, kid.

[Spazito]

99. He has a Dad....

The parents in question are the mother and the step-dad NOT his biological father who is part of his son's life.

Your post is pathetic in it's implication and it's display of ignorance as to the facts.

[chrisa]

102. He probably will a lot more now that he doesn't have to inhale drugs all day.

[Upton]

108. Remind me of the DARE program

I think it was..which encouraged kids to turn in their parents, claiming they would get them help, as if pot smokers need it anyway, when in actuality all those parents got was a jail cell. The kids foster care. No child should be encouraged to turn in their parents over something as harmless as weed. I'm surprised, though perhaps maybe I shouldn't be, there are people on DU supporting that kind of shit..

[hifiguy]

157. +100 nt

[Union Scribe]

197. Link?

I went through DARE programs. I was never told to turn in my parents.

[reggie the dog]

281. I was, a cop taught me young

perhaps 5 or 6 and they repeated it up until jr high. i had dare in in the suburbs of chicago

believe me you dont forget having a cop teach you in school that your parents dont deserve to raise you

[ohheckyeah]

107. I think this was a terrible way to handle things

on the father's part. He pitted his son against his mother and possibly caused great damage to that relationship for life. I think the father should have had a discussion with the mother and told her where things stood and what the consequences would be if she didn't change the situation for the child. Encouraging a child to help in getting a parent put in jail just doesn't seem like an adult or emotionally healthy way to deal with this except as a last resort.

[geardaddy]

124. And this post wins the thread.

[ohheckyeah]

134. Thank you. n/t

[KittyWampus]

243. How do you know the bio-father hasn't tried to discuss this already? If the potheads had 8 pounds

there's a good chance she forgot that discussion.

[reggie the dog]

283. why would they forget? pot doesnt give you blackouts

i stil have over a pound of what i harvested this fall and still do a fine job teching jr high and university students, raising my daughter, doing my bike riding.

they were likely dealers so they have to keep track of expenses and assets.

[LanternWaste]

117. There are indeed Sacred Cows on DU...

There are indeed Sacred Cows on DU... and an eleven year old certainly ain't one of them.

[redqueen]

122. Don't you dare say anything bad about porn, though!

:nuke:

[LanternWaste]

128. Series!!!!

BTW... glad to see you posting again. :)

[grantcart]

126. Neither is science - if it conflicts with lifestyle

increasing research is rasing the possibility that early exposure to MJ may effect teen and preteen brain development.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/02/090202175105.htm

unless it is proven otherwise then parents who expose their kids to it should be prosecuted.

Making critical distinctions like this is part of the legalization process.

[Tatiana]

136. +1

Do it on your own or away from chidren, but parents who expose their young children to MJ are bad parents, IMO. Same goes for cigarette smoke as well.

[great white snark]

137. Interesting, thanks.

"Making critical distinctions like this is part of the legalization process."
:thumbsup:

p.s: You are one of the reasons I joined this forum. I wish you would post more often.

[reggie the dog]

286. you are full of shit, and your like proves it

"ScienceDaily (Feb. 2, 2009) — Adolescents and young adults who are heavy users of marijuana are more likely than non-users to have disrupted brain development, according to a new study"

this kid is not a heavy marijuana user. there is no evidence the kid was ever in the same room as the smoke

we know tobacco smoke is bad for kids and there is no possiblity to prosecute parents for exposing kids to tobacco smoke so why the double standard for cannabis?

[FedUpWithIt All]

179. + + + + + +

[Codeine]

189. Ain't it the fucking truth? nt

[Nye Bevan]

132. What a horrible position to put your 11-year old son in.

Confused and scared, not sure if he is doing the right thing. Shame on the "shitty kid / little turd" brigade.

[FedUpWithIt All]

313. This is a really good post. n/t

[fascisthunter]

138. Ouch!

[mitchtv]

140. No smoking at our house-inside

discretion for out doors, but no one has to hide either.As for the kid, I hope he wanted to live with his dad, I don't think he can appreciate what might happen to his mother.

[Capitalocracy]

143. If it were legal, they could smoke outside

As they should.

[reggie the dog]

289. right, but if you live in town

you have to smoke inside so the neighbors dont see and rat you out.

when i lived in town i smoke in the bathroom, i live in the countryside now so i smoke outside

[ohheckyeah]

144. My dad is an alcoholic

and at the age of 17 I outed him. Not to the police but to a trusted individual who helped him get treatment and into AA. It changed my family forever for the better. Turning him into the police would have blown my family apart and would have been a burden I would have had trouble living with.

I don't think the father really thought this through and I don't think he acted in the best interest of the child. Nor did the mother and stepfather. I feel for the child and hope the parents and stepparent learn how to deal with things in a better manner.

I think all three of the adults should be ashamed and I hope the child doesn't take the burden of guilt on himself for being a part in his mother being put in jail. The adults betrayed the child on every single level.

[KittyWampus]

244. How do you know the father is the manipulator? How do you know whether he tried to reason with the

pothead mother?

[reggie the dog]

290. how do you know the mother is a pothead?

the stepdad smoked and admitted to it. the mother of my child never uses cannabis. i do.

plus not all users are "potheads" i smoke every day so i qualify for that but what would you call my girlfriend who uses cannabis once or twice a month?

[reggie the dog]

147. this is a moral crusade, and the kid broke rule number one

DONT RAT OUT ON FAMILY, HELL ANYBODY, FOR CONSENSUAL ACTS! physical, sexual abuse you rat out. Mom or step dad smoking in their bedroom no. where does it say that they smoked in the same room with the kid even? kids talk in generalities, filling the house with smoke all the time could mean that dude smokes by the window in the bathroom but that the whole place smells like a skunk, just aroma no smoke, for ten minutes say 3 or 4 times a day,

turning in ones own kin over some grass does not sit well with how i was raised at all.

in the other longer article linked below "These allegations raise moral concerns and legal concerns," said Washington County Attorney Pete Orput, according to the Minneapolis Star-Tribune.

[Nye Bevan]

149. Actually, the *real* "rule number one" is to not put your children in that situation (nt)

[reggie the dog]

151. so you let the government win the culture war?

you make your kid see a world in which using dangerous alcohol and tobacco is seen as normal yet dont also show them that using much safer cannabis is normal? i know many many parents, especially in france where they dont take your kids away for grass, who smoke where their kids can see them in open air. it is the whole "normalization" approach. it is nothing the kid wont see later in high school anyways.

[pipi_k]

171. No...here's what you do

You teach your kids that, although pot may not be as harmful as cigarettes or alcohol, it's ILLEGAL.

and until it becomes LEGAL, it's a crime to use it.

Or, if it's illegal and you want to use it, you do the smart thing and don't use it in front of your kid.

You don't start your kid out in life teaching him to embrace double standards.

[reggie the dog]

258. i dont have double standards

i smoke weed because the law in unjust, and i raise my kid to not respect unjust laws.

[pipi_k]

351. Hah!

So, by those standards, we should all teach our kids to disrespect laws WE think are "unjust".


And that's all it takes. If WE think the law is unjust...just go out and break it.


In front of our kids, no less.

Meh. OK.

Most people grow out of the "I'm gonna do it because it's illegal/bad/unkind/etc." stage when they're teenagers.

[reggie the dog]

292. i did tell my daughter it is illegal

i told her that daddy doesnt like seeing helicopters in the sky near harvest time, played her the song "police in helicopters" and told her it was one of the laws that doesnt respect people as free beings in control of their own minds.

[pipi_k]

168. How the hell is a kid

supposed to know what the "rules" are?

Yeah, smoking pot may be "consensual", but it's illegal.

So, what...the parents sit the kid down and tell him that A, B, and C illegal acts can be reported, but X, Y, and Z can not?

Nice way to fuck up a kid's head.


Here's a nifty idea...responsible parents don't expose their kids to ANY act that's illegal. That way the KID isn't left with the problem of wondering why he's responsible for being the one who has to deal with ADULT issues.


PS...my son, who has two daughters (10 and 8) smokes pot. He knows enough NOT to do it in front of them, and does it out in his little man-cave with the door locked. And if either of his girls ever caught him doing it and reported him, he would be the first to tell them they did the right thing. Because he's, you know, an adult.

[reggie the dog]

297. in his man cave with his door locked because you made him ashamed

of who he is to the point that he hides himself from his kids. and you are proud? proud that he is literraly in the closet?


"So, what...the parents sit the kid down and tell him that A, B, and C illegal acts can be reported, but X, Y, and Z can not?"
that is it exactly, teach the kids that crimes with victims can be reported as there is a victim but that "victimless" crime is not a crime because there is no victim and the state is out of line for making such laws.

"Nice way to fuck up a kid's head." actually, no, it make me see our government as being full of shit, which is true, at an early age. responsible parents dont expose their kids to any illegal acts???? what????

no taking the kid to protests which are declared illegal by the cops then either right?

i will NEVER hide in a cave and smoke so my daughter thinks that i dont use weed. she sees alcohol users all over the place and i am not one of them, i will not let the alcohol people be shown to my daughter as normal and hid cannabis people from her. she can see that of all my normal friends most use pot and alcohol and that alcohol is far worse than pot. she also sees that daddy never smokes tobacco or uses alcohol but that he smokes the green flowers he grows.

being 2 faced and hiding what we smoke from our kids is all the rage in the usa but honesly in france most hash smokers dont hide it at all.

[Robb]

169. Cosa Nostra parenting. You should write a book.

Baby needs a new pair of cement shoes?

[Codeine]

192. "Omerta for Families."

"Ratting Out Daddy: How to Avoid Being a Nasty Little Prick"

"The Godfather Lessons: Mario Puzo's Guide to Raising Moral Crusaders"

[pipi_k]

222. Wonder if there will be a scene

where the kid wakes up to find his teddy bear's bloody head next to him in his bed

[Dorian Gray]

422. Bwah...

I love this post.

[closeupready]

345. Three days since this discussion began, and that is still making me laugh out loud.

:rofl:

[reggie the dog]

298. i was taught like that, my cousins

my kid, my friends and now their kids, yep,
it is not hard to understand, no victim no crime. perhaps this is why it is so easy for me to understand that idea and so difficult for so many others.

[Codeine]

191. Rule number one is to keep your kids out of a house of dealers, actually.

Rule number one is realizing that kids are more important with one's imagined need to be permanently high or drunk. If smoking weed in the house makes a kid that fucking miserable (and it can -- my parents smoked that filthy shit non-stop and I hated them for it) then maybe the parents should knock it off.

[Nye Bevan]

194. +1. Kids growing up have enough to deal with

without worrying about whether they should report their parents for using illegal drugs.

[reggie the dog]

300. which is why you teach them not to narc on ANYONE for drugs

EVER! drugs are a personally choice, not the choice of the state. it is a freedom thing. you think that kids acting as agents of the states, little live in spies, is normal, that is fucked up.

[reggie the dog]

299. keep your kids out of a dealers house?

my old dealer, now i grow my own, is one of my best friends and was a friend before he started to deal. my kid can damn well see my friends. you talk as if people who sell cannabis are some kind of degenerates.

[TheKentuckian]

150. Blood might be thicker than water but it isn't as thick as the drug war.

[pipi_k]

159. Wow, I can't believe people are slamming the kid

Hey, I don't care what people do with their own bodies. They wanna smoke pot, go right ahead. I don't like it, personally, and I absolutely HATE the smell of it. It nauseates me.

So an 11 year old kid complains about the smell (a number of times, apparently), and his mother and her husband care so little about him they can't even set aside one room of the house and open the windows, or do it outside?

Nice "parents"

:eyes:


PS...and if the stepfather smokes it for "medicinal purposes", the house wouldn't have been raided. So it's being smoked illegally. Nice lesson to teach your kid. You do illegal shit, you're gonna be busted. Even by a kid, who sounds like the only adult in that house.

[reggie the dog]

301. medical pot is illegal in minnesota

plus how do you know that the parents didnt smoke in the bedroom and that the smell is what the kid didnt like, not the smoke.

"You do illegal shit, you're gonna be busted. Even by a kid, who sounds like the only adult in that house."

this is so like the hitler youth, fucking scary shit!

you care more about teaching a kid to blindly follow all laws rather than using critical thinking to determine whether or not their act is actually a crime hurting someone.

and you think i am the crazy one.

[aikoaiko]

160. I would never put my child in the position of watching me commit an arrestable crime ...

...and repeatedly at that.

Its a lot for a little kid to handle.

At the same time, I think pot should be completely decriminalized.

[reggie the dog]

304. why? the "crime" is not immoral, the law is

teach your kids that breaking immoral laws is patriotic.

if you were black you would not have drank out of a whites only fountain in front of your kids?

if you were in a mixed race couple when it was still illegal you wouldnt have had kids to see you in that illegal state?

you would not have done alcohol in front of them during prohibition?

you would not peacfully gather in a public park to demand change in the political system in front of your kid (it is an arrestable crime after all)

[Name removed]

170. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[krabigirl]

172. People using medicinal cannabis should be really discreet around kids, especially at that age.

Not even talking about the smoke here (shouldn't be done in the same room as non-consenting people fwiw), but the fact that kids of that age (about 7-12 more or less imo) are usually very into trusting "authority" and why the DARE program is pushed so hard in the fifth grade. A few years later, they start to question things and so on, but at that age or younger, it's pretty much the opposite. So it would be a good idea to be uber-discreet, even for medical uses.

Heck, I've had friends' kids chide me about drinking wine with dinner because of what they heard in DARE. I laughed, but it was unsettling. Moderation in anything doesn't seem to be valued or taught here.

[aikoaiko]

182. It's true tha most kids that age are dualistic in their thinking. Something is good or bad.

[slay]

190. While I agree that people shouldn't smoke around kids

the father shouldn't have encouraged his kid to be a rat either. Hopefully they will just cook it into brownies next time.

[Name removed]

198. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[slay]

200. Not true at all. Some people need it for medical conditions. Why would OWS ever unite w/Tea Party?

tea party peeps are welcome to join the #ows movement i'm sure - but we don't think we are Taxed Enough Already - #OWS has nothing to do with that - quite the opposite when it comes to the rich.

[Name removed]

202. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[slay]

203. According to the article - the husband did get medical MJ

or smoked for medical purposes. i'm not one to judge why they are doing it - but I agree - shouldn't do it around kids.

i don't think #OWS will ever agree that taxes should be lowered on the rich, cause well, they shouldn't - the rich should be paying much MUCH more, but other than that, you're right - the TP are part of the 99%.

[fujiyama]

I find it ridiculous that many here are blaming the kid

or claiming the biological father has "some agenda". Perhaps he did. It's possible...but maybe he was just looking out for his son.

But either way, it doesn't fucking matter. The kid is 11. He didn't want to live around pot smoke. And it's illegal, regardless if you or I think prohibition against marijuana is incredibly stupid (and believe me I do, and I enjoy smoking every so often as well). But if I had a kid, I certainly wouldn't be smoking around him or her!

The mother and step father should have been much more discrete if they wanted to smoke weed. Smoke it outside, during the night after the kid's asleep. Or get a sitter and do it away from the home.

[fujiyama]

199. I find it ridiculous that many here are blaming the kid

or claiming the biological father has "some agenda". Perhaps he did. It's possible...but maybe he was just looking out for his son.

But either way, it doesn't fucking matter. The kid is 11. He didn't want to live around pot smoke. And it's illegal, regardless if you or I think prohibition against marijuana is incredibly stupid (and believe me I do, and I enjoy smoking every so often as well). But if I had a kid, I certainly wouldn't be smoking around him or her!

The mother and step father should have been much more discrete if they wanted to smoke weed. Smoke it outside, during the night after the kid's asleep. Or get a sitter and do it away from the home.

[Romulox]

201. People who support the War on Drugs should own it and stop using children as an excuse.

[seabeyond]

205. what, more of the "fuck the children" crowd? nt

[Romulox]

208. I can understand perhaps a third of what you post. Just thought I'd put that out there. nt

[seabeyond]

210. do you think as a parent, i am offended that i have concerns for my children? really? that is the

fucked up mentality of du

it does not embarass me that i "think" about my children.

go figure, i know that concept is wayyyyyyy out there.

[Romulox]

212. See, there you go. I get the gist of it, but I do not understand the specifics of your first

question.

Especially since all of the ideas that you are presumably refuting aren't ideas that I've presented. :shrug:

[seabeyond]

214. this is an OP about a child sittin in a bad place. people attacked that child. you are more

concerned with war on drugs than the actual child. i can only guess, since you put up the snarky, think about the children.

wouldnt the opposite then be

fuck the children?

[Romulox]

215. How do you know the child "(is) sittin in a bad place" though? You've assumed your premise--

to whit, that because the child smells marijuana, it is per se abuse.

I think your premise doesn't hold without more evidence. Did the kid have clothing? Heat? Shelter? Three squares? How are his grades? Does he have friends at school? THESE are the questions that must be answered to determine if the kid "(is) sittin in a bad place".

You've just declared him to be abused because of the pot--you haven't made your case therefore.

[seabeyond]

217. you are right. you convinced me. the kid is skank and parents angels. i see the little halos now.

let's diss the boy.

[Romulox]

225. I didn't say any of the things you've mentioned, so you're not being honest. nt

[pipi_k]

219. Just because a kid has

a place to live, food, clothing, heat, etc., that doesn't mean he's not being emotionally abused.

Or, at the very least...neglected.

I grew up with an alcoholic father.

We had all of those creature comforts.

What we didn't have was a DAD.

He was so involved in his addiction (and my mother, as co-dependent, with him) that my sisters and I might just as well had NOT had parents.

When we weren't being ignored, we were the cause of everything that happened, and the rules were never the same from one day to the next.

Material things don't mean shit when a kid has to deal with the fallout from adult issues.

[Romulox]

226. All valid points. But abuse has to be SUBSTANTIATED. Smelling pot isn't per se abuse. nt

[Broderick]

230. If the conversation was about a happy meal

or tobacco, the conversation would be far different.

But when it's pot smoke filling a house and 8 lbs of it sitting around; the conversation is quite different. Sacred cow.

[reggie the dog]

307. how would a kid rat out their parents over tobacco or happy meals?

if people want to make their kids fat feeding them happy meals that is their affair, if they want to give their kids lung problems smoking tobacco that is their affair, there are no laws against such behaviour because they do not constitute abuse or neglect.

[Broderick]

427. Plenty of conversation on the laws here

where certain cities have banned the happy meal and smoking tobacco around kids or in cars with kids was discussed.

[pipi_k]

251. Well, I'm really not claiming that smelling pot

is abuse.

What I am saying is that when two adults are doing something that is currently ILLEGAL in front of a child, they can't get all pissed off if the kid reports it. Nor can anyone else.

And if the "parents" are so self centered that when the kid said he didn't like the smell, they continued to IGNORE his wishes and smoke it where he could smell it, then that's being a shitty parent.

When you have kids, your life stops revolving around YOU.

and when it's still all about the parents, that's neglect, at the very least.

[reggie the dog]

306. alcohol and cannabis are not the same drugs

cannabis fucks you up way less than alcohol. i never use alchol, havent for over ten years now, not a drop. cannabis is daily because it doesnt impair you, you just feel a bit different and go on with chores, playing with the kid etc.

[FedUpWithIt All]

206. Some of us were the children.

We're entitled to ask that others think of the children because we were the children who could have benefited from some concern.

There are a number of things that children should be protected from, that adults do not need protection from, due to the fact that children are relatively voiceless in society regarding their own needs.

[Dreamer Tatum]

207. Look, the message is clear: a joint in the mouth trumps all reason, logic, morals, ethics.

concern, responsibility, duty, judgment, and any other corny social construct that has served human development well
over the millenia. The divine right to TOKE THE FUCK OUT supersedes ANY social or filial obligation we can feebly
suggest.

Fuck my narc kids, mannnnnnnn. I'm TOKIN' OUT.


:eyes:

[closeupready]

277. Yup. Like, some people took Cheech & Chong a little too seriously, as kids.

nt

[FedUpWithIt All]

305. I'm just glad that this thread has shown some true colors.

That children sometimes get lost in the discussion of the beloved weed...or worse. Not all threads on DU take this turn.

[reggie the dog]

308. what are the ethics for busting these parents?

what moral reason can they go do jail?

holy shit! you think that my dad didnt fulfil his obligations to me?

i said the kid is a prick for getting the cops involved, not for bitching about the smell.

[Dreamer Tatum]

379. I would say that yes, someone failed you horribly, as you fail your kid now. nt

[reggie the dog]

400. no someone failed you horribly as you fail your children now

you support continued double standards between alcohol and cannabis, villify me for thinking it horrible that a child ratted their parents out to the cops for hemp flowers (something perfectly legal from 1776 to 1937), and probably accept that your kids see alcohol on the dinner table.

holy shit! seriously??? in the usa it is good that a kid ratted out his parents to the cops who busted them because they had hemp flowers,

the idea that people can go to jail for having the "wrong" flower is horrible enough but that people here cheer it as somthing good blows my mind.

[Romulox]

209. My dad was an alcoholic, as are many millions of American parents (no doubt including some posters

here on DU.)

And yet something in our history suggests that forming a police state around alcohol is a grave mistake. Strange how we can't learn from the past!

[FedUpWithIt All]

218. And if a child of an alcoholic parent reported to the authorities

that the alcoholics home is not a healthy environment for him/her to live in? That does happen as well and i cannot imagine people would be insulting, belittling the child as "worthless prick" or little narc.

This has NOTHING to do with wanting a police state and everything to do with the rights of a child to seek out a healthy environment using whatever means available to him. This boy believed his parents 8 pound stash was leading to an unhealthy environment and i suspect HE knows better than the posters here what the truth, which led to his action, is.

[Romulox]

227. Nothing is typically done in such cases. Perhaps a social worker will visit. nt

[FedUpWithIt All]

232. And nothing is typically done in the case of children in homes with pot smokers.

This instance is very non-typical as most children are not aware that they have options other than to endure whatever type of treatment their parents subject them to. But occasionally, in either instance, a child does speak out and stand up for themselves. That is what this boy did.

Regardless, this has nothing to do with a public war on drugs and everything to do with this boy's rights. Parents should not even put their children in this type of position.

[seabeyond]

234. it was the eight pounds that did it.

and

i am sorry for what you went thru growing up. i have seen it with mom adn how it effected her. and my brother and what it has done to niece and 2 nephews. not pretty at all.

[FedUpWithIt All]

246. Thank you seabeyond. Really, thank you.

The truth is, the further removed i become from that portion of my life the more grateful i am for my experiences. It isn't hard for me to put myself into the shoes of some very downtrodden people, particularly children. I was a very fortunate person in that there were a couple of people who really let me know that the life i was being subjected to wasn't the only option. This combined with a couple of profound experiences and I knew young that i could choose different for myself and i have. But i am fully aware that this is more of a rarity and that most abused and neglected children do not have this in their lives.

The real struggle now comes with seeing things like the treatment of this boy here. Kids can be so helpless and when they are being mistreated by those who are supposed to be protecting them and looking out for their health and well being there can be real long lasting damage. Sometimes whole lives are suffered to endure unimaginable pain just because a child is taught young that they have no value and so they seek things that mirror this misconception. Tragic waste of something that would otherwise, under more responsible care, have the potential for wonderful achievement, great love and hope.

[seabeyond]

257. now that the kids are almost adult teenagers and a little older, having made many poor choices

i think that is the hardest challenge. for them to get it, in their heart, this is not the norm. i had them over a lot for the soil purpose of showing them a different way, different choices.

one that is almost 17 who would be all over my son saying how he didn't have the freedom, and was a prude, and restricted got out of juvie after a year and half. the first thing he said to son, (i heard in the distance and smiled) was, ... you were right.

they use to be so close, but as he started taking a different path, my oldest had no desire to be around him anymore.

still, i have two nieces and two nephews i have to some how get them to KNOW, that is not a life the are relegated to. it is so hard to change the only thing you know and are comfortable with, regardless of the obvious pitfalls.

[FedUpWithIt All]

279. You may not know until much later, or even ever, the impact you've had on them.

But nothing goes without consequence and unconditional love and support is one of those things that can have to most power.

[seabeyond]

303. .

:hug:

i am hoping. i hear ya.

[reggie the dog]

311. options, you do the stasi proud

you probably want laws to make it so we can put parents in jail for smoking tobacco in their bedroom and smelling like it in the rest of the house.

[reggie the dog]

309. at 11 the kid understands that the pot was sold to buy his food

and so he ratted out his parents? how can 8 pounds of a flower lead to an unhealthy environment? its a fucking flower. i have over a pound in my house, its a plant, you grow it, it harvests in the fall so you keep it in jars until next fall.

oh no... what a shitty environment for my kid. how did i ever make it out of my own childhood?

[FedUpWithIt All]

316. I also had hippie parents who did drugs. Would you like to compare notes?

I assure you, not many come out of those homes praising their upbringing and if the child in the OP was one who felt like many of us do about our parents use and subsequent neglect and abuse, then you have no right to insult him further for protecting himself with at least equal vigor to that which you are displaying toward your desire to defend and protect your precious "flowers".

[reggie the dog]

320. compare notes

what do you have against your parents?

did you get indoctrinated by dare?

too much shit from conventional kids and their conventional parents for your parents being different?

where is this kid being abused? keep in mind that making kids breathe in tobacco smoke does not constitute abuse legally speaking so how can doing the same with cannabis be abuse except for in a legal system that persecutes some cultures and not others.

[FedUpWithIt All]

326. I wasn't in school enough to participate in something like a DARE program.

No i was too busy trying to get my mother to put her clothes back on outside the McDonalds, preventing her from jumping out of cars in the freeway...from braining her boyfriend with a brick or stopping the flow of blood when she stabbed him.

I was too busy looking for food for my siblings and myself after being left for over a month alone with them and after the food ran out (We were also told to "keep secrets" and i was afraid to tell my other family that we were hungry), way too busy cleaning up her boyfriends urine after he pissed and passed out in my bedroom doorway, days after he and his high friends discussed at length, in my presence, how they each wanted to be the one to "bust my...".

I was too busy consoling my brother after she told him, when he was 10 and had recently been caught in the bathroom, to "go jack off", which was quite amusing to her high friends who laughed in spite of the crying child in their midst. I was too busy trying to keep my brothers safe from her so she wouldn't again rev her car engine at the seaside and tell them, 3 and 6, that she was tired of them and life and was going to drive them all into the lake.... "what do you have against your parents?" Shall i fucking go on?

DARE...please.

[reggie the dog]

334. i am sorry you had degenerates for parents, really i am

but you cant lump their behaviour to pot, if people are pissing themselves, not feeding you etc. there is way more than pot use going on. plus not telling secrets to cops about drug use is different from a blanket "dont tell secrets to anyone".

again i fail to see cannabis being the cause of your parents behaviour.

[FedUpWithIt All]

338. First, you have not always distingushed in this thread when you say things like "Drug users are ...

responsible".

Second, you are the one calling this boy from the OP, who's home life and circumstances YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT, a worthless prick.

Third, not all children, PARTICULARLY AT 3, (i have a 3 yr old climbing on my at this moment so i speak what i know) are able to distinguish what is or is not appropriate to tell. And what about a hypothetical like the following, suppose your daughter were abused by someone you expose her to (nd don't say you're certain that could never happen because that would expose you as even more clueless than you already appear) and your daughter, being "indoctrinated" (to borrow a word from you) to keep secrets for drug users, was afraid to tell about the abuse because it would expose your friend's AND YOUR OWN drug use? Are you certain, absolutely certain, that you know how she would process such things? How can ANYONE say they are certain of another person's perception and thought process? You put your daughter in very serious potential danger when you play the games that you are playing with her.

You use words like indoctrination and then tell us how you TRAIN your toddler to protect your *illegal* activity that you CHOOSE to practice openly and in front of her. IRONIC

[reggie the dog]

347. my "illegal" activity is not immoral

someone abusing her is immoral, i teach her to talk and rat out people for immoral acts. i know that abuse happens from people we never susupect so i know it is possible. my dad stressed to me when he told me not to rat out for drugs, that you damn well should rat out for touching or other abuse.

my daughter can rat out anyone who would ever abuse her family or not, that is what i teach her. i tell her that if anyone hurts her she needs to tell mommy or daddy.

i train my daughter to not be a rat to the state and not to fight a culture war against daddy.

the fucking state would lie to her with DARE but ??, what??? i looked out for her interests and left the shitty USA 8 years ago.

[Dorian Gray]

423. A 3 year old

is incapable of distinguishing a moral or immoral illegal activity.

[dotymed]

216. Personally, I think this shows parental alienation, up close.

I, as a personal choice, never smoked weed around my children. Eventually, I began to smoke cigarettes outside because of the second hand smoke and the lingering odor.

I think there is a world of difference between smoking pot and (for instance) smoking meth. I do not believe that if you are a "pot-head," you are necessarily a bad parent. I think that a good parent is one who stays involved, in a positive manner, in their child's life. IMO, a parent who stayed drunk around his/her child would probably be a worse example for their child.

I know that parental alienation is a major problem in our society. Yet, many courts do not even recognize that this occurs. If one parent instructs their child to spy on, take photographs,etc. of the other parent in compromising situations, then they are alienating the child from their other parent. Of course there are exceptions. "Dangerous" activities may need to be documented in order to remove the child from the danger. Meth labs, bomb making, out-of-control drunken parties, etc. can and do jeopardize a child's safety.

[Rex]

224. That it went as far is it did, imo, is a failure in parenting.

They obviously put their own self-interests above the childs. Even if the man does have a script...outside was to hard to get to? I know people that have kids and smoke cigs...outside the house, they always go outside to smoke so the kids don't have to smell it/suffer from second hand smoke.

[reggie the dog]

312. go outside in a non medical cannabis state and smoke in front of

strangers so as to not be ratted out by your own family? that is what you suggest?

[Rex]

409. Yeah right, open the frontdoor and yell out you are about to SMOKE

SOME SWEET MARY JANE, also make sure you are naked. They have these things called privacy fences and backyards...maybe you've never heard of them.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

229. And of course, DU faults the kid.

God forbid you put aside your 8 pounds of weed for "medical" purposes and provide a halfway decent environment for your kid.

Or at the very least, use a vaporizer, for God's sake.

[Dreamer Tatum]

231. Yeah, when I need painkillers, I get 5,000 vicodin at once.

8 POUNDS of weed?

Someone please explain why someone who has a MM "prescription" needs 8 POUNDS OF WEED.

Unless they're SELLING it, but that CAN'T be true. :eyes:

[EOTE]

248. Where is the 8 pounds mentioned?

I've heard that reference a number of times in this thread, but it's not in the article. Was the 8 pounds simply made up?

[Dreamer Tatum]

256. I don't make things up. Link:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57326838-504083/11-year-old-boy-helps-bust-parents-for-marijuana-possession/

[msanthrope]

285. Google is your friend. She's also a parole officer. Now, can you smell hypocrisy?

Want to bet on how many times she's busted people for having a dirty sample?

Look, being a LEO with 8 pounds of pot? She's a dealer.

[msanthrope]

288. wrong place.

[reggie the dog]

314. say you planted 10 plants last year

7 were male, 3 female but one got eaten by a deer so you harvested 2 plants and got 3 pounds. This year 7 female plants, all harvested and you have 8 pounds.

otherwise they were selling but at least we know that the pot is not a money loss but a money gainer for the family.

[closeupready]

247. I know. Just unbelievable. But for some, everything is ALL ABOUT THEM.

And fuck everyone else.

[msanthrope]

291. Drug addicts tend to be self-absorbed. nt

[FedUpWithIt All]

329. + + + + + + + + + + + +

[Shrek]

233. For those who fault the kid

What if it were 8 pounds of . . .

. . . crystal meth?

. . . anthrax?

. . . ricin?

. . . child porn?

. . . ammonium nitrate?

. . . hand grenades?


Is an 11-year-old qualified to judge which laws apply to everyone but his parents?

[reggie the dog]

315. here you go

8 pounds of meth? once again adults with drugs or selling drugs to other adults should not be illegal, there is no victim.

anthrax? unless daddy had 8 pounds of old rap/metal albums yeah that would be a time to rat out daddy for plotting to kill lots of people

ricin, same as for anthrax,

child porn, rat the fucker out

ammonium nitrate (depends, is daddy a farmer?) if not yeah rat out daddy for bomb making

hand grenades are rattable too, now if there is a civil war going on all of the bio and other weapons would be fine to have.

[pipi_k]

330. There's a big difference between

"should not be illegal" and IS illegal.

If something is illegal...and I don't care what it is...it should NOT be done in the presence of children. Period.

If and when it no longer is illegal, then do away, with moderation, if appropriate.

But doing something illegal in front of a kid and then expecting the kid to know the difference between what illegal things are OK to report and what aren't OK is insane.

Kids have enough trouble with black and white issues without putting that kind of burden on them.

[reggie the dog]

335. i disagree

i understood early on the the laws were out of line and it made me question authority from about age 6 or 7. also it is not normal that kids learn in dare that they have the option of ratting out their parents for drug use.

[pipi_k]

342. All I can say is

that anyone who teaches his or her kid to "question authority" by blatantly disobeying laws...stupid or not...has some problems.

That's not questioning authority. That's spitting in the face of authority.

You question authority by working to get the laws changed. Not by spitting in the face of society and expecting kids to know what laws are OK and what laws are not.

Picking and choosing, in effect.

So, if some guy thinks a law against child molestation is stupid, that gives him a right to flout it? YOU may not agree with his belief, but that's not the point. HE thinks it's a stupid law, so therefore he isn't going to obey it.

yeah...it's all OK as long as the laws we're flouting are the ones WE hate.

:eyes:

[reggie the dog]

344. you know damn well the difference between mollesting and drugs

there is a VICTIM to child molestation. If he wants to flout that fine but there are victims to his crimes and they deserve to see justice. there is no victim to my "crime" of growing and using cannabis. It is all ok so long as the laws we are flouting are laws that make us criminals when we victimize no one. is it that hard for you to understand?

i was able to understand that so long as i was nice to other people there was no problem, i didnt have to think "must follow rules" i just thought "what is the nice thing to do?"

[FedUpWithIt All]

352. She does but i suspect your 3 yr old doesn't.

unless she is the most precocious 3 yr old ever.

Besides, you and your hippie culture, that you must preserve in your very young child's presence for some reason, was not always clean on the point of preventing unhealthy sexual exposure to young children. Although I'd wager your not so concerned with exposing her to your ADULT sexual activities as you are about your ADULT drug activities...why not. Drugs are age inappropriate and sex is age inappropriate. How do you choose which thing you will expose your child too under the heading of preserving "culture"? You, yourself said the culture must be preserved and all that...So be sure to have sex in front of your daughter after you smoke that joint so she can really live the culture...or do you find that this is where you draw the line of exposing your TODDLER to adult issues? No, i suspect it has nothing to do with culture and has EVERYTHING to do with personal convenience, otherwise your picking and choosing of cultural exposure reeks of nothing more than selfish hypocrisy.

Parents were grappling with their own beliefs about sexuality, attempting to forge a set of values through trial and error. Katrin echoes virtually every person interviewed for this article about their experiences in communal living when she says, "Sex was way too much out in the forefront. We knew too much--we were exposed to a lot of talk about sex, a lot of hearing sex, seeing sex, a lot of dirty jokes."

While her parents and their friends were busy shedding the mores of the 1950s along with their clothes, Katrin believes fragile boundaries important to children were trampled. "It's great that you shouldn't feel bad about your body," Katrin says. "But the flip side was to go naked all the time and to have no privacy."

David says he had his first sexual experience at 13 and also had sex with at least one of the adult women at the commune while he was a teenager. "It was an open time sexually," he says. "The adults were experimenting sexually, switching couples, and we would notice."

Freedom's Double Edge

All three village alumni remember the brunt of decision-making being left with them, a duty that has since cut both ways in their lives. Katrin recalls a time her mother broke a collarbone and ribs in an accident. Her sister Zoey walked a half mile to the nearest neighbor for help while Katrin stayed with her mother, who was slipping into shock. "I remember David's parents praising us for our courage , and I remember feeling such a sense of pride and self-worth. We got a lot of validation, but we were given a tremendous amount of freedom and responsibility for taking care of ourselves. For me, it was too much. I was a little kid and I needed to be taken care of."

While Zane considers that much freedom a positive aspect of his youth, David would disagree. "We had too much freedom," he says. "I wish my parents would have pushed me a little harder."

Since drug experimentation went hand-in-hand with sexual curiosity through that decade, it is no surprise that children were introduced to mind-altering substances at an early age. According to Berger, children as young as 2 were given marijuana at the Ranch. Says Panda, "I was provided with LSD when I was 13 and told, 'You'll probably experiment, so you might as well have the best.' "

David started taking acid when he was 14, "but I got all that out of my system early, too."

Zane started smoking pot when he was about 5 years old. He also remembers making some Kool-Aid and accidentally using the LSD-soaked sugar cubes. But earlier drug exposure stood him in good stead. "When I got to high school, the hippie Deadhead thing was making a rebound. I would show kids how to do acid right--you don't want to play with it, you know."

But some kids grew up doing more than "playing" with drugs. Tao Govinda Gurnoe's father led Buddhist chants in the Santa Cruz Mountains and partook of sweat lodges and yoga. Dad also partook of his fair share of cocaine. "I remember snorting dirt when I was 3, trying to imitate my parents," recalls Tao, now 24.

http://www.metroactive.com/papers/metro/02.29.96/hippie-9609.html

[reggie the dog]

360. you equate pot smoking in front of a kid like having sex in front of a kid

now if your parents had sex in front of you that is fucked up, sex is a thing that is not only not for children to do but to see as well.

now drug use on the other hand is perfectly acceptable in front of kids. there are beer commercials on tv for example, kids see those all the time, they sell alcohol at sporting events, people do alcohol in front of their kids all the time, you can buy alcohol in chuck e cheese, tobacco is used in front of kids all the time, people do up caffeine and even give it to their kids

so how is brewing up coffee beans, shipped overseas leaving a large carbon footprint any better than rolling up a joint in front of the kids?

how is drinking coffee on the porch different from smoking home grown, zero carbon footprint weed????

[FedUpWithIt All]

367. The hippie culture you're using as justification for smoking pot in the company of your toddler

made no distinctions of one being harmful and one not. Way to pick and choose.

[reggie the dog]

373. well the hippie culture i was raised in didnt involve fucking kids

like i said, your parents were truly degenerates and i am sorry for that, but the hippie culture i know has never involved sex with kids, hell the age of consent is 15 where i live but i wouldnt do anyting with a girl that young out of principle.

your idea that hippies are child fuckers is a distortion of hippie culture and you know it. sexual encounters may have happened between kids and adults then but was it at a higher rate than the non hippie culture?

[FedUpWithIt All]

394. Well i didn't say anything about fucking kids. I said they tended to expose their kids to sex.

Exposing their kids to sex was extremely pervasive part of the hippie/commune structure. I wasn't talking about molestation and I wasn't speaking of my own experience. I have already pointed out reports that show that this was a typical experience of the grown children of hippies. They were made see, hear about, witness or otherwise experience a level of sexuality inappropriate for their age. You ignore this part of the culture and suggest that another part is sanctified. Most here feel that your exposure of drugs to your young child borders on abuse for similar reasons they would find the sexual exposure abuse. It is not appropriate for a young child to be discussing, witnessing or otherwise exposed to drug use.

Most people do not require their toddlers to discuss and sit through lessons over their bottle of liquor like you said you subject your daughter to with your pot plants. And your nicotine and caffeine argument is an apples and oranges issue. Tobacco and caffeine are not broadly mind altering.

[reggie the dog]

397. ah, i misunderstood

and as most hippies didnt live in communes my father/relatives didnt see that either

what do i subject my daughter to? i go up and check on my plants to see if they are ready and my kid said they were pretty. i fail to see how exposing my kids to pot plants is like having sex in front of them. like i said people do up alcohol, tobacco, caffeine whatnot in front of kids and it is socially acceptable.

and no sorry, cannabis is not broadly mind altering, mildly mind altering yes, not broadly

[reggie the dog]

398. ah, i misunderstood

and as most hippies didnt live in communes my father/relatives didnt see that either

what do i subject my daughter to? i go up and check on my plants to see if they are ready and my kid said they were pretty. i fail to see how exposing my kids to pot plants is like having sex in front of them. like i said people do up alcohol, tobacco, caffeine whatnot in front of kids and it is socially acceptable.

and no sorry, cannabis is not broadly mind altering, mildly mind altering yes, not broadly

[pipi_k]

354. Your statement somewhere above...

is that you smoke pot because it's "unjust" and that you teach your kid to disrespect "unjust" laws.

You mentioned nothing about victims.

But that's not even my point.

My point is that just because YOU think a law is "unjust", it's OK to flout it.

There are plenty of people out there who think they should be allowed to do certain things you may not agree with. They think the laws are unjust. You don't get to make the rules as to what someone else thinks is just or unjust.

And really, that's not even the entire issue.

The issue is adults who choose to flout the laws doing it in front of their kids.

If people want to be good role models for their children, they work to change the laws they think are "unjust"...not spit in the face of society, teaching their kids that it's OK to do that.

[reggie the dog]

366. personally i think my kid owes little or no respect to current society

current society supports cuts in the funding of her education, making her work longer before retiring, helping the wealthy to ensure she will live less well than i do, which is less well than my parents

i hate american society, can barely tolerate french society

dog eat dog, blame yourself, be loyal to the state, you are with us or against us

fuck those kind of societies

i have a friend whose 2 daughters, aged 13 and 16, are full on anarchists, do the protests organized by them and their fellow high school and jr high school students on the front line holding the banners and everyting, they are involved, their eyes are open, and they were raised counterculture by a man who left the UK because of the unjust poll tax

i do like he does, i teach them that respect is to be earned and that a system which shits on you merits no respect and that a society that denigrates you for challenging that system deserves no respect either.

like the rastas say "fuck babylon law"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h83QEY-fuJs the exploited, "fuck the USA"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-Yihs6S0Ac pennywise, "fuck authority"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adxhto88bYA the exploited "fuck the system"



i am countercultre, i raise my child as such, i dont have similar mindset, norms, values, goals, desires as average americans or average french people, happy to endebt themselves for alcohol, flat screend tv, cars with big motors, content to work over 40 hours a week so they can sit on a couch and stare at a fucking fake window whilst chasing paper to have "nicer things" than the jones' I dont want to look like or sound like average people whose only "concerns" are to talk about the fake universe of tv programs, the bullshit "real life battles" of sports or their god damned investment portfolios. i dont give a fuck to hear in polite conversation how well ones foreign currency investments are doing whilst sipping hard liquor and smoking a cigar (the same asshole would bitch that i smoked weed and talked about how trickle down fucked the working class) why??? BECAUSE I DO NOT SHARE YOUR CULTURE AND AM SUPPOSED TO BE FREE TO DO THAT SO LONG AS I DONT HURT YOU OR DAMAGE YOUR PROPERTY!

no, i really do not respect the USA as a country, a people, a society, or a culture. i had to live my first 24 years in the festering cesspool that is america and i am glad to be gone. in the usa image is more important than substance, you people say i should hide that i smoke weed from my kids, i should act like the image of a "clean" person yet i bet you do up alcohol in front of your own kids, then you hide behind "its illegal"

i actively do something to teach my kid that the system is corrupt. she knows that daddy and almost all his friends an lots of his family members are criminals even though they harm no one, in time she will come to hate the system that criminalizes her fathers cultural group.

i dont want dog eat dog, i want sharing, i dont want competition, i want harmony, i dont want material goods, i want quality relations. i know i am not normal, much of what i teach my daughter probably goes against your "refined" sensibilities and i really dont fucking care.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MkRuV0aCcI Dead Kennedy's "Nazi punks fuck off" read the lyrics and you will understand how i view the current system, i see it as a system in which the fascist have taken over and i have no respect for it or the society it helped create.

[FedUpWithIt All]

390. My children, my husband and myself life completely off grid.

We use only rainwater for washing and bathing, we use a composting toilet system and i mainly wash our clothing by hand. We use solar energy. We can our home grown produce. We make things for each other for Christmas. We raise chickens and goats and grow much of our own food. We are building our own home in the spring, out of renewable straw bales, with our own hands, and do nearly all of the things for ourselves that others hire out like auto repairs and building.

I do not need to smoke pot in front of my kids to hold any standing as one living in a counter culture. I do not need my children to be faced with adult issues to train them to think for themselves. In fact, i do not even need them to prove they will think the way i do. They are allowed to reach understanding on these issues on their own and with as much support for their individuality as possible.

It is always so interesting that those who feel they are the most non-conformist tend to behave in a very conformist way within their ow social group.

[reggie the dog]

395. your lifestyle is awesome

i am in the process of converting from city person into what you are doing. i have friends who are teaching me masonry work building their own house so i can learn to build a house out of rocks which is very energy efficiant because they keep heat in well. i have been learning about raising goats from my friend who now has 3 of them, i teach in the public sector which brings me some money but land is so damned expensive here to even rent.

my friends loan me land to grow stuff like tomatoes and raddishes and next spring as i bought them tobacco seeds to save them money on cigarettes they told me i can have some land to grow more veggies on so potatos and carrots will be going in.

i also ride my bicycle to visit my friends often.

its too bad you think that i am unfit as a parent just because i dont hide the grass aspect from my kid. where i live the kid is never taught to rat out parents for drugs and they dont get sensationalistic lying drugs education. the pot smoking is just one aspect of the manner in which i show my daughter that mainstream society is fucked.

i dont buy brand name clothes or any shit like that, dont own a tv and dont expose my daughter to that world that she sees from other kids at school.

other than the anti pot stance that you have due to your lumping your parents behaviour on their pot use you seem really interesting. you are into that whole "one revolution at a time" way of living (do you consider yourself an anarchist?)

[pipi_k]

426. Really, really sad

Why don't you let your kid decide him/herself whether s/he will respect society?


It's hard enough growing up without a kid's mind being poisoned by his parent's issues.


In any case, I get the feeling I am wasting my time trying to explain this simple concept, and it really doesn't matter in the end, anyway. I'm just really uncomfortable with people who think they're great parents, because they're the ones who usually end up the biggest failures.

I have lots of respect for people who can admit that they weren't perfect parents...that they made lots of mistakes they didn't mean to make, and if they had it to do over again, they would have done something very different.

[Supply Side Jesus]

269. smoking weed around a child is child abuse

lock them up

[iamthebandfanman]

294. now that i agree with...

nobody should use drugs infront/around their children. especially something smoke related.


pot use in general by adults tho, A-okay in my book.

[reggie the dog]

318. how do i abuse my kid by growing or smoking in front of her?

i generally dont smoke indoors when my kid is here but outside i smoke where she can see me, i roll joints inside where she can see me, she has seen my plants as seedlings, big towering plants, hanging up drying and cut up and put into mason jars and none of this has ever hurt her.

i am not a child abuser in any way morally speaking and not even legally speaking in france.

[Supply Side Jesus]

407. agreed

!

[reggie the dog]

317. opening your bible around a kid is child abuse, you should be locked up

seriously i abuse my kid by smoking weed around her? how? the weed she sees me smoke outside is hurting her? the plants i grow hurt her?

i am glad i dont live in the usa because in france it is NOT child abuse to smoke weed around your kids.

[Supply Side Jesus]

406. don't get your baguettes in a twist

if she is consuming your second smoke....in a reasonable amount...then ya, you do have a problem.


and yes, you do make a case for the Bible..... ;)

[reggie the dog]

410. we agree, i smoke outside

[reggie the dog]

319. yet doing up some alcohol

or doing up some tobacco around kids is a-ok good wholesome activity????

fucking pathetic.

lock them up for doing something less dangerous than tobacco smokers legally do every day.

you fascists blow my mind sometimes.

[Supply Side Jesus]

405. ya...ever see a 3 year old high?

but I guess you are down with that? that's fucking pathetic.....

and yes caring for a child while being drunk is C.A.

[reggie the dog]

411. no, never saw a high 3 year old

i dont shotgun hits to my kid

i know that rastas les their kids smoke from an early age but that is not my thing

[Renew Deal]

328. It's a shame this didn't happen sooner.

There are people out there that couldn't care less about their kids. Hopefully his future gets better.

[reggie the dog]

349. and they dont care about their kids

how do you know this? seriously how do you know that?

we dont even know that they smoked in the same room with the kid

i care about my daughter, i still have the pound and a half i just harvested this fall, i dont spend any money on cannabis,

i spend lots of time playing with, reading to my daughter, i work, i work out. i never watch tv NEVER dont even fucking own one.

[msanthrope]

355. People who care about their kids don't deal drugs where they live.

Nor do they smoke around their kids to the point where the kid has to go outside....

These people were dealers.

"The preteen, who police did not identify, reportedly confronted his mother, Heidi Christine Siebenaler, who is a Dakota County probation supervisor, about the smell, which he told police was so pungent he "was unable to escape without going outside."

Siebenaler allegedly told her son that marijuana use is "not that bad," a criminal complaint stated.

The boy, who police called "mature for his age," forwarded the picture to his biological father who turned it over to authorities.

A search warrant was executed in the family's home on Oct. 25, where police found eight pounds of marijuana and drug paraphernalia along with a black digital scale in an RV parked outside the home."



http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/minnesota-boy-turns-mom-marijuana-stash/story?id=14964599#.TsbU21aNOSo

[reggie the dog]

357. the kid bitched about pungent smell

not even smoke

and how does selling pot=not caring about kids?

granted with the digi scale it does look like dealing, but he could be a grower who had a nice harvest this year and is gonna smoke most of it.

the police called the boy mature, for cops mature means "obeys without critical thinking" that is why they call the OWS people kids, as if to insinuate that they are immature, because they think for themselves instead of just obeying like a good citizen does

you had better get ready for your soma

[FedUpWithIt All]

365. "obeys without critical thinking"

Are you really so baked that you do not get the irony of the things you say?

"they think for themselves instead of just obeying" Didn't you say all over this thread that this boy should have just coped with his discomfort and obey the "rules" of the family regarding turning the parents over to the authorities? You have said all over this thread what kids should and should not do and yet you are accusing this boy, who very much took personal initiative, of not thinking for himself? Wow.

"ratting your parents for grass is like denouncing them to the gestapo, that is what i was taught and that is what i will teach" Sounds like you were the one who obeyed without critical thinking. The boy, in the OP, clearly took a stand, in spite of the "rules" he was forced to live under.

[reggie the dog]

371. took a stand? he showed more loyalty to the state than to his family

the kid thought for himself and got people arrested and possibly thrown in jail and fired over pot, the kid will see stepdad in jail, mom homeless and then he will understand the wrong he has done to his family but it will be too late, his action had a victim, his parents, what he did was not nice at all.

he didnt think for himself, he likely learned in dare that pot will make his parents killers and that his duty as a citizen is to turn them in and he listened to the state, not his parents, also the dad is a dick for grassing out his ex just to get custody. i am in a custody fight but i would never get my ex thrown in jail over this shit.

[firehorse]

383. No, he showed more loyalty in his self worth and didn't feel like being a codependent enabler with

no backbone. Kudos to the kid.

His parents were dealers and addicts.

I've spent years in alanon meetings listening to the damage caused by growing up in households of addicts and dealers. Breaking the silence and not buying into the dysfunctional rules of keeping the family secrets is one of the first steps an individual can take to recover their sense of self worth.

[reggie the dog]

386. dealers and addicts?

how do you know they were addicted? an enabler cleans up the mess after somone who fucks shit up under the influence, that genearlly doesnt happen with cannabis

i never lost my sense of self worth by not ratting out my dad and his biker friends for weed, dad made it clear that the govt made bullshit laws to try to tell adults what kind of drugs they could do, that the same govt that is so concerned about his health sent him to vietnam and poisened him with agent orange.

you met the kids of degenerates who could not raise their kids, most drug users and dealers are not like that. most pot dealers have "regular" jobs and sell a bit of grass to smoke for free, the vast majority of "dealers" buy an ounce and sell 3 quarters each week to smoke for free or get a quarter pound once a month, sell 3 ounces to friends and smoke one for free.

you seem to have no idea how vast the network of dealers is and just how many "normal" people sell a bit of grass.

[firehorse]

396. yes 8 pounds of pot and scales.

I agree that pot addiction and dealing is pervasive and therefore is perceived as "normal". 1/3 of Americans are high on something whether is doctors scripts, booze from the corner, pot, sex addiction, video game internet addiction, etc.

I grew up in Northern California where there is a culture of pot connoiseurs and dealers, as pervasive as wine is in Napa. I sold pot myself once (12 year old girl) when my dealer neighbor gave me his shake to sell to my friends. A few weeks later he went to jail for selling coke and pot. Half the people I grew up with either deal it now, grow it or buy it. My alcoholic mother's boyfriend grew it in his back yard - he was a nice guy - but it had an affect on me. My aunt went to jail for dealing, and she lost her baby to the state when she gave birth in jail. She's now addicted to all kinds of things offering her body on craigslist in exchange for someone to fund her addictions. My mom's been in rehab, my step father is still active. My step brother died on X-mas eve of an overdose.

So I think I got a good idea about how the affects of addiction have on a family. I'm watching at a distance a young relative go from pot addict to dealer, and am worried what will happen to him later in life with each choice.

Most my family made the choice to go along with the family script of dysfunction and addiction. They keep the secrets and obey all the dysfunctional rules and stay in denial -- and the cycle perpetuates. I get why they do it, I did it myself for years. Its easier to go into denial than rock the boat, its easier to be high with the rest of them than stay sober and deal with the ugly reality.

[reggie the dog]

399. your aunt went to jail for dealing

pot and the state took her baby which fucked her up and she got into hardcore drugs

your moms problem is alcohol not pot

your neighbor got busted for selling weed and cocaine, that is the state again doing the harm not the drugs

your nice stepdad who grows weed is still active

your step brother died of something other than weed

if people are oding and renting themselves out for sex for drugs they are not doing it weed aint the issue

i must be in denial, i never drink, never do tobacco, smoke weed every day and do lsd or mdma once every couple of years. oh noes i must be in denial

[msanthrope]

375. Apparently, keeping the family's secrets are more important than this kid's distress.

Sad.

[RainDog]

369. I have to disagree with you, reggie

first off in calling a child a narc. he's a child who is in a situation that makes him extremely uncomfortable. he tried to address the situation with the adults and he was ignored.

they live in a state in which even medical mj is not legal. yet they are, apparently, open enough about having mj in the house to the degree that the kid can take a picture of it sitting on the dresser.

that's irresponsible. that's unfair to this child.

that's disrespectful of this child. he can't bring friends over because he may worry someone else would tell their parents... parents cannot just do whatever they want when they have kids. parents have boundaries too, in their behavior, simply b/c they are parents.

[reggie the dog]

378. i doubt they smoked in the house when he had friends over

and what business do his friends have poking around in his parents bedroom?

here in france schools do not teach kids that cannabis is going to kill their parents or them, they dont teach kids to rat out people for drugs and the issue is pretty non existant. most smokers and dealers i know over here dont hid anything from their kids because their kids understand that their loyalty is to family unless some kind of abuse is happening, we had a nasty experience with indoctrination of kids during wwii here in europe

[RainDog]

385. nevertheless, the kid exists in his culture, not yours

and you don't know what went on when the child was at home or when he had friends over. and when cannabis is lying out on a dresser, kids don't have to poke around to see it.

the illegality and the smell are what's at issue here. I assume you know I am pro-legalization - and I even lived in Europe for a while and, yes, their take on many social issues is much more reasonable to me.

but those parents don't live there and the child doesn't either.

just on the face of the issue that the parents are exposing the child to all sorts of moral conflicts seems to me to be reason enough to set a boundary between what an adult does and what children are exposed to.

anyway, that's my take on it. obviously you see it differently.

[reggie the dog]

388. this is where we disagree

"the parents are exposing the child to all sorts of moral conflicts " i see it as "the government is exposing the child to all sorts of moral conflicts"

i guess we just see it differently.

[pipi_k]

425. IF the government is doing that at all...

then it doesn't help for the parents to be adding even more conflict to the mix, does it.

Again...a responsible parent doesn't purposely set out to create even MORE conflict for his child.

Growing up is hard enough...developing an ethics system is hard enough without parents giving their kids permission to selectively obey or disobey laws or rules they (the parents) don't happen to agree with.

IMO, that's just a case of a parent using his own kid to get back at society. The kid becomes nothing more than a pawn in the parent's stupid little "I HATE AUTHORITY!!!" games.

[reggie the dog]

428. My kid is not a pawn but you would have her made into one

IT IS NOT IN HER INTERESTS TO RESPECT AUTHORITY.

what in the hell is this idea that we should respect authority? authority comes from what? the elite who buy the government, buy the laws, and then tell use to live by their version of a just society.

teaching a kid to be ethical is a lot more involved than teaching them to follow rules. i am 32 and if i follow the rules i can legally have sex with a 15 year old here in france even if she is a student in one of the high school classes i teach. in your eyes doing such a thing would be ethical because it is legal but in my mind (where laws and ethics are often out of tune) doing such a thing would be unethical, so i dont do it.

[pipi_k]

424. They may or may not have...

but that's not the point.

The point is that they're asking a kid to KEEP SECRETS. Kids should NEVER be expected to keep family secrets. Ever. If there are things parents don't want others to know, they don't make them known to the kids.

It's too easy for a kid to accidentally slip up. To say something that someone else might pick up on.


No responsible parent ever forces his kids to deal with adult issues in that way.

[msanthrope]

370. I feel sorry for your daughter, if you can't tell why dealing drugs around your kids is a bad idea.

I don't like it when parents put their children second to their drug use.

[reggie the dog]

381. where do i "put my kid second"

what in the hell does that even mean?

and seeing as you cannot even list reasons why selling pot when you have kids is bad why do you think it is so obvious to me? you dont grow smoke or sell pot and you know that it is just somehow bad to do when one has kids?

so say someone grew a pound and a half of weed, but needed say 150 euros for birthday and christmas gifts for his kid so he sold an ounce of marijuana. that person would be horrible according to you and would be letting their kid come in second?

dealers or growers spend NO MONEY AT ALL ON DRUGS, they are more responsible than people who spend 50 dollars a week on a habit as they take no money at all away from the family budget for their habit, none.

non street level cannabis dealing rarely leads to arrest, hardly ever involves violence and poses no real risk to the children who live in the house. pot dealers and their clients are not getting dope sick and robbing to get their drugs, they will not come begging for a taste for free then get pissed of if you say no. pot dealers often tell clients to come by before a certain hour unlike crack and heroin dealers.

do you have any idea what you are talking about? do you know any parents at all who sold pot?

[msanthrope]

384. Are you saying you deal pot? I hope you refrain from doing it in front of your kid. nt

[reggie the dog]

387. where did i say it?

and what difference would it make anyway?

if you worked at a supermarket and your kid came into the store and was standing in line behind someone buying a bottle of booze would you refuse to scan it? remember the bottle of booze is enough to kill a child whereas the kid cannot accidentally od on pot.

you cannot imagine that anyone on this board has dealers as aunts or uncles or that perhaps dad used to sell a bit of pot? you really have no idea about the distribution network that surrounds you do yo?

these people had 8 pounds, they sell to people buying one pound at a time, who sell quarter pounds to people, who sell ounces to people, who finally sell others their little bags for personal use.

a whole shitload of people "deal" most making no profit except for smoking for free.

why do they smoke for free? they have a "connection" and know where to get weed so they sell to a few buddies, then later if they lose their connection another friend may find one and become the new "dealer" for their group of friends.

and you still havent answered my question

what is bad about selling pot? really what bad does it do to a kid? and what does "putting their kid second" mean? what the hell are you talking about?

[Renew Deal]

403. He complained multiple times and she did nothing.

"the boy told investigators he had complained numerous times to his mother about the smell of the marijuana."

That's the big one. The fact that they're involved in criminal activity at home is the other. But their disregard for the complaint of the kid is shameful.

This isn't about you. :shrug:

[Irishonly]

333. DARE

If the schools are still doing the program he would believe that pot will keep you from obtaining life's goal, ever being a productive citizen and all sorts of dire consequences. Reminds me of when I was taught in 4th grade if I ever took ONE drink in my life I would destroy a fair amount of brain cells. I cried when my mom, dad and I went out for a birthday dinner and they had a drink.

There may be thousands of other reasons but I think DARE played it's part. All of the schools around here still do red ribbon week and they are not learning about AIDS or heart problems.

[McCamy Taylor]

402. Misleading article title. Makes the kid sound like a narc. Bet he didn't want to see mom in jail.

[LadyHawkAZ]

408. A very, very long thread

full of name calling against a young child, with side trips into name calling against the child's mother, father, stepfather and even other DU posters.

This is productive in some way that I don't quite get, I'm sure.

I think I will ignore this thread.

[Name removed]

413. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[tammywammy]

418. He has a father. n/t