Can we maintain a little perspective on Weiner's Wiener, please?

[markpkessinger]

Look, what Rep. Weiner did in originally tweeting the pictures was just plain stupid, and attempting to lie about it, colossally so. But he didn't break any laws with what he did (nor in lying about it, since he did not lie under oath). He has not abused his office or the public trust in any way. To be sure, he may now have some marital issues to deal with, but that's between him and his wife.

Lots of folks, even here on DU, have been rather self-righteously propounding about Rep. Weiner's "poor judgment" or "lack of judgment," implying that the poor judgment the man exercised in this one particular area of his life necessarily calls into question his judgment in all other areas. But that is nonsense; human beings are far more complex than that, each with his or her own set of character strengths and weaknesses. We all have feet of clay, whether not we admit it and regardless of whether our clay feet are ever exposed for all to see, as they have been in Mr. Weiner's case. To suggest otherwise is to be naively simplistic about the various impulses, drives and desires that comprise human nature.

I would address this question particularly to men, gay or straight, here on DU who insist Rep. Weiner is permanently compromised by this scandal: how many of you can honestly say that you have NEVER, under any circumstances, done or said something, either in pursuit of sex or driven by sexual desire, that was ill-advised/stupid/potentially self-destructive (even if it has never been exposed)? And does that really mean you are unable to exercise reasonable judgment in the performance of your job? Get real, people.

I am reminded of a sermon I once heard by the late Rev. Dr. William Sloane Coffin, who was then the chief pastor of Riverside Church in New York. Coffin, in addition to being a pastor, had been an outspoken opponent of the Vietnam war and a major civil rights activist. In the sermon, he was talking about people who were feeling discouraged or disillusioned about the state of affairs in our country. To those folks, Dr. Coffin said simply: "Who the hell ever told you you had the right to harbor illusions in the first place?"

[fascisthunter]

1. Kick and Recommend!

[bbinacan]

2. The party leadership will decide his fate

IMO, he's a goner.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

3. Hey, if his constituents don't mind who am I to judge?

However, didn't he lie about it? I've not kept up with the details, so I could be wrong on that. If he did that will get him in trouble. Ask Bill Clinton, it's not the act of being sexual that's prosecutable, but the lies you tell trying to cover up the fact that you are sexual.

As to Weiner's weiner, or his kittah pose, or whatever, a big meh from me, but I'm not one of his constituents. :shrug:

[Control-Z]

4. Thank you.

I've been trying to find a way to sum all of what you said down to one subject line for an OP.

I am so disappointed in DU today. (Second only to the way I was treated during the 08 primaries because I was a Hillary supporter.)

I thought we were all a lot more sensible and honest.

[Canuckistanian]

5. My God, someone actually gets it

Big K&R

[markpkessinger]

8. Thank you! n/t

[Canuckistanian]

16. You're welcome. We do seem to be the minority view, though

Some so-called "liberals" seem to be on the warpath about this.

[cali]

6. he broke no laws that we know of.

What if someone he sent messages/photos to was under age? And although it's not the same thing, what if broke House Ethics rules?

[markpkessinger]

9. If he broke any laws or rules . . .

. . . then there are appropriate systems in place to investigate such matters and to determine what, if any, consequences should follow. But so far there have not even been any allegations of illegality, let alone any proof of same. If he broke House rules, there are disciplinary measures the House could take (such as censure, for example). And given the fact that many others (David Vitter, for example) have done far worse without being expected to resign, I see no reason why Weiner should be expected to do so.

[dixiegrrrrl]

13. Isn't there some Federal Law about sending lewd pics to via the Internet?

And having them on your computer?

[Canuckistanian]

14. Until that hypothetical time, I stand with Rep. Weiner

And not a millisecond before that time.

[cbdo2007]

7. Hhahaha, so you want a congressman who will look you right in the face and lie to you?

That's what he did with all of us. Sure lying isn't against the law but it is a major character flaw and I wouldn't vote for someone after them lying so publicly like this.

[markpkessinger]

12. Of course I don't "want" a congressman who will lie to me . . .

. . . but I am simply recognizing the reality that many people, even those who are otherwise very honest, will, when faced with humiliating exposure of something they did, will initially resort to lying as a means of self-protection. (It almost never works, however, and one wonders when folks will realize that.) The reasons for lying under such circumstances are manifold, including self-protection, protection of one's spouse, of one's marriage or of one's other family members, etc. And I will say again that it is absurdly simplistic and naive to suggest that because someone lied in this particular circumstances renders that person utterly untrustworthy in all others. After all, everyone lies at some point in their lives, about things both large and small. So not only is such a stance naive, it is also hypocritical.

[cbdo2007]

15. It isn't naive or hypocritical. We hold them to a higher standard....

for a specific reason. Because they are the ones creating the laws the rest of us have to follow and when one of these people gets in a bind and they immediately start a cover-up conspiracy, that is a good indicator at how they'll behave about other issues and it should scare you as much as it scares me.

The is exactly what is wrong with Washington, though you are right that it is on a very simplistic level, but the root of the problem is the same. We can do whatever we want and if the public finds out we'll just cover it up and make it go away. I don't agree with the bushies doing it, or Rep Weiner doing it. If he isn't going to man up to this and just be honest with us then he deserves all of the fallout from it.

Personally, I think the only reason he is telling the truth now is because there is other stuff out there we're going to find out about. I bet he'll have multiple affairs coming to light and possibly other things. He could have avoided much of this by just telling the truth and now he's made himself a bigger target.

[Puglover]

10. Kick and Rec.

People are so freaking askeered of the mirror.

[yawnmaster]

11. The problem though is that these types of behavior "just happen"...

It isn't just a moment of weakness, it is a continuing behavior of weakness. It takes some effort to continue.
One has time to think about what one is doing. One has time to make decisions.

Does poor judgment in one area of life call into question judgment in other parts of life.
Yes, it definitely calls it into question. They may not, in fact, be linked, but the question arises whether they are actually linked.
Actions in one aspect of life do sometimes warrant questions into other aspects.

Actions in one area of life are part of what constitutes the entire person.
When choosing someone to represent me, I look at as many aspects as I am able to judge that person.
It is dangerous to use this behavior as the only ruler of the quality of that representation, but it is also dangerous to ignore it.

What bothers me most is the ability to make an "in your face" lie.