If you're reporting below the poverty line in income, do you get grants for college education?

[HughBeaumont]

I'm asking because I genuinely never heard of such a thing. I assumed there's never a free lunch here when it comes to higher education and if you do get grants, it's because you had to jump through an obstacle course of hoops to get them.

My wingnut worker told me about this to sort of counter my argument about how student loan debt and the ridiculously high cost of college is stifling youth/worker progress in this country.

The thing is, if this is so commonplace, then why isn't everyone doing it? Obviously, it still doesn't even begin to address the massive student loan problem we have in this country, but what stops the student from just trying to latch onto this program? Again, I'm also not an accountant, so I don't get how the tax structure stops this from happening en masse.

[More_liberal_than_mo]

1. True you can get grants

http://www.fafsa.ed.gov/
Go to the above site and fill out the Free Application for Federal Student Aid form. You'll need your last year's income tax copies and if you are a dependent on your parents, you'll need their income tax copies as well. They will send you a pin number for future access to the info. After you get the pin they will send you back an answer pretty quick with a EFC number (estimated Family Contribution). If this number is less than the current amount for Pell Grants they will give you the difference between the EFC number and the current Pell amount ($5300). If the EFC is greater than 5300 then no Pell money for you. If you make less than poverty level then expect the EFC to be 0 allowing you to get the max amount.
My 25 year old son gets both VA and Pell grants. You can't get it if you don't apply, so get on with it now.

[More_liberal_than_mo]

4. You're right about no free lunch

but the catch is that you actually have to enroll and be accepted as as full time student (12 credit hours or more per semester). Unless you have a low cost place to stay (parents or sharing with friends) you'll still need to find a job. $5300 will go a long way at a small state supported college but won't at a more expensive school. The catch is you can't make too much money or you will start to reduce the Pell Grant the following year. Once the fafsa form is accepted and in the system you may qualify for other grants, and of course loans. Try to stay away from loans if possible because loans, unlike grants, have to be paid back, and many students today are buried under so many loans that it will take decades to pay back.
They pay out the funds for the Pell grant in two stages, half at the beginning of each semester.
Not so many people do it because it is extremely difficult to make enough money to live on and have the time and energy to both work and attend college.
Good luck, you'll need it.

[Massacure]

2. Yes you can get grants if your income is low enough

Pell grants are the most common, and the Free Application for Federal Student Aid (FAFSA) needs to be filled out to received them. I filled the FAFSA out the first year I started college but was only offered unsubsidied loans. Fortunately, I make enough money working retail that I paid my way through school and didn't see a need to fill out FAFSA the previous three years. The FAFSA probably took me about three hours to do the one time I did it.

[Lyric]

3. Yes, the Pell Grant.

However, the Pell is not enough to cover ALL the cost of a college education. The maximum Pell grant you can get is $5350 per year ($2675 per semester) and you only get that much if you are SO poor that your Estimated Family Contribution is 0. Even still, there aren't many colleges where the tuition, fees, and room & board expenses are that cheap, so unless you are lucky enough to (1) live in a cheap-college town, (2) have good public transportation and/or a car that's already paid for, and (3) have parents who are willing to let you live at home rent-free, then you're probably going to need some loan money.

Oh sure, there are always students who manage to get good jobs and pay cash for all expenses beyond the Pell, but with the stagnation of wages and the lack of jobs, that's really not a reasonable expectation to have anymore. I'm a current college student at a relatively inexpensive university, and every other student I know is still carrying loan debt, even the ones that work every hour that they're not sleeping, studying, or in class. The $7.25 an hour jobs available to students just don't pay enough to survive on, much less enough to survive AND pay for part of your college expenses.

[Bill McBlueState]

16. thanks for the numbers

"The maximum Pell grant you can get is $5350 per year"

Typical annual tuition+fees at a public university is now hovering around $10,000, I think.

[More_liberal_than_mo]

5. I almost forgot about the Federal Work Study Program.

If your EFC number is low enough you may also qualify for the Federal Work Study program which could add another $4000 or so to your Pell Grants per year. You must get an approved job, usually one on campus sponsored by the college, or a public service type volunteer job. The volunteer job is one that normally doesn't pay but if the Feds accept an application from the organization that basically says that the organization will not pay you cash but will they will fill out a time sheet for you to be submitted to the Federal Work Study Program Office. The Feds pay you up to $10/hour for up to 20 hours a week until you max out the funds granted. There are lots and lots of hoops the volunteer organization has to go through on your behalf so many don't want to do it unless they have trouble attracting unpaid volunteers.

[readmoreoften]

12. EFC and a Pell Grant won't get you through a public university these days.

The university I work was has on average $7500 in tuition. And, come on, an "up to" $10 job isn't going to cover the gap plus living expenses. A $10 job is going to cut into that $10 job you already have as a poor person. It was $10 back in 1989. Come to think of it, it was an up to $5000 grant then too.

[madrchsod]

6. yes and at my community college retirees go free!

i have several friends that are going to college that are under the poverty guidelines. they received various government and private grants.

[Berry Cool]

7. I could not have afforded a college education at all without Pell Grants.

But I also could not have afforded a college education with Pell Grants alone. In order to fully pay for college as an undergraduate I needed a combination of Pell Grants, a state grant (which I got for the two years I was at an in-state school), scholarships, work-study, AND both federal and private bank loans. Luckily, back in my day the interest on those loans was 3% and 7% respectively, and could not be raised once I began full-time study. Carter was still in office then so I didn't get subjected to the ridiculous interest rate hikes other students did after Reagan came in--also, school just cost less then than it does now. Even so, Reagan cut my aid in terms of me qualifying for less even with the small amount of money my single parent made, so I had to transfer from private out-of-state to public in-state halfway through just to finish. Then I needed a full scholarship and another loan (to live on) for my master's. I was able to pay off all my loans within 12 years of getting the master's, but they totaled only $15,000. You don't get off that easily today. School is much more expensive and debt is crushing.

And, of course, I had to fill out the FAFSA with my mother every year (it was still the FAF when I started) and answer all the income questions, and apply for every scholarship I could get, and also fill out all those loan papers after I qualified for loans, which my mother had to co-sign for in case I defaulted (even though she couldn't really afford to).

Don't let any freeper tell you that all you have to do as a poverty-level person is latch onto a Pell Grant and you get a free college education without having to pay back any student loans. It was a lie back when I went to college 30 years ago, and it is an even bigger lie today. Need-based financial aid has always been a "package" of various tools, and Pell Grants are only one. They do not pay the whole tab.

Oh, and here's something that was always fun: before I was permitted to register for classes in any semester, I had to make sure all my bills were paid, right? So for me, what that meant (as opposed to making sure Daddy had mailed the check) was to run around from office to office on campus...from bursar to financial aid to registration to whatever and back again...and make sure that everybody's, and I mean EVERYBODY's, computer showed that my aid had come through and all was paid for...which was not always the case, because back in those days the campus was not networked and just because my bill showed up as paid on the financial aid office's computer didn't mean it showed up as paid on the bursary office's computer, or the registration office computer...oh, it was fun, I tell you! I got more exercise, learned more about bureaucratic red tape and spent more time crying in the offices of sympathetic secretaries than I even want to recall.

Oh, and another nice thing about colleges: they have a tendency to ask for advance deposits on things like dorm rooms for next year and stuff like that, before your aid package for that year has been awarded. You know, $100 here, $200 there, and pay by the deadline or else be shut out...If your family isn't made of money, those deposits aren't easy to produce. I am sure that many times when my mom paid them for me, or even just mailed me some spending money so I could have a bit of a normal college experience where I could chip in on the late-night study pizza or go to the movies or or whatever, it was my older sister's money rather than or in addition to her own. Which is why I sometimes overspend a bit today when it comes to her Christmas gifts. :-) Or at least did back when I still had a job.

Funny thing is, I put in all that time and effort going to college, and paying for it some way or other, in part so that I wouldn't end up unemployed and a burden on society. And just look at me now! Didn't work out so hot, did it?

[ThomWV]

8. I'm reporting it and I already have a College education

[HughBeaumont]

9. This was very informative.

I'm not going back to school because there's no way I'd be able to afford it and certainly wouldn't qualify for a grant if I applied. I just wanted to know if what the wingnut worker said was true or not. I kind of figured it was too good to be true.

[Chemical Bill]

10. I went to school on Pell Grants.

The repukes have gutted the program in recent years, it doesn't cover anywhere near what it covered in the past. Also, you cannot live with your parents rent free and get a Pell Grant if they make much money. Finally, Convicted murderers and rapists can get Pell Grants, but convicted drug users cannot, another gift from the repukes.

Bill

[More_liberal_than_mo]

11. I agree with all you said except

the live with parents part. That's not entirely true. If you file your own taxes and are not listed as a dependent on your parent's tax forms and have the previous year's tax forms that proves that you are a financially independent taxpayer, then yes you can live anywhere you want including your parent's home and still qualify for the Pell Grant. The amount of rent you pay them (or not) doesn't disqualify you.

[Chemical Bill]

15. I was relying on a friend with a college age kid.

If I was misinformed, I stand corrected.

Bill

[Broken_Hero]

17. my understanding of the Pell Grant

is that you have to claim your parents income until you turn 25yrs of age, regardless if you live on your own, or live with them.

eta-to change of, into if.

[More_liberal_than_mo]

18. Nope

I'm sure of this as my son started collecting the Pell Grant when he was 24. The reason was he had been filing his own returns for the previous 5 years claiming himself on his return. He was in the Marine Corps for 4 of those years and I last claimed him as a dependent 6 years ago when he first went into the service. Even so, the rule only includes the previous year's income tax returns. As long as they haven't been claimed as a dependent on the parent's return for the previous year, then they do not have to list any income from a parent regardless of age.

The catch 22 for most parents is that the child must be independent for at least a full calendar year as far as the IRS goes before the Pell stops counting the parent's income. That means the student will not get the Grant the first year if the parent's income is too high. The student would have to have a job and support him/her self for a full calendar year before filing out the fafsa. Example: high school graduate in 2010 is claimed on parent's return for 2010 (to be filed in 2011). Student forgoes college and gets a job straight out of high school. 2011 the kid continues to work and this year the parent can't take the exemption for the kid (ouch!) for taxes to be filed in 2012. In late 2011 the kid applies to college starting in Fall 2012. In Jan or Feb 2012 the kid files a fafsa showing that he/she is independent and not on his/her parent's tax forms for the 2011 year. Kid receives Pell Grant and starts college in September 2012 (2 1/4 years after graduating high school). As an added bonus (not) the parents have to give up the extra exemption on their taxes for at least 5 years (more if the student stays in college until year he/she turns 25) and can't claim college expenses for them unless family income is below $115,000 a year . It's not worth it folks, to try and game the system, you'll lose.

It only worked out for my son because he chose to join the military straight out of high school. This gave him both VA and Pell money for school, but even still had he not moved back into my home he still would have had to get a full time job just to pay the rent elsewhere. His school has very low tuition and is close by. Next Fall he will have to move out and go to a 4 year school which means he will have to get good enough paying job just to pay the rent and good paying jobs are hard to come by these days. I'll still have to help him out I'm sure.

[Broken_Hero]

19. Thanks for the info,

its been a while since I filled out a Fasfa, I recall it taking a long time before I was approved for one. When I first started college, I went two years without getting a Pell. I left school, worked for a 5yrs or so, and went back to school to finish my degree. When I got back to school I qualified for Pell for 4 semesters(til I graduated).

I figured it was because of the age, but I fully admit I'm not good at reading the fine print, most of it goes over my head.

[readmoreoften]

13. Including marijuana.

Get caught using marijuana, you lose your grant. Know someone this happened to in the early 90s. He was also on pain meds for HIV.

[Hannah Bell]

14. Average New Award: $3,611. Range of New Awards: $486–$5,350.

http://www2.ed.gov/programs/fpg/funding.html


federal work study Average New Award(includes Recovery Act): $1,500
number of new awards anticipated: 944,881

http://www2.ed.gov/programs/fws/funding.html


work-study has had basically the same funding since before 2005.

Recovery Act : $200,000,000
Fiscal Year 2009 : $980,492,000
Fiscal Year 2008 : $980,492,000
Fiscal Year 2007 : $980,354,000
Fiscal Year 2006 : $980,354,000
Fiscal Year 2005 : $990,257,000

http://www2.ed.gov/programs/fws/funding.html