It's Simple Really... Take Out The Mandate, And Then Pass The Bill

[WillyT]

Funding you say???

Reconciliation...

<snip>

Reconciliation is a legislative process of the United States Senate intended to allow a contentious budget bill to be considered without being subject to filibuster. Because reconciliation limits debate and amendment, the process empowers the majority party. Reconciliation also applies in the United States House of Representatives, but since the House regularly passes rules that constrain debate and amendment, the reconciliation process represented less of a change in that body.

<snip>

Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconciliation_%28United_States_Congress%29

There... Fixed it... What's next?

:shrug:

:evilgrin:

[AndyA]

1. What you suggest would take guts, leadership, and intelligence.

And we would need to find those things in Harry Reid...

Hence my concern.

I do agree that they could pass a bill that's mighty nasty and fix a lot of it in the reconciliation process, but no one seems to be ready to do that.

[Echo In Light]

27. And elected Reps who aren't in the pockets of vested intere$ts

[TheWraith]

2. Pass the bill WITHOUT reconciliation, then do a second WITH reconciliation.

Reconciliation takes time, and if we want to get this done before the end of the year, we need to pass the bill through regular means. Then go back for a second round using reconciliation.

[Jackpine Radical]

3. That's unspeakably dangerous.

They're likely to forget entirely about the improvement phase once they've passed a Health Care Deform bill.

[TheWraith]

7. That's one of three choices we have.

The others are, wait another 3-6 months to go through reconciliation, facing a renewed wave of opposition and potentially losing more moderates and people up for reelection.

Or, scrap the bill entirely and accept another 15-20 years of pre-existing conditions, no insurance industry regulation, and people dying in emergency rooms.

[Lance_Boyle]

13. WHY must we 'get this done before the end of the year?'

This EXCEEDINGLY STUPID artificial deadline is... exceedingly stupid. Congress - if you're gonna do it, do it right.

[Javaman]

24. so it doesn't muddy the waters for the dems to attempt their reelections.

See? It has absolutely nothing to do with us.

Step back and see the larger picture. This bill will be rammed through in what ever bullshit form so these tools can go out on the campaign trail extolling their virtues about how they helped America and the poor and the blah blah blah, bullshit bullshit bullshit.

That's why.

It's all about ego and image to them.

[Jackpine Radical]

4. You can't do that!!1!

It would cut into the profit surge the insurance companies are counting on. Obama promised!

[WillyT]

6. That's Why I Like It...

:evilgrin:

:hi:

[TheWebHead]

5. so remove pre-existing, remove caps

and allow people to buy insurance only after they've been diagnosed with a costly illness. Sounds like a simple path... to bankruptcy.

[WillyT]

9. I'm Pretty Sure I Didn't Say That, But I'll Look Again...

Nope... didn't say that.

:shrug:

[Lorien]

14. Why pass a bill that screws us even without the mandate?

[blindpig]

28. Aw, come on, it's the lesser of two evils.....

This is where we that whole stupid argument hits the wall.

[Romulox]

10. It's exactly as logical as forcing people to buy a product from a for-profit company

and then promising them that once demand is mandated by law that prices will magically go down. I mean...really? :eyes:

[Lorien]

12. Don't allow insurance companies to cross state lines, stop excessive

deductibles, allow importation of drugs from Canada...there really is so much wrong with this bill that it's utterly worthless AND evil!

[Romulox]

8. You misunderstand; the mandate is the ENTIRE point of the bill

Everything else is meant to be sugar to make that medicine go down.

[WillyT]

15. Great... Now I Have A Mary Poppins Song Stuck In My Head !!!

Actually... it is one hell of a metaphor, isn't it?

:shrug:

[Romulox]

20. Great metaphor, wonderful film, lovely lady!

:loveya:

[Lorien]

17. Where's the sugar?

All I see is a giant givaway of our hard earned dollars to the already uber wealthy.

[Romulox]

21. I'm on your side, but you've got to see if from the perspective of the President and his backers...

:shrug:

[Lorien]

26. More profits for them and less for us?

That's pretty much all I'm seeing here.

[Laelth]

23. +1 n/t

:dem:

-Laelth

[stray cat]

11. If people don't have a mandate to buy insurance we don't need to subsidize it...

that would save alot of money. Fewer people would get covered but without a mandate the number covered will be substantially lower anyway.

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

19. Yeah, the only people that would buy insurance would be the sickies.

Healthy people would not assume any shared risk. Rates would be sky-high (like the are now).
If a public option exists, it will need to deny coverage to many and have low caps to survive in such a market.

Said otherwise, if you remove the mandate any public option MUST have means to deny coverage and set caps.
Otherwise, a public option would not be finacially sustainable. More or less... that is the current market.
No mandated participation means absolutley no change.

[amborin]

16. Nope, too much else wrong with it:

<http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=433x58124>

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

18. That's a terrible idea at this point in time.

Passing a weak/bad bill will anger the Progressives, unify all the Republicans, and likely push many Centrists 7 Independants to the right. Remember that the midyear elections are in 2010 - you'd be giving the republicans something legitamite to beat on by passing a bad bill and would also be asking Dems to temporarily eat sour grapes and wait patiently for reconciliation.

The American public is anything but patient and the Dems may lose many midterm election house and senate seats.
Best case scenario, the Dem majority is hurt and the rest of Obama's agenda (including reconciliation) get difficult.
Worst case, you lose a ton of seats and make Obama's progressive agenda items go out the window completely.

[PassingFair]

22. I'll back that.

Bluff called.

[WillyT]

25. Exactly !!!

:toast:

:hi: