Thoughts about bleeding to death

[Horse with no Name]

updated http://journals.democraticunderground.com/Horse%20with%20no%20Name/15

As a nurse, I have been involved in major traumas.
I remember one in particular. A young woman was involved in a motor vehicle accident.
Her sports car went under the back of an 18-wheeler. It took the top of her head off, as well as many other injuries...but that was the most spectacular.
She came in with large bore IV's...we literally were squeezing the blood in by hand while it was running out holes everywhere else. We were literally ankle deep in it. She was losing it so fast that we couldn't keep up with the volume.
After slamming in 15+ units of blood...and still not able to get a viable blood count, we had to let her go.
All of the blood in the world couldn't replace what was lost.
We tried, but there was literally nothing we could do.
This is how I feel about Afghanistan. It is analogous to a country bleeding to death and our troops are the transfusion.
However, we simply cannot transfuse fast enough, because when we stop one bleeder, there are 20 to take it's place.
It's time to pronounce the patient President Obama.
Our resources can be conserved to utilize when it can make a difference.
Now, it simply does not.

[Morning Dew]

1. more than ankle deep, perhaps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXnJVkEX8O4

Waist deep in the Big Muddy
And the big fool says to push on.
Waist deep in the Big Muddy
And the big fool says to push on.
Waist deep! Neck deep! Soon even a
Tall man'll be over his head, we're
Waist deep in the Big Muddy!
And the big fool says to push on!

[HarveyDarkey]

8. beat me to it

that song was my first thought also

[patrice]

2. China doesn't want us to pronounce the patient. Remember, this has ALWAYS been about Oil.

[natrat]

3. roll muddy river

When the last rose of summer pricks my finger,
And the hot sun chills me to the bone,
When I can't hear the song for the singer,
And I can't tell my pillow from a stone,
I will walk alone by the black muddy river,
And sing me a song of my own,
I will walk alone by the black muddy river,
And sing me a song of my own.

Black muddy river, roll on forever,
I don't care how deep or wide, if you've got another side,
Roll muddy river, roll muddy river, black muddy river, roll.

[shadowknows69]

4. Nice. Memories of Jerry.

[Morning Dew]

5. oh yeah.

When it seems like the night will last forever,
And there's nothing left to do but count the years,
When the strings of my heart start to sever,
And stones fall from my eyes instead of tears,
I will walk alone, by the black muddy river,
And dream me a dream of my own,
I will walk alone, by the black muddy river,
And sing me a song of my own, sing me a song of my own

[nadinbrzezinski]

6. I hate this war, and I hate war as you would not be able to comprehend

having been shot at, and taken care of those caught in the middle.

And I don't like this war.

But I am not surprised he ain't letting go. He told us this during the campaign... and he ain't letting go.

And as a medic I saw my fair number of people bleed to death as well...

[saracat]

7. Well done Horse K+R

[Stinky The Clown]

9. Striking analogy

Powerful.

:thumbsup:

[Bluerthanblue]

10. what if your patient had been 8mos. pregnant?

It's not as ....'simple'- is a terrible word to use for your analogy, I know there is nothing simple about what you recounted.

But you spoke of the fate of one person. How many people will die because we just leave? I am not advocating for the extra troops being sent- I was against our going into Afghanistan from Sept.11, 2001- and I don't believe war is a solution for anything, but it's not as neat and tidy as your analogy makes it out to be.

Our leaving abruptly would endanger many people- our staying and escalating more than likely will too.

There is no good answer to this hell. I don't like any of the solutions.

It was over for your patient well before she was pronounced. Any suffering she may have experienced as a result of your life-saving efforts ended when the medical intervention ended. The suffering of the Afghani people won't end when we leave- it's just not as simple as that. If only it were.

[Horse with no Name]

11. How many people will die because we stay?

And what difference does it make if she was 8 months pregnant?
How much blood do you think that fetus had access to when it was all on the ground?
Sorry--the woman was the patient, not the fetus.
There was no way with that blood loss that ANYONE would dare cut her--until she was pronounced dead. It would have been fatal.
After that--you could attempt to save the baby--but the health of the MOTHER is always first.
It wasn't a lifetime movie.

[Bluerthanblue]

12. sorry I didn't speak my thoughts better- Your analogy doesn't

work because the woman you were dealing with was an INDIVIDUAL-

Her life ended that day- when the decision was made to stop any further life support- her suffering ended as well.

Our leaving Afghanistan is NOT so cut and dried. And I acknowledged that regardless of what is done there will be suffering and death-

I wasn't seeing this as a lifetime movie- and wasn't criticizing your life saving procedure.

It isn't as easy as just "calling" Afghanistan's TOD. You have millions of patients in Afghanistan- not one critically injured woman. And no matter what is done- people are going to die. There IS no "good solution".

:shrug: