Breaking on MSNBC

[nadinbrzezinski]

Zelaya is back in Honduras... this coup is not going to turn like most.

[rabs]

1. He is in the Brazilian Embassy in Tegucigalpa

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090921/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/l...


For Spanish speakers, suggest listening to Radio Globo.
http://www.radioglobohonduras.com/

President Lula da Silva has done what Hillary/Obama could not, or would not.

[Warpy]

3. My guess is "could not."

After all, our "help" under Reagan is part of what has them in this mess in the first place.

The Obama administration has been trying to work through other Latin countries instead of directly. It's probably a very good idea.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. Would not...

there is a 200 year old history...

[Ozymanithrax]

2. Ousted President Zelaya says back in Honduras (Google)

Ousted President Zelaya says back in Honduras
TEGUCIGALPA, Honduras — Deposed President Manuel Zelaya said Monday he has returned home to Honduras to reclaim his presidency, defying threats of arrest and summoning supporters.

While the State Department confirmed on Monday that Zelaya is in Honduras, his exact whereabouts were unclear, possibly in an attempt to avoid capture.

"I cannot give details, but I'm here," Zelaya told the local TV Channel 36. His voice, but not his image, were transmitted.

He said initially that he was at the United Nations headquarters in his homeland, and Elisabeth Sierra, a spokeswoman for the Honduran Embassy in Nicaragua, where Zelaya had been exiled, reiterated the claim.

"He is in Honduras and calling the resistance to gather in front of the United Nations and protect the constitutional president of Honduras," she said Monday.

But a spokeswoman at the U.N. offices in Tegucigalpa told The Associated Press he wasn't there. "I have no idea where that story came from," said spokeswoman Ana Elsy Mendoza. Nonetheless, Zelaya supporters were gathering outside the U.N. compound, said U.N. spokeswoman Michele Montas in New York.

[TxRider]

5. Isn't his term up?

I thought it was election time there about now...

[nadinbrzezinski]

6. No, his term is up in six months

he will return to power... before all this mess is over. Which is HIGHLY unusual for Latin America

[TxRider]

11. Only to serve a few months and be out again?

Doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

I watched an interview withe interim prez, he says their constitution can be changed excpet for a very few articles that cannot be changed by -any- legal means.. One term for presidency is one of those.

The interim guy said by just serving as interim, he was barred from ever serving again.

Edit: Election is on November 29th

Seems a lot of trouble for a couple of months back in office. I bet they stall for most if not all of that time.

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. If you believe in democracy it makes sense

he was ousted in an illegal act...

A coup is highly illegal.

If, as they said, he was breaking the law, impeachment or a similar mechanism should have been used.

And yes, it is not illogical... and it breaks so-many traditions it is not even funny.

[TxRider]

16. That's just it, I don't know Honduran law.

What I hear is that he decided to hold a referendum on changing the constitution, and the supreme court said it was illegal.

And that he moved to do so anyway, which was illegal so he was arrested and taken from office.

I do not pretend to know whether or not that is due process under Honduran law, but they maintain it that it is.

Then there are allegations he took 40mil to Venezuela, and had the ballots printed there or some such.

I've never seen a comprehensive legal case made that I could have faith in yet.

It would seem to me that just waiting until the regular election in November, and having a newly elected president would be the cleanest way out of this mess. Zalaya could not run for another term anyway.

[nadinbrzezinski]

18. The problem was what they did, and the coup was a RW coup

the fact the US did not support is was one of those where many of us went... hmm things are changing in the hemisphere. They expected our support, due to the history of at least the last fifty years.

As to Honduran law, I asked Hondurans on this, since most Constitutions have a mechanism to remove a president. Mind you, impeachment is a political act, but usually when I have asked that question the way it breaks is, the RWess him and haw, while the lefties go into why they had no case. This tells me there is a mechanism, and the coup leaders chose not to use it.

[TxRider]

19. It doesn't tell me that though

A law should be an easy thing to cite.

Is procedure for the supreme court to do it? Then it's ok that's what they did.

Is it through a legislative impeachment like ours? If so then it's illegal.

I wish our representatives would cite Honduran law instead of rhetoric. I don't know which side to be on.

Was Zalaya pushing a coup looking to become a dictator and was ousted, or was he the victim of a coup, or was he legally removed?

Nobody wants to cite what the actual law is, or present the Honduran supreme court's rationale in a legal framework.

[nadinbrzezinski]

20. From what I understand it is legislative

and we haven't got the full poop anyway.

The fact that the US did NOT recognize this government broke way too much precedent. So that is the clue that we consider it illegal, but could not say that... and that is the power of the American RWing.

And he was a victim of a coup... the people leading it were graduates of the school of the Americas and expected FULL US Support.

And I guess I could go and look for the damn law... but to be honest I don't feel like readying the Honduran Constitution. To me the events have been highly unusual given US Latin relations of at least the last fifty years.

[TxRider]

21. That's why I figured it best to just wait a couple more months until an election

And do what we can to make sure it's a fair and honest one.

I'm not going to read their constitution either.

[nadinbrzezinski]

22. Here you go, and curiosity got the best part of me

23. Decretar la restricción o suspensión de derechos de conformidad con lo prescrito en la Constitución y ratificar, modificar o improbar la restricción o suspensión que hubiere dictado el Poder Ejecutivo de acuerdo con la Ley;

If the executive went over their rights it was up to them.

Let me translate the legalese

To decree the restriction or suspension of the rights of conformity what is prescribed by the Constitution and to ratify, modify or suspend the restriction or suspension that the executive dictated by law.

Long document, but as usual it is based on ours... and having read the Mexican Constitution many a times... I guess I knew where to look.

And lord that thing is HARD to read... and like most modern constitutions it is just messy.

Oh and I forgot, here is the link

http://pdba.georgetown.edu/Constitutions/Honduras/hond05.html

A few things gave me pause, but that is another matter.

[cali]

12. there is no way of knowing whether or not he'll return to power.

[Name removed]

14. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[cali]

15. raving, ranting and insulting me is not ignoring me.

you have completely jumped the tracks. The comment you responded to was not an attack on you or cyberstalking.

[malaise]

7. Good news

indeed.

[Ian David]

8. Yeah, but the airline lost his luggage. n/t

[Liberal_in_LA]

9. uh oh.

[UTUSN]

10. So, IOW, his status is now fugitive and subject to be arrested and tried, as opposed to

being free in exile.

(And, please, anybody, just forget calling the "freeper" name--if that's all you got when it's patently lying, DU-rule-breaking, then it's a pathetic reaction.)

[TxRider]

17. Apparently he is in Honduras, at the Brazilian embassy, having snuck bak into the country.