Residents refused to evacuate during fire; now they are asking to be rescued

[Liberal_in_LA]

Gold Canyon residents refused to evacuate during fire; now they are asking to be rescued
August 31, 2009 | 3:13 pm
When the Station fire barreled toward their community in the Gold Canyon area, they refused to leave.

But then firefighters set backfires in the area, and now the five residents are asking to be rescued, according to authorities.

The problem is there is no way to get to them. The Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department considered sending a helicopter up to get them, but fire officials advised it would be too dangerous.

Sheriff's spokesman Steve Whitmore said the department is now monitoring conditions and figuring out how to get them.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2009/08/station-fire-evacuate-gold-canyon.html

[Drunken Irishman]

1. Tough shit. Risk you pay refusing to evacuate.

[Drunken Irishman]

4. Ok, that's a bit harsh. But seriously...

Why wouldn't they evacuate?

[Creena]

8. No, not really.

I'm sorry for their predicament, but they put themselves in that position. From what I read, they received ample warning and wanted to defend their home. Anyone living in Southern California knows that is bullshit. Voluntary evacuation...fine. But, mandatory? Haul ass!

Two firefighters already lost their lives. Like someone else said, there is a difference between being heroic and stupid.

[wroberts189]

9. They banded together in an heroic effort to save their homes.

They probably thought they would be able to get out in time.

The lack of empathy here is disappointing.

[sarge43]

10. Tell that to the families of any rescue workers who'd have to go in for them.

A house, a human life. They don't have equal value.

[Drunken Irishman]

11. They banded together. Awesome.

But they're now putting OTHER lives at risk because they didn't get out when it was safe.

You know, a house is just that - a house. Lives are so much more valuable and they shouldn't risk it to save something that can be replaced.

[Dorian Gray]

43. They shouldn't.

I hope that they don't die, but I don't understand, for the life of me, why they didn't evacuate when they were ordered to.

[rollingrock]

47. Property is more valuable than life

...in the conservative view.

[Creena]

12. A house is not worth the life of my friends and family.

I've lost enough loved ones to people not following orders. Where's the empathy towards the widow and children of the rescue worker who perished while attempting to save someone who should have evacuated?

[havocmom]

Hey, they didn't leave when it could be done safely, now they want others to save them

at risk to the people who would do the rescues. Sorry, no. It is not lack of empathy. It is common sense, common decency and consideration of the finite resources that are HUMAN beings doing the rescuing.

They made their choice, they need to deal with the consequences. IF not, lots of rescue people will die because more fools will pull the same shit.

[JeanGrey]

24. If someone dies trying to "rescue" them, would you still

think of them as "heroic?" I think of them as morons.

[treestar]

46. The lack of empathy for the firefighters is more than disappointing

It's shocking.

[johnnie]

5. Oh oh

That thinking didn't go over too well here at DU during Katrina.

:yoiks:

[Drunken Irishman]

6. That's a bit different.

Surely many should have evacuated and while I feel sorry many lost their lives, many also didn't have the means to evacuate.

IF they had reason to do so and didn't, then I feel sorry for them, but - well, we'll leave it at that.

[ellenfl]

7. the difference is that these 5 could easily evac. eom

[JuniperLea]

14. The difference being, and it is huge...

There was no way to get out of NO... these people in So Cal have had DAYS to get out.

Not the same thing. Not at all.

[johnnie]

18. Here is a post three days before it hit

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=4474155

There are many posts prior to Katrina hitting talking about the evacuations.


I'm not agreeing with the above posts, it's just that I remember what was happening and there were a lot of people in New Orleans saying they were just gonna ride it out. And I also remember some people here saying that they were warned to get out and they got flamed. That's all I was saying. But I honestly do recall seeing people on the news coverage saying they were going to stay and ride out the hurricane.

[havocmom]

20. Poor people do not always have the means of escape

The fact that cops from another town were shooting people who tried to WALK across a bridge and get out might be worth considering too.

[JeanGrey]

26. Was that happening three days prior?

[havocmom]

37. The bridge? No. The poverty with its attending limitations on travel?

Most assuredly. If one has never been so poor to know the reality of no where to go, no way to get there, one should count blessings, and apply a bit of imagination mixed with empathy. Perhaps that understanding is beyond some here.

edited for typo

[JeanGrey]

44. Of course. But the OP seemed to think the "shooters" were

keeping people from getting away from Katrina. That is incorrect. Plus there are MANY who could have evacuated and chose not to.

[havocmom]

48. Actually, the shooters WERE keeping people from leaving the flooded area

So, I fail to grasp your point

[JeanGrey]

49. The shooters were not there pre Katrina, when evacs

were ordered.

[maxpower]

2. Privatize the police and fire departments

How dare they asked the socialists to help them. Sarcasm off.

[Kajsa]

3. They should have evacuated when it was safe

to do so.

This is so sad and very dangerous for everyone involved.

Two firefighters lost their lives yesterday.

May they RIP, my condolences to their families.

:(

[Liberal_in_LA]

13. Update - they still haven't been rescued

Oops. Changed our minds. Save us after all!

August 31, 2009 | 4:54 pm

After at first refusing to leave their homes during the evacuation of Gold Canyon, five residents are now asking to be rescued. Right now that's not even a possibility, but fire crews are looking for ways -- or a change in conditions -- that might make rescue possible.

http://opinion.latimes.com/opinionla/2009/08/fire-wildfire-brush-fire-chaparral-angeles-flintridge-santa-clarita-.html

[Kajsa]

21. Damn, that is going to be

so dangerous!

Thanks for the update.

[JuniperLea]

15. I would have a hard time giving the order...

To rescue them when it would mean putting the rescue crew in danger, and it would mean pulling them off other fire fighting duties.

No house is worth that.

Some idiots thought they were going to be safe in their hot tub... they are now in the hospital because they thought deadly wrong.

[Liberal_in_LA]

16. To prevent a lawsuit, they'll rescue them eventually

[JuniperLea]

17. I thought of that too, sadly...

I'm sure there are plenty of lawsuits against those who spend their lives trying to save others. That's just how us greedy sumsbeeches roll.

[JeanGrey]

27. Unfortunately that is the MO of many Americans.

"We don't have to obey you" and then "if you don't save us, we'll sue you"

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

19. Oooops.

[madeline_con]

22. They tell us the same thing during hurricanes.

Get out now, or deal with it. Live and learn. Or not.

[alittlelark]

23. I assumed it was an older community - it's a development

A very young one from the look of the trees.

Weeds.

http://www.movoto.com/real-estate/homes-for-sale/CA/Saugus/22123-Gold-Canyon-Dr-203_F1818001.htm

http://realestate.yahoo.com/California/Santa_Clarita/22123-gold-canyon-dr:4ffd53bd589d51cff67dc60653f88

I wish them the best, but they have maybe 1 or 2 years of memories to protect in their houses.
They were likely afraid of looters.

[Canuckistanian]

25. There should be a waiver to sign

Saying that if you refuse to evacuate, you should bear the costs of rescue.

It's only fair.

[RB TexLa]

30. If you don't evacuate during a mandatory evacuation there is no rescue.

They should obey the law and not send anyone.

[RB TexLa]

31. wrong spot

[pipi_k]

42. Yep, I agree...it IS only fair.

People who refuse to evacuate when they are perfectly able to should first be told that it may, or even will, become impossible for them to be rescued should they change their minds later.

Then they should sign a form saying they will be responsible for any and all costs of having to rescue them if they do change their minds and if it's possible to rescue them.

I also think that if a rescue worker dies or gets injured in the process of rescuing someone who refused to evacuate before, the person who made the decision NOT to be rescued in the first place should be made to attend the funeral of the dead rescue worker and to make personal apologies to that person's family.

It's one thing when people want to endanger themselves...quite another when their stubbornness or stupidity ends up costing the life of someone else.

[dixiegrrrrl]

28. Around here, the sheriff/rescue office makes you sign a next of kin

letter and write your SS # on your arm, with indelible ink, if you refuse to evacuate.

And they emphasize there will NO POSSIBLE rescue until perhaps days after a hurricane.

Yet, still, there were people who tried to ride out hurricanes in Galveston, Biloxi, all along the coast, time after time after time.
And no, I am NOT talking about the people who COULD NOT evacuate in New Orleans.

[Swamp Rat]

32. Yeah, I remember before and after hurricane Camille

I remember seeing a lot of nice, strong houses before Camille hit, and then only their foundations, flipped like potato chips in a breeze, afterward... and metal stairs that went to nowhere.

If you can get out... GET THE FUCK OUT!

[Swamp Rat]

29. I hope they are rescued

:(

[dysfunctional press]

38. if they are, i hope that they get sent a bill for the operation that rescues them.

if they wanted to be rescued for free- they should have evacuated with everyone else.

[RB TexLa]

33. once when I and some family stayed during a mandatory evacuation

a friend who was with the sheriff's office offered to come bring us supplies and cut down some trees. We refused and told him that he needed to obey the law.

[Inchworm]

34. To the folks calling for help... here's your sign

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mUEUwdhsn4

:hide:

[Sultana]

35. Let them die, they chose to stay

Firefighters shouldn't be sent in to save these idiots!

[lonestarnot]

36. Is shock and awe taking place in CA with the fires, or does anyone know the cause.

The first reports I heard were firecrackers or fireworks to keep birds away from something er other.

[Lance_Boyle]

39. It's summertime in California. That shit burns. Every year.

If anyone there is shocked, they're either brand new residents or extraordinarily willfully ignorant.

[lonestarnot]

41. And ignition points appear to be extraordinarily strategic at this time.

:shrug: just an observation.

[rucky]

40. Who on earth would make that decision so lightly?

Are they really that attached to their stuff?

[treestar]

45. It is not fair to firefighters to expect them to take extreme risks

If they gave the advice to evacuate, I'd evacuate. I can't imagine the people who wouldn't listen, and then would have the gall to ask others to risk their lives at an even higher rate.