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Sad that... American Presidents and Candidates have to visit countries in SECRET...

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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-20-08 07:08 PM
Original message
Sad that... American Presidents and Candidates have to visit countries in SECRET...
Edited on Sun Jul-20-08 07:52 PM by KoKo01
Sort of like Roosevelt at Yalta.

What have we become as a Nation when Senators can go out there and get constant "Press Coverage" for their "visiting the troops."

BUT... Bush/Cheney and Obama have to go under the "dark night cover" and have the "American Free Press" (HA! :rofl: and all that) seem to "disguise" their itenerary.

I'm a WWII Baby....so I guess I find this disconcerting in some way. I'm sure there are so many who understand the need for American President's /VP's and Dem Candidates to have to travel in "SECRECY."

After all...the "dirty smelling hoards of disenfranchised" might just "rise up" and throw a stone or two at them. Then it's a HUNDRED YEARS IN GITMO!" Who wants to deal with that shit?

:eyes:
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TechBear_Seattle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-20-08 07:11 PM
Response to Original message
1. If they have nothing to hide, why the secrecy?
If they are making secret trips, what are they trying to hide?
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dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-20-08 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. they are trying to avoid being killed
which seems fairly reasonable.
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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-20-08 07:37 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. But....the question is...why are they "avoiding being killed?" Aren't we spreading Democracy
to the World? Aren't all our MSMedia telling us the "Surge is working" and aren't the Pundits verifying that? :shrug: Why are "American High Officials" flying around "under the cover of darness/secrecy?"
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dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-20-08 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. actually that is a kind of goofy arguement
we were certainly on the right side then but I don't think FDR would have been wise to just travel about Europe willy nilly.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-20-08 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Security was such a hassle - he was almost killed before inauguration - he rarely went to NYC. nt
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-20-08 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Security.
Edited on Sun Jul-20-08 07:34 PM by MookieWilson
Even here: I've always been fascinated that she was permitted to go on this trip as, by then, she knew about The Bomb.



And here:

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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-20-08 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. lol's a GOOD ONE...pics...and Irony! n/t
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Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-20-08 07:51 PM
Response to Original message
7. Iranian President Imadinnerjacket was able to openly visit Iraq...
... and he even walked around without a bulletproof vest.




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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-20-08 07:55 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Yeah! He said things were just "Great goings in the Bazarres and Marketplace for "average Iraqi."
Edited on Sun Jul-20-08 07:58 PM by KoKo01
...and then...sadly...it was reported that the Shops" he visited were BLOWN AWAY after he left!

-------------
NYT
April 3, 2007
McCain Wrong on Iraq Security, Merchants Say
By KIRK SEMPLE

BAGHDAD, April 2 — A day after members of an American Congressional delegation led by Senator John McCain pointed to their brief visit to Baghdad’s central market as evidence that the new security plan for the city was working, the merchants there were incredulous about the Americans’ conclusions.

“What are they talking about?” Ali Jassim Faiyad, the owner of an electrical appliances shop in the market, said Monday. “The security procedures were abnormal!”

The delegation arrived at the market, which is called Shorja, on Sunday with more than 100 soldiers in armored Humvees — the equivalent of an entire company — and attack helicopters circled overhead, a senior American military official in Baghdad said. The soldiers redirected traffic from the area and restricted access to the Americans, witnesses said, and sharpshooters were posted on the roofs. The congressmen wore bulletproof vests throughout their hourlong visit.

“They paralyzed the market when they came,” Mr. Faiyad said during an interview in his shop on Monday. “This was only for the media.”

He added, “This will not change anything.”

At a news conference shortly after their outing, Mr. McCain, an Arizona Republican, and his three Congressional colleagues described Shorja as a safe, bustling place full of hopeful and warmly welcoming Iraqis — “like a normal outdoor market in Indiana in the summertime,” offered Representative Mike Pence, an Indiana Republican who was a member of the delegation.

But the market that the congressmen said they saw is fundamentally different from the market Iraqis know.

Merchants and customers say that a campaign by insurgents to attack Baghdad’s markets has put many shop owners out of business and forced radical changes in the way people shop. Shorja, the city’s oldest and largest market, set in a sprawling labyrinth of narrow streets and alleyways, has been bombed at least a half-dozen times since last summer.

At least 61 people were killed and many more wounded in a three-pronged attack there on Feb. 12 involving two vehicle bombs and a roadside bomb.

American and Iraqi security forces have tried to protect Shorja and other markets against car bombs by restricting vehicular traffic in some shopping areas and erecting blast walls around the markets’ perimeters. But those measures, while making the markets safer, have not made them safe.

In the latest large-scale attack on a Baghdad market, at least 60 people, most of them women and children, were killed last Thursday when a man wrapped in an explosives belt walked around such barriers into a crowded street market in the Shaab neighborhood and blew himself up.

In recent weeks, snipers hidden in Shorja’s bazaar have killed several people, merchants and the police say, and gunfights have erupted between militants and the Iraqi security forces in the area.

During their visit on Sunday, the Americans were buttonholed by merchants and customers who wanted to talk about how unsafe they felt and the urgent need for more security in the markets and throughout the city, witnesses said.

“They asked about our conditions, and we told them the situation was bad,” said Aboud Sharif Kadhoury, 63, who peddles prayer rugs at a sidewalk stand. He said he sold a small prayer rug worth less than $1 to a member of the Congressional delegation. (The official paid $20 and told Mr. Kadhoury to keep the change, the vendor said.)

Mr. Kadhoury said he lost more than $2,000 worth of merchandise in the triple bombing in February. “I was hit in the head and back with shrapnel,” he recalled.

Ali Youssef, 39, who sells glassware from a sidewalk stand down the block from Mr. Kadhoury, recalled: “Everybody complained to them. We told them we were harmed.”

He and other merchants used to keep their shops open until dusk, but with the dropoff in customers as a result of the attacks, and a nightly curfew, most shop owners close their businesses in the early afternoon.

“This area here is very dangerous,” continued Mr. Youssef, who lost his shop in the February attack. “They cannot secure it.”

But those conversations were not reflected in the congressmen’s comments at the news conference on Sunday.

Instead, the politicians spoke of strolling through the marketplace, haggling with merchants and drinking tea. “The most deeply moving thing for me was to mix and mingle unfettered,” Mr. Pence said.

Mr. McCain was asked about a comment he made on a radio program in which he said that he could walk freely through certain areas of Baghdad.

“I just came from one,” he replied sharply. “Things are better and there are encouraging signs.”

He added, “Never have I been able to go out into the city as I was today.”

Told about Mr. McCain’s assessment of the market, Abu Samer, a kitchenware and clothing wholesaler, scoffed: “He is just using this visit for publicity. He is just using it for himself. They’ll just take a photo of him at our market and they will just show it in the United States. He will win in America and we will have nothing.”

A Senate spokeswoman for Mr. McCain said he left Iraq on Monday and was unavailable for comment because he was traveling.

Several merchants said Monday that the Americans’ visit might have only made the market a more inviting target for insurgents.

“Every time the government announces anything — that the electricity is good or the water supply is good — the insurgents come to attack it immediately,” said Abu Samer, 49, who would give only his nickname out of concern for his safety.

But even though he was fearful of a revenge attack, he said, he could not afford to stay away from the market. This was his livelihood. “We can never anticipate when they will attack,” he said, his voice heavy with gloomy resignation. “This is not a new worry.”

Ahmad Fadam and Wisam A. Habeeb contributed reporting.
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Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-20-08 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. I think most of the people in McCain's photo-ops were killed the next day because of it.
Edited on Sun Jul-20-08 07:57 PM by IanDB1
Imagine a Town Hall meeting on TV:

"Mister McCain... my husband met you in the marketplace in Iraq. Here is a photo of you shaking hands with him. The next day, insurgents came and killed him and both of our children. These other people in these other photos taken with you were also killed. Was this worth it for you?"
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