NBA Ref: Games are Fixed

[Jack_Dawson]

Anyone who saw Game 6 of Kings / Lakers in 2002 knows this was fixed. The NBA is finished.


http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/8231176/Donaghy:-Refs-fixed-playoff-series,-other-games

[Drunken Irishman]

1. Game 6 of that series has nothing on game 6 of the 1998 NBA Finals.

[LSK]

16. yes because the Ref tipped in Jordans jumper

:eyes:

[Drunken Irishman]

17. That jumper shouldn't have mattered, as Jordan pushed off.

And prior to that, the ref took 3 points away from the Jazz when Howard Eisley clearly hit a 3 pointer BEFORE the 24 second shot clock expired and then they gave Ron Harper his 3 point bucket, even though his shot came AFTER the 24 second clock expired. As Bob Costas said during the telecast, "With calls like this, you've got to wonder if the refs are rooting for the Bulls."

[LSK]

18. refs should not call tacky tack calls in the final 10 seconds

And can I ask you about a certain foul on Scottie Pippen against the Knicks in the 1994 playoffs???

[Drunken Irishman]

19. Pushing off is not a ticky tack call.

No more than an obvious hold on the line to get your running back open for he can make a game winning touch down.

As for that NY game, I wouldn't be surprised if it were poorly called as well. But I'm not a Knicks fan and those Bulls teams didn't have Jordan.

[Buzz Clik]

26. Bad calls are dime-a-dozen in the NBA. As are Hall of Fame no calls.

None are indicative of fixed games.

[Drunken Irishman]

27. Wrong.

Not a call like that. Not in the Jazz' home gym and not when that call has been pretty much called the entire game. It was an offensive foul and if it were to have happened to any other player, the refs would have called it.

Jordan pushed off to get a shot and that's not just a ticky tack call. It's not incidental contact. Not when he has to push the player to get a clean shot.

[Yupster]

42. I still remember that shot as one of the worst

examples of Superstarism in the NBA.

It was right out in the open, right in front of the ref and everyone else. Jordan took his defender around the top of the key, threw him aside, took the pass and hit the open jumper. Then everyone just looked at the referee and said, "well?".

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

38. Yup, that was the day I stopped watching(n/m)

[Diane R]

2. I would summit that the Seattle Seahawks/ Pittsburgh Steelers Superbowl is a candidate, too.

[SeattleGirl]

5. I'd second that submission too.

[neverforget]

22. That was a horribly called game........the Seahawks were robbed.

[DiverDave]

47. I couldn't finish watching that Super Bowl

I taped it, and taped over it, just couldn't watch it again...I waited 30 years as a fan of the Seahawks for THAT?

Handing out free pittsburgh 'terrible towels' to fans before the game...should have known it then.
Fuck the NFL, it's all rigged.

[Bill McBlueState]

57. Yeah, those refs really sucked at catching Willie Parker.

:eyes:

[DiverDave]

77. Yes parker did well, but what about

the lowest passer rating EVER (22.6) for that stealer QB ( and no I didn't mis-spell it.
Hasslebeck called for CLIPPING!!?? when he tackled the freaking ball carrier??, how is that fair?
And big ben didn't break the plane for that td
Maybe the most damaging call, though, came in the fourth quarter with the Seahawks trailing 14-10. Tight end Jerramy Stevens finally held onto a pass from quarterback Matt Hasselbeck at the Steelers' 1-yard line, but a holding penalty called on right tackle Sean Locklear negated the play.
There was no hold.
Hagans actually jumped offside on two consecutive plays, one of which was the Hasselbeck interception, which should have negated that play. These were plainly visible to the naked eye on national TV, but apparently not to the six blind mice on the field

Seems that offensive tackle Sean Locklear's incidental hooking (which occurs on nearly every NFL play from scrimmage) on his block of Clark Haggans (who was offside) was too dastardly to ignore.

Maybe the officials were calling the game tightly.

Nope. Only two plays later, Steelers linebacker Joey Porter used an illegal "horse collar" tackle on Alexander, and the officials decided to let it slide, even though that would have transformed a third-and-18 on the Steelers 34 to a first down on their 19.

A poll on Espn.com :
“Do you think officiating mistakes affected the outcome of Super Bowl XL? (103,167 votes)
61.7% Yes
38.2% No

Yep, a stealers fan will take it, but it WAS the worst called game in nfl history.
To take a tainted win tells alot about you.

[lumberjack_jeff]

60. The Pittsburgh QB got on TV the next day and said "I didn't really score".

Great.

[Jack_Dawson]

61. Seriously?

I don't remember Big Ben saying that.

[lumberjack_jeff]

62. Probably better links out there, but here you go.

http://blogs.king5.com/seahawks/archives/2006/02/even_roethlisbe.html

[devilgrrl]

67. The WORST Superbowl ever!

:thumbsdown:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

68. Agreed

Seahawks getting robbed in the playoffs in an earlier season was the reason they brought back the use of slow motion to judge calls.

And they still robbed it.

Haven't watched an NFL game since.

[Skink]

3. What was the spread for game 2 Sunday?

[Gman]

4. We've all seen it happen dozens of times

We've all seen game fixing toward the end of the season and in the playoffs is common knowledge. What's unusual is a ref talking about it.

[Gman]

6. I'll go all the way back to game 7 of the Washington Bullets vs. SA Spurs

for the Eastern Conference Championship circa 1978 or 1979. The infamous Earl Strom and (IIRC) the equally notorious Joey Crawford made damn sure that the former ABA Spurs didn't get to the NBA Finals. The Spurs had only been in the NBA for 2 or 3 years.

[Jack_Dawson]

8. Joey Crawford's hatred of the Spurs...

goes back that far?

[Gman]

10. Oh, Yes!

There's a very long history between Crawford and the Spurs.

[doublethink]

7. I stopped watching the Lakers/Celtics last game bout half way ...

through the second quarter ..... Lakers couldn't buy a foul .... read the final stats the next morning and sure enough Boston went to the free throw line 38 times, Lakers went there 10 times.

I'm watching tonight though !!! Back in L.A. :)

[TexasObserver]

30. When one team gets 38 free throws and one gets 10 in a championship game, IT'S FIXED

[doublethink]

36. Yeah I saved myself the agony of watching the rest of it ... total waste of time.

Good decision on my part even though the Lakers made it close at the end somehow (like 7 of 10 .... 3 pointers in the last 6 minutes of the game). Peace.

[Yupster]

41. I'd like to see a statistical analysis of

two types of calls.

1. Off the ball fouls like illegal screens.
2. Travelling.

It's my contention that the home team gets hit with less than half the calls in those two categories than the away team.

Tonight's game was as good an example as any. The Celtics got called for about three out of the blue travelling calls yet Kobie can change pivot feet at will without a call.

Not that I'm saying it's unfair to the Celtics. Back in Boston it will be the exact opposite and Kobie will get called for travelling on those exact same plays. And all of the sudden PJ Brown at age 38 will stop moving on his screens back in Boston and Lamar Odom will all of the sudden start setting moving screens.

I think home court is probably worth 10-15 free throws a game, not to mention the extra time stars have to sit on the bench on the road with foul trouble.

[ellisonz]

43. Kobe, not Kobie.

[AngryAmish]

52. Someone did a statistic analysis of racism by the refs in the NBA

Not overt but subliminal...there is a small but significant* bias toward players the same race as the referee. Nobody said it was conscious racism, more the racism we are all born with.


*Statistical significance is a changeable value

[TexasObserver]

71. I remember that, and it explains why Yao, as an Asian, catches hell from all refs

I've long felt that there was anti Asian bias at work from many of the refs toward Yao.

[doublethink]

63. Gawd I can't stand watching the stars sitting on the bench with early foul trouble !!

especially when the team is on the road .... wait all day to watch the game .... and poof ... :wtf: anyway at least there's only two days before they play again tomorrow night. :) Maybe that will help the young Lakers against the old Celtics? ;)

[TexasObserver]

70. It's so obvious when the refs start setting up the Win early in the first quarter.

First, the star for the "loser" catches two quick tacky fouls in the first, and has to sit. Then the other team makes a run, and builds a lead.

Then, the second quarter starts, and the star returns to the floor. But oh, damn, he catches another foul. Now he's got three, so he has to play carefully on both ends of the floor. He can't challenge a shot. He can't guard closely. He can't risk an offensive foul. And if they are calling offensive fouls on him, it totally screws up the player's offensive game.

Basketball is easily manipulated at the NBA level. The refs can dig a team in a hole the first half, even if they let the score stay within ten points. By fouling up one team earlier, they change the second half dramatically. The fouled up team cannot take the risks the other team can. And when they do, they get a foul, one that seems unfair.

I've seen them do it too many times. Sometimes you can see in the first ten minutes of the game that this NBA crew intends to help one team win.

[tridim]

9. That explains why I don't like watching the NBA but love college B-Ball.

And why do most centers WALK down the fucking court while they're on offense. Really lame.

[Jack_Dawson]

11. It's no longer a sport

UFC is 100x the sport the NBA is

[TheMightyFavog]

13. Yeah, and NBA refs seem to be unaware of a little rule called travelling.

Fuck the NBA.

[Oeditpus Rex]

14. They got rid of that rule years ago

The rule now states (and I invent this in its entirety):


When approaching the basket with the apparent intent of taking a shot, a player must take at least two steps while not dribbling the ball. Failure to do so may result in less juking and jiving, which the National Basketball Association will not tolerate.


There are similar rules against passing, taking high-percentage shots other than dunks and playing defense.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

39. College b-ball is so much better

I'll watch a game between Cal-Northridge and Pacific or Wisconsin-Green Bay and University of Illinois at Chicago before I'd cross the street to see an NBA game.

My brother watches the NBA (only because Boston is winning again). Guys are walking through the lane and double dribbling left and right. I ask "Is that legal now?", and he just says "Yup".

[Yavin4]

12. Professional Sports League Need to Outsource Their Refs and Umps

An independent, third entity should hire, fire, and manage the refs and umps for the games. Get the officiating out from the control of the leagues.

[bemildred]

15. You don't think it's all about the money do you?

:rofl::rofl:

[Jack_Dawson]

28. Well no shit

but if it's going to be Wrestling, then call it that. But for Stern to have a straight face and still call it basketball is a travesty.

[BlooInBloo]

20. Felon former ref who'll say anything to get less prison time: Games are fixed....

I'm not saying he either is or is not telling the truth. Just describe the situation fairly.

[Jack_Dawson]

23. He just happened to reference...

the one game I always knew was fixed.

-C

[Guaranteed]

33. Me. Too.

Because it fucking WAS.

[blondeatlast]

50. Exactly. No doubt about it. nt

[ellisonz]

44. Second.

And this doesn't excuse the fact there may be other refs engaged in similar behavior and that human error occurs...

[TexasObserver]

55. that can be said of every criminal who rolls on other criminals

The playoff game and series he mentioned are well known to fans, and many have long believed the league was fixing games in the playoffs. In fact, the league has been fixing games. It's obvious to long term fans of the league. Refs have never been so prevalent in determining the direction of NBA games as they have the past ten years.

Just as there are dirty cops, dirty congressmen, dirty judges, and dirty businessmen, there are dirty referees and dirty sports execs. It is naive to believe otherwise. And it is naive to believe only one ref was involved in fixing games or point spreads.

[Twillig]

78. How's that going to help him get less prison time?

The only way it can is if he is telling the truth and has evidence.

No evidence, no deal.

Lying, and the hammer is brought down upon him.

[TheWatcher]

21. It's not a sport, it's a business.

And unfortunately, a very corrupt one.

[Carnea]

24. So is baseball

The Devil Rays need 150 million dollars from hungry children to build a new stadium and miracle of miracles they are sweeping teams with ten times thier payroll.

:thumbsdown:

[malaise]

25. Corporate sport is as evil as all the myriad corporations

This is hardly news. Money and greed have been trumping all the positive aspects of sport for ages.

[TexasObserver]

29. the Lakers got 27 free throws in the 4th quarter of that game

Thank Dick Bavetta, one of the premiere fixers among NBA refs.

They've been fixing playoff games for years.

[Guaranteed]

31. No question. I've been bitching about that game for FIVE YEARS now.

And FUCK the NBA for stealing that championship from the Kings.

[Jack_Dawson]

34. Amen.

:toast:

I haven't been back since.

[LeftyMom]

40. Damn right. nt

[dysfunctional press]

32. i lost interest in the nba when michael jordan retired for real.

most of chicago did.

and things just haven't been the same since. they all seem proud to look like the bunch of thugs that the nba has appeared to become.

[Hannah Bell]

35. Sports, Business, Politics - what's not fixed, where big money controls it?

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

37. The NBA has been rigged for ten years

This current series is a sham as well. Being a huge Lakers fan in the 80's, I would have obsessed over these finals. Now, it's no more legit than the WWE.

[Yukari Yakumo]

45. This story is as credible as Chimpy.

Note the source: Tim Donaghy. He's about the go to prison for a few years. He's lobbing as much s*** as he can at the wall in hopes some of it will stick.

[Jack_Dawson]

49. Thank you, David Stern

Those are indeed the NBA talking points. However, anyone who saw the game knows what I'm talking about.

[TexasObserver]

56. It's naive to believe only one ref is dirty in the NBA.

EVERY criminal prosecution of criminal conspiracies involves getting a guy to roll on others. That is usually done by getting a conviction on the one guy and getting him to roll.

Your faith in the NBA is undeserved. There is absolutely no reason to believe they haven't been fixing games. It's pretty obvious to the long time fans of the league, and should have been obvious to you.

[cottonseed]

65. One bad apple?

No, Kings fan here that knew that game was fixed the day it was played. The whole barrel is rotten.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

74. Where there's smoke there's fire

I'm no conspiracy nut, and I stopped watching the NBA ten years ago because of the distinct feeling games were rigged, or even scripted. I don't feel this way about any other sport. Looks like the chickens are coming home to roost.

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

46. I'm not surprised

I'm not much of a basketball fan, but with all the big money involved in pro sports, there would be nothing but rife incentives to rig the games.

Sports have become too much of a spectator activity where the masses watch the elites. Whatever happened to mass participation, i.e. getting off the couch and picking up a basketball yourself? Sounds like much more fun to me...

[tom_paine]

48. The NBA is NOT finished. NEVER underestimate the power of denial and corporate-fueled

propaganda.

The NBA is not finished. Nor is the NFL, even though I strongly suspect something similar is going on over there, too.

MLB should have been finished long ago, but is not.

The NBA is not finished. Not even close. The corporate media will close around this like a negative Bush story, and kill it by ignoring it.

Good for the sponsors, everyone keeps making money, so everyone keeps quiet.

[blondeatlast]

51. Hardly finished, but Stern is/has been handling these sorts of allegations really poorly. I'm a Suns

fan. This year--D'Antonio sucked and they deserved to lose but last year???--don't even get me started... :mad:

[michreject]

53. Det. v Clev last year

Stern wanted LBJ on the main stage.

The document also described other alleged infractions, including league officials telling referees that they should withhold calling technical fouls on certain star players because doing so hurt ticket sales and television ratings."

[noonwitch]

54. Pro Football always seems rigged to me

I don't know, it just seems so predictable. Not college football, though.

[Twillig]

79. Not college football?!

OK. maybe not. Incompetence to rival 'fixing', maybe.

Oregon Ducks v. Oklahoma Sooners. Sooners screwed out of a win.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIn1mNmgDjc&NR=1

Oregon State Beavers v. Washington Huskies. Beavers nearly hosed by incompetent on field and in the replay booth refs. Or was it a try for a screw job? Damn near caused a riot. That was an ugly crowd. Booed until and after the Beavs won.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-O1QGjGFYlg

[Romulox]

58. 2006 ECF Dwayne Wade was treated like the second coming

When you get away with a crime for so long, you get sloppy, and you get blatant.

I have no doubt that Donaghy's allegations are true.

[PCIntern]

59. There were a couple of umps years ago who

used to make the most outrageous calls against the Phillies...when one of them was behind the plate, the strike zone was 4 feet wide and called 3rd strikes were occasionally in the dirt. the broadcasters would only vaguely allude to it occurring...even Richie Ashburn who rarely held his tongue would just sit there in silence. It was so obvious but no one would say a word. When it was brought up on talk radio, the host would just dismiss it as the vagaries of the game (not his words, I assure you).

[cottonseed]

64. I remember sitting in a sports book watching the game, chanting fixed.

A lot of Lakers fans, a lot of Kings fans. We all knew that stinking game was fixed. I always joked that I'd tell my children Kings were champions that year (the same year LA was talking "Best Team Ever") but it was a day and age when the games were fixed. How true it was.

[Jack_Dawson]

75. Exactly - even Lakers fans...

...the intellectually honest ones...have admitted as much. Big asterisk on the 2002 "championship"

[devilgrrl]

66. I met a bookie who insists that ALL games are fixed. MLB, NBA, NFL, NHL, etc..

It's all about the money.

[Better Believe It]

72. He's Wrong: MLB Games Aren't Fixed

The players try their hardest to win, play well and make it big in the majors.

A lot of money can be made if you're talented enough.

And the umpires can't really throw a game as easily as basketball.

The "home field" advantage isn't nearly as great in baseball as it is in basketball or even football.

It's more balanced. Even the poorest teams can and do frequently beat the best times on their home field.

And the history and tradition of professional baseball goes all the way back to Reconstruction days.

[undeterred]

69. I haven't watched the NBA since Michael Jordan played

for the Bulls and I lived in Chicago. But having watched 6 NBA championships, it was always obvious that they were supposed to drag the series out as long as possible. I wasn't sure if it was the players or the refs or both throwing it.

[truebrit71]

73. No shit they are. There have been far too many series that have inexplicably gone to 7 games...

...for no other reason than to generate revs for the network and the NBA...

I really hope this ends the bullshit refereeing in the NBA...

On edit....never mind that'll never happen...

But the comment upthread about about MLB not being fixed misses the most obvious point that the ENTIRE game is controlled by the ump...the guy behind the plate...there has been ZERO consistency forever about calling balls and strikes...there are some umps how must not have read the rules about how wide or how low the zone is, but you can see it almost anytime you watch a game...In all honesty I think MLB is the most rigged of them all...

[Blue_Tires]

76. like McClellan,should we file this under "stuff we already knew?"