What would happen if they gave a SOTU and no Democrats...

[Historic NY]

showed up? Inquiring minds want to know.

[FlyingSquirrel]

1. It would be a new day in America. eom

[Jack Rabbit]

2. What would happen if the Frat Boy came to give the SOTU and . . .

. . . the sergeant-at-arms arrested the bastard?

[MonkeyFunk]

3. We'd be out of power for 20 years

Americans don't want their leaders to act like petulant children. The SOTU is a grand tradition, honoring the office of the Presidency, not the man who holds it.

[Dark]

5. Pretty much. n/t

[Dr Fate]

8. So any DEM who snubbed it would risk losing an election? That might be a stretch.

I'm not saying it is the best idea in the world, but 20 years? I doubt it. Most people could care less about Bush- even in the SOTU forum.

I imagine a candidate with a solid explanation for why he didnt want to waste his time listening to that man would be fine in a re-election. Played right it could even help a candidate.

But-that kind of political theater might make more sense if we were still the minority and not in control of congress- then again, nothing like thais ever happened under those circumstances either.

We both agree that such a powerful symbolic display of dissent against Bush would never be in the cards.

[Greyhound]

10. So, upholding the law equates to "act(ing) like petulant children"?

Valuing the law, and following it, is "act(ing) like petulant children"?

Placing country before party is "act(ing) like petulant children"?

Makes me all warm inside knowing I share a nationality with people like this...
:puke:

[Dr Fate]

14. It's actually bullied children who always let the bully have his way.

I'm not sure the people who want Bush to pay for his actions are being children either- but there are some DEMS who do resemble frightened kids when it comes to fighting Bush and putting him in his place.

[Greyhound]

19. We are usually of the same mind, but in this case I have to disagree.

Republik or Democrat makes little or no difference. This is, and always has been, all about class. Warren Buffet openly stated it (check the sig line when they come back) several times in the late 90s, this is a class war and only one side is waging it. All the rest is just theater to keep the simple folk entertained.

Look at Conyers for one classic example, 3(?) years ago he was Mr. Impeachment, holding his hearings in the basement and garnering as much publicity as possible when there was absolutely no chance of anything being accomplished (and DU cheered). Now, when articles of impeachment have an admittedly slight chance of getting somewhere, he locks them up in his committee so there can never even be a debate of the issue.

These people are not stupid, nor traumatized, they are simply the ruling class that will do anything to anyone to stay the ruling class, and nothing will change until enough of us have had enough to risk everything to stop them.

[Dr Fate]

20. I'm not sure where we disagreed.

Except I would never suggest that Conyers is allowed by the party leaders to go foward with whatever he wants. His hearings in the basements were ignored by the "centrist" DEMS even back then. Little has changed in that regard.

If the DLC/Lieberman/Bluedog types dont want impeachment, then Conyers has to go along. He is the least of the problem.

I dont think they are traumatized either- I was just saying that if we are going to comapare one group to children, it certainly wouldnt be the people who are willing to stand up to Bush- it would be the ones who are bullied by him.

[Jamastiene]

4. It would be the only way to ever silence the Demon In Chief. n/t

[MonkeyFunk]

6. How would he be silenced?

Only dems would be silenced in this scenario.

[Dr Fate]

9. Not silenced-every reporter would be asking every DEM why they didnt show up.

It would not silence DEMS at all.

If anything, the media would have to drop the issue in a couple of days. What Americans are going to be truly outraged about someone not wanting to listen to Bush?

Again, I'm not saying this is the best idea at this point in the game, but making strong statements and taking strong stances is not always as harmful as we are told.

It seems there are always excuses for why we cant do something different, stand our ground or make a strong point-as opposed to WAYS to fight these guys.

[MonkeyFunk]

11. They'd be asking every Dem

why they behaved like children, why they disrespected American tradition.

It's a childish fantasy that Democrats should do anything of the sort.

[Dr Fate]

13. And if the DEM answered "I had real work to do, I've heard all his rhetoric before..."

"...and that is why most Americans didnt watch it either. They knew it was the same old bull too." Say something to that effect and your average American would probably laugh and agree with him/her, then move on.

But I'm not sure DEMS could do this -b/c I know too many of them wouldnt back it up-they would cave and apologize before they gave an answer like I suggest.

Some sort of protest-even a symbolic one- showing opposition to Bush is not behaving like a child- but kissing his ass, fearing a fight with him, and letting him get away with everything does indeed resemble the actions of a bullied child.

The main point is that failing to show to the SOTU would not cause any candidate worth his salt to lose even one election, much less for 20 years.

Everytime someone suggests any kind of fight with Bush-even something not half as dramatic as the Op's suggestion, we always get doom and gloom and "the media will attack us if we fight" talk- but never ways to fight-It's all about caving and running out the clock.

[MonkeyFunk]

15. If you think there's a political advantage to boycotting

the SOTU, you're just woefully ignorant about political realities.

It might make YOU feel good, but we'd lose 80% of our congressional representation in the next election, and we wouldn't restore it for at least 20 years.

Acting like children at the SOTU is NOT "fighting back". It's a childish temper tantrum. I fully undersrtand that a lot of people here WANT childish temper tantrums, and that makes me happy that adults actually get elected.

[Dr Fate]

16. The average American would not kick someone out of office for not attending a Bush speech.

On the flip side, Where are all of our political advantages from 8 years of kissing his ass? I dont see them.

To think like that is to be terrrfied, like a bullied child- of almost anything that even remotely resembles fighting Bush.

We even agree that not showing up to the adress would be pointless at this juncture- but my point is that you would be opposed to ANY sort of meaningful showdown with Bush-justified or otherwise- that might cause media people to attack DEMS.

Like Impeachment- or filibustering a judge, for instance. Those have been characterized as a "childish tantrums" too. It's the same excuses and name calling no matter what the proposed fight against Bush is.

If the base wants it, and the DLC/Lieberman/Bluedog DEMS and the GOP/media doesnt want it, then it is characterized as "childish" or a "tantrum" or a "fairytale."

Even still-you really think we would lose 80% of the electorate for ignoring one of the most unpopular Presidents in history?

What are you basing this on? Most people dont watch it, they certainly dont like Bush,and they wouldnt care.

Just because you characterize impeachment or a protest against Bush as a childish tempertantrum doesnt make it childish.

I get it- DLC/Centrists types who help Bush invade Iraq and sheild him from impeachment are the "adults"-and the ones who disagree are "children"- But being scared of bullies like a few of your "adults who get elected" have been doing is what is childish.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[MonkeyFunk]

23. I would LOVE a meaningful showdown!

But this isn't it. That's all I'm saying.

[Dr Fate]

24. So you supported the Alito Filibuster and would LOVE to see impeachment then- good to know.

Becuase those would have been meaningful showdowns if it were not for the DLCers who fought against them. You know-DLCers- the "we" in "we dont have the votes."

OR- would you characterize impeachment or the Alito Filibuster as a tantrum thrown by children who need to grow up and understand how things really work?

It seems that some of you guys will characterize anything that the DLC "adults" dont have the guts, morals or work ethic to follow through with as "childish".

It's not just a hypothetical speech walk-out that is attacked- but even impeachment, filibustering judges, or a general protest against the Iraq war. That's all I'm saying.

[Dr Fate]

7. The media would harumph and then most everyone would forget about it.

n/t

[ashandaurynsgramma]

12. it would be funnier

if they showed up, all stood and turned their backs to him in unison.

[Hippo_Tron]

17. Formally the Speaker of the House invites the President to give the SOTU

It is constitutionally mandated that he report to congress on the State of the Union but not that he do so in front of a joint session of congress. He has to be invited in order for that to occur.

So I think the better question is what would happen if Pelosi just did not invite Bush.

[Dr Fate]

18. The DLC would attack her harder than they ever DREAMED of attacking Bush- that is what would happen.

See the DLC/BlueDog censure threats against Rep. Stark or Moveon.org if you want example of how they treat people who make symbolic or actual attacks on Bush.

Then ask yourself what members of the Bush admin have been threatened with censure.