I just don't understand the Obama attraction

[blues90]

I am ready for the bashing but I have to ask what is it and why .

I heard his speechs and to be honest they don't inspire me . He leads with an example and then always has a two of three word chant such as yes we can . Ok fine , but what does yes we can refer to , this is not the 60's where we had good public schools with funding of free community colleges where you got used books cheap or where it was possible for anyone who was willing to learn had a chance to move ahead or even get a grant or schororship . This has all been erased where only those who have the money can get educated . Beside this even a degree now does not garrentee a good job .

This is just part of what I take from Obamas speechs , this sigh of false hope when reality dictates something quite different .

we are dealing with an entirely new set of social issues then we did in the 60's or 70's and yet Obama used Reagan as an example to remove excess and the excess was social programs as well as de-regulation where just about everything has become privatized with cut corners .

I get the impression the he is projecting his own ego and ambitions for his own goal and not the real possibilities for the people .

The only way these ideals can even be is if big business is regulated and stopped from controlling this government , short of this we will get nowhere .

I do understand the desire for voters to want someone from there age group , I felt the same way with Clinton . I understand the gen X dismay with the boomers but I don't understand a sort of following blind faith of some sort of cult .

Why not ask Obama to answer just how he intends to make these hopes he proposes come true in a world of corporate hold and a global economy with no regulation and a shrinking dollar with billions going to an occupation with no end in sight .

Hell the EPA now does not have to gather info or provide it . Where are these jobs going to come from if the corporations dictate the wage and safety and fund candidates .

My man point is what was possible 40 years ago is not possible now .

[ursi]

1. well, some of us wanted someone new in the White House ...

http://www.gregpalast.com/hillarys-mother-fing-tour-business/

In my opinion, half of America can't get past their fixation with trusting those who screwed things up.

Or maybe we just like people with ties to big money. I don't know. I don't understand that.

[bellasgrams]

13. Hillary has not screwed up and B O also has ties to

big money. If he didn't he couldn't afford to run for President.

[indimuse]

26. rezko..rezko..rezko

money tied to rezko...and fed indictment! no_bama!

[madrchsod]

34. well it`s true!

i read it at du

i read it on the sun times website

an unnamed source that is "close" to the case

why is he flying back to chicago today?

[indimuse]

41. AND...

I just read on a post TODAY on DU he returned another $40,000 TODAY on top of the cash he donated from last year..!! I have a huge problem with this...Fitzgerald and Time...

[Atman]

27. They ALL have ties to "big money." It's the ties to BFEE that scares us about HC.

Her policies simply don't differ much from BushCo's. She's major-league corporate-backed, and her husband has virtually become Poppy Bush's adopted son. "Big money," unfortunately, is required to run for president these days. That's a given. It's where the "big money" backing comes from that scares many about Clinton.

.

[madrchsod]

37. no she`s not a neo-con

she`s a bad mash-up of neo con and neo lib ideas...god help us all

[indimuse]

45. please..neo con...

...

[indimuse]

43. say it with me...

Rezko...Fed Indictment..Obama..BIZ DEAL!

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

2. If enough people conclude the situation is hopeless, then it will be.

[blues90]

5. Hope is just a word , reality of any situation will dictate the possibilities

I am not saying hope is a bad thing but you cannot rule out the reality of any situation . The reality can be seen everywhere if people chose to accept this then you deal with how to change this when it is damaging . Hope will not change a thing , work and action do .

[cali]

3. From his speech today at Ebenezer Baptist in Atlanta

This is just an exerpt. What do you find problematic about it?

"We have an empathy deficit when we’re still sending our children down corridors of shame – schools in the forgotten corners of America where the color of your skin still affects the content of your education.

We have a deficit when CEOs are making more in ten minutes than some workers make in ten months; when families lose their homes so that lenders make a profit; when mothers can’t afford a doctor when their children get sick.

We have a deficit in this country when there is Scooter Libby justice for some and Jena justice for others; when our children see nooses hanging from a schoolyard tree today, in the present, in the twenty-first century.

We have a deficit when homeless veterans sleep on the streets of our cities; when innocents are slaughtered in the deserts of Darfur; when young Americans serve tour after tour of duty in a war that should’ve never been authorized and never been waged.

And we have a deficit when it takes a breach in our levees to reveal a breach in our compassion; when it takes a terrible storm to reveal the hungry that God calls on us to feed; the sick He calls on us to care for; the least of these He commands that we treat as our own.

So we have a deficit to close. We have walls – barriers to justice and equality – that must come down. And to do this, we know that unity is the great need of this hour.

Unfortunately, all too often when we talk about unity in this country, we’ve come to believe that it can be purchased on the cheap. We’ve come to believe that racial reconciliation can come easily – that it’s just a matter of a few ignorant people trapped in the prejudices of the past, and that if the demagogues and those who exploit our racial divisions will simply go away, then all our problems would be solved.

All too often, we seek to ignore the profound institutional barriers that stand in the way of ensuring opportunity for all children, or decent jobs for all people, or health care for those who are sick. We long for unity, but are unwilling to pay the price.

But of course, true unity cannot be so easily won. It starts with a change in attitudes – a broadening of our minds, and a broadening of our hearts.

It’s not easy to stand in somebody else’s shoes. It’s not easy to see past our differences. We’ve all encountered this in our own lives. But what makes it even more difficult is that we have a politics in this country that seeks to drive us apart – that puts up walls between us.

We are told that those who differ from us on a few things are different from us on all things; that our problems are the fault of those who don’t think like us or look like us or come from where we do. The welfare queen is taking our tax money. The immigrant is taking our jobs. The believer condemns the non-believer as immoral, and the non-believer chides the believer as intolerant.

For most of this country’s history, we in the African-American community have been at the receiving end of man’s inhumanity to man. And all of us understand intimately the insidious role that race still sometimes plays – on the job, in the schools, in our health care system, and in our criminal justice system.

And yet, if we are honest with ourselves, we must admit that none of our hands are entirely clean. If we’re honest with ourselves, we’ll acknowledge that our own community has not always been true to King’s vision of a beloved community.

We have scorned our gay brothers and sisters instead of embracing them. The scourge of anti-Semitism has, at times, revealed itself in our community. For too long, some of us have seen immigrants as competitors for jobs instead of companions in the fight for opportunity.

Every day, our politics fuels and exploits this kind of division across all races and regions; across gender and party. It is played out on television. It is sensationalized by the media. And last week, it even crept into the campaign for President, with charges and counter-charges that served to obscure the issues instead of illuminating the critical choices we face as a nation.

So let us say that on this day of all days, each of us carries with us the task of changing our hearts and minds. The division, the stereotypes, the scape-goating, the ease with which we blame our plight on others – all of this distracts us from the common challenges we face – war and poverty; injustice and inequality. We can no longer afford to build ourselves up by tearing someone else down. We can no longer afford to traffic in lies or fear or hate. It is the poison that we must purge from our politics; the wall that we must tear down before the hour grows too late.

Because if Dr. King could love his jailor; if he could call on the faithful who once sat where you do to forgive those who set dogs and fire hoses upon them, then surely we can look past what divides us in our time, and bind up our wounds, and erase the empathy deficit that exists in our hearts.

But if changing our hearts and minds is the first critical step, we cannot stop there. It is not enough to bemoan the plight of poor children in this country and remain unwilling to push our elected officials to provide the resources to fix our schools. It is not enough to decry the disparities of health care and yet allow the insurance companies and the drug companies to block much-needed reforms. It is not enough for us to abhor the costs of a misguided war, and yet allow ourselves to be driven by a politics of fear that sees the threat of attack as way to scare up votes instead of a call to come together around a common effort."

[blues90]

14. The problem I see with it is that this framework is nothing new

It's the same as the 60's which Obama has a problem with , he is barrowing ideals from speeches long gone by . The problem is once the speech is over people are back in the same situation dealing with the same obstructions and human nature of competition rather than an effort of unity .

He has no new ideas just a recall of the past and from where I stand we are worse off then in the 60's and it's now not just the skin color these issues affect all races and all ages .

what is his goal in the speech , a revolution , where are his solutions in this speech , appealing to human nature to suddenly grow a conscience and unite . This is what I get out of the speech and now , today , the possibilities have been reduced .

We have found ourselves almost forced to walk over someone else in order to somehow succeed or even to just survive and this is human nature as sad as it is .

It took people to form unions and fight for a 40 hour week with a fair pay and job safety and many lost their lives in this process , who is today willing to make that sacrfice ? We now live in an entirely different environment now , we were not fighting third world wages nore did we have computers to make it easy to ship jobs all over the globe .

Obama does not offer ways to solve this , he points out the facts but not a solution , he wants the people to unite and fight and at what sacrifice to him ?

[Bluerthanblue]

30. believe me, it is NOT the 'same' as the '60's. If you were

living in MLK's day, would you make the same claim about him?

Would you point to the failures of the Emancipation Proclamation and say "what is the point?, reality dictates that we can never be truly free"??

Would you tell JFK "yeah RIGHT!- go to the moon, dream on you idealistic blow-hard"?

Would you tell Flo Kennedy and Gloria Stienem that women would have to settle for illegal abortions because in all "reality" abortion would never be legal in the US?

there are so many examples I could post.

If you are only willing to work for change that you KNOW is easy- you may succeed- but what have you really gained?

As for "unity"- we have to begin at the beginning. We have to start somewhere- If we can't find any area of common ground, a common goal, then we are doomed.

RFK said:

I have not come here to propose a set of specific remedies nor is there a single set. For a broad and adequate outline we know what must be done. When you teach a man to hate and fear his brother, when you teach that he is a lesser man because of his color or his beliefs or the policies he pursues, when you teach that those who differ from you threaten your freedom or your job or your family, then you also learn to confront others not as fellow citizens but as enemies, to be met not with cooperation but with conquest; to be subjugated and mastered.

We learn, at the last, to look at our brothers as aliens, men with whom we share a city, but not a community; men bound to us in common dwelling, but not in common effort. We learn to share only a common fear, only a common desire to retreat from each other, only a common impulse to meet disagreement with force. For all this, there are no final answers.

Yet we know what we must do. It is to achieve true justice among our fellow citizens. The question is not what programs we should seek to enact. The question is whether we can find in our own midst and in our own hearts that leadership of humane purpose that will recognize the terrible truths of our existence.

We must admit the vanity of our false distinctions among men and learn to find our own advancement in the search for the advancement of others. We must admit in ourselves that our own children's future cannot be built on the misfortunes of others. We must recognize that this short life can neither be ennobled or enriched by hatred or revenge.

Our lives on this planet are too short and the work to be done too great to let this spirit flourish any longer in our land. Of course we cannot vanquish it with a program, nor with a resolution.

But we can perhaps remember, if only for a time, that those who live with us are our brothers, that they share with us the same short moment of life; that they seek, as do we, nothing but the chance to live out their lives in purpose and in happiness, winning what satisfaction and fulfillment they can.

Surely, this bond of common faith, this bond of common goal, can begin to teach us something. Surely, we can learn, at least, to look at those around us as fellow men, and surely we can begin to work a little harder to bind up the wounds among us and to become in our own hearts brothers and countrymen once again.

without hope- dreams- what is the point of anything?


peace~

[blues90]

49. I was 19 when MLK was killed

It is not the 60's and this is my point really . It was a different world then , a different mentality and a people that were not so divided . What many feared back then is now today reality , there is alot more to change and it is now alot more difficult .

I don't want to fix what's simple , the entire mindset of the world now has to change and be on the same page since we now have this global economy . They have advanced the ways to kill and to lie and to spy , manipulate and control , we are caught in the middle of this .

[zalinda]

19. And..........................

What is he going to do about it? How is he going to do it? What will his actions be that we can hold him accountable on?

If you boil down this syrup that you posted, it says people have it tough, and we should embrace them. Huh? How?

And don't post stuff from his web site, if you can't give me an elevator speech about him, then you are just another dewy eyed admirer.

zalinda

[Lorien]

40. I can reduce it down to one line:

"I feel your pain".

But, as you said; where's the PLAN to fix these problems? I need something more than rhetoric to get behind a candidate. So far I'm not head over heels for any of them, though Edwards has at least tackled the problem of corporate control (which is at the crux of our problems, imho).

[snagglepuss]

46. This speech shows he should be Oprah's replacement not the next

President.

[balantz]

4. I'm with you. I get nothing from his speeches.

Lots of grand and fluffy words about needing to take a path together for change. But what's he plan to do? I mean, what is he going to do about it? You can preach change all you want, but if you are in the machine you can't fix it.

[saracat]

7. I don't either.He wants to "reach out to the other side' which has been proven NOT to work and

he wants to work in a broken sytem without replacing it.He thinks he can nice and talk others into agrteement.It ain't gonna work.

[Liz7]

15. exactly

That's my number one problem with him.

[Bluerthanblue]

31. what do you advocate we do with "the other side" then?

shall we round them all up and kill them?

Shall we put them in prisons?

Shall we give them lobotomies?

You cannot pretend that they simply don't exist- You can't avoid them- what is your plan, if you are completely unwilling to work towards any kind of workable unity?

[Lorien]

35. Convert them. Make the people wake up to the fact that they are con artists

frauds and criminals.It's all about the message.

[Bluerthanblue]

39. we can't convert them if we don't

connect with them.

It is more than the message- it is the method, and the goal.

[Lorien]

44. Connecting with them and appeasing them are two separate things

making them and their ideas part of the one party "big tent" is a disastrous idea. It IS the message. The repugs gained the Presidency in 1980 and the house and senate during Clinton's term by controlling the message. They made racism acceptable by chiding people for being "politically incorrect", they made environmentalism uncool by calling us "tree huggers" (it was the repugs who made the spotted owl an issue, not environmentalists). They coined terms like "Feminazis", "liberal media" and "nanny state"-all of which reverse decades of progress for human rights, science, and worker safety.

Do you REALLY believe that "reaching out" to Republicans is a worthy method of success for our party, and it's ultimate goal? Do you think that America would be a better place if only one party exists?

[Bluerthanblue]

51. I believe you are giving

"them" too much credit, and us too little power or responsibility. The notion that the republic's made racism acceptable by labeling people who stood for equality as being "politically incorrect", or that environmentalism has languished because of the "tree hugger" meme- may make you feel comfortable- or convince some people but I can't buy it.

If name calling lost us "decades of progress for human rights, science and worker safety" then I ask you, how much of a grasp did we really have on those things? Where does OUR responsibility for what is lay? If I'm going to abandon the struggle for what I believe is just and right simply because I fear the uncomfortable/unkind judgment of society, then I am not very committed to my cause to begin with.

Yes, I believe 'reaching out' to the Republic's is a worthy idea. Reaching out does not mean going belly up- it does not mean compromising on those things that form the foundation of our beliefs. It does mean, sitting down at the table together, and talking with those who sit opposite us. It means listening, and trying to understand why others feel as they do- It means making the case for why WE believe as we do-

I think America would work best if NO "party" existed- I think there will come a day when boundaries of all kinds cease to exist. I'll never see that day, nor will my children, but that day will come, of that I am sure. If it doesn't, then human-kind will have succeeded in destroying itself. If that is our goal- if THAT is our ultimate destination- why should we continue this futile charade.

I am not naive- or ignorant.
I am not young in body or mind.

I am tired.

peace~

[saracat]

42. What did they do to us? We must "beat " them into submission. We must exceicise "strength.

They view "negotiation" as "weakness".Sorry, but it is true. And BTW, didn't they just abour "pretend' we didn't exist?And it worked.They passed whatever legislation they wanted.And we went along with it.Now it is our turn and sadly, this is the only thing they understand.

[Bluerthanblue]

60. so you are content to let "them" win eh?

You will become what you despise- because "they" did it to you?

Sorry, I will not do to others what has been done to me, and feel justified, or noble, or even expect to be able to live with myself.- that isn't "winning" it is losing the only thing I really have any control over. - myself. I would rather die than become the kind of person who is willing to destroy others to get what "I" want.

I don't give a fart how anyone views "negotiation"- Being strong is a result of continual excercise. I'm not in this life to be admired or to score points. I'm here for a fleeting moment in the grand scheme of things, and while I'm here -as much as it is within my power, I hope to live in such a way that when I leave I leave this world no worse off than it was when I arrived, and if it is possible, perhaps in some minute way a little bit better for those who come after.

Those people I admire and aspire to learn from, and follow, were not those who beat others into submission, they were almost without exception, people who gave up their lives working toward something much bigger and more lasting than "self"-

peace~

[lastliberalintexas]

66. Go FDR on them

They don't understand compromise, they only understand strong leaders. Roosevelt didn't back down when the elite (via the Supreme Court) challenged the New Deal programs- instead, he threatened to change the poiltical realities of that day by enlarging the size of the Court and packing it with supporters.

You can't compromise with people who think you are evil, you can only fight them.

[Lorien]

33. Haven't Dems been "reaching out to the other side" for long enough?

Look where it's gotten us. The "other side" doesn't reach out to us; it does all it can to crush and destroy us. As another poster said; our party is now behaving like an abused wife who keeps going back to her abuser. Enough already! And to quote Bill Maher;"I don't want a candidate who will appease the other side; I want someone who will CRUSH them and grind them into a powder that's fine enough for me to snort"! We do need to finally HIT BACK and TAKE CONTROL. Otherwise, there won't be any "change" at all.

I'm like both of you; I can't see the appeal of Obama. He's a great speaker and he's a good looking guy, but I really don't get anything out of the things he says. It's mostly just empty rhetoric. I'd like to hear him speak of a solid road map for getting us out of this mess. One that includes holding corporations accountable for THEIR excesses!

[femrap]

64. Same here....I just don't see

what is so special about him. And of late, I notice an annoying cockiness to him.

[OHdem10]

6. I do not believe most people think things are hopeless.

The Media has created many of the problems by injecting
their notion of what is wrong with the country.

What is their answer: Not someone with the background
to do something about it.

If we are honest and I sincerely mean no disrespect to
Obama. His appeal is to the 20somthings and 30 somehtings.
and the college students.

The rest do not understand what he is talking about.

And if we are honest--no one person can appeal to all groups.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

9. In short, he is appealing to and increasing the future of the Democratic party n/t

[Bright Eyes]

8. And I don't understand the Clinton attraction.

Point being?

[blues90]

18. I don't understand the Hillary attraction either

So all I am left with is some historical moment for the first black or the first women as president . An historical moment means nothing to me .

[balantz]

24. Both Clinton and Obama are owned by the machine that is firmly in place.

Neither one will dismantle that machine. Flowery words recalling MLK, or crocodile tears won't dismantle that machine. Unfortunately great speeches and emotional displays will attract votes from people who think these things mean something genuine. How are either of these candidates going to affect change in Washington when they work for the machine that must be dismantled? That dismantling is the real change that is needed.

[blues90]

58. Absolutely !

[femrap]

65. IMHO, the people of the U.S.

should be saying to our candidates: "It's the Rothschild/Rockefeller/Wealthy Elite Billionairs, Stupid!"

These are the folks who have ruined this country...another cycle of Robber Barons. Who is going to stop them this time??? Or now that they own the Propaganda Machine (Media), the Campaign Finance Machine, and The Voting Machine...are we shit out of luck?

As the bumper sticker says: 'End World Hunger. Eat the Rich."

[blues90]

74. I wish I knew , I don't know who can stop them and

as many others have expressed with the lying msm and the huge corp control owning the media and driving their message as well as the candidates fighting with race cards and gender cards against eachother which is dividing the party all I can hope for is Edwards is the real deal and wins .

These so called debates are a setup sick joke and Hillary and Obama are fallin gright into this so they may cancel eachother out playing these games .

If their games are more important than the people then they have no business running for president .

[earth mom]

10. I can't stand Obama's empty rhetoric. I think some people like Obama because of the Oprah factor.

People want to BE Oprah. They want wealth and a fascinating lifestyle where they mingle with the rich & famous. You know the rock star life. They see that reflected off of Oprah and onto Obama.

Well, I choose to look at Obama's record, his corporate ties, his crap about Reagan and his meaningless words.

NONE of it adds up to a positive for me. In fact it's the exact opposite-ALL NEGATIVE.

:thumbsdown:

[calmblueocean]

11. Fair enough. I don't understand the Hillary attraction.

I don't see how people can overlook her complete inability to apologize or take responsibility for her Iraq War vote, or listen to her try to campaign as the candidate of "experience" and "35 years of change" with a straight face. Hillary's speeches feel like meaningless assemblies of political cliches to me, like last night when she said, "I want to thank my two biggest supporters, my husband and my daughter. They believe, as I do, that politics is what makes our democracy work!" What the heck is that supposed to mean? Is that supposed to be inspiring? This just in from Camp Hillary: gas makes our cars go, too!

[blues90]

21. I don't aspire to either of their speeches . I have had enough speeches

They are not going to cut through the slime we are in .

[femrap]

67. As a pro-choice woman,

I do believe HRC will be good for Choice, as well as for working women and their children (returning some of the programs that W dismantled).

And I still remember her younger days when she was progressive...and I sure hope she still has some of that but can't show it while campaigning.

Shit...I just want these damn Robber Barons run off the planet before they destroy it.

[AndyA]

12. I am at a loss also. Barack seems flat to me. No dimension or depth

to the man at all.

And yet I read posts from people wetting themselves over this guy. I just don't get it. He's almost monotone when he speaks. There's no spark in his eyes.

He has a lovely wife, with a great personality, and I think she'd be a great First Lady, but not if he's part of the deal.

And now that this connection to a Chicago mobster has surfaced, I think there's a lot of bad news coming this way about Barack.

When the McClurkin thing happened, that did it for me. I just cannot vote for him. I see no potential for change, other than the first black President, but that's the wrong reason for voting for him, especially now.

We need more than new wallpaper furniture. We need a change of direction.

[Skittles]

71. I am with you

I cannot understand the sheer devotion Obama receives at all

[NNN0LHI]

16. He has a great sense of humor which is important to me

We need someone like that.

Don

[zalinda]

20. Yup, let's all laugh our way into oblivion. n/t

[blues90]

22. They said the same damn thing about Reagan .

It does not help much really .

[madmom]

38. that's about as bad as voting because she's a woman or he's black, IMO

[karlrschneider]

54. Can't we just hire a laugh czar for that?

:eyes:

[NNN0LHI]

55. Will you guys please quit kicking my ass here for a while?

Th OP asked what attracted me to Obama. And I answered honestly.

I am going to have to start lying or keep my trap shut.

You guys are making me real gun shy.

How about a little :nopity: for me?

Nah, didn't think so.

:hi:

Don

[karlrschneider]

59. Me so bad...and speaking of which, it really is bad when we cant even figure out

what our friends mean! :silly: :P

[NNN0LHI]

62. Oh Gods, please don't make me ever have to use them sarcasm tag thingys

I knew what you guys meant and was just funning around. You guys know me. Probably better than I know me.
Don

[karlrschneider]

63. HAHA....I hears ya

:D

[femrap]

68. If you like humor, they say

huckabee is a real joker. lol

[ecstatic]

17. we're not gonna fall in love each and every time... geez

It's not about falling in love. That may happen once in a lifetime. It's about being practical and making sure we don't end up with another repug in office.

[blues90]

23. I know that , but what we don't need is republican light either .

[XboxWarrior]

28. Well then OP....

Why just whine?

State your case, and make an argument......

Otherwise, have another beer and watch the game.

[blues90]

29. I made my case , no whinning here and the games or beer do not interest me

[Bluerthanblue]

delete double post-

[Bluerthanblue]

36. your Avitar didn't/doesn't share your

view of hope. - His body may be gone, but his dreams live on.

I AM a dreamer- aren't you? Can you help but imagine a world where people have what they need? Where war is obsolete? At the very LEAST- a world that is better than what we now are living in?

John said- "War is over- if you want it"- and it would be. If we really DID want it. If we believed.

We all get discouraged- maybe that is where you are right now.

Hope is sometimes all anyone has left. And it is the one thing none of us can live without.

peace~

[blues90]

48. That's true . However

John was shot down because of his ideals that were a threat ( my opinion ) .

The way I look at it now in this world of complete madness is , there are people living in FEMA trailers for years now hanging onto hope and what have they got for it . There are people hoping this damn Iraq occupation will end now and this does include the Iraqis .

People hope not to lose their homes or jobs or health insurance yet they do .

People hope for a job that they can survive with the fair pay .

Yes you need hope but Lennon did say Hope is something you have to find within yourself , no one can give it to you , this he said to the homeless fellow living on his property as the fellow admired Lennon and felt Lennon was relating directly to him through Lennons words , it was in the Imagine Movie .

Lennon also said he prefered none violence but he could become violent if the situation dictated this sort of action . The song Revolution was this conflict .

I wonder how Lennon would look at this today since he died before Reagan came along and destroyed everything , yes before Reagan we had alot more reason to hope . Now we try to find a reason to hang on and alot of people are desperate and for good reason . Hope is to try to ride this thing out .

Sometimes I get the impression many people feel if a Dem is elected that suddenly all the problems will just end and this is just not the case . Many being caught up in this long election have lost the idea bush has still a year and what he can still do so many are distracted for far to long .

It's also about letting these crooks off the hook , we can't allow this , if we do what does this really say about this country . Many people have lost all and many more will before this is over , they have no time left , are they to be forgotten since they have no voice anylonger .

I have to live in the now , it is all I have and the future is not predictable and the past can't be changed , but some are trying to re-write history to alter the future .

I don't know where I fit into all of this because I don't have alot of time nore does my wife . I know how the past got us here but that's about it .

Yes Obama blends a nice speech , we have a history of great voices and writtings with warnings of things to come yet we have ignored all , we have never learned from the past and I fear we are walking right into another decade of hope without what truely amounts to change that lasts longer than election cycles .

[Bluerthanblue]

56. Thank you - you

have answered with your perspective and experience so very well.

I agree with so much of what you say- and understand very well what you are voicing.

I'm not expecting a miracle- I don't see Obama as anything more than a man, with a vision and a direction that offers a reason to keep trying. - There is so much I'd like to add- but will leave it here for now-

Thank you Blues90-

I wish you peace, and a reason to hope.

blu

[Djinn]

72. better we get someone

who wants to work with them once in office?

[Cabcere]

25. Can't say for sure, but my take on it is

that any hope is better than the no hope at all we've had for the past too-many years. :shrug: I don't know. I think Obama is a very charismatic man and that he honestly believes he can change things, and that tends to come across in his speeches (at least, what I've seen, which admittedly is not everything). His message of hope strikes a chord with many people - especially those of my generation (college kids, etc.), who have spent the majority of their political lives under the Bush regime and are desperate for any kind of change. I think Obama is telling a lot of people what they want/need to hear after so many lies and corruption, and the fact that he is younger, African-American, and damn good-looking probably doesn't hurt, either. :shrug: Like I said, I don't know. I'm not completely sold on him (I'm more of an Edwards girl myself, although I think any/all of our candidates have the potential to do good things for this country), but I can kind of understand some of the appeal.

(Disclaimer: this is just my opinion, and is not intended to bash Obama or anyone else...just sharing my thoughts.) :hi: Peace.

[madrchsod]

32. so it is impossible to change anything now?

[blues90]

50. I don't know . Things will change even if we do nothing

There is no avoiding this . The problem I see it now we are faced with issues we have never faced before and this includes just about anything one could list .

There has to be a starting point , something that is the most important issue which is the greatest threat to our survival . I honestly don't know what that is , I don't think anyone does . So many things have become a tinder box . What will the chain reaction be if we attack the wrong issue first , what issues can be put in the same group to tackle more than one and have the best outcome for the most people , to do this many people will be left out and I would not want to see this happen .

This is much larger than a speech or one person , we know this but some how this is the game , the focus on one person , ie , who's the best , well there is no , the best , there is no number one which we have long been convinced there is .

If we have a government that asks the people to unite and work together then the government must do the same and we do not have this because they are posed for a win , to continue on this path we all lose .

[snagglepuss]

47. I couldn't agree more with you. Obama should be Oprah's stand-in not the next president.

I don't think Obama supporters want to face hard economic facts ie there's no jobs deficit, monetary deficit there's simply a hope deficit. I don't know if Obama believes in this fairy story but his supporters do. Obama supporters seem committed to Dale Carnegie's Positive Thinking mantras and despise those who want to rain on their fantasy.

[Djinn]

70. If Obama had, at any time

spoken about the REAL issues, I might believe he was the "change" candidate.

When is he going to speak about STRUCTURAL inequity.
When is he going to speak about US Empire.
When is he going to talk about CLASS
When is he going to talk about what Iraq was REALLY about?

He doesn't speak ANY truth that the paymasters don't want to hear.

I'm at a loss to see how happy speeches about "change" without any substance have swung anyone

[Orangepeel]

52. So? There's no accounting for taste.

Obviously, many people do find him inspiring. There are probably people you find inspiring that others find boring as hell.

Different strokes for different folks.

[blues90]

57. that goes without saying . I can't say I find anyone of modern times

Inspiring , a few still left out there who are pretty old now who could see through the crap who told the truth without trying to gain from it , people how shared their wisdom without a huge price tag .

Like I said , we have been warned for centuries and ignored this or passed it off as outlandish .

So here we are now . I do hope all comes out for those who support their candidate and they get what they need out of it .

I have just seen to many years of hope and inspiration taken down to dust , that's just me . I am obsolete in this new world order and high tech parade .

The truely sad part is we could have done so much better with what we had and blew it through greed and progress that was put on the wrong path all sold at the best thing when in fact it was not .

We wait until things are in crisis mode before we see them or react if we react at all and by then it's to late .

That's part of the trouble with free enterprise , even if the product is not a good idea but it sells and generates a profit well then it becomes acceptable , sort of like the huge floating mass of plastic garbage in the ocean , save the tree but kill the ocean in the process . package the product instead of bring your own cloth bag and buy 5 bottles of beer instead of the standard plastic package of 6 and toss out the plastic or get that plastic tub of berries instead of bringing your own container and have it weighed . It's all about forcing you to get more than you need and marketing with pretty packages and making it easy at the expense of the environment which was all some job created to sell , sell ,sell .

[karlrschneider]

53. Much of his very vocal support will not translate into actual votes if and when.

There is zero chance of him winning in a general election. A lot of pie-in-the-skyers don't believe that but it's true.
Sorry.

[DFW]

61. Although not an Obama supporter (or of anyone else yet)

I DO understand his attraction. You gotta meet the guy in person, maybe,
but he has a personal magnetism that rivals Bill Clinton's. His speeches
don't really do it for me, I confess--they always seem to leave me in an
upbeat mood and yet trying like hell to remember what he said. But he does
radiate confidence and charisma, and I understand fully why he impresses
people. He is a darling of the media age. In a debate with a loser Republican,
and I find them all to be losers so far, Obama would be a JFK to their Nixon,
where Hillary would have to really use her head and shine with quick thinking
and preparedness. Obama was editor of the Harvard Law Review. He is no slouch
in the brains department either, but he has his delivery and charisma to sub
for him if he can't come up with the right thing to say at the right time. That
is a luxury Hillary can't claim, although I think she is smart enough in her
own right to slam dunk McCain, Rudy, or Mittens. If she isn't, she has no
business seeking the nomination in the first place.

[Djinn]

69. neither do I

but I don't get the appeal of any of 'em frankly.

The whole two-party shuffle is nothing more than bread and circuses for the prols. Have an election every few years and people think they live in a democracy.

Let 'em get all het up about a horse race and they'll spend all their energy on it and then think the battle's over if their particular horse wins by a nose and they'll shut up and shop for the next 3 years.

[xspowr]

73. European conservatives really like Obama too...

Interesting news blog item on NPR regarding Obama's conservative "fans," both here and in the UK, and his possible role in the resurgence of a palatable conservative movement in Europe. Sad day when so many Dem voters and their corporatist candidate give the wingnuts on both sides of the pond a reason for hope. Hardly the kind of "unity" we need at this point!

Here's the link:

http://www.npr.org/blogs/news/2008/01/barack_obama_and_his_conservat_1.html

Nice quotes from John Edwards regarding Obama's Reagan reference and the anti-union, anti-worker, and anti-middle class policies that Reagan actually stood for (yes, I know that the Reagan thing was overblown, but come on...a supposed leading Dem candidate invoking the Gipper for anything? Get real. Talk about Bedtime for Bonzo.)

[Bluebear]

75. "I then said, 'give me some of that' & the guy shook my hand with the same hand .....

he had just clasped with Barack's"


You just don't have the BAM! :crazy:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=4057783