Do you remember when Richard Gephardt stabbed the Dems in the back?

[CatWoman]

and couldn't wait to stand side-by-side with Chimpolini when he declared war on Iraq?



Most opposition came from Democrats, who were sharply divided on the issue. Minority Leader Richard Gephardt, D-Missouri, said giving Bush the authority to attack Iraq could avert war by demonstrating the United States is willing to confront Saddam Hussein over his obligations to the United Nations.

"I believe we have an obligation to protect the United States by preventing him from getting these weapons and either using them himself or passing them or their components on to terrorists who share his destructive intent," said Gephardt, who helped draft the measure.

http://archives.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/10/10/iraq.us/

[PassingFair]

1. I remember his "rosegarden" moment.

I remember when the leaders of the "free world" let us ALL down.

We would do well to reward those who were NOT afraid of the Chimperor.

They would do well to know that we are WATCHING now.

The INTERNETS have made us AWARE.

[salin]

16. with Joe and Evan... all with presidential aspirations...

those didn't go to well, for them.

Sadly their support and thus collapsing of the attempts at amendments to put more strings on the administration collapsed immediately after the speech.

[Tom Joad]

2. A day that will go down in infamy. Geppy deserves to share a cell

with bush, for co-conspiring to wage a war of aggression.

[951-Riverside]

3. Who?

:P

[twilight_sailing]

4. Gephardt

Sigh...

I always hated that guy. Sue me.

[AX10]

5. I never forget anyone who stabs, craps upon, assults...

me! The Less Dick Gephardt, the better!

[progressivebydesign]

6. Not here to defend him.. but...

I think you'll find, if you look back at what was said about the Resolution at the time, and what the Dems supporting it said... most of them did NOT feel they were giving a blanket okay to invade Iraq at the time. They were sending a strong statement based upon the intelligence given to them (which we all know now was bullshit).

Can anyone tell me at all how this differs from what is going on now with Iran? I'm hearing the same comments from Democratic leaders about the need to show strength to Iran, and not let Iran believe that we are not going to do something if necessary. Honestly, it feels eerily similar.

I'm not a fan of revisionist history, trying to selectively choose whom to attack regarding the IWR vote. Most of the Democrats that supported it in D.C. did so because they were serving their constituency, who.. if you recall.. at the time.. mostly supported going to war.

We all marched against it, but we were totally in the minority. Gephardt served in Congress, and served his constituency, with distinction for many, many, years. I refuse to attack him, nor Hillary, nor Edwards, nor Kerry, or anyone that voted for the resolution. Because the public atmosphere, the faux intelligence, and what they thought they were authorizing, was entirely different than what we have today.

[Downtown Hound]

11. I'm going to have to call bullshit here

The information that Saddam's supposed weapons build-up was false was totally there. I remember the first antiwar demonstration I ever went to, in October of 2002, before the war even started. Somebody was holding up the headline of a San Jose Mercury News story about how the intelligence was being cooked. If ordinary citizens could find out the truth, members of Congress sure as hell could. They were simply too afraid to oppose Bush, too afraid to stand up to the truth. And the notion that the American people overwhelmingly supported the war from the start is in fact, false. Polls repeatedly showed that most Americans only supported military action with the support of the United Nations, and that was never given. But when Bush was given a green light to go by the media and the Democratic leadership, most Americans also went along with it because of the climate of fear that had been created in our country. Remember the old quote, "Evil can only triumph when good men do nothing." They rolled over, they thought that the only way they could win the next elections was to go along with it. They sacrificed American and Iraqi lives for the sake of their own careers, and this cluster fuck of a war is what we got as a result.

They could have and should have taken a stand, but they were ultimately a bunch of chicken-shit cowards.

[hfojvt]

13. I expect them to know better, to inform the public, not delude the public

Take Dennis Moore, please. You could say he was serving his constituents by voting for the Bush tax cuts (after he voted for the Democratic alternative which was defeated). However, since the Bush tax cuts did not really help his, or anybody else's constituents, he would have served them better by voting against them. Because if his constituents really knew how bad those tax cuts were, they would not support them either. So Moore caved instead of informing his people. Worse yet, when he ran for re-election in 2002, his ads bragged that he voted for the Bush tax cuts (at a time when I, an many others, were saying those tax cuts should be undone). If we are going to accomplish anything progressive, then Democrats need to stop caving to Republican spin points, and stop repeating them as well.

[ewagner]

7. That Picture....

could it be used as evidence in a war crimes tribunal?

I sort of think it could.....

[hfojvt]

8. actually I did not remember that

and am not sure why it is relevant now. Is Gephardt running for President again? He has a reputation as a friend of the working class. He also might have made a better running mate than Edwards. Could he have delivered Missouri into our column? Edwards did not bring NC.

As far as that resolution goes. Gephardt was right in a sense. The resolution and the sabre rattling did convince Saddam to accept the inspectors, and to open up his palaces, and allow fly-overs, etc. If Bush had not been determined to start the war no matter what, then the Gephardt resolution would have been a good idea.

The Democrats and the UN did not seem to make enough noise when Bush violated resolution 1441. 1441 did not authorize force without another resolution. That was even according to the Bush administration. France and Syria voted for that resolution on that understanding. It's not like Bush followed the Gephardt resolution.

But that's all water under the damn.

[CatWoman]

9. It's relevant

because it's something "I" wanted to talk about.

Next time I'll run my idea by you first, ok?

[H2O Man]

14. More,

it is important because one of the democrats who is running for president was making a serious effort to pass "an alternative that would narrow the president's authority further." Joe Biden was gaining the support of democrats and republicans, when "it was Dick Gephardt .... who derailed the bipartisan effort." Gephardt was, of course, positioning himself for a run in '04. (Hubris; Corn & Isikoff; pages 127-128)

It may strike some as "water under the bridge." However, many of us view it as a cause for the "blood in the streets" in Iraq. If one is making a serious study of the issues facing us in the '08 campaigns, it is an important issue to discuss.

[CatWoman]

17. lol

H20 Man to the rescue :)

:hi:

:loveya:

[ikojo]

10. The essence of tricky Dicky Gephardt

Slime

People get on Bush for having a fake ranch..heck Gephardt's address in St Louis was his MOM's home!

Oh I'm working class, but like much of the working class I am not in a union, and trust me I didn't trust Tricky Dicky Gephardt at all.

[Hippo_Tron]

12. Gephardt couldn't even get a majority of the democratic caucus to vote for the IWR

Pelosi lead the insurgency against it and completely undermined him. Had he not run for President I'm still convinced he would've resigned as minority leader because I'm not sure he could've effectively run the caucus after that.

[pretzel4gore]

15. it's funnyweird watching ambitious men defy the people, the real world!

to abet bush, and then lose their careers as a result ...it's as if having the majority for something ie no war, means nothing!

[NNN0LHI]

18. Gephardt did resign as minority leader in November 2002 n/t

[Hippo_Tron]

20. I was saying that he would've resigned even if he had not run for President

[NNN0LHI]

22. Sorry I misread your post n/t

[salin]

19. in fairness to Gep - he didn't try/ask dems to follow him.

I hated his support for bush in the rose garden (and above reiterate that this betrayel was what collapsed talks in the senate that would have at least led to a more restrictive resolution). However - iirc, he was very clear that this was *his* position and that he was *not* asking dems to follow him, nor asking them to compromise their own beliefs/positions on the vote.

[goforit]

21. Yes and let us count the dead. Blood tainted hands will have deep karma to pay