Roe vs. Wade is Dying as we Speak

[JCMach1]

We now have the Supreme Case on Late Term Abortions and now with this:

SIOUX FALLS, S.D. - South Dakota became the first US state to pass a law banning abortion in virtually all cases, with the intention of forcing the Supreme Court to reconsider its 1973 decision legalizing the procedure.

The law, which would punish doctors who perform the operation with a five-year prison term and a $5,000 fine, awaits the signature of Republican Gov. Michael Rounds and people on both sides of the issue say he is unlikely to veto it.

“My understanding is we are the first state to truly defy Roe v. Wade,” the 1973 high court ruling that granted a constitutional right to abortion, said Kate Looby of Planned Parenthood’s South Dakota chapter... http://www.khaleejtimes.com/DisplayArticle.asp?xfile=data/theworld/2006/February/theworld_February631.xml§ion=theworld

THIS IS A HUGE ISSUE... AND IT LOOKS LIKE NO ONE IS PAYING ATTENTION YET...

[Selatius]

1. It's obviously meant to attack Roe v. Wade directly

If the Republicans can get it before the SCOTUS as soon as possible, then they hope they can kill it as soon as possible or, at least, cripple it.

[JCMach1]

3. Bush thanked religious broadcasters several days ago

for their help in this 'struggle'


-Will post when I find the story post on that.

[FreedomAngel82]

8. And use it for the midterms

[JCMach1]

13. Definitely, the late-term ruling will come before the midterms

:(

[Tesha]

21. No it won't. It'll come *JUST AFTER* midterms. (NT)

[northzax]

2. well, there's nothing to pay attention to, is there?

first it will be challenged in court, then the 8th Circuit will eventually throw it out. And it will get appealed to the Supreme Court. Then we start paying attention. And the Supreme Court will uphold the 8th Circuit's ruling. it'll take 5 years, minimum, before it gets to the Supreme Court. South Dakota is wasting its time and money.

[JCMach1]

4. It will get done much sooner...

so that Bush can crow about his great accomplishment in his farewell address.

[tabasco]

53. Hahahahha! How nice to be psychic.

Your scenario may have been true last year.

In case you haven't noticed, there are a couple new faces on the USSC.

If you think Roe v. Wade is written in stone, you are foolish.

I see it being overturned and abortion given back to the states.

[Orangepeel]

74. R v W won't be overturned yet.

Kennedy tends to vote in favor of restrictions but against outright bans. Based on past voting, the late term abortion ban will be allowed, 5 - 4, but the SD law will be overturned, 5 - 4.

[Occulus]

63. The issue will be settled by the end of the year.

They want it, AND THEY WANT IT NOW.

Actually, they wanted it 30 years or so ago.

Trust me- this will move faster than any previous SCOTUS case. Just watch.

[northzax]

92. you think they actually want it?

we have had an anti-abortion president for 18 of the last 24 years. We have had an anti-abortion house of representatives since 1994, and an anti-abortion senate since 1998. It's a great fundraiser and way to get the base motivated, but they don't actually want to do anything, or they would have already.

Believe me, the overturning of Roe v. Wade would spell the end of the Republican party as a national force. And the leadership knows it.

plus, what are you going to do about a bill in the South Dakota government? the governor is going to sign it, and it will begin to wind it's way through the courts. The 8th Circuit has no choice but to strike it down, since it obviously violates a Supreme Court decision. and then it winds it's way up, losing every time. the Supreme Court will deny the writ of ceratori, and the whole thing will die. Again.

[Tesha]

99. Sooner or later, they have to throw a bone to their base.

Probably not this one, as it's hard to imagine SCotUS
ruling in favor of this law without striking down RvW.
But as I joked below, the Right will eventually come
up with something that is the equivalent of a 10 month
waiting periodm it will go all the way to SCotUS, and
an increasing Reich Wing court will approve it.

Tesha

[robertpaulsen]

110. Overturning Roe is just a stepping stone to overturning Griswold.

Abortion is just one issue. If Roe is overturned, they'll just move onto something else to take us back to where Santorum wants us, like the 13th century. I don't buy that having it resolved in their favor would end their dominance , I think it would only strengthen them. I didn't think it was possible for this country to go any farther to the right, but every year it just keeps getting worse and worse. If Stevens dies before 2009, there's just no turning back.

[SharonAnn]

119. The Right-Wing Base wants it. Republicans may have to give it to them.

[Iris]

116. An anonymous donor has offered a million dollars to fight for this law.

[sarahlee]

141. South Dakota - Talk $$$

We have to fight back ecconomically. God suggestion at:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=217&topic_id=3294&mesg_id=3294

[upi402]

5. I tried to rat out the DINO's who were rolling over for Alito

I can do no more. Even people here think it's useful to have these imposters prevent us from having our party back.
Even Governor Dean said -just last weekend- that we need to get Sen Maria Cantwell re-elected.
:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[FreedomAngel82]

6. Oh my gosh

:cry: This is outrageous and totally insane!!! They're playing with people's lives and health!

[lyonn]

15. Why should they stop now?

These creeps have been doing this since they took over our country. Notice how the mosques are being bombed in Iraq, it's heating up more and more over there. Death, dying and misery is not a problem for this bunch. Bushies should look up the word consequences. When you run a country you must consider consequences, they never have.

The Democrats might decide to also consider the consequences if they don't do something besides being the "me too" gang.

If abortion is done away with then laws should be enacted so that poor women get financial help, yeah, right.

[Tesha]

22. Several hundred thousand Iraqis could have told you that.

Except that they have no lives or health left; they're dead.

It's nothing new that Republicans kill people.

Tesha

[Charlie Brown]

7. A lot more is in jeopardy besides 'Roe

this law does not even provide exceptions for incest or rape victims. These protections for women are settled humanitarian standards that go back generations. Any judge who upholds this law is setting a horrible precedent for how society treats women.

[KingFlorez]

9. Bring it on

Most people think abortion should be illegal, so we'll see how much this will help you

[JCMach1]

11. Don't you mean the opposite?

[KingFlorez]

18. Typo

I meant legal

[Erika]

Can you imagine the horror of a 12 year old girl raped by her father

and told she must deliver the child. She must pay for his sin.

Contact South Dakota at www.state.sd.us

[Lindacooks]

16. There's going to be a lot of dead young girls if this is allowed to stand.

Because they WILL take matters into their own hands with a coat hanger or a tube with water. Or they'll give birth and abandon the baby.

I can't believe how fucking neanderthal that state is.

[Lars39]

17. Or the abuser will kill them.

[Selatius]

19. There was an eerily similar case in Florida a year or two ago.

The problem was she was raped while in the custody of the state.

[Twist_U_Up]

10. I heard a report today

That said this case was expected to reach the Supremes by 2007 and it will threaten Roe vs Wade

CNN I think

[JCMach1]

12. I think the RW has a plan to bring a test case, even if

the left doesn't...

It will then be fast-tracked through the courts.

[Twist_U_Up]

14. In any case

the pukes only want it in the supremes hands for election reasons . they could give 3 turds as long as they are in power.

[Tesha]

20. This is actually good for the country in the long run.

The whole ridiculous rap of women saying "But I'm
not one of those (ewww!) Feminists!" while they
exercise their right to work at equal work for
equal pay, vote, sleep with their boyfriends
without risk of criminal prosecution, buy
contraception, and occasionally, obtain an
abortion is a farce that really needs to come
to an end.

All these rights that these women have and enjoy
are directly attributable to *HARD WORK BY (ewww!)
FEMINISTS, MOST OF THEM LIBERAL*.

When the Republicans end legal abortion and vastly
encroach on the right to obtain birth control, maybe
some of these idiots will finally wake up and recognize
that Rich White Christian Republican Men aren't their
friends? Maybe they'll even start to kick these
fascists right in their electoral balls (where it
will hurt them the most)?

Tesha

[robbedvoter]

24. Oh, yeah! Dead girls=good of the country! How visionary of you!

Like whackos cannot find something else to hate! Like DU posters that rejoyce when women get killed! That, I may actually join them in!
The big catastrophy Nader social solution strikes again! Who else (but you) do you want dead for the "good of the country?" Some draft legislation? Expand Guantanamo? I know! Nader wanted an environment disaster or a war - let's have some of those for the good of the country. But then again, those might affect YOU, so let's just pile dead girls for now...

[Tesha]

26. Choose your poison; the Republicans are killing lots of Americans now.

Young women *ARE ALREADY DYING*. Some are dying as
a result of botched abortions in states where there really
is no practical access to clinics. Some because they suicide
upon becoming pregnant. Some because they can't get routine
health care. Some because they can't get information about
sex due to fundamentalist religious whackos running school
boards. Some because their pharmacists/pharmacies won't
provide legally-prescribed drugs such as birth control.
Some because we have an absolute plague of violence in
our society.

The problem is already here! The overturning of Roe v. Wade
won't actually change things all that much, but it sure will
focus people's attention on what rights they were ignoring!

It would be far better if we go through the pain of a brief
period without universal legal abortion in all 50 states but
end up with the Republicans completely politically castrated
than if we go along as we're going today, with abortion still
being supposedly "legal" but simply becoming unavailable to
ever-increasing numbers of American women.

Seriously, the end of Repulicanism is going to be extremely
painful, but we still have some choice as to how it ends.

Tesha

[cap]

33. we need to publicize Mississippi

where there is only one abortion clinic. We need a documentary. Visuals work

[DancingBear]

67. There is also only one in South Dakota n/t

[Tesha]

73. My point exactly.

> There is also only one in South Dakota

My point exactly. The overturn of Roe would have
very little practical impact on the women of either
Mississippi or South Dakota (especially if abortion
stays legal in most of the Blue States).

Tesha

[Selatius]

89. I live in Mississippi. Mississippi is a lost cause.

People won't listen. If people refuse to listen to me and to others, there is nothing we can do with them.

[cap]

133. mississippi isnt a lost cause... abortions and baby abandondment

do occur there too.

[Selatius]

139. Well, it's difficult to help when the state government offers no aid

The majority of the people here will support no such thing as the right to an abortion. If I find out any of those in the majority who don't believe in such a right and do decide to get an abortion or encourage his girlfriend to get an abortion after having unprotected sex and getting pregnant after throwing the "moral values" nonsense at me and pretending to be the "good Christian" who is against pre-marital sex, I am sorely tempted to scream "hypocrite!" in his or her face.

That kind of stupidity and duplicity has made me extremely disappointed, and it causes me to question the notion of whether people are naturally good or are naturally base, brutish, selfish, and cruel.

[cap]

146. Mississippi is sorely in need of a documentary

exposing this type of system.

I suggest you read some of Joe Bageant's writing at joebageant.com. Excellent writer about mentality in the South.

[drm604]

138. Michael Moore should do that.

I'm sure that he could find and document some horrifying cases.

[robbedvoter]

41. Many problems - let's not trivialize lives - any lives.

I am not trying to say here that Roe Vs Wade is the most important issue facing us now - the lack of elections is the root of all crimes - because there's unchecked power and no responsibility, so, yeah. Lots of people dying - Katrina victims, miners, soldiers, sick people without insurance etc.
I simply can't abide using people's mizery - either of these miseries as 'political opportunity". It's crass.

[Tesha]

44. *SOMETHING* better provide our opportunity!

> I simply can't abide using people's mizery - either of these miseries as 'political opportunity". It's crass.

*SOMETHING* better provide our opportunity! 'Cause it sure ain't
our elected Democratic officials (who roll over every damned time
anything important comes up).

The alternative is Bushworld forever!

The "opportunity" (as you put it) provided by the elimination
of abortion rights is coming whether you want to take advantage
of it or not; I'd simply suggest we *TAKE FULL ADVANTAGE
OF IT* rather than accumulating more of that worthless "dry
powder" that we seem to have warehouses full of.

Tesha

[robbedvoter]

48. How party hack of you! Opportunity? War not enough? Torture?

Selling the ports? Patriot Act? Nah, you need some dead girls - preferbly blonde, blued eyes, non?
Gaad, I so hate operatives! Soulless buzzards!
May I remind you, it doesn't even matter which new tragedy you see as "opportunity" as your reality doesn't even count:


''We're an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And
while you're studying that reality -- judiciously, as you will -- we'll
act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and
that's how things will sort out. We're history's actors . . . and you,
all of you, will be left to just study what we do.''
Bush aide to Ron Suskind

[Tesha]

51. Wait a minute; let's get the insults straight.

> How party hack of you!

Wait a minute; let's get the insults straight.

A few posts above, you practically accused me of
being a Naderite.

Now, you're accusing me of being a party hack.

Which is it?

*IN POLITICS, ONLY A FOLL WILL PASS UP AN
OPPORTUNITY TO WHACK THE OTHER FELLA UPSIDE
THE HEAD WHEN HANDED A 2x6 BY HIS OPPONENT*.

Are you a fool?

Tesha

[robbedvoter]

59. Party hack with a mind like Nader's: opportunity in suffering of others

Again, without a soul, you can't actually get the meaning of my words. I so hope the women in your life (if any) treat you accordingly

[Tesha]

61. You can't actually speak to my point so you hurl insults.

> Party hack with a mind like Nader's: opportunity in suffering of others
>
> Again, without a soul, you can't actually get the meaning of my words.

You can't actually speak to my point so you hurl insults?

I actually understand your point; you think there's something
we can do that will save Roe (for another year or two).

I simply think you're wrong. There's nothing (that our elected
Democratic politicians) can do and even if they could, it would
only save Roe for a short while longer. Actually, more exactly,
I don't think the Republicans will allow Roe to actually be
overturned, per se. They will simply make Roe become more and
more meaningless as the Religious Whackos figure out all the
ways to encircle and evicerate its effects.

So I'm for taking the other approach; let them blast Roe.
In fact, *FORCE* them to blast Roe so the somnambulant
women of America finally *WAKE THE FUCK UP* and see that
their reights (not just to an abortion, but all of their
rights as women) are in *GRAVE JEOPARDY*.

You obviously disagree, so why not explain how your
approach will play out over the next several decades.
I'm still more than willing to listen, at least if you
can explain yourself without resorting to insulting me
in the process.

Tesha

[robbedvoter]

64. Oh, dear, you still believe in elections, "electable" candidates

and the Easter Bunny...
I have bad news for ya. All your strategerizing is for another time, long gone, when the power was actually shared/switched between two parties. You want opportunity? Go talk to the Bin Ladens in UAE - cuz that's where the action is.
In a few years you'll get the sad truth that you live in an empire and celebrating the death of women was as silly as it is offensive. Dismissed.

[Tesha]

72. I honestly don't care if people use elections, pitchforks, or howitzers.

I honestly don't care if people use elections, pitchforks, or
howitzers to drive the NeoCons and Religious Whackos from power.

And you still haven't offered any actual rebuttal to the point
I'm making.

Tesha

[Bridget Burke]

66. I'm also old enough that I won't need an abortion....

But I can't remain so distant & detached about the fates of women who will die or bear unwanted children. Even if we'll gain some votes.

[Tesha]

71. But this isn't the choice you're being offered.

The "decision point" for open, unfettered access to
abortion services was passed quite a long time ago,
certainly at least as far back as 2000 and one might
make a good case for 1980 when Raygun was elected..

Abortion access is moribund. It *WILL* go away for all
the women in all the Red States.

Accept that. Short of a radical overhaul of American
politics, Red State access to abortions is over, except
by travelling to a Blue State.

The decision we get to take now is, basically:

1. Keep fighting the Republicans as they whittle away ever
more rights for ever more people. They'll never actually
"overturn" RvW, they'll simply make it meaningless through
the thousand cuts of relatively covert restrictions. "Oh
yes, you have an absolute right to obtain an abortion,
but we've arranged it so that the nearest unbombed clinic
is 1,563 miles away, and only open three days a year."
And they'll get away with this shit because no one
ever gets stirred up enough to really fight back because
"we still have Roe!".

2. Use a Jujitsu approach. Temporarily let them take
what they want. Let them put severe, *OVERT* abortion
restrictions in place so all those Red State women who
voted for Republicans get to see what they lost. And then
watch the Republicans get politically crucified as America's
women finally wake up from their long sleep that started in
1973.

As I said, the choice you want doesn't exist any more; it's
passed us by. I'm willing to entertain a third actual option
on my list of choices, but right now, I don't see any.

Tesha

[Bridget Burke]

87. I'll keep fighting, thank you.

I'm a lifelong Democrat & live in the "Red" state of Texas. Quite a few of the women you so blithely dismiss DID vote for Democrats.

But I can understand your lack of empathy. Lots of them aren't white, either.

[Name removed]

95. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SharonAnn]

120. But, quite a few women voted Republican in Texas and they've

set the agenda, unfortunately.

All these "moderate" Republican women who think their rights and their daughters' rights are safe with today's Republican party. They'll find out how safe they are from the right-wing juggernaut bearing down on them.

And here in Tennessee we have Harold Ford, Jr. saying that he now thinks he's against late-term abortions.

Sheesh!

[Tesha]

31. Did I mention Nader?

Did I mention Nader? You seem to be allowing hatred of Nader
to cloud your visions of the realpolitic that's going on here.

(By the way, I voted for Carter, Carter, Mondale, Dukakis,
Clinton, Clinton, Gore, and Kerry, so there's no point aiming
your anti-Nader rhetoric at me.)

Tesha

[robbedvoter]

39. Nope. Just think like him. Tragedies are NOT GOOD for anything!

You know the famous
"First they came for the girls, and I said nothing....."
It's cavalier and offensive to see political opportunity in the suffering of others. I didn't mean you were a Neder voter, just that your rationing is as callous as his.
Can we stop using people as cannonfoder for strategery?

[Tesha]

40. It's too late to choose whether or not we have a tragedy.

> Tragedies are NOT GOOD for anything!

As I pointed out, the tragedy is already on-going.

At this point, our only choice is how long the tragedy lasts.
It could be slow, running for many decades (while the frog
gets ever hotter in the pot) or it could be more intense
but much shorter and eliminate the Republicans for the rest
of our lives.

Me, I'd prefer the second alternative.

Tesha

[robbedvoter]

43. So, your solution - bullhorning on the mound dead bodies?

Good luck with that.
Much as I want to change things, I'll always steer clear from crass opportunism, no matter from which side.

[Tesha]

45. If that's what it takes, yes. (NT)

[robbedvoter]

50. Glad dead women made your day. Enjoy now!

I am sure your world will become a better place.

[Tesha]

52. They're not any *LESS DEAD* if we take your approach.

They just keep *GETTING DEAD* for as long as the Repubicans
retain their death-grip on power.

Tesha

[robbedvoter]

58. My approach? Actually caring vs exploiting misery?

Geez, I never knew it was an "approach". Silly me, I thought it was just being a human being.
But then again, I never went to "strategery school"

[Tesha]

62. "Stragery school"

> Geez, I never knew it was an "approach". Silly me,
> I thought it was just being a human being.
>
> But then again, I never went to "strategery school".

That's a shame -- the enemies of women did.

Tesha

[SmokingJacket]

77. I see your point, BUT...

I'm beginning to lose hope that people will EVER wake up to what the RW is doing to this country -- or if they do wake up, it will be too late, and the Republicans will have an absolute lock on power.

You have faith that if they overturn R v W, people will vote them out. But they've been threatening to do it for ages... and look! They're still in office!

[Tesha]

80. It's just about the only hope I have left. Sighhh...

It's just about the only hope I have left. Sighhh...

Well, that for the women and a draft for the men.

But like the overseas headline said, "How can 59,xxx,xxx
people be *SO* dumb?"

Tesha

[leftstreet]

93. Many people are shocked when they learn the current status

The RW nutjobs have been screaming about abortion so effectively and so long that most people assume it's happening all around them. Like you, I do believe an outright ban would awaken the "eeww! feminists!" women and men in America.

http://www.prochoiceamerica.org/choice-action-center/in_your_state/who-decides/state-profiles/

Click on any state. Example:

Ohio
Grade: F
91 percent of Ohio counties have no abortion provider

[bunkerbuster1]

23. Just a five year jail sentence?

Pussies! go for the death penalty.

YOU KNOW YOU WANT TO!

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

27. Oh absolutely.

After the last anti-abortion march, I heard Rachael Maddow play part of the speech by the main speaker. She said there would be "Nuremberg trials." There is so much hate that they will direct into violence to people if they get their way. All that repressed emotion has to go somewhere.

Then Maddow played Bush calling the woman during the march and praising her, so that shows all the support they are getting, even when they talk about executing people.

[bunkerbuster1]

35. Nuremberg trials... yeah, I heard that, there's also the "slavery" analogy

witness the seemingly bizarre (even though I understood instantly) Chimpy reference, during the 2004 Presidential debates, to the Dred Scott decision.

I covered this idea a bit in yesterday's blog entry:
http://hillbillyragger.blogspot.com/2006/02/this-just-in-racist-cretins-are-not.html

I'll copy/paste it here:

as I pondered the hysterical over-reaction to Lowery and Carter's remarks that seem to show little sign of abating (although JC's backing of GWB's UAE port thing might mitigate this a tad) a little lightbulb went off. One reason the right wing loathes the left so very much is that they've no unique American heros of their own.

Sure, they can point to some people -- your Reagans, your um, um... ok, there must be someone else -- seen as somewhat larger-than-life in retrospect. But for a Reagan, there's an FDR.

Who does the Right have that's a right-wing image of Martin Luther King or any of the other civil rights heros? Nobody, that's who. And so they squirm and complain when MLK or his wife are praised; it's gotta hurt. The best they can do (and I mean that genuinely, because MLK was fighting for everyone) is co-opt and claim partial ownership of the ideals, and that's fine as far as it goes.

But the final solution, the end game that southern right-wingers have to play, is to elevate their anti-abortion movement into the realm of civil rights. I think many on the right consider it their own personal abolitionist movement, one that will be recognized in time as necessary as that of John Brown.

Until that (very unlikely) day arrives, though, they have to sit and squirm as Bush did during Coretta's funeral. Which is why any unflattering remarks about the current US government (via Lowery), or even that of LBJ (via Carter) that might remind the right of what a wretched history it has, and how unheroic it's been, were so very hard to swallow.

[Mizmoon]

25. rich and middle class women will go elsewhere

poor women will be forced to have babies they can't afford and don't want.

That's the way we like it here in America - punish the poor for our "sins".

[Samurai_Writer]

29. Well the adoption industry has to get those newborns from somewhere...

I would bet the farm that the adoption industry helped lobby for this bill. They are salivating over the idea of having thousands of pregnant girls who can't get abortions at their disposal to manipulate, coerce and outright force into relinquishing children for adoption. Think of all the money the adoption industry is going to make off the babies these girls are forced to deliver. It's sickening.

[KitSileya]

151. Why the use of the future tense?

In truth, you should say "rich and middle class women go elsewhere, poor women are forced to have babies they can't afford and don't want." That is the the situation in many states today - with Roe vs Wade. That is what many, who talk about fighting for RvW, don't realize. RvW is already dead in many parts of America - and for a good number of women in America. Preserving RvW won't mean squat to them, but as long as rich and middle class women, who still have the opportunity to have abortions, don't feel the consequences of these de facto abortion bans on their own bodies, the only women who will realize the seriousness of the situation are those who are already politically aware on the left side of the political spectrum and are willing to fight for their rights, and that is not a majority of American women. Unfortunately. As Tesha says upthread, women are already dying, and they will keep on dying, even if RvW is preserved. Honestly, I doubt the overturn of RvW will change the situation for many, if not most, American women. Perhaps it's time that those self-satisfied middle class women get to feel what poor women live with every day - perhaps that'll wake them up. They reap the benefits, but scorn those who have fought for those benefits. I have no respect for them.

[progressoid]

28. We're paying attention but the rest of the country doesn't seem to be.

Maybe they're in shock??

30. Wow - this is incredible

This state must really be run by fundamentalists.

[Tesha]

32. I hate to break it to you, but...

I hate to break it to you, but this country is run by
fundamentalists and NeoCons using the fundamentalists
and conservative Catholics as their willing fools.

Tesha

34. South Dakota one of the 7 smallest populations in US

That state is mostly empty space, also Mt. Rushmore and lots of Indian Reservations.

State July 2004 pop.


Alaska -- 655,435
Delaware -- 830,364
DC -- 553,523
North Dakota -- 634,366
South Dakota -- 770,883
Vermont -- 621,394
Wyoming -- 506,529

[sarahlee]

140. Writing from one of those Indian Reservations

Good idea from a diary at Kos

If you are as disgusted with the recent South Dakota anti-abortion legislation as I am, there are things you can do. Sure you can write the Governor's office, but I think you will have far more effect if you contact the Office of Economic Development. You see - South Dakota has been losing people, jobs, and entire communities for most of the past 60 years. They are hurting.




Although this map shows recent population loss - it misses two things. It doesn't cover population loss between 1940 and 1970 when nearly every county in the state lost considerable population - plus it doesn't indicate population losses greater than 5%. Since WWII, more than half the counties in South Dakota have lost 50% of their population.

So hit them where it counts.
Contact South Dakota Economic Development.

Mary Lehecka Nelson
[phone]
[email protected]

Here are 4 things you can do:

1. Make it clear that your personal travel and vacation plans will not include South Dakota. There are other Interstates in North Dakota and Nebraska. There are other places to gamble besides Deadwood. There are other mountains to visit besides the Black Hills and Mount Rushmore.

2. If you own your own business, tell SDED that you would not consider relocating or expanding operations in South Dakota. Let the people at Economic Development understand that women's reproductive rights are part of economic development.

3. If you work for a company that provides a full range of reproductive health benefits, let SDED know that it would be difficult for a company such as yours to locate in South Dakota. Also, let them know that in the competition for top employees, you could not consider working in South Dakota.

4. Better yet, try to get your company to issue a statement on reproductive rights' benefits. It can be very neutral in tone. "XYZ Corp. could not locate in any state which did not offer a full range of health protections" would be a powerful reminder to SDED.

Make sure that state officials in South Dakota know the real cost of their proposed abortion legislation. It's sad that these ideologues have no concern for women's health, but they may think twice before plunging their state into further economic decline.

by johnnygunn at:
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2006/2/23/124829/214

142. Ya good idea

Does anyone vacation in South Dakota? There are surely a lot of companies who do business with South Dakota, and hitting them in the pocketbook would work.

I passed through the Badlands once, really incredible. A lot of dinosaur bones there. And my father took a bunch of pictures of my little brother and sister amongst the fields of sunflowers that they grow there.

[sarahlee]

143. Yes - LOTS of vacationers

And there is the big Sturgis Motorcycle Rally every August. Motorcycles start coming through for it in July.

Ideas from the comments at Kos:
We should also make up list of companies that are either based in SD or have significant presences there, and write them telling them you will boycott their products until they put pressure on the state legislature to uphold women's rights.

South Dakota Chambers of Commerce:
http://www.globalindex.com/comindex/sd/index.shtml

Also, e-mail Billie Jo Waara, director of tourism, at [email protected].

And the link below will take you to a page that conveniently provides a form and e-mail connections for every South Dakota state legislator. I have gotten very interesting responses back from two legislators who have been quoted as supporters of the bill:
http://legis.state.sd.us/email/index.aspx?FuseAction=Member

Sample letter at:
http://www.dailykos.com/comments/2006/2/23/124829/214/14#14

Congratulations, South Dakota! You just secured a spot at the top of my "States I'll Never Spend a Nickle In" list with the passage of your barbaric law criminalizing all abortions, including those resulting from rape and incest or performed to preserve the health of the mother. I presume your governor will sign this wretched piece of legislation.

I hope you're happy to live in a state in which you can be raped and impregnated by your father, or your grandfather, and the Great State of South Dakota will force you to carry that pregnancy to term--force you to bear a child that is the product of an act of extreme violence and perversion. Are you going to list that attribute among the reasons to visit South Dakota?

How's this for a new tourism slogan:

"Come to South Dakota and be raped by Grandpa--we'll make sure you bear the children of your familial attacker!"

or this:

"Visit South Dakota--where the buffalo roam and doctors are jailed."

or this:

"Visit South Dakota: Home of Forced Childbearing"

Is South Dakota that hard up for new citizens that it must impose forced childbearing on its residents? With laws such as this, do you really have to wonder why South Dakota is LOSING population?

I'll be sure to counsel all my friends on the advisability of traveling to South Dakota or spending any money there. And if I must travel to South Dakota, I assure you I will only be passing through without spending a nickle. Well, maybe I'll stop at Wall Drug for a FREE glass of ice water.

First Bill Janklow, now this. You really know how to elect your politicians out there on the edge of the earth, don't you? The buffalo that roam your state have more brains.

Sincerely,

by MnRaindog

And, lets write some letters to the Editor of South Dakota papers to let the general population know as well. The politicians might not tell them how many calls and letters they are getting.

You can find the contact info and/or write them directly from here:
http://www.congress.org/congressorg/dbq/media/

With all of us here and at Kos, if we can get this on more sympathetic blogs, forums, YahooGroups, etc. we might give some folks a second thought.

144. South Dakota is 2nd largest producer of sunflower seeds

and North Dakota is #1. That is a product that could be targeted.

One other thought is that South Dakota is really just the staging ground to bring this issue to Supreme Court. However, they can be made to feel this issue in their pocketbook. Too bad they don't produce peanuts, because then I could make an impact. I don't buy much sunflower seed but I buy lots of peanuts.

[DemGirl7]

36. There is no doubt in my mind that Roe will be no more within 5 years

First the late-term ban is coming up to SCOTUS, now South Dakota banning abortion which will no doubt be challenged by the local Planned Parenthood in the area, and the fact I believe I read somewhere else that 4 more are trying to ban abortion. There is no doubt in my mind that Roe is toast, especially since the SCOTUS looks the way it does now, and to think there are going to vacancies on it for sure coming (Lets pray to God that Justices Stevens & Ginsburg don't retire, since I've heard from several well informed people that they might or will soon). People aren't going to start paying attention until there are a bunch dead women from the back alley abortions they had to have done, and the sad thing is that even then some people still won't fucking care. This country is going to full of people that will have blood on the hands from this, because they help in allowing for Roe to be overturned, and causing the deaths of my women who only mistake was not having the proper means and money of getting a safe abortion.

[stop the bleeding]

37. I heard this on NPR yesterday n/t

[Greyhound]

38. Yeah, but filibustering the Scalito appointment was not important

I just hope you all remember which of "our team" bailed for their own purposes... :banghead:

[dysfunctional press]

42. Every day I am more and more glad that we remained child-free...

what a wonderful world it ain't gonna be.

[Bridget Burke]

68. Well, contraception will be the next target....

So I hope you've taken more permanent steps to ensure you remain child-free.

If you're still "taking precautions"--be sure to use the 100% effective method--as soon as it's invented.

[dysfunctional press]

70. i had a vasectomy 6 years ago.

i was having a cystoscopy, and popped for the add-on, as long as they were in the neighborhood.
and in the course of the cycstoscopy the dr. found and removed a wee bit o' cancer that luckily hasn't re-appeared.

btw- cystoscopies are NO fun. and i never liked condoms anyway.

[Bridget Burke]

86. Good for you!

For being man enough to get snipped. And for the cancer that went away.

[ronnykmarshall]

112. I'll second that.

If you can't support a kid and won't use a condom ..... get snipped.

My step-mom has friends that a typical "my baby momma/daddy" types. The kind of guys that think getting snipped will effect their sex lives. Dumb ass. It may take a man to be a daddy, but takes a REAL man to be a father.

Same goes for women. (and I might get flamed here) But I can't stand when I hear women using abortion as a form of birth control. The same friends of step-mom just had a child that neither of them are financially or emotionaly able to support. She got pregnant AGAIN and had an abortion. He has three kids from his first wife that he pays little or no child support to and still he won't get fixed. It pissed me off.

:rant:

[cap]

147. the issues that you raise are wedge issues...

most women dont use abortion as birth control. Also, there are reasons why some women use abortion as birth control. For instance, one woman came in for multiple abortions. The staff questioned her as to why she was doing this. It turns out her husband beat her every time she used birth control and insisted on having sex. The staff gave her a Depo shot and she returned faithfully for her shots. She did not have control over her body.

On an another note, Women who are addicts dont have control over their bodies ... they cant control themselves. Are you going to adopt those babies?

[shrike]

46. What a lot of young women don't understand

is when they say "no abortion," they also mean no morning-after pill.

I read an article in Glamour (I know, trashy, trashy) about the "young" pro-lifers movement. Without exception, these young women considered abortion barbaric and unnecessary BECAUSE OF the availability of the morning-after pill. More than a few of them, in fact, had used it more than once.
No one seems to have pointed out to them (and Glamour certainly didn't) that these folks also have the morning-after pill in their sights. Not to mention certain forms of birth control (the Pill, perhaps?)
Can't feel too sorry for the ladies in the article, though. They deserve what they get. Guess my bleeding heart has bled dry.

[Norquist Nemesis]

49. No. What they don't understand is turning it over to Government.

Once that's done, it's out of their hands. While they may agree with the Government's position today, down the road the government just might change it's mind. The state would have the power to abort their future unborn grandchildren because they turned it over.

[SharonAnn]

121. If government has the right to FORBID abortion, then it has the right

to REQUIRE it when it deems appropriate.

It's actually a civil rights issues. The government has no right to control the body of a citizen, with the possible exception of the mentally incompetent.

[Tesha]

54. The ordinary BC pill is *DEFINITELY* a target.

> No one seems to have pointed out to them (and Glamour certainly
> didn't) that these folks also have the morning-after pill in
> their sights. Not to mention certain forms of birth control
> (the Pill, perhaps?)

The ordinary BC pill is *DEFINITELY* a target.

Exhibit A:

The reluctance of Reich Wing pharmacies to carry it and
Religious Whacko pharmacists to dsipense it.

Exhibit B:

The arguments that several forms of *ORDINARY B/C PILLS*
prevent implantation and are therefore the moral equivalent
of abortion.

I wonder how many people even know what Griswold v Connecticut
was all about? Was it *THAT* long ago?

Tesha

[shrike]

69. I thought I'd read news stories that the Pill was being challenged

Thanks for the info. These women just do not have a clue. Maybe I should feel sorry for them.

[Norquist Nemesis]

47. Whatever will the Randall Terrys and James Dobsons do

without their flagship divisive issue to waive in front of the masses while passing the money basket? :shrug:

Seriously, we need a bumper sticker with something to the effect of: Want Government to Control Abortions? Think China

[Tesha]

56. There's always gays, evolution, and prayer in schools. (NT)

[Norquist Nemesis]

57. LOL! They've certainly moved those into the replacement category! n/t

[bobbieinok]

111. the anti-gay hysteria by the RW and religious right before selection 2004

made it clear they thought they needed a second issue b/c destruction of most 'rights' to abortion was a done deal

the religious right was pushing the anti-gay week of demonstrations and marches......I think it was in Oct

[dr.zoidberg]

55. Hear that noise?

That's the sound of a gun cocking because the the Republican party is about to blow its fucking brains out. It might make a nice splatter pattern on the wall. It will be like that guy in Pittsburg that shot himself on live TV, complete with a blood geyser.

On the other hand, it mean that the Democrats will be in power for the rest of our lives. Although that may not be a good thing...

[robbedvoter]

60. How so? Did they restore elections? Nobody tells me those things!

:shrug:

[dr.zoidberg]

109. I have zero clue what you're talking about.

Did they restore elections? What kind of question is that? It makes no sense whatsoever.

[bobbieinok]

113. it means republicans control voting machines and in many states

control the counting of votes

it's clear they stole FL in 2000 and 'won' by a 5-4 in the supreme court

it's somewhat harder to follow, but it's also pretty clear they stole OH and thus 2004......plus problems in NV and AL.....they also learned from 2000 and probably fixed the votes in sure Kerry and Bush states so that Kerry won by less and Bush by more than they should have according to exit polls......this was SO THAT it would appear that W 'won' the popular vote; that Gore won the popular vote in 2000 was a big 'no no' for the republicans and they made sure it would not happen again

it's highly likely the republicans tested the plan in GA in 2002, where republicans won the senate and the governorship in stark contradiction to the day before polls and the exit polls

and the republican CA secretary of state has approved voting machines for all of CA after the democratic secretary was forced out on probably trumped up charges b/c he opposed voting machines

unless something is done about the election process republicans have a lock on future elections for president and congress

[dr.zoidberg]

129. Oh, that shit.

What's next, are you going to tell me that they are in cahoots with the lizard men or the saucer people?

[bobbieinok]

131. denial isn't just a river...you don't think 2000 was stolen?? +

that there is no way that OH might have been???? or GA in 2002??

you seem to be doing a good ostrich impersonation

[dr.zoidberg]

132. I ain't no ostrich.

My neck isn't long enough. ;) I feel I was a little to flippant in my previous post. Sorry about that, but I just can't stand the fact that some people still dwell on something that happened nearly 6 years ago. You got to learn from it and get better. Also, your previous post indicates pessimism. Some people would say that was a typical Democrat viewpoint. I, however, wouldn't(even though i just did:)). You can't have that attitude. I'm telling you, seriously, that regardless of what the Republican party may or may not have done will NOT help if Roe v. Wade is overturned.

Yes, yes I have heard about the fixing of elections. Point me to a source that is not liberal and I'll take it seriously. Otherwise, it means nothing to me. Kind of like FOX News, minus the comedy element.

[Pachamama]

65. I'm paying attn! But w/ all the sh*t going on, I'm trying to digest it all

and figure out what the hell we can do! It's like having 50 fires burning all at once, and you can only tackle 10 at a time....

I just hope that people at the top of various organizations like Planned Parenthood, the ACLU etc. have a good strategy, because the other side is drawing the battle lines....

AND I SURE AS HELL HOPE THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY IS PAYING ATTENTION!

:grr:

[Tesha]

75. Planned Parenthood and the ACLU *HAD* a strategy.

> I just hope that people at the top of various organizations
> like Planned Parenthood, the ACLU etc. have a good strategy,

Planned Parenthood and the ACLU *HAD* a strategy: it was to block
Alito's nomination. But the Democrats checkmated *THAT* strategy
but good by refusing to filibuster.

I haven't had the heart to open PP's mailings since then, but
I'm pretty sure the ACLU will just keep fighting the ground war
as best as they can. It's just a holding action, though, given
how many attacks on choice are simultaneously occurring

Tesha

[Fleshdancer]

76. preparing now for the absolute worst

We know that abortions will not end, this will just make it more expensive and considerably more dangerous for poor women. What actions can we take to ensure women aren't dying or mutilating their reproductive organs this time? I was born after abortion was already legalized so I am blissfully ignorant when it comes to creating a network of people who can help women get to the states where abortions are legal (assuming it is true that the SC rulings will make abortion a state issue) and donating to possible organizations that help fund them for women who can not afford it.

I just can't accept sending women to alleys again. I'll call, write, scream, protest...I'll do what needs to be done on the political front but I'm not optimistic. At the end of the day, it's going to be our responsibility to keep our sisters safe.

[Tesha]

79. Training collectives to do "do-it-yourself" abortions has been discussed.

Training collectives to do "do-it-yourself" abortions has been discussed.
After all, vacuum pumps and canulas aren't *THAT* expensive.

Smuggled RU-486 is certainly another alternative for some women.

Providing transportation to Blue States/Canada is yet another
alternative; and the smarter women won't ever go back to their
Red States.

Ahh, Margaret Atwoods's "Underground Femaleroad" is here. :-(

Tesha

[Fleshdancer]

83. that sounds so...I don't know, tragic.

DIY abortions. wow. Sounds very scary to me.

Smuggled RU-486 sounds promising. I wonder how expensive it will get on the black market. Life would be a little easier if the morning after pill was sold over the counter too but the FDA put a stop to that idea pretty quickly.

The internet will make it much easier to create the network for providing transportation and fundraising for the women who most need it. We can't turn our backs on the illegal setups though. It would be nice to ensure the underground red state "clinics" were still safe.

There's a lot of work to do.

[robertpaulsen]

118. Good ideas Tesha.

Smuggled RU-486 is certainly another alternative for some women.

Providing transportation to Blue States/Canada is yet another
alternative; and the smarter women won't ever go back to their
Red States.

I was discussing exactly those options with my wife this morning. We were wondering what needs to happen in a Post-Roe America for people to wake up and realize we need a Constitutional Amendment to protect women's rights.

I like those two ideas because they are confrontational, it requires attention be paid to the injustice of women not having a legal choice, the civil rights if you will, in a repressive state. The "do-it-yourself" idea is something I'm not too familiar with. I just hope it's safe.

I tried looking up "Underground Femaleroad" and I kept coming up with The Handmaid's Tale. Is that the book you're referring to?

[Tesha]

128. Yes, "The Handmaid's Tale".

> I tried looking up "Underground Femaleroad" and I kept coming up
> with The Handmaid's Tale. Is that the book you're referring to?

Yes, "The Handmaid's Tale".

It was the first book I re-read after the Selection of 2000 when it
was clear that all of this was going to be going down.

I believe Sheri S. Tepper's "The Gate to Women's Country" may
have been the second.

Tesha

[WinkyDink]

78. I'm old, childless, yada, yada.

Time for the young and affected to take to the streets.

[Nobody]

125. It's the male and post-menopausal who are harassing patients

at the clinic I volunteer at as an escort.

There is a grain of truth in what you say, we should ALL stand up for our rights before they go down the tubes.

However, we're all affected. Even those who are not heterosexual. Even those who are abstaining until marriage and haven't met Mr. Right yet. Anyone can be raped. And what is never made clear is just how are they to tell whether someone has been raped or not when women don't always file a report? And how is she to file a report when it was daddy dearest who raped her? Or Mama's precious boy who raped his sister?

And that's just rape. I can rant on about life of mother issues, but I'll confine myself to ranting about rape for the moment.

[DarkTirade]

81. Well that didn't take them long at all.

I wonder how many of the people who voted on it are actually, y'know, WOMEN who have a womb of their own to worry about.
Just wait until one of these conservative white men's teenage daughter gets herself pregnant, then see what they think about abortion. Hey, even better if she gets pregnant by someone who isn't white. I bet they'd looooove that.

[SharonAnn]

123. My aunt says "wait till their secretary or girlfriend gets pregnant."

Then see how they act.

She is the wife of a surgeon and is sick to death of all the doctors who are "morally opposed to abortion" except when their secretary or office nurse gets pregnant. There's no way they want the woman to deliver that child and have the DNA test prove paternity.

[Initech]

82. IMO - death of Roe V. Wade = beginning of police state

Really, if the die-hard fundies can overturn Roe V. Wade, then who knows just how far they'll go?

[JCMach1]

126. They will go as far as they can push it...

If they can't have an absolute dictatorship, they will just slip the next dictator in with a littl machine and media help in 2008

[DrGonzoLives]

84. Won't get out of District Court

And the Court of Appeals will laugh at it before denying cert. This bill is headed for the round file, and the only real issue is how much taxpayer money the governor will spend on lawyers in a losing cause.

[Nikki Stone1]

90. Care to put a wager on that?

It would be a terribly horrible kind of gambling, but I really think you're wrong here. All the same, I'll pray you're right.

[ourbluenation]

94. ITA Doc...and R v W will never be overturned ...

Instead there will be tighter and tighter restrictions on, basically, what a woman can and cannot do with her body according to the US Government. For example - mandatory waiting periods, parental approval, etc...

[Tesha]

96. Expect a 10 month waiting period before we're through. (NT)

[eggman67]

100. And that's why

your earlier assertion about it being good in the long run was so on target. They don't need to make it illegal if they can make it functionally inaccessible, which is much easier than people think. Some people won't see the logic in this, however.

Frankly, I'm surprised SD went this rather short-sighted route.

[Nikki Stone1]

102. Inaccessibility can always be reversed by legislation. A Supreme Court

ruling is much more difficult to fight.

[eggman67]

104. A Supreme Court ruling wouldn't make it illegal

It would return the decision to the states. State would then make laws which can also be can always be reversed by legislation. There's no difference between:

Illegal - a law that can always be reversed by legislation.

Inaccessible - laws that can always be reversed by legislation

Actually, come to think of it, illegal would be easier, you'd only have to overturn one law. Inaccessibility would be many laws.

[Tesha]

105. Thank you for your kind words!

> And that's why your earlier assertion about it being good
> in the long run was so on target. They don't need to make it
> illegal if they can make it functionally inaccessible, which
> is much easier than people think.

Thank you for your kind words!

We've clearly seen this strategy at work for the last few
decades, and the payoff (and tipping point for women's
rights?) is finally coming. Over the decades, the Reich
Wing has simultaneously:

o Legislated picayune restrictions (waiting periods,
zoning laws, disposal of fetal remains laws, etc.)

o Caused abortion to become highly politicized/stigmatized

o Blown up/burned clinics/driven them out via pressure on
their landlords

o Prevented new clinics from being built (no concrete available
in the area for building the clinic, etc.)

o Killed/threatened doctors and their families

o Discouraged training of ob/gyns in abortion procedures

o Harrassed the clients, even if they're only at the
clinic for a Pap smear or BC prescription.

o Etc., etc., etc.

This long range strategy is finally paying off; there are
plenty of places (we've seen Mississippi and SD cited in this
thread) where it is basically impossible for woman to get an
abortion today.

And once abortion is firmly nailed, they'll surely continue
(and step-up) their attack on access to contraception.

But hey, "we've still got Roe!".

Tesha

[eggman67]

108. No problem

I've taken similar flamings for the same views :)

[eggman67]

114. Exactly right

People seem to think that Roe magically makes abortions accessible.

Actually what Roe does do, aside from the obvious political utility to both sides, is prevent a movement for a Constitutional Amendment explicitly guaranteeing these rights. To move for such an amendment now would be a tacit admission that the right is not already there. As long as we have the vaugeness of Roe, there'll always be room for arguement. An amendment would eliminate that, and if Roe were overturned I believe you'd see the needed groundswell to get it passed.

[Harald Ragnarsson]

85. America is dying as we speak n/t

[Nikki Stone1]

88. kick and recommend

:kick:

[Codeblue]

91. Interesting side note

Conservatives think liberals are such life-hating bastards and only liberals have abortions. But the simple truth of the matter is, the Red states have waaay more abortions than all blue states. Texas has more by itself than all of the blue states combined. Just a nice little fact conservatives like to ignore.

[Tesha]

98. Contraception trumps abortion every time.

Liberals don't have hang-ups about accepting that
they are going to have sex and planning for that
eventuality by obtaining birth control.

Religious Whackos think that if they just prey, err,
pray hard enough, the Good Lawd will relieve them
of their wicked thoughts. And obtaining B/C would be
obvious proof that they expect to be overcome by the
sin rather than overcome the sin. Hence, pregnancy.

As Stephen King so clearly put it in Carrie:

Margaret White: I should've killed myself when he
put it in me. After the first time, before we were married,
Ralph promised never again. He promised, and I believed him.
But sin never dies. Sin never dies. At first, it was all
right. We lived sinlessly. We slept in the same bed, but we
never did it. And then, that night, I saw him looking down
at me that way. We got down on our knees to pray for strength.
I smelled the whiskey on his breath. Then he took me. He took
me, with the stink of filthy roadhouse whiskey on his breath,
and I liked it. I liked it!


Jeez...

Tesha

[DanCa]

97. This is the consequence of not votting for Senator Kerry.

Remember that the Supreme Court was an election issue. If we don't win back the White House in 08, well, let's just say that the repukes will establish a national religion and it will be called "Pro-life". I plead with everyone here to think about the Supreme Court as an election issue before they cast thier ballot in the next Presidential election.

[eggman67]

101. It's not dying, it's already dead.

They just keep the corpse around as a distraction.

[Nikki Stone1]

103. Not really dead yet. Abortion is still accessible for many women

But I do think it is dying

[eggman67]

107. And without it it will still be accessible for many women.

No bluse state is going to ban it, and the red states are just going to legislate it into inaccessibility it's just a matter of time.

What people fail to see is that the way it is now, all they have to do to pass a restriction is pass the "undue burden" test. Now while each of, oh let's say, 10 restictive laws might individually pass the "undue burden" test, the aggregate of those laws can render it functionally inaccessible.

The Blue Staters to whom it is already accessible will see no change at all.
The Red Staters to whom it is already functionally inaccessible will see no change at all.

It's an illusion, used for political points by both sides.

[JerseygirlCT]

106. Yup. A slow, painful death by strangulation. nt

[Pacifist Patriot]

115. Did anyone else catch that a Democrat woman sponsored the bill?

I'm going to be sick.

[Iris]

124. Sickening is right.

I can't even think about this without my stomach turning.

[ecstatic]

117. Will "Plan B" emergency contraceptive be made more readily available? nt

[JCMach1]

122. I would suspect that such drugs are also outlawed in this bill

i.e. they would take a Doctor's prescription.

[ecstatic]

127. The hypocrisy is MIND BOGGLING! nt

[Fire Walk With Me]

130. "Intelligent Design" (sic), coming soon to a SCOTUS near you.

[RB TexLa]

134. guess we'll have to have spousal notification of vasectomies

or permission before we can get one. I can see the nurse laughing in the waiting room "got your little note from your 'mommie,' you have permission?"

[Kool Kitty]

135. You'll never need permission for vasectomies.

It's only we women that are going to be denied rights over our own bodies and reproduction.

[RB TexLa]

136. Wanna bet?

Taiwan requires spousal notification of a vasectomy. I'm sure the "Concerned" women for America will declare that women have a "right" to their husband's sperm.

"Taiwan also requires spousal notification, but not permission, for an abortion, vasectomy, or tubal ligation."

Taiwan

[foreverdem]

145. My husband had to sign...

for my hysterectomy last June. He had to sign an authorization and consent that was included in the hospital paperwork I had to fill out. I had no idea that was necessary and I think he was as pissed off about it as I was.

I don't see vasectomies being far behind with the way the tide is turning.

[tavalon]

137. Yeah,

I didn't buy the line that the Republicans didn't want to challenge Roe V Wade. They can and they will.

[cap]

148. it is part of the ownership society... a man can own his woman

this is the bone they are throwing the red neck male... you can own your woman. You may not own much else and be sucking wind economically... but you can own a person.

[arealliberal]

149. Nonsense...

[mnhtnbb]

150. If you have a CITI credit card...

their collections are based in Soux Falls, SD.

You want to make a statement? Cancel the card and send a notice that you're cancelling to the Governor of SD. Tell them you won't support a state
that wants to deny the right of choice to women.

Lots of banks are now offering balance transfers at no cost with months of no interest on balances.

[Inspector77]

152. Lot of side issue are being used to cloud the reall adgenda of the Repubs