FEINGOLD: "We will look back on this day as a stain on nation’s history"

[kpete]

Statement of U.S. Senator Russ Feingold
On the President Signing the Military Commissions Act
October 17, 2006

“The legislation signed by the President today violates basic principles and values of our constitutional system of government. It allows the government to seize individuals on American soil and detain them indefinitely with no opportunity to challenge their detention in court. And the new law would permit an individual to be convicted on the basis of coerced testimony and even allow someone convicted under these rules to be put to death.

The checks and balances of our system of government and the fundamental fairness of the American people and legal system are among our greatest strengths in the fight against terrorism. I am deeply disappointed that Congress enacted this law. We will look back on this day as a stain on our nation’s history.”

http://feingold.senate.gov/~feingold/statements/06/10/20061017.htm

[MannyGoldstein]

1. Are Feingold and Conyers

the only actual Democrats left in Congress?

[Jackpine Radical]

6. Kinda looks that way sometimes.

Especially on my darker days.

[LSparkle]

8. Makes me wonder sometimes

But then there's Boxer, Maxine Waters and Henry Waxman, too ...

[The Count]

10. Most democrats voted against it - it's not all in the statements

Everyone who voted against is a decent human being to me. The rest - criminals.

[glitch]

15. The worst kind of criminals. The torturing disappearing war criminal kind.

The 20th century totalitarian dictator/collaborator kind.

[MannyGoldstein]

21. WHat About The Triangulators?

Ms. Clinton voted against it - but now she says she's in favor of torture sometimes.

[nebenaube]

46. Hillery should give it up!

There's just no way I would trust either of the Clintons again... Bill lost me when he supported the total information awareness program.

[RapidCreek]

34. As far as I'm concerned...Yes, them and 7 or 8 others

That's why I am an Independant. Calling yourself a Democrat means nothing any more....Hell they want to destroy the Social Security system by letting 20 million or so illegal immagrants who haven't been paying into it for 60 years collect! Right along with the fascist dictator whe have running our country into the ground. Kennedy and Dorgan can lick my butthole. More men of means who can't understand that many of us former Democrats live on Social Security. I used to respect both men to a high degree....not any more.

RC

[Jim Lane]

41. Question about your Social Security comment (OT)

You criticize Democrats who "want to destroy the Social Security system by letting 20 million or so illegal immagrants who haven't been paying into it for 60 years collect". Do you have further information about that? I've read a fair amount about the Social Security debate, and I haven't heard of anyone (in either party) who supports that idea. Payouts to people (whether illegal immigrants, legal immigrants, or citizens) who didn't pay in would be contrary to the structure of Social Security and would, as you suggest, worsen the system's financial condition.

[karynnj]

45. The Limbaugh clones are pushing that

Their point is that the provision in the Kennedy/McCain immigration bill - that was not passed - that would enable people who became LEGAL to claim contributions put into the SS system in the past to determine their benefits.

This seems emminently fair - they should get credit for payments made. People who do NOT become legal get nothing.

So 1) This is not law
2) The big problem in SS is that the surplus was spent every year since 1986 (may be off by a few years) and the CW is that the government cnnot and will not pay it back. (What that means is that the increase in the regressive SS tax that starts on the first dollar of WAGES (not income) earned that was enacted to secure SS for the baby boomers was spent as if they were general revenue dollars - while Reagan in the 80s and Bush2 now - lower the more progressive income taxes.)

The other RW thing going around is the list of Democrats who "voted against English being the national language". They voted for an alternative calling it the "common and unifying language". All of which is moot as the amendment was on the Spector bill that passed though the conservative Republicans voted against it, but which I think doesn't have a matching House bill.

[RapidCreek]

61. First of all illegals DO NOT pay into social security

Unless they are using a STOLEN social security number....which I will give them the benefit if the doubt and assume most are NOT. Stealing a social security number is a CRIME, it is a major crime, a felony.

I am a disabled veteran and I am fighting to get my social security disability insurance...Ive been fighting for two years and have been forced to higher a lawyer...a lawyer that is going to be paid OUT OF MY SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFITS the sum of 5000 dollars (if I win). I am rated at 100% disabled by the Veterans Administration. Ive suffered two...TWO traumatic head injuries. The first was a coma I suffered 20 years ago...the second was a weeklong coma I suffered 2 years ago....I was in the veterans recovery hospital in Minneapolis Minnesota for three months. My disabled status relates to my arm being crushed and sever brain damage. My disabled status was dictated by GOVERNMENT doctors. None the less I have been denied social security disability insurance TWO TIMES OVER. I am currently taking social security to federal court. I've been paying into social security for over 25 years.

You are eligable for social security if youve been working for one year....it matters not how many years you have been working. It does matter what your salary is or was when you apply for it. So an illegal who is given citizenship and has worked for one year is eligable for benefits...you get it? An illegal who is given citizenship is eligable for social security regardless of the number of years he or she has contributed as long as they worked legally for a year. This will decimate the "solvency" of Social Security....PERIOD. And yea the surplus has been spent,,,predominanty by Rethuglicans...the same mother fuckers who have been responsible for letting the vast majority of illegals break our laws. I am well aware that the hoopla thrown up by Rethuglicans over illegals is nothing more that election year propoganda....they, after all, had no probem letting the fuckers steal our jobs for the past 25 years. Why all the caterwaling now? It's a load of bullshit plain and simple.

The surplus is gone. This is a problem for the Democrats as well as Rethuglicans. The Rethuglicans are happy to talk of privatization...and of course their motivations are centered on the destruction of the system. They are confident that they can bullshit the American public into accepting privatizations "benefits". The Democrats cannot be this obviose however....or they choose not to be. It behooves the Democrats to destroy the system as well...they, however have chosen a different route to accomplish this end. They have chosen to wear the cloak of the bleeding heart the Rethuglicans have so graciously laid upon then. They operate under the guise of being equitalble folks and have chosen the route of letting 20 million illegal immagrants claim social security while not having contributed to the system. Its the same goal, it just cleverly hides itself. Wake up and smell the fucking coffee folks. I should also mention that both of the Democrats who so voiciferously support our dictators plan are Catholic......as are the cities which are courting the illegals. Catholisism has led to the destruction of every society in which it has reared it's head. Greece, Rome, Central America and South America, Spain and Russia to name just a few. Now there working on the US. You see Catholithism is the religion of the poor....so it seeks to create as many poor as possible.

Oh and before all you newbies infer that I am a Rethuglican I strongly suggest that you do a little research on my past posts. It's been a little over a year since I've posted because I've been in therapy for that year. It says I've posted over a 1000 times...but it doesn't say how many past 1000. Ive been posting on the board for over 4 years. I've gotta say I don't recognize your names.

I am one VERY PISSED OFF former Democrat...I've worked extensivley on the campaigns of the Democratic legislators in my state...HAVE YOU done the same?

Peace and Innner Harmony,

RC

[rodeodance]

57. illegals DO pay into SS but NOT collect. Irony-they make SS more solva

nt.

http://articles.news.aol.com/news/_a/illegal-immigrants-are-bolstering-social/20050405090209990003

Illegal Immigrants Are Bolstering Social Security
By EDUARDO PORTER, The New York Times

STOCKTON, Calif. - Since illegally crossing the Mexican border into the United States six years ago, Ángel Martínez has done backbreaking work, harvesting asparagus, pruning grapevines and picking the ripe fruit. More recently, he has also washed trucks, often working as much as 70 hours a week, earning $8.50 to $12.75 an hour.

Not surprisingly, Mr. Martínez, 28, has not given much thought to Social Security's long-term financial problems. But Mr. Martínez - who comes from the state of Oaxaca in southern Mexico and hiked for two days through the desert to enter the United States near Tecate, some 20 miles east of Tijuana - contributes more than most Americans to the solvency of the nation's public retirement system.

Last year, Mr. Martínez paid about $2,000 toward Social Security and $450 for Medicare through payroll taxes withheld from his wages. Yet unlike most Americans, who will receive some form of a public pension in retirement and will be eligible for Medicare as soon as they turn 65, Mr. Martínez is not entitled to benefits.

He belongs to a big club. As the debate over Social Security heats up, the estimated seven million or so illegal immigrant workers in the United States are now providing the system with a subsidy of as much as $7 billion a year.

While it has been evident for years that illegal immigrants pay a variety of taxes, the extent of their contributions to Social Security is striking: the money added up to about 10 percent of last year's surplus - the difference between what the system currently receives in payroll taxes and what it doles out in pension benefits. Moreover, the money paid by illegal workers and their employers is factored into all the Social Security Administration's projections.

Illegal immigration, Marcelo Suárez-Orozco, co-director of immigration studies at New York University, noted sardonically, could provide "the fastest way to shore up the long-term finances of Social Security."

[karynnj]

44. Don't buy RW lies

Kennedy has vote for the economic needs of those less fortunate than he for over 40 years.

[smoogatz]

49. You've got to quit listening to wingnut radio.

It makes people stupid.

[karynnj]

43. No, there were I think 33 others in the Senate and many in the

house that voted against this. Leahy's speech in the Senate was an incredibly detailed indictment of this bill. Kennedy was awesome explaining that the US and the world sentenced Japanese soldiers who used water boarding to 10 years at hard labor as war criminals.

Before the bill, Kerry was on at least 5 shows saying unambiguously - absolutely no torture, and speaking of how moral leadership is essential in the war on terror. (Note - I'm sure others spoke before the bill, I saw Kerry - this is not an attempt to say others weren't out there.) Kerry on the Senate floor said this bill condones torture and argued that it gives Bush exactly what he wants.

Don't buy the media attempt to equate the Democrats and Republicans on this - only 1 Republican (Chaffee voted against it).

[robertpaulsen]

53. Ah, Chaffee! That explains why FAUX put a D next to his name. eom

[DearAbby]

2. I weep for what we have lost

:cry:

[wholetruth00]

3. He is so correct. Sad day for America.

[MadMaddie]

4. And this stain is much worse than the stain on the blue dress...

For you Neocon lurkers....when they grab your ass up for finally waking up and dissenting....and there is no one left to defend you....you can fuck off.....

Feingold is at least speaking truth to power....

[razors edge]

5. bring back those terrible days where the only stain

we had to worry about was on a dress.

[BootinUp]

7. I approve this message. n/t

[elehhhhna]

9. When is one of them going to state THIS IS AN ABOMINATION

succinctly and simply?


We're waiting.

[faithnotgreed]

22. right ON

and should have been talked about and even screamed about by legislators long before today

[Pacifist Patriot]

40. Indeed!

[derby378]

11. Now THIS man is Presidential material

Feingold for President in 2008. 'Til the wheels fall off.

[cascadiance]

23. DAMN RIGHT!

Feingold is the one who should be sitting in the White House soon!

[me b zola]

24. He is indeed. n/t

[Le Taz Hot]

28. The ONLY Dem I'll vote for in 2008.

Everyone else is a fraud (Gore would be a possible exception).

[Maven]

30. Ahem.

;)

[Brundle_Fly]

12. Bush continual stream of Sh*t continues to land on the

Constitution.

[glitch]

13. The whole Bush era will be considered a stain.

A rather smelly, long and nasty one too.

[spanone]

14. Let's hope it's only a stain. I see it more as a tsunami.

[tblue]

26. I hope it's only a tsunami. It could be the Apocolypse.

[dogday]

16. Feingold said he came to Washington to

protect the Constitution... It is time to do that... It is hard to hear the voices of our party, but Feingold is one of the loudest heard.....

[mogster]

17. It's abhorrent

[lcordero2]

18. every non-white american citizen should look at this for what it is

It's a return to the days of Jim Crow and segregation.

[VOX]

19. Old-school conservatives (i.e. Barry Goldwater) would be aghast at this.

The constitutional conservatives of the 1950s-60s, for all their flipping out about the "Red Menace," would be absolutely horrified by this act being signed into law today.

Ripping apart the Constitution of the United States is not something to be undertaken lightly, if undertaken at all, and the right wing has just done both.

It's now up to the liberal-progressive wing of the political spectrum to try and keep together what freedoms remain, and to do our utmost to throw these RADICALS out of office. They are not conservatives, they are RADICALS, and they are running this country off a cliff. :grr: :nuke:

[ninkasi]

20. On December 8, 1941

President Franklin D. Roosevelt gave his famous speech declaring the day before, the attacks by Japan on our fleet at Pearl Harbor, as a day which would live in infamy. I believe that today, Oct. 17, 2006, will one day be looked at in the same way.

Why did we fight, along side the British, and the other allied powers, if the outcome was to allow America to become a dictatorship, and a nation which tortures, like the regimes of Hitler, and Japan, and the other Axis powers?

Why did we shed so much blood, lose so many American lives, if 60 years later, the American government would be free to practice the worst atrocities of Hitler's Nazi Germany? We could have saved the lives, and the money, poured into fighting for freedom, if we were willing to surrender it in the future to a man who is trying his best to rule as Hitler ruled.

The America Bush rules right now is not the reason my father was sent to Nagasaki, to be part of the occupying force of a defeated nation. It's not the reason the man who would become my father-in-law, was part of the American forces at Normandy. It was not the reason my former father-in-law, a doctor, enlisted in the army while in his 50's,only to have one of his legs shattered while attending wounded troops in North Africa.

Bush is a disgrace to America, and to every principle I was raised to respect. Today, Oct. 17, 2006, is another day which will live in infamy.

[Generator]

25. We can be known as the worst generation

It's such a moment in history for all. The shame for everyone (AND I DO MEAN EVERYONE) is immense in my eyes.

[tblue]

27. So we're good Germans?

Like many of the most decent German people in the '30s, we remain respectful and keep to ourselves and the details of our daily lives. We don't push too hard, we don't threaten, we don't demand anything except through a few letters we write, or conversations we have, or petitions we sign. We watch our mouths and watch our backs and we follow every law and most rules of decorum. Meanwhile, we keep waiting and waiting for someone to lead us out of this tyranny.

So, 10 or 20 years from now, think we'll stop waiting?

[bdamomma]

32. we are the only ones who will lead us out of this nightmare

it hasn't affected anyone yet out there, well those who do not pay attention, but when people start getting hauled off because of saying something or doing something against this stupid and corrupt government and these thugs running/ruining it, maybe they will begin to wake up, just maybe. It is so sad that we are at were we are right now. Sad for us and sad for our children. I say it is us against them right now.

[midnight]

35. Oct. 3 at 1:11 in the morning my husband was coming home

from work at a local hospital. He was pulled over and asked about the dent in his car. He told them our daughter put it in the car.Officer then asked for his license. Waited for back up then asked him to get out of car for some testing. Breath, walk the line, and then arrested him. My husband asked what the reading was. The officer wouldn't tell him. My husband told him he doesn't drink. The officer told him to put his hands behind his back and that he was arrested. At the station another three hours of breath test, and going over all his medical conditions, military background, and then a blood draw. O yes it is happening, and it is going on right now.

[magellan]

36. That is outrageous!!

What happened?

[elehhhhna]

42. Is your husband unwhite? What? Longhair? Hippie looking?

Wrong bumper sticker?

[hsher]

51. I agree with you, but I've given up

I'm a "light entertainment" DU poster now.

I was one of my generation hoping and trying for change. I found us to be too scared for our jobs, our reputations and our pitiful trinkets to risk any of them to help protect America. Plus we'll gang up, flame, tar and attack one another, over nothing, in seconds. I don't even post hopeful messages, boosts or suggestions on DU anymore after being flamed a couple of times too many just for having a backbone and speaking out loud about what's happening in America. I suggested ideas and things we could do and say to regain control of the country and steer it back to normalcy again. I got torn a new one from several flamers on the board. I'm sure what I've experienced here online is only a microcosm of the tarring I'd get publicly if I began speaking out *offline*. If there were others who gave a damn and would join in, it'd be worth it. But if I decided to speak up and speak out, judging from what I've seen here, I would be doing it alone. Not worth it.

We are going to get just what we deserved, and we'll forever be known as the generation who could have done something, but were too selfish, spiteful, hip and uncaring and apathetic to try, to believe, to risk, to speak out, before it was too late. I'm "over" my generation, ready for occupation and the destruction of America, and COMPLETELY over "the cause". The Online Flame Era has burned out my soul.

From now on I will just watch how things change, and take private notes on what I'm seeing for my personal enjoyment, and once the smoke has cleared, perhaps my grandchildren will find it interesting reading in a history classroom, if we all survive. "But mommy, why didn't you guys DO something?" "Some of us tried, sweetie. We were described as hateful in a chatroom for it."

[ItsTheMediaStupid]

37. October 17, 2006 a day that shall live in infamy. . .

That is what came to mind when I saw bunnypants signing his precious torture bill.

[sandnsea]

29. More than a stain

but yeah, bad day in our history for sure.

[leesa]

31. I wish this man were our President.

[Kurovski]

33. K&R. At least some politician is saying it out loud.

Is there/will there be anyone else in Washington to speak up?

[bklyncowgirl]

38. Thank you Senator Feingold

You are a true American who loves his country and is unwilling to sell out his soul.

[texpatriot2004]

39. I agree Senator Feingold. nm

[indepat]

47. The only things we have to fear is fear itself and our own government

which daily makes a mockery of this Republic and its Constitution, liberty and freedom, the land of the free and home of the brave, and all its sheeple. :scared:

[madrchsod]

48. i`m backing him all the way to the presidency

he is the best democrat canidate we have.

[nam78_two]

50. k&r

:-/

[MrCoffee]

52. Waaaa...Unanimous Consent includes YOU, Mr. Feingold.

he had his chance to stop this nightmare, and didn't take it.

his hands are just as bloody as the rest of them.

[omega minimo]

54. www.thomhartmann.com

:kick:

[omega minimo]

55. and HERE'S a kick for all who thought FOLEY was more important than this

saying that Everyone Else is too stupid to unnerstan Habeas Corpus. :evilfrown:


:kick:
:kick:
:kick: :kick:

[Zybelline]

56. Habeas Corpus is like the 11th Commandment

these nuts insist the 10 Commandments are the underpinning of
our nation, and they are only partly right

But THE big leap, the big bang, from monarchy to rule of law
was habeas corpus and the magna carta

Bush belongs in that disgrace top 40 of mullahs and tyrants 
and  Elmer Gantry s 

GW has zero crediblity on gathering and using intelligence  

his bunch persecuted Plame, Wilson, so many who provided
intelligence pre invasion  

[newyawker99]

59. Hi Zybelline!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[rodeodance]

58. there are distinct values between many Dems and Repugs if people

would take the time to look!

[lovuian]

60. Congress are war criminals and Torture is never tolerated

This is the worst Congress...
agree with Feingold and they will be booted out