...and when they use religion to justify their action, it has nothing to do with religion.

[laconicsax]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5826193

That is if R/T or any other forum is our guide on this.

[trotsky]

1. They're really atheists, duh.

Everyone knows that - R/T has taught me so.

[charlie]

2. Seems to be a common view

It's UN-possible for religion to have real world effects, even when some nutbag points directly at God as the reason for some travesty he's caused.

Suggest taxing churches though, and you'll hear about your opposition to hospitals and food kitchens.

You'll also hear about religion being an "objective" standard of morality, something atheists evidently lack.

Cake-eat-have-ism at its finest.

[TZ]

3. Don't forget....

Anti-Semitism also has nothing to do with religious bigotry...:crazy:

[trotsky]

4. Of course not.

Hitler was an atheist, you know.

[onager]

5. Hmm. "No religious criminals" is a worldwide meme...

While I was in Egypt, several spectacular crimes were committed with a clear religious component. The Egypytian government ALWAYS claimed it was "one mentally unbalanced person." IIRC, sometimes it made that claim before the perp was even identified or arrested.

And of course, religion had NOTHING to do with it. Move along, nothing to see, etc.

In April 2006 (on the Coptic Xian Good Friday, no less), three Coptic churches in Alexandria were attacked by people with knives. Because I lived in Alexandria, I knew good and well that one person could not have committed all three attacks. The churches were in 3 different districts of the city, quite a ways apart from each other.

But the Official Story in the Egyptian media puked up the dependable old "Lone Knifeman" theory as usual. He must have had Iron Man's jet suit.

Even my Egyptian co-workers hooted at the story.

The church attacks sparked riots that killed and injured several people. One riot took place uncomfortably close to where I lived.

I remember looking at a roll-down steel door in front of a Muslim-owned shop. There were some funny marks on it, and I finally realized they were made by an axe.

Somebody was so pissed at their neighbor, they were trying to chop thru a heavy steel door to get at them. And these were people who normally lived side-by-side in harmony. My daily commute took me thru the neighborhood twice a day, and I often saw Muslims and Copts chatting, shopping together, etc.

This is why I like to compare religion to the human appendix. Normally a benign organ that does nothing useful, but capable of flaring up suddenly and killing you.

[salvorhardin]

6. I think almost any belief or system of beliefs can lead to similar behavior though

At least any set of beliefs that promotes an us. vs. them world view and even then it's more to do with how you believe than what you believe. In other words, I don't think religion has the lock hold on violent fanaticism. However, historically, religion has held the majority concentration of power in most parts of the world so that's how violent fanaticism tends to get expressed.

What do you think?

[onager]

7. True that religion + politics = tremendous power...

I saw that in the OTHER major Alexandrian riot. That one happened in November 2005, during the first Egyptian "free" elections in decades.

At first it seemed mysterious. After Friday prayers, a mob of Muslims attacked the beautiful old St. Geragis (George's) Coptic church in Alexandria. They just swarmed into the church's large courtyard and started attacking the building. And people.

The root cause? A DVD. Muslim religious leaders distributed a DVD of a play that Copts allegedly produced--TWO YEARS EARLIER. The play dealt with a young Muslim being recruited as a suicide bomber, then converting to Xianity just in time. On that particular Friday--just before the elections--the DVD was the subject of fiery sermons in many local mosques.

Apparently all that was a smoke-screen, but a very useful one. I read later that the riots were actually stirred up by the local Muslim Brotherhood candidate for election, who was running against a popular Copt. And yes, the Muslim got elected.

Weird fact--Alexandria, the most tolerant and cosmopolitan city in Egypt, has the most elected Muslim Brotherhood politicians of any place in Egypt. While simultaneously having just about the lowest actual Muslim Brotherhood membership in the country.

That's probably a good indication of what can happen when two "majority concentrations of power," politics and religion, help each other out.