My cocker spaniel just had a weird fit!

[fugue]

He was sitting next to me when he lurched away suddenly. He seemed locked in a semicurled position (he moved his head toward me when I said his name--really straining it--but didn't seem able to move the rest of himself). His muscles were all stiff and trembling; I thought that when dogs went stiff they were in an extended position, but he was half-curled up. He swallowed a lot (if he was salivating, he swallowed it all). He was of course very distressed. This went on for several seconds, then the trembling stopped, then the stiffness went away. He went to his water bowl and had a drink of water. Now he seems fine and not even upset.

He couldn't have eaten anything without my knowing it; we've been together constantly without break since about 6 pm Thursday. There's been no change in diet.

Has anyone seen this? I'll call his vet on Monday (sooner if he does it again!), but I thought I'd ask if anyone had seen anything like it.

[demnan]

1. If it were me

I'd try to contact a vet through emergency service. And I have no idea what the problem is, it just sounds serious.

[Shopaholic]

2. He could be epileptic

or he could have been having some type of seizure. Get him to the vet on Monday. My dog did this last year. He was asleep and then let out a yelp and then by the time I got there, he was having some sort of seizure. Turns out his liver was failing (he was 15) and the toxins building up in his body had caused him to seizure. He died about two months later. I don't mean to freak you out here, there's probably some simple and non-life threatning explanation to what happened but a vet will be able to pinpoint it for you for sure. Good luck!

[SW FL Dem]

3. Sounds like it could be a mild epileptic fit

I have several friends whose dogs have epilepsy. Call you vet, it can be treated, usually with phenobarbital. There are also some homeopathic meds that can help (in addition to the regular meds). Unfortunately, I don't know what they are, but you should be able to research them on line.

[fugue]

4. OK, to the vet he goes

I really don't want him on phenobarbytol. I was on it as a kid for about a year, and I have a very poor memory of that year. I slept through a lot of it.

Sigh. My poor baby. He's been the image of health until now, and he's not an old dog.

[Rowdyboy]

5. My spaniel has epilepsy-it is common in the species...

My springer will stare off into space, drool, and appear totally oblivious to everything around him. When he comes out of it, he likes to be close to you, preferably held.

If its just once in a great while, you have nothing to worry about. However, if you start to see seizures on a frequent basis, you should see your vet. My dog has been on a small doses of phenobarbital for the last three years and it has really helped. He rarely has seizures, and when he does, they're MUCH milder than they were before he went on the medication.

BTW, the phenobarbital doesn't make him lazy, slow or fat-those are all just myths. He's just as crazy as ever, only protected from bad body chemicals..

[fugue]

7. I really don't like phenobarbitol

I know from personal experience. As a child I had a grand mal seizure, they couldn't find a cause, and they put me on phenobarb for nearly a year. I don't remember much of that year. I slept through most of it.

So forgive me if I believe the "myths" and do my damnedest to keep my little guy off the stuff. If he has to be on it, he has to be on it, but it will be an absolutely last resort.

[fugue]

9. Looks like I owe you an apology

Been doing some reading. Apparently phenobarbitol is entirely different in the canine system than it is in the human system. Everyone and his brother and particularly his dog is saying it's great for canine seizures, and they only wish they had something as good for human seizures.

Sorry. It's just that my own experience with phenobarb was so very horrific. I didn't want to subject my boy to the same thing. He's my beautiful angel baby, you know.

[Rowdyboy]

10. I completely understand....

When we realized Champ had seizures, we were really scared. I could not imagine him suffering. But our vet, who specializes in small animal care, assured us it was the absolute best answer. Champ has responded beautifully and I hope you meet the same kind of sucess!

[fugue]

11. Thanks!

One of the folks testifying for phenobarb is a friend locally who said that when her dog started having seizures, she and her husband tried all kinds of things other than phenobarb for months, to no avail. She said they both felt very guilty when they finally went with the phenobarb and the dog responded beautifully to it. They could've saved him a lot of suffering.

So I guess what I hope to do (we'll see if the vet agrees) is wait awhile to see if there's a repeat. There's a lot of folks whose dogs have one or two mild seizures in a lifetime, and my boy's was mild (however I happened to feel about it! ^_^;;;). If it becomes a pattern, or he has a grand mal seizure, then we'll go for the drugs, probably starting with phenobarb. (I heard that another anticonvulsant can cause liver failure, and I certainly don't want that!)

Thanks for being understanding.

[Rowdyboy]

12. We only started treatment when we experienced three serious seizures

in four days. That scared me, since the vet had warned us to look out for multiple seizures, An occasional one is nothing to worry about, apparently.

No need to apologise for being reluctant to use phenobarbitol. I know what it can do to people. Its a dangerous drug and should be used sparingly and VERY carefully.

[Rhiannon12866]

17. You don't need to resort to phenobarbital

That class of drugs can affect the liver, and that's the reason that I lost my Samantha, after being on an anti-convulsant for more than four years. My vet said that she died of liver failure, as a side effect of the medication that she had been taking.;(

If you have to resort to an anti-convulsant, though I hope that you try diet first, the new way to go is with Potassium Bromide, which does not affect the liver. Someone else also posted this website, which is excellent, and I should have thought of doing, but this is the page about Potassium Bromide. My cutting edge vet prescribed this for my Sheena, after she still had seizures after he put her on thyroid meds, prescribed herbs, and changed her diet to Hill's Science Diet B/D (brain diet, for dogs prone to seizures). The title of this site is "If I Knew Then What I Know Now." That sure sums it up for me.;(

Talk to your vet about this, and, as I said, phenobarbital is old school. I know, since I've been there, twice. Let us know how he's doing.:-)

http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/potassium_bromide.htm

[Rhiannon12866]

6. I have had four cockers in my life

They are my breed and my love, but all of my dogs, except the one I had as a child, have been rescue. Two have been prone to seizures, but I adopted my Samantha and Sheena, both, at age eight.:-)

This is something that usually comes on early in life. There are a lot of treatments for this, if your dog actually does have seizures. The symptoms vary widely and it is often hard to tell. Sam's were unmistakable and very violent, while Sheena just seemed to zone out for a few minutes, and I only knew what was going on because I had obtained her veterinary history. They got more unmistakable as she got older. My vet tried to treat Samantha with diet, but, eventually, prescribed an anti-convulsant. I lost her, from liver failure, from the side-effects of the primidone, an anticonvulsant, four years later.;(

With Sheena, I had, unfortunately, learned, and took her to a vet who treated her with diet (Hills Science Diet B/D-brain diet), herbs (Gastrodia & Uncana) and, finally, Potassium Bromide, which does not affect the liver. His first step was to test for low thyroid, which she was, and put her on thyroid replacement. He tried one at a time, to see if the seizures ceased. He mostly uses herbs, diet and acupuncture. I lost her, last year, from cancer.:-(

I truly hope that your dog doesn't have seizures, but you are right in checking with your vet, since only he can tell. If you have any further questions, don't hesitate to PM me, since I've been through so much with this. I'd be willing to discuss this, anytime. I know how tough this is, and will tell you anything about my experiences that might help. Good luck. I have been so scared, so know how you feel.:scared:

[fugue]

8. Thanks!

It did scare me to death. He seemed unbothered once it was over. And he's been his normal bouncy self since.

Thanks for the PM offer. I may need to take you up on it!

[Rhiannon12866]

16. I was so scared when my Sam had her first one, exactly a month

to the day, after I adopted her. I had no idea what was going on and was just so afraid that she was going to die. That's the moment that I realized how much I already loved her. My friend in animal rescue, who had already placed another cocker with me, offered to take her back, since the people who gave her up lied about her health status. She later found out, from Samantha's previous vet, that this was not a new thing and was very angry that these people had lied. This must have been the reason that they gave her up, even though they had had her since she was a puppy. It boggles the mind that anyone could possibly give up a pet just when they need you the most.:grr:

Anyway, I knew that someone had to care for this dog, and I already loved her, so repeatedly turned my friend down, on taking her back and refunding my adoption fee. She had already spent a great deal, just to get her up to date on everything and for all her eye and ear problems. And she has many animals, though is never irresponsible. I never regretted adopting my little Sam, despite all her health problems. She was such an adorable bright spirit.
:loveya:

Is that your dog in your avatar? If so, your dog resembles my perfect Barney.
:loveya:

[lukasahero]

13. I have a lab with epilepsy

I do think you should still take your pup to the vet to check for underlying causes but I thought I'd give you some good news too.

I never put Beau on the pheno. My vet talked to me at the beginning and suggested we watch the seizures before deciding to put him on it. The stuff can change his personality and taking him off it at any time in the future could actually make things worse...

Anyway, he's had epilepsy since he was about 3 (he's now 10 1/2). Never been medicated. Luckily he only had a seizure every three months or so and it was easy enough to deal with. He's been seizure-free now for almost two years.

I would say the best thing to do is a) have him checked by a vet and then b) monitor the situation before deciding on a course of action.

[Iceburg]

14. My beloved 2 yr old aussi-shepherd had a similiar event 8 weeks ago

Rushed her to the vet and she confirmed a seizure. In light of the fact that we have had her (Murphy) into the vet numerous times over the past year for other abnormal changes (lethargy, weight gain, mild skin infections), we did request that the vet do a full-screen thyroid profile since we were certain that these symtoms were indicative of some underlying metabolic disorder (diabetes, thyroid disfunction, etc). Sure enough the thyroid profile came back abnormal. She is now on thyroxin 2x daily and has show dramtic improvement in all areas.

Here's a useful recource regarding seizures and underlying causes
http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/causes_seizures.htm

[LibertyLover]

15. Fit

My Siberian Husky has had two such fits in the course of 5 years and my greyhound male had one. We told the vet, but since the fits haven't been repeated in 2 years, there isn't much for him to do. I hope that this is just one of those things for you and your cocker.

[InvisibleTouch]

18. Consider what you're feeding him (danger of soft treats)

My Pomeranian has epilepsy, and your description sounds very much like one of his seizures. Usually this is a genetic condition (though can result from an injury to the brain), and there are varying degrees of severity. If your dog seizures less than once a month, and the seizures are short, I'd be very wary of putting him on medication, with all its potential side effects. Environmental and dietary factors can trigger seizures, as I found out with my Pom; I finally realized, after more than 10 years, that it was the preservatives and artificial colors in the soft-moist treats he loved, that were triggering his seizures. If you feed any kind of Jerky Treats/Beggin' Strips/etc., anything soft-moist and chewy as treats, cut them out immediately and see how that goes. Crunchy treats seem to be fine, but I'd avoid anything with lots of artificial color. After I cut out the soft treats for my little guy, his seizures decreased dramatically. After I put him on a raw/homecooked diet, he hasn't had one since.

Be careful also about chemical cleaners you may use around the home. My Pom has reacted with seizures after my carpets were soaped and steam-cleaned, for instance. Switch to natural cleansers as much as possible ... it's better for your whole family. :)

Good luck....

[Rhiannon12866]

19. You make some excellent points that I had been taking for granted

Food is the most important factor, but treats can also cause problems. I never, ever give treats with coloring and always check out the ingredients, in anything I buy, really carefully. My friend totally eliminated seizures in his lab by feeding a natural diet and eliminating colored treats. When she had another seizure, he discovered that his wife had given the dog one colored biscuit.:-(

My little terrier isn't keen on biscuits, but when I got them for my cockers, I got the homemade, natural, variety, from my local health food store. You can also make them yourself, if you have the time, since you can be sure of the ingredients. I've seen them made on TV, so I'm sure that recipes are available on-line.:-)

I also am very careful with cleaners. I try to choose those that are safe. The one I use now, Hy-Pro Spray Cleen, is so safe that the guy who was selling it kept licking the applicator until I insisted that he stop it, LOL! It works very well, though, especially on pet accidents. Being careful about what you use to clean carpets and floors is really important, since our little guys are much closer to the ground than we are.:-)

Also, another most essential warning is eliminating any pesticides used on your lawn. My mother employed a lawn service and I read her the riot act. She said that they wouldn't use anything harmful, but I have read up on this and know better. I have a friend who learned that her little Bichon's seizures were caused by lawn pesticides. I consider my pets good health to be much more important than the greenness of my grass.:grr: