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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 01:29 AM Original message |
Newest NEJM study on the cost effectivenes of Gardasil |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 01:42 AM Response to Original message |
1. Deleted sub-thread |
WillYourVoteBCounted (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 01:57 AM Response to Original message |
2. here' s another one: You don't love our girls as much as TX Gov Rick Perry |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 07:27 AM Response to Reply #2 |
5. . |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 02:00 AM Response to Original message |
3. Deleted message |
Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 02:08 AM Response to Reply #3 |
4. Deleted message |
mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 09:11 AM Response to Original message |
6. Kick n/t |
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WillYourVoteBCounted (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 11:31 AM Response to Original message |
7. Motley Fool: A Gardasil Gotcha |
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csibona (16 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-09-09 04:21 PM Response to Reply #7 |
108. Arbitrary |
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WillYourVoteBCounted (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 11:32 AM Response to Original message |
8. This vaccine is desperately needed to help Merck recover from paying Vioxx victims |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 01:47 PM Response to Original message |
9. What Gardasil lacks in cost-effectiveness, it more than makes up in marketing. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 04:05 PM Response to Original message |
10. Let's consider just three of this study's baseline assumptions further. |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 04:45 PM Response to Reply #10 |
73. Link to the study please. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:16 PM Response to Reply #73 |
78. The link was provided in the OP. |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 06:36 PM Response to Reply #78 |
97. Ooops, another false statement |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-29-08 12:25 AM Response to Reply #97 |
99. Great. Where did the study consider the costs of the adverse |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Sep-12-08 02:30 AM Response to Reply #97 |
103. Your accusation of falsehood was false. |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 04:50 PM Response to Reply #10 |
74. How do your assumptions prove that women "have more risk of dying from an injection of Gardasil"? |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 04:55 PM Response to Reply #74 |
75. Prove that Gardasil can reduce the incidence of cervical cancer. |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:05 PM Response to Reply #75 |
77. Nice try but I made no claims, you did. Now prove Gardasil is deadlier than cervical cancer. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:18 PM Response to Reply #77 |
79. So you don't think that Gardasil reduces the incidence of cervical cancer? |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:23 PM Response to Reply #79 |
80. Stop obfuscating and prove your claim that Gardasil is deadlier than cervical cancer |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:30 PM Response to Reply #80 |
81. Prove that Gardasil can reduce the incidence of cervical cancer. |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:32 PM Response to Reply #81 |
82. You are changing the subject because you got caught in a lie. n/t |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:45 PM Response to Reply #82 |
84. I am not changing the subject. I am making a point. |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:48 PM Response to Reply #84 |
85. So you made it up. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:50 PM Response to Reply #85 |
88. Just as Merck "made up" its claims that Gardasil prevents cervical cancer. n/t |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:54 PM Response to Reply #88 |
92. Their made up facts justify your made up facts? |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:55 PM Response to Reply #92 |
94. Cute. n/t |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 06:04 PM Response to Reply #94 |
96. Just more evidence of you shifting morality. |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:56 PM Response to Reply #88 |
95. Sure, except their claims are backed by science and your claims are backed by ignorance. |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:49 PM Response to Reply #84 |
87. Finally an admission that you can't prove your claims |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:53 PM Response to Reply #87 |
91. I've admitted that from the start. Nobody can "prove" what may happen in the future. |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:35 PM Response to Reply #81 |
83. I made no claim, you made several you can't prove. Typical for someone who makes up their own facts. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:48 PM Response to Reply #83 |
86. The name for a person who "debates" without making any claims |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:50 PM Response to Reply #86 |
89. The name for a person who "debates" making false claims |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:53 PM Response to Reply #86 |
90. You just admitted you made it up: "The "claims" I am making are informed estimates" |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:55 PM Response to Reply #90 |
93. I wish to discuss the cost plus risk vs. benefit profile of Gardasil. |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 05:05 PM Response to Reply #10 |
76. And you prove these assumptions were made. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-02-08 03:51 PM Response to Reply #10 |
102. Still hoping for some reasoned, scientific discussion on this. n/t |
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WillYourVoteBCounted (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-22-08 04:07 PM Response to Original message |
11. New England Journal of Medicine? isn't that some right wing rag? |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Aug-23-08 01:03 AM Response to Original message |
12. Additional Vaccination (Gardasil) to be REQURED (VA) |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Aug-23-08 01:14 AM Response to Reply #12 |
13. Parents will also have the opportunity to opt out for any reason. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Aug-23-08 01:25 AM Response to Reply #13 |
14. How about the reasons listed above? |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Aug-23-08 01:39 AM Response to Reply #14 |
15. You're citing the article and you didn't even read it? Did you read my post? |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-25-08 02:53 AM Response to Reply #15 |
16. The reason to opt out is that Gardasil will almost certainly do more harm than good. |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-25-08 06:17 PM Response to Reply #16 |
19. You're responsible for proving your claim: "Gardasil will almost certainly do more harm than good" |
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WillYourVoteBCounted (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-29-08 12:47 AM Response to Reply #12 |
100. a case of Big Brother if ever there was |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-25-08 06:06 PM Response to Original message |
17. Here is a thread filled with brand new content worthy of civil discussion. |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-25-08 06:12 PM Response to Reply #17 |
18. Post #2 and #6 pretty much ended any chance of civil discussion. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-25-08 06:19 PM Response to Reply #18 |
20. It's hateful, vicious, nasty and sick to suggest that huge corporations like Merck sometimes |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-25-08 06:25 PM Response to Reply #20 |
21. Thus ends civil discussion. n/t |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-25-08 11:14 PM Response to Reply #21 |
23. Because I questioned one of your many insulting overstatements? |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 06:36 AM Response to Reply #23 |
24. No, civil discussion ended when you posted the hateful comments |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-25-08 06:27 PM Response to Reply #18 |
22. I think the "Colon Head" comment did it for me. Well, that and being called "murderous assholes". |
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antigop (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 09:05 AM Response to Original message |
25. WSJ: Study questions cost-effectiveness of Gardasil Cervical-Cancer Vaccine |
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salvorhardin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 09:12 AM Response to Reply #25 |
26. You missed the key paragraph |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 09:19 AM Response to Reply #26 |
28. It is really sad that we can't protect women who were born too early |
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salvorhardin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 09:47 AM Response to Reply #28 |
29. Well, the earlier the better to be sure |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 10:00 AM Response to Reply #29 |
30. That was very informative, thank you. n/t |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 01:59 PM Response to Reply #29 |
35. That's assuming lifetime efficacy. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 01:56 PM Response to Reply #28 |
34. We can protect these women. We can give them HPV tests. |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 02:03 PM Response to Reply #34 |
36. "we can make better HPV tests." Now there's some faith based medicine. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 02:38 PM Response to Reply #36 |
41. There are already a slew of advanced HPV tests in production. |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 02:45 PM Response to Reply #41 |
42. How about you leave MY BODY OUT OF YOUR FUCKING CRUSADE? |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 02:56 PM Response to Reply #42 |
44. LOL! |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 02:58 PM Response to Reply #44 |
46. Where is your proof that this "vaccine that does more harm than good"? |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 06:22 PM Response to Reply #46 |
54. See post #10 on this thread. n/t |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 06:28 PM Response to Reply #54 |
55. I did, it doesn't prove your claim. Prove that the vaccination is more dangerous than cancer. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-27-08 02:27 AM Response to Reply #55 |
57. See post #10 in this thread. |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-27-08 07:12 AM Response to Reply #57 |
59. You are stumped! |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-27-08 01:44 PM Response to Reply #59 |
60. Respond to post #10. And can pick the discussion up there. n/t |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-27-08 01:51 PM Response to Reply #60 |
61. Prove that the vaccination is more dangerous than cancer. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-27-08 05:02 PM Response to Reply #61 |
62. Why are you so frightened of responding to post #10? |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-27-08 05:38 PM Response to Reply #62 |
63. I'm just waiting for you to prove your claim. n/t |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-27-08 06:23 PM Response to Reply #63 |
64. Her "back of the envelope comparison of potential benefit vs. potential harm" claim? |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-27-08 06:25 PM Response to Reply #64 |
65. Hey! you got here just in time for the tantrum! |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 01:19 AM Response to Reply #63 |
66. Respond to post #10. If you wish to discuss the substance of these issues, that is where to start. |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 06:49 AM Response to Reply #66 |
67. Can you prove your claim that Gardasil is "a vaccine that does more harm than good" or not? |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 07:03 AM Response to Reply #66 |
68. Four times you have been caught using made up facts |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 06:53 PM Response to Reply #46 |
56. The question is, what's the appropriate comparison group: |
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Fire_Medic_Dave (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 07:56 PM Response to Reply #56 |
98. No mention of the fact that the efficacy goes down significantly in women already exposed. |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Sep-12-08 03:03 PM Response to Reply #98 |
105. no one said it was; that was my point. the cost is all in the young years |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Sep-12-08 02:53 PM Response to Reply #42 |
104. yours is the faction pushing to mandate it for everyone. who's trying to control whose body? |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 02:47 PM Response to Reply #41 |
43. It's a good thing Big Pharma isn't producing any of those. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 02:58 PM Response to Reply #43 |
45. Every medical decision must be examined on a case by case basis. |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 03:00 PM Response to Reply #45 |
47. Blanket generalizations like this is a "vaccine that does more harm than good"? |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 03:05 PM Response to Reply #47 |
49. It takes a while to make up that much data. n/t |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 03:09 PM Response to Reply #49 |
50. "it's not a fact. It's an unknown" ! |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 04:56 PM Response to Reply #47 |
51. It's not a blanket generalization. It's about one specific vaccine. n/t |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 03:02 PM Response to Reply #45 |
48. So when you say Big Pharma, you really mean |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 04:58 PM Response to Reply #48 |
52. I have no grudge against Merck. They just happen to make a lot |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 05:01 PM Response to Reply #52 |
53. Could have fooled me. |
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WillYourVoteBCounted (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-29-08 12:51 AM Response to Reply #52 |
101. Maybe Merck is like Diebold Voting Systems |
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Stop_GMO (1 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-08-09 02:45 PM Response to Reply #28 |
106. Finally you said something that I can debate with you! |
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varkam (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-09-09 07:03 AM Response to Reply #106 |
107. Welcome back! |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 09:13 AM Response to Reply #25 |
27. All the more reason to vaccinate early |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 01:28 PM Response to Reply #27 |
31. Consider that 95%+ of Gardasil's test subjects were adults, not little girls. |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 01:36 PM Response to Reply #31 |
32. 100% efficacy among those who had not been exposed. |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 01:52 PM Response to Reply #32 |
33. Gardasil was clinically tested on fewer than 1,200 total subjects under 16. |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 02:03 PM Response to Reply #33 |
37. Is that a real fact or a made up fact? |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 02:18 PM Response to Reply #37 |
38. No, it's not a fact. It's an unknown. |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 02:19 PM Response to Reply #38 |
39. So you are making up numbers just to scare people. |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-26-08 02:22 PM Response to Reply #38 |
40. ! |
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Evoman (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-27-08 03:26 AM Response to Original message |
58. The Gardasil vaccine is awesome. |
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antigop (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 09:19 AM Response to Original message |
69. So has anyone actually replied to mhatrw's post #10? If not, why not? |
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cosmik debris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 09:36 AM Response to Reply #69 |
70. That poster uses made up facts to support her points |
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beam me up scottie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 09:46 AM Response to Reply #69 |
71. *SQUAWK* Post #10! Post #10! *SQUAWK* |
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mhatrw (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-28-08 04:33 PM Response to Reply #69 |
72. Because they don't want to go there. |
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xchrom (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-09-09 08:07 PM Response to Original message |
109. yours is the 'faith based' myth |
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xchrom (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-09-09 08:16 PM Response to Reply #109 |
110. comapring treatments would be reasonable for a truly 'concerned' person. |
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