Lieberman says he WILL block any PO bill. (AP story confuses Final vote and Cloture vote)

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

Lieberman is saying that he will not try to block the motion to proceed to get the bill onto the floor for debate.

But that he WILL vote against ultimate CLOTURE if the bill has a PO, preventing the senate from ever voting on passage of any bill with a PO.

The AP story is vague as to whether opposition means voting NO on final passage (which would be okay) versus voting no on CLOTURE, thereby blocking a final vote from happening. Lieberman said he would prevent a vote from happening.

AP: "Connecticut Sen. Joseph Lieberman said Tuesday that while he won't vote to block Majority Leader Harry Reid's plan from going to the Senate floor for debate, he would ultimately oppose the measure because it includes a public option."

The problem is the misuse of the word "ultimately" which implies an action on a final vote. AP will reword their story later today. Bank on it.

TPM has it covered nicely, as usual, with what Lieberman actually said, not a clumsy paraphrase:

Lieberman: Sure, I'd Filibuster A Health Care Reform Bill With A Public Option

Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-CT) told reporters today that he would in fact filibuster any health care bill he doesn't agree with--and right now, he doesn't agree with the public option proposal making its way through the Senate.

"I told Senator Reid that I'm strongly inclined--i haven't totally decided, but I'm strongly inclined--to vote to proceed to the health care debate, even though I don't support the bill that he's bringing together because it's important that we start the debate on health care reform because I want to vote for health care reform this year. But I also told him that if the bill remains what it is now, I will not be able to support a cloture motion before final passage. Therefore I will try to stop the passage of the bill."

There are two procedural issues at play here. Most people think of a filibuster as a minority blocking passage of a bill that's already been debated ad nauseum on the Senate floor. That's the most standard filibuster. But on major legislation, it's become more common for the minority--in this case the Republicans--to object to the majority getting a chance to debate legislation in the first place. If any one of them objects to the so-called motion to proceed, it will take 60 votes just to start the amendment and debate process. That's a less-discussed filibuster, but it's quite plausible that this health care bill will have to contend with it.

Lieberman is saying that he's pretty much OK with letting senators offer amendments--try to change the legislation, move it in any direction they deem necessary. But when that process is all over, and Harry Reid wants to hold an up or down vote on the final product, Lieberman's saying he'll join that filibuster, if he's not happy with the finished product. Point blank.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/10/lieberman-sure-id-filibuster-a-health-care-reform-bill.php

[uppityperson]

1. Are you saying he wants to continue to discuss, but not vote?

I need simple words today

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

3. Yes. He is saying he's willing to have a debate but will block a vote on the bill

[uppityperson]

5. Thank you, am sick today. Sounds like he wants to talk more about the money

However, everything is related to everything else. If he wants to talk about money, how about he talks about money for other things also. I know that a person says "enough!" at one specific point, but this is not the one to do it on, imo. Seems more like repub strategy, keep war funding going, keep bail outs of buddies going, but for the common folk? OMG! The MONEY!

Like that?

[ecstatic]

2. So his main beef with the PO is the tax payer burden

but he's perfectly OK with war spending. :eyes: :puke: F*cking asshole! Still, I think the PO will be fine with or without him.

[katsy]

4. he's okay with many kinds of bailouts:

corporate welfare, taxpayer $$$ for israel, perks for the senate... just not you and me or anything related to health of our communities.

Mr. "let them eat cake" has found his fiscal bearings just in time to slam the door on the sick and poor working class.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

6. Does some DUer work for AP? Who the heck would unrec this?

The OP is the uncontroversial correction of an AP error with the actual language offered in place of an erroneous paraphrase.

And the correction of a borderline-RW source (AP) is done by an impeccable progressive source (TPM)

You might as well unrec "2+2=4"

[katsy]

7. Remember when the UNREC was just about to become a reality?

A little unrec fairy was born and promised to unrec every thread it read.

I can't remember it's name, but it threatened to unrec every thread if unrec became a reality.

Good op. Helpful.

[IndianaGreen]

10. Lieberman still has his stealth defenders in DU

just as Zell Miller used to have a solid base of fans in DU, until he went too far and Skinner himself blasted him.

[Clio the Leo]

8. Isn't that worse?

help me ....... you're sounding optimistic (and you dont do that very often) kidding!!!!

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

11. Not optimistic, just correcting AP's confusing story. Yes, it is worse

[Clio the Leo]

9. *

[billh58]

12. Since Lieberman is

a "Bush Democrat," a DLC traitor, and a neoconservative war-monger, why is anyone surprised that he would be against a health care PO for Americans? Lieberman is slime, and should never have been allowed to caucus with real Democrats.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

13. ...