NYTimes article - Some Obama Enemies Are Made Totally of Straw (or what the NYT reports these days

[Mass]

(or another attempt to be balanced by comparing Obama to Bush where there is NO comparison).

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/24/us/politics/24straw.html?ref=politics

Some Obama Enemies Are Made Totally of Straw

*
By HELENE COOPER
Published: May 23, 2009

WASHINGTON — Democrats often complained about President George W. Bush’s frequent use of a rhetorical device as old as rhetoric itself: creating the illusion of refuting an opponent’s argument by mischaracterizing it and then knocking down that mischaracterization.
...
Now that there is a new team at the White House, guess who is knocking down straw men left and right? To listen to President Obama, a veritable army of naysayers has invaded Washington, urging him to sit on his hands at the White House and do nothing to address any of the economic or national security problems facing the country.

“There are those who say these plans are too ambitious, that we should be trying to do less, not more,” Mr. Obama told a town-hall-style meeting in Costa Mesa, Calif., on March 18. “Well, I say our challenges are too large to ignore.”

Mr. Obama did not specify who, exactly, was saying America should ignore its challenges.

Similarly, the next day in Los Angeles, Mr. Obama took on Wall Street and Washington, two of his favorite straw men. “I know some folks in Washington and on Wall Street are saying we should just focus on their problems,” Mr. Obama said. “It would be nice if I could just pick and choose what problems to face, when to face them. So I could say, well, no, I don’t want to deal with the war in Afghanistan right now; I’d prefer not having to deal with climate change right now. And if you could just hold on, even though you don’t have health care, just please wait, because I’ve got other things to do.”
...

The telltale indicators that a straw man trick is on the way are the introductory words “there are those who say” or “some say.”
Note: Amusing that what the Times consider good reporting becomes a straw man when Obama speaks
“In strawmanese, you never specify who ‘those who’ are,” Mr. Safire said. “They are the hollow scarecrows you set up to knock down.”...

Indeed amusing. Reporters do that all the time, and want to tell us this is good reporting. But, when a Democratic president says that, it becomes a strawman.

[fugop]

1. Ridiculous

All the writer had to do was google "obama too ambitious" and read the articles that come screaming up. How many Republicans (and Democrats, too!) have suggested he's trying to too much? How many EDITORIALS have screamed the same thing? Yet now this article tries to pretend it's all in Obama's head. I don't know whether to laugh, cry or scream and scream and scream.

[firedupdem]

2. Helene Cooper

is out of her friggin mind. I heard the complaints President Obama talked about with my own ears on every "news" station and read plenty of editorials about each. They really are trying to slam my Prez. "Liberal Media" my eye!

[pot luck]

3. Helene Cooper sure has an ax to grind.

She's been writing pissy articles about Obama ever since he snubbed the NYT by not granting them a pre-inauguration interview.

[LiberalFighter]

7. She should go back to her country of birth. Liberia.

[Thrill]

15. Yup. I remember her pool report. lol

[DrToast]

4. Click on her name to send her an email

I told her to Google http://tinyurl.com/pzj8n7">"Is Obama doing too much"

[Pirate Smile]

5. Who could forget that meme? It went on for quite a while.

[creeksneakers2]

6. Good idea. Done

I think I'll send another though and point out when Cooper wrote:

"To listen to President Obama, a veritable army of naysayers has invaded Washington, urging him to sit on his hands at the White House and do nothing to address any of the economic or national security problems facing the country."

She accused him of saying something he never said, so in fact, she's the one who set up the strawman.

[creeksneakers2]

8. Very nice of Helen Cooper to respond to my E-mail

Ooh you're totally right! I did. Now I wish I had put that in the story too.
In my defence though, I didn't knock it down after.
------Original Message------
From: NYTimes.com
To: Helene Cooper
ReplyTo: [email protected]
Subject: READER MAIL: Helene Cooper
Sent: May 24, 2009 12:42 AM



To: HELENE COOPER

You have received reader mail via nytimes.com. To respond to this reader, simply 'reply' to this message.

READER'S NAME:
Matthew Cowan

READER'S E-MAIL:
[email protected]

READER'S MESSAGE:
You wrote: "To listen to President Obama, a veritable army of naysayers has invaded Washington, urging him to sit on his hands at the White House and do nothing to address any of the economic or national security problems facing the country." Since Obama didn't say anything like that, aren't you the one who set up the strawman?

ARTICLE REFERENCED (if any):
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/24/us/politics/24straw.html?ref=politics

[Parker CA]

9. Probably a good idea to delete your email address from your post. ;)

[creeksneakers2]

10. I love to get E-mail that isn't spam.

[jenmito]

11. That's BS. Everyone in the media was "asking" and even polling: "Is Obama doing too much?"

If the NY Times hasn't heard this question/argument, they must've been living under a rock.

[malletgirl02]

12. NYT

So much for the New York Times being the " paper of record."

[Mass]

13. Helene Cooper Needs To Discover Google, Lexis (by publius)

An awesome answer to Cooper's note.

http://obsidianwings.blogs.com/obsidian_wings/2009/05/by-publiusso-lets-say-im-helene-cooper-of-the-nyt-and-lets-say-i-have-a-great-idea-for-an-article----the-premise-is-that-oba.html

So let's say I'm Helene Cooper of the NYT. And let's say I have a great idea for an article -- the premise is that Obama knocks down pretend strawmen in his speeches just like Bush used to do (e.g., "Some have said...").

It would be a good idea for an article -- if it were true. But it's not, as about 15 minutes of Google and Lexis would show. But Cooper went ahead and wrote it anyway.

The difference between Bush and Obama's arguments is fairly simple -- Bush just made stuff up, while Obama's critics are actually making the critiques that Obama attributes to them. Somewhat hilariously, Cooper herself concedes this on several of the supposed examples of Obama's "strawman" arguments. She notes, for instance, that the criticisms Obama cites were made by real, living, breathing, non-straw-filled people like John Kyl, Anne Applebaum, Bill Kristol, and Jeffrey Kuhner.
...
After finishing with the domestic policy strawmen, Cooper moves on and cites a few foreign policy strawman arguments. There's no need to tear this part of the article down because Cooper does it herself. For virtually every strawman she cites (e.g., criticisms of reaching out to Iran, eliminating nuclear weapons), she cites prominent pundits who actually made the very arguments Obama cited.
...
Google and Lexis are valuable tools -- they should be used. Also, whenever you have to rely heavily on Bill Safire for quotes, that's usually a bad sign.

[anonymous171]

14. The NYT, like the rest of the old media, is useless and irrelevant. nt

[beachmom]

16. The media are the "Some Say" in example #1 (plus the GOP).

They all said "Obama is doing too much". I heard that non stop. Geez.