Imagine for a moment it is 1960 and Kennedy decides to have a chaplain of the KKK

[dsc]

deliver the prayer for his inagural. Would that be OK on the grounds that the KKK had the support of a large percentage of the people back then? Should blacks be happy the KKK chaplain would have to listen to a mention of civil rights? Sorry folks, but this is what it feels like for us to have Rev Warren deliver this prayer. It is that wrong.

[LostinVA]

1. And, it would be EXACTLY the same, no matter those that wish to deny it

Disgraceful for it to be EXCUSED here.


To make it even more accurate: this KKK minister was able to get the Civil Rights amendment blocked in Congress by pulling in some favors and preaching about it on the radio.

[dsc]

26. thanks

[scheming daemons]

2. Geez.... Hyperbole much?

:eyes:

[WeDidIt]

3. Yeah, because Rick Warren supports burning rainbows on lawns

:eyes:

[LostinVA]

8. He already did that with Prop8

[WeDidIt]

13. REally, why was there no footage of rainbows burning on lawns?

:eyes:

[EFerrari]

20. You really need to change your sig line. n/t

[WeDidIt]

21. It's a fucking invocation

not a policy speech opposing LGBT rights.

If his invocation mentions homosexuality at all, I will immediately denounce the choice, but I betcha he invokes the divine and that'll pretty much be that.

[EFerrari]

22. Public gestures matter or they wouldn't be done at all. n/t

[Sebastian Doyle]

24. So if the Klan showed up and gave the speech, it would be OK

As long as they didn't talk about "hatin' the goddamn ni**ers"?? :wtf:

[QC]

28. Hey, it's just a speech. Nothing to get all bent out of shape over.

:sarcasm:

[WeDidIt]

29. Apples and oranges

comparing Warren to the Klan is apples to oranges.

[QC]

30. Very true. Warren is more like the White Citizens Council. n/t

[WeDidIt]

32. Now there is a thoughtful analogy!

I'm going ot have to reconsider in light of that analogy.

[QC]

34. I'm quite serious. Warren's more polished and fit for polite company than, say, Dobson,

but he holds the very same beliefs.

[WeDidIt]

37. I'm serious, too

Comparing him to the Klan was over the top, but you've developed a very apt analogy and it makes me rethink how I feel about this.

[Maven]

33. People like Rick Warren create an intolerant atmosphere that results in hate crimes.

So fuck your hyperbolic, eye-rolling snark.

[ZombieHorde]

4. Most people don't understand that a person's sexuality is just like a

person's race. They may understand intellectually, but not emotionally.

[LostinVA]

5. SExual Orientation -- but good post

[mwei924]

6. I'm not a fan of Rick Warren, but pro-gay marriage pastors are a little hard to come by.

I guess he should've been a member of the Episcopal church (that's now split over this issue).

[LostinVA]

12. Not true at all -- there are many of them -- from all walks of religion

And, how about JUST a pro-GLBT civil rights pastor?

[cali]

16. Yes, and one is giving the benediction. I believer Rev. Lowery

is pro marriage equality.

[QC]

14. Split? Hardly.

Parts of four dioceses--out of 110--and a couple hundred congregations--out of app. 7,600--have left.

That's a splinter, not a split.

And what on earth does it have to do with giving a reptilian fascist like Warren a national pulpit.

[Critters2]

18. any of the leadership of the United Church of Christ could have done it.

To be in national leadership in Obama's (apparently) former church, one HAS to be pro-gay. There are a lot of pro-marriage equality clergy. Hell, there are a lot of gay clergy. Obama did this to send a message. A deeply disappointing message.

[crappyjazz]

35. There are tons

but perhaps not famous ones

and therein lies the political rub so to speak

[camera obscura]

7. Your analogy is flawed - the KKK endorsed maiming and killing blacks, a better analogy is

if Kennedy had a chaplain who supported denying key civil rights to blacks... which, for all I know, he did have. It's not unthinkable anyway.

[ellacott]

15. That is a better analogy

And most of the clergy in Kennedy's time were no advocates for Civil Rights. When Kennedy was inaugurated he wasn't an advocate either.

[EFerrari]

19. Assaults Against Gays Seem to be Increasing

Marcus Franklin, Associated Press
Sunday, December 14, 2008
(12-14) 04:00 PST New York - --

A rash of attacks against lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people across the country - including the severe beating of a New York man whose attackers believed he was gay - suggests the number of reported assaults could rise in 2008, an advocacy group said.

The number of reported attacks against people who are lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgender increased 24 percent in 2007 over 2006, and they were expected to jump in 2008, said Sharon Stapel, executive director of the New York City Anti-Violence Project.

Officials are still compiling the 2008 figures, which will be released next spring, Stapel said.

The baseball bat beating of Ecuadoran immigrant Jose Sucuzhanay in New York last week was the latest in a number of reported assaults, said the project, which coordinates organizations that document violence against gay and HIV-positive people. The attack left Sucuzhanay, 31, brain dead.


http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/12/14/MNH214NK0L.DTL&feed=rss.gay

[NoPasaran]

31. Kennedy's invocation was given by Richard Cardinal Cushing

Cardinal Cushing was a member of the NAACP. He was also a strong advocate of the reforms of the Second Vatican Council.

[JohnnieGordon]

36. Cardinal Cushing was a member of the NAACP.

Just wanted to highlight that for the people reading outside.

[QC]

9. Are you trying to say there's something wrong with reaching out to the Grand Dragon?

That's not very pragmatic, post-partisan, or post-ideological of you!

[EFerrari]

23. LOL

:applause:

[QC]

25. Hey, I'm just trying to get with the program here.

Apparently my old-fashioned ideas--like equality and not letting corporations rule the universe--are holding back our brave new party.

[PVnRT]

10. Gosh, why do you gays have to freak out over stupid things?

It's far more important to cater to fundies than the left. Don't you know that?

[Unsane]

11. good lord what a ridiculous analogy

[hlthe2b]

17. Not to make light of the argument, but chances are he had members

or at least KKK proponents, as will Obama--among the RW invited members of Congress.... :shrug:

[musette_sf]

27. and to the Greatest with you!

K&R

[dsc]

38. thanks