Three major troubling issues for me re: Biden

[SHRED]

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His backing of the "Credit Card Bill", his support for the Iraq invasion, and his hawkish support for the bogus "war on drugs".

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/08/23/11114/

http://stopthedrugwar.org/speakeasy_main/2008/aug/25/biden_is_a_moderate_on_crime_iss


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[LostinVA]

1. The "Credit Card Bill" is a big one for me

It was so mean spirited.

And, I wish she was more than lukewarm on GLBT rights, although he is at least lukewarm, unlike a few others on the short list.

[LynneSin]

15. Sissy - you need to get to know the real Joe

People keep forgetting that he lives in a state that is controled by the credit card companies and the bulk of us here in Delaware are employeed by them. I truly believe that with a reformed healthcare program, something that Biden supports wholeheartedly, it would mute some of the worst in that credit card bill.

As for GBLT - he hasn't been the strongest voice in the fight for equality but he 110% on board. I think these 2 quotes he has made sums him up best. He's on the right team (which is the left team) for this issue:

http://www.ontheissues.org/2008/Joe_Biden_Civil_Rights.htm

Nobody asks if you're gay in a foxhole
I've been to Afghanistan, I've been to Iraq seven times, I've been in the Balkans, I've been in these foxholes with these kids, literally in bunkers with them. Let me tell you something, nobody asked anybody else whether they're gay in those foxholes. Our allies -- the British, the French, all our major allies -- gays openly serve. I don't know the last time an American soldier said to a backup from a Brit, "Hey, by the way, let me check. Are you gay? Are you straight?" This is ridiculous.
Source: 2007 Dem. debate at Saint Anselm College Jun 3, 2007

Civil unions ok; gay marriage is probably inevitable
Q: In November 2003, you were asked, "Do you believe gay marriage is inevitable?" And you responded, "I'm not sure. I think probably it is."
A: Well, I think it probably is because social mores change. But I don't think the government can dictate the definition of marriage to religious institutions. But government does have an obligation to guarantee that every individual is free of discrimination. And there's a distinction. I think government should not be able to dictate to religions the definition of marriage, but on a civil side, government has the obligation to strip away every vestige of discrimination as to what individuals are able to do in terms of their personal conduct.

So New Hampshire coming out in favor of civil unions is OK by you?

A: Yes. Yes, it is.

BTW: he opposed the constitional ban on same-sex marriage and voted yes to adding sexual orientation to hate crimes. He has a 78% rating for HRC which isn't perfect but according to that group he is lumped into '70%-100%: supports gay rights (approx. 177 members)'

You can count on Joe! He's one of us

[LostinVA]

18. I know, Sissie

That's why he was my number 2 pick after HRC for the nom.

[Cooley Hurd]

2. I think it's safe to say that he regrets all three...

[cali]

3. Joe Biden will not be President. Obama will be.

And Biden has plenty of positive attributes. And what's the alternative? Think about that for a moment. It is what it is, and it's a lot better than McCain/Whoever.

[Mass]

4. Nobody is perfect, but remember that he is pro-choice, pro-environmental, and his work on

many other issues. In balance,he is a lot better than anybody else that was suggested.

[opihimoimoi]

5. I find a lot more Troubling stuff on McPOW....but who is pickin on the nits?

McGigalo married $$$...is that a Success story as Pat Buchanan sez? No....he was going for the easy out....he is a gigalo

[graywarrior]

6. The bankruptcy bill

I have a problem with that. It had a direct effect on me. However, I am willing to get past it and work on getting it reversed.

[1corona4u]

7. Oh fer christ sake....

did you really need to post this? Has this not all been hashed, and rehashed here, on DU?

(where's that pot stirrer smilie when I need it...)This one will have to do...:spank:

[Frustratedlady]

8. We aren't electing Jesus...

Move on, please! This election is too important to keep knocking people down. Let's all get up and fight!

Go, Obama! Go, Joe!

[SHRED]

9. not trying to...

..."knock down".

I will be voting Obama/Biden and encourage everyone to do the same.

===

[Honeycombe8]

10. And what are the 3 main things you LIKE about your new VP? nt

[Honeycombe8]

11. CR card bill-inconsequential. Affects no one who pays their bills every mo. The

IW vote....he has said he regrets it. War on drugs....who cares about THAT right now?

What is GOOD about Biden is....he is a very strong supporter of environmental/alternative energy. Now THAT'S something that affects every person in the country. The country is at a crossroads when it comes to the environment and alternative energy. In some ways, we are already too late. In other ways, there is still a window to DO something meaningful and save the environment.

That is a MUCH bigger issue than credit cards. (I don't have a credit card balance, and never have. I've been dirt poor. Rule: If you can't pay cash for it...you can't frickin' afford it. Short on $$ for food? Clip coupons and buy cans of green beans on sale. Yep...that was how I avoided debt. Americans have gotten spoiled about getting what they want, the latest electronics, Ipods. Do you realize how many POOR people you see gabbing on cell phones in elevators and in their cars? Heck, I'm financially comfortable, and I only JUST got a cell phone this year! AND it's a pay-as-you-go not-to-be-used-except-for-emergencies.)

[Norrin Radd]

16. What if someone needed a medical procedure, but could only pay for it with credit cards?

It's not always as simple as you make it out to be. This is a good documentary on this subject:

In Debt We Trust
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=in+debt+we+trust&emb=0#

[Honeycombe8]

20. That is rare. But it doesn't matter if healthcare is charged or not...healthcare bills are

exempted from being included in bankruptcies.

That is the part of the bill that I objected to. One catastrophic illness could ruin a person's life, even if s/he is cured. Because s/he could never get out from under the huge debt.

The reality is, OTOH, that most care providers will negotiate, if someone really can't pay a, say, $100,000 medical bill. Most would rather get 50cents on the dollar than nothing. You can't squeeze blood from a turnip.

But even with the vote...I STILL love Biden because he is more than ONE vote. He has voted thousands of times over the years, and in recent years, has been steadfast in supporting some of the bills that some Dems have been too scared to support. Like strong environmental bills.

He's not running for President. He wasn't even chosen for his economical expertise. He was chosen for his foreign affairs knowledge and experience, and that will be his main focus as an advisor to Obama (as well as how to get things done in Washington).

It's like every single person any of us knows. There's something each of us has done that really ticks off others, and there are things we've done that others have really liked. To focus on ONE bad vote by Biden is not a true picture of who he is.

[blondeatlast]

12. Yes, but no one--NO ONE--in the Senate is as strong on worker's rights.

That credit card bill was a bad, but his actions in the Senate for labor are very pro-working class in that regard.

[sourmilk]

13. They troubled me initially, BUT:

The VP never USED to formulate and promulgate policy before Darth and Chimpy were selected. That used to be the Preseident's job, remember? There's no reason to believe that Biden would push Obama any further than Gore pushed Clinton back in "the good old days," is there?

[democrat2thecore]

14. And your point is? He's the Veep choice, so why bring this up now?

What can you possibly say now that hasn't already been said? The choice has been made - so why does it matter that these things "trouble" you? Are you saying they may keep you from supporting the ticket? John McCain and whoever he chooses would somehow be better?

Joe Biden has a 100% AFL-CIO rating for 2007 and an 85% lifetime rating. With your "Union Yes!" avatar - doesn't that count for something?

[No Elephants]

17. Right ater the Iraqi invasion, Democrats like Biden and Schumer made the point that the Resolution

had been very carefully worded and Bush violated their understanding. They were all over the Sunday talking heads shows with that message. The Resolution was a trap into which many Dems fell.

[Honeycombe8]

21. Well, yes. I love Biden. I didn't know he was one of the ones who said that. But I never fell for

But I never fell for that argument, did you? I mean, I knew what the resolution was for. And I'm no expert! So I figure if I knew, THEY must've known, and were looking for a reason to explain to their angry constituents.

Or....I also thought that maybe, just maybe, they were made certain promises behind the scenes, over and above the language in the resolution. And THAT'S what they were mad about...that they were lied to in some verbal non-binding promises. But WHO would've believed Bush at that point? Were they really that naive? I mean, I didn't trust Bush at that point. I could see quite plainly on TV how anxious he was to start bombing.

But no matter. Biden soon said he regretted that vote. And that's about all you can do about that, which is more than some others did.

He's going to be the VP, not the President. He will be a consultant, an advisor. But I don't think Obama is the type of person who would easily be led to war, or would easily let others make his decisions for him.

[IndianaJones]

19. I don't like his love for the RIAA and a desire to spy on internet users. nt.

[Honeycombe8]

23. What are you referring to? nt

[IndianaJones]

24. siding with the recording industry and supporting spying on peer to peer networks. nt.

[damonm]

22. 1st and 3rd bother me, BUT...

He gets a pass on the 2nd for calling it a mistake.
Moreover, his strength on Women's issues, labor and foreign policy overrides.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

25. the morans are already making the bumper stickers....

I just saw a thread in another site that asks if Osama/BinlaDEN is the ticket


http://forums.myspace.com/t/4136282.aspx?fuseaction=forums.viewthread



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