This slur against Mickey Kantor is complete bullshit

[featherman]

I'm a hard core Obama guy but this slur against Mickey Kantor is complete bullshit.

In the context shown and within the context of the film, it makes absolutely no sense that he was referring to "the voters or people of Indiana" as "shit". That's the heart of the slur... who the "they" were.

It should be simple common sense that he was referring to some (previously referenced off camera) enemies of the campaign (pollsters, state insiders, other side) that had averred something earlier like "Clinton can't possibly win Indiana" that was now being proven untrue by early results. This is a snippet of a continuing conversation between these guys with the previous part unfilmed.

Those are the people being referred to as "shit", likely shorthand for "full of shit".

[dbonds]

1. You might be right, but...

the audio is up for interpretation. I think we should debate this for a week on all the news channels.

[Cheap_Trick]

3. I think the media should be covering

Hillary's attempt at voter supression via robo-calls in NC. Much more important story.

[leftynyc]

7. Is there proof it came from her campaign? (n/t)

[leftofcool]

8. No, it comes from a group called Women's Voices

or something like that. They have both Clinton and Obama supporters on board

[leftynyc]

19. Well there is someone asshole upthread

asking why Hillary isn't being investigated for it. Morons everywhere today.

[dbonds]

9. I agree with you there.

But no issue will be allowed to paint Hillary in a bad light. My post was just a tongue in cheek parody of the controversies they contrived for Obama, then rehashed them todeath. There are real, issues to bring up against Hillary including her dirty campaign. These won't see the light of day any more than these sensational "I'm outraged' ones do. Only Obama gets the smear.

[KaptBunnyPants]

14. The media does not cover voter suppression.

Trivial crap is all you're going to get. At least now they are doing it to Clinton, it's been Obama's turn for over a month now.

[Hepburn]

10. Works for me....

...just like all the Clintonistas debated on how to interpret the words of Rev. Wright. Goose/gander argument here.

[DearAbby]

13. !!

[Leftist Agitator]

22. "I think we should debate this for a week on all the news channels."

Fuckin' A.

Turnabout is fair play.

[nichomachus]

23. Now let's see -- who would do a thing like that?

Something comes out that disses your candidate. You have evidence that debunks it. The other side takes a hit.

I seem to remember something about Dan Rather and his being fed phony documents about some candidate and those documents were later debunked. Can't remember who the candidate was.

Hmmmm -- now who was it ran that guy's campaign.

Oh year, Karl Rove. This kind of thing happens every time Karl Rove is in the neighborhood. This is pure Rove.

[dbonds]

25. You don't bring a knife to a gun fight.

If clinton plays by the rove book, then you can't be nice back. Yes we all want to be above it - I really really wish we were. But as long as some lowbrow is swinging at you, you can't have a debate.

[nichomachus]

27. I think you misunderstood me -- I think this came from the Hillary side

There isn't much difference between Rove and Carville

[dbonds]

30. While that is possible, I'm not sure they would think it would work...

Obama's so far tried to stay above the fray. He hasn't stepped in to push any of the issues that could have sank Hillary - including giving her a pass on sniper-gate. So if Hillary's camp put this out there hoping Obama would bite, then they are just throwing random things out because the historical Obama would not bite. But either way, I think it is time Obama or his supporters fight fire with fire. If you just stand there and take it you can say you didn't fight dirty, but you might end up dead. On edit: If there is a clean way to fight someone fighting dirty I'm all for that. But we must fight it. But I think the game is so rigged there is no clean way left.

[leftofcool]

2. the actual quote is" They must be shitting in the white House"

referring to Ross P's numbers

[mrreowwr_kittty]

6. I take Kantor at his word on that.

I mean, as far as I know, that's what he meant.

[dbonds]

11. Can't possibly be right.

He doesn't even say that's what it was.

You can clearly hear him say "They are shit", then 'excuse me', then inaudible. He says he was saying the pollsters were shit not the people of Indiana. So don't spin unless you get the official spin.

[featherman]

16. I believe you are correct... Kantor says "pollsters" now. It was Pennebacker

who claimed the other thing.

[Hissyspit]

4. He says "those people are shitting"

He's talking about the White House.

[tularetom]

5. It's tough when you get accused of something you didn't do - ask Rev. Wright

I've heard more whining out of this kantor guy in one day than I've heard from Wright in the past 3 months.

[Texas Hill Country]

12. thank you

[ShaneGR]

15. He actually says "Those people are shitting."

And he was talking about the White House.

[meow mix]

17. theres no ing and why was he whispering

try again sorry

[KSinTX]

18. Hey, featherman, I think Kantor's name on a presidential ballot somewhere

It must be, otherwise, why does anybody in a political context care what this guy said or didn't say? Or maybe I missed the scene where Hillary enters the room and says, "Damn straight, Mickey. They'll be the same ignorant Hoosiers when I run in 12 years too."

If we missed that nugget, what say I bring the tar, you bring the feathers (make 'em pretty, 'kay?). Otherwise, it's silly season stuff, isn't it?

[featherman]

24. In a strictly non-political context this has been unfair to Mickey Kantor as

a person who has a personal reputation to think of and a long history of public service.
He wasn't demeaning the people of Indiana IMO and I just didn't like the implication that he was.

[KSinTX]

26. You must have some history with the guy

and I like that you took the time to correct the record on his behalf. I am not overly familiar, although I may have heard of him in passing back when. So to that end, it's just not particularly relevant for me as far as getting this damn war off our backs and bringing our kids home safely.

[DearAbby]

28. !! Snarf

[sfam]

20. What's your point? Pretty much the entire nomination fight has been bullshit...

Why bother getting outraged now? Truly, I don't get it. For a couple months now, the Democratic party has looked like a bunch of petty, incompetent assholes. I don't see how this latest thing changes the trajectory.

Lets face it - the democratic party is the MSM's court jester at this point. The ongoing question is again whether or not we even have the slimmest of chances in November.

[rox63]

21. The Clinton people went berzerk over "bitter"

Which was also taken out of context. What's the difference?

[NatBurner]

29. this is true

[damntexdem]

31. Whether or not is is a smear, whether or not true, it is complete bullshit.

This is one issue where "get over it" is an appropriate response to anyone obsessing over it -- whether they think it a smear or factual.

[dcindian]

32. I agree it doesn't pass the smell test.

Kantor in my opinion is trash talking the white house. People are hearing what they want to hear, and this is not us (Obama supporters)

We can ignore this trash and be better then the Clinton hate machine.