Is it even possible for a gracious exit for Clinton at this point?

[Lerkfish]

(I posted this as a response in another thread)

I don't see how a scorched earth campaign like the one she's run has any room for a gracious exit.
The campaign has painted her into a corner: she's been so toxic in her condemnation of Obama, that if she turns around and wholeheartedly supports him, she runs the risk of looking hypocritical or disingenuous.

So, from the corner she's painted into, I can see her only being able to either say nothing, or continue to justify her previous attacks. If she's a good democrat and hopes to run again, I see her being completely silent.

However, the worst possible thing she could do would be to continue to snipe at Obama until the convention and afterwards. It might be more subtle, but I think she could still think its appropriate to do so. Since its the worst possible thing, judging from the rest of this campaign, I figure murphy's law dictates that's what she'll do.

Hope I'm wrong, though.

[BuyingThyme]

1. She wasn't even gracious coming in.

[StevieM]

2. Obama is the one who has run a scorched Earth campaign, tearing Hillary down

in the most personal of terms. His behavior has been disgraceful.

Steve

[Lerkfish]

8. okay, if that's how you feel, reverse the shoes: can any negative campaign

graciously exit the arena?

I'm saying I don't think so. I think extreme negative campaigns automatically restrict the ability to graciously exit.

[backscatter712]

10. Name the behaviors.

Name them.

It's so fucking typical of the Hillaryites - Hillary goes so low as to resort to smear after slander after lie after dirty trick, and now she's darkening Obama's face in her attack ads to make him like a stereotypical scary black man.

Hillary's the one that's going scorched earth and tearing this entire party down.

And then you switch to psychological projection - projecting your own candidate's sins on your opponent.

Guess what. We're not buying it.

[Lerkfish]

13. but I'm telling them that even if that were true, and Obama was doing what I say

Hillary is doing, is there any gracious exit?

I say no.

And that is why I say we have to stop running these sorts of campaigns, they hobble all democrats.

[TheWraith]

14. Bingo. They scream murder about "dirty campaigning," but can't name more than one or two tiny things

While their candidate wages probably the dirtiest campaign seen in national Democratic politics in almost 50 years.

[thoughtcrime1984]

38. Not buying it, not even close. nt

[Saturday]

3. Flamebaiter. n/t

[Lerkfish]

5. um. no, I'm bringing up a valid point.

strategically, I think her campaign has painted her into a corner on this issue.

You can disagree, but that's my honest assessment.

[CountAllVotes]

4. no

she cannot redeem herself. She is showing her true colors. I cannot stand her. If I vote for her, it will be a true effort. :puke:

:kick:

[thereismore]

6. Bitter aftertaste will linger for years. nt

[redqueen]

7. I don't see how. (nt)

[grantcart]

9. The ship Gracious Exit has left port several times but has come

back for a final exit tonight.

After tonight the ship "Pathetic Loser" takes over.

[Mme. Defarge]

11. I am reminded of

that great Doc Holladay line spoken by Val Kilmer in "Tombstone" -- "I have not yet begun to defile myself."

[TheWraith]

12. No, it's not. nt

[indimuse]

15. obama is finished..

can you say..REZKO?

[backscatter712]

21. Yawn. Rezko's yesterday's news.

[pampango]

16. Yes. If she wins Ohio by 7-10 points and Texas by 1-2, but does not cut into

Obama's pledged delegate lead. It will be obvious that she will enter the convention behind by more than 100 pledged delegates.

While there would still be the mathematical possibility that the sd's could overcome that pledged delegate lead, it would be both unlikely and probably a Pyhrric victory leaving a fractured party. Leaving "for the good of the party" after popular vote wins in Texas and Ohio would constitute a graceful exit in my book and might be more palatable to her than leaving after the 11 straight losses.

Among other things it would put her at the front of the list for 2012, if Obama doesn't win this year, whereas losing a brawl at the convention might not leave her in the same situation (like Kennedy in 1980 and Hart in 1984).

[DemocratSinceBirth]

22. Kennedy And Hart Were The Presumptive Favorites In 84 And 88

Ted Kennedy chose not to run in 84 because he decided he couldn't beat Reagan ; that the weight of Chappaquiddick was really too much...But the nomination was his... Gary Hart was on his way to winning the 88 nomination until his campaign imploded when it was discovered he spent a night with a woman in his Georgetown townhouse who was not his wife...If the affair wasn't discovered in real time he could have weathered it...

If HRC was to drop out after victories in OH, TX, and RI she should return the $35,000.000.00 she raised in February and pay her debts out of her own pocket...

[pampango]

25. I see your point about Hillary likely surviving a nomination fight at the convention

to be the front runner in 2012, if Obama loses in the GE. But we still lost the GE's in 1980 and 1984 after the convention battles even though the losing candidate emerged four years later to be a front runner. A convention battle, even if Hillary lost it, might not hurt her in 2012, but it would hurt the party this year.

Quite honestly I expect this to go to the convention and for it to be a raucous affair, though hopefully without hurting our electoral chances too much. I was only trying to come up with a "graceful exit" (not a realistic) scenario per the OP.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

26. I Am Trying To Put On My Non-Partisan Hat

This isn't a sporting event where the team with the most points at the end wins...It's a process that tempers the raw results with human intervention...

If HRC loses TX she's most likely done...But if she wins TX she most likely goes on to win WV, KY, PN, and PR...

They would be close in the delegate count and the Supers would be loathe to alienate the nearly half of the party that chose the losing horse... The Supers would force them to be a unity ticket for their endorsement, whether Obama and Clinton like it or not...

Hispanics have an emotional investment in Hillary's candidacy...African Americans have an emotional investment in Obama's candidacy... I don't see the Democratic party telling either constituency to take a leap...

[pampango]

29. A unity ticket is not very likely, IMHO, for many reasons, though it would be an elegant solution.

The biggest barrier would be the egos of both candidates who believe they should be number 1, not number 2. How do you convince one of them to be the VP?

Hillary might think this (and maybe 2012) is her best shot and she may have the popular vote. If she's the VP and Obama wins, she may not be viable in 2016 and if he loses, well I don't know how many losing VP's have come back to win the presidency.

Obama might not want the VP if he leads in the pledged delegate count and, perhaps, in the popular vote, even though he is younger and would still be viable, most likely, in 4 or 8 years.

Plus you have the reluctance of some to take the gamble of trying to break the race and gender barriers on the presidency and vice-presidency at the same time.

[Phillycat]

23. Hey, we still get to vote! (PA).

[greguganus]

17. The tazers have been charged just in case. n/t

[LizW]

28. Your misogynist fantasies have no place here. n/t

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

18. Gracious is a relative term.

She would be saving grace to exit at this point, or continue to humiliate herself by staying in.

[AnarchoFreeThinker]

19. is there a gracious mushroom cloud, 'cause it's gonna be Khan hitting the self-destruct button when

she leaves.

[LeftCoast]

20. Nice positive campaigning!

[Lerkfish]

27. I'm not working for any campaign

you?

I'm asking a legitimate question.

[rosetta627]

24. No, but I'll still welcome any exit.

I'm eager for her to meet her destiny as a footnote in history.

[Orsino]

30. Of course it is.

She can be as gracious as she wants to be. Just as Obama could be if the tables were turned.

It's still a little premature.

[Perry Logan]

31. You are not fit to lick Hillary Clinton's boots.

[damntexdem]

33. Thank goodness! They're likely toxic.

[Lerkfish]

36. wow. good example of what I'm talking about, though

so, on Tuesday, you say I'm not fit to lick her boots. How do you graciously, on thursday, say I'm a wonderful guy and you'd love to work with me?

do you see my point?

[frylock]

40. but you are

[damntexdem]

32. Oh yes! Any time she wants to withdraw, she can be declared gracious.

The earlier the graciouser -- and certainly the better.

;-)

[Medusa]

34. Given the fact that she and her entire family

Bill & Chelsea have demonstrated over and over again that they don't understand the meaning of the word, I'd say "HELL FUCKING NO" to the inquiry.

[snooper2]

35. "runs the risk of looking hypocritical or disingenuous"

That ship went out to sea a long time ago....

[AtomicKitten]

37. Too late; she has already rendered herself a pariah within the Democratic Party

in a karmic 'what goes around comes around' kind of way, as it should be.

:hi:

[Catherina]

39. Too late. There's nothing graceful about a hysterical woman

throwing the kitchen sink who says she's just getting warmed up.

[underpants]

41. No she has made a complete ass of herself