Obama's rezko friend. Please, you can't really want Obama in the Oval Office?!

[Captain_Nemo]

and don't get me started on the FBI Mole who is one of the witnesses in the case who "loged frequent visits to Rezko by Blagojevich and Obama."

this reeks.

http://i.abcnews.com/Blotter/story?id=4365942&page=1

"We have a sick political culture," said Jay Stewart, the executive director of the Chicago Better Government Association, "and that's the environment that Barack Obama came from."

Stewart says he does not understand why Obama has lectured others about corruption in Washington and Kenya but "been noticeably silent on the issue of corruption here in his home state, including at this point, mostly Democratic politicians."

There was no immediate comment from the Obama campaign.

The trial Monday involves federal charges of bribery and extortion against Tony Rezko, a real estate developer who became known in Illinois politics as a behind-the-scenes operator and fixer.

While Obama is not considered a target of the Rezko investigation, Stewart says it will shed light on a man who was pivotal to Obama's political career.

"This wasn't just some guy who wrote a check once for Barack Obama, it's someone who was an early supporter and had a personal relationship with Sen. Obama for quite some time," Stewart said.

Indeed, even after he was elected to the United States Senate, Obama involved Rezko in a land deal that enabled the senator to buy his current home on Chicago's South Side.

Obama has since called his decision to involve Rezko "a bone-headed mistake."

"Tony Rezko is all that is wrong with the old kind of politics or any kind of politics," said the Better Government Association's Stewart.

[tabatha]

1. The Clintons are also very dirty.

[Captain_Nemo]

2. Ok, this kills me from liberals! That was in the NINETIES!! and they proved NOTHING. This Obama

guy has not been properly vetted.
He:
Obama voted for Cheney's energy bill for god's sake!!
Obama has voted to find the war the entire time he has been in the senate.

Where are the liberals heads at?!

Hillary's work around the world for women and children is phenomenal!!

Where is your head?

I am a liberal and I don't trust him. What do you think the republicans are dishing up for our saintly Obama?

[barb162]

16. And why have a prez who made a self-admitted "bone-headed mistake"

on something as simple as buying a house. Can you imagine how he'd fuck up foreign policy or anything else semi-complicated if he can't buy a damn house without getting involved with deals with slumlords? I'm with you on the trust issue.

[Captain_Nemo]

38. His past affiliations are scary. His excuses are lame. He is no good.

[barb162]

69. And let's not forget about those evangelical type meetings he likes to hold

where his supporters chant in wonderment of the transfigured one.

[indimuse]

117. Bravo!

100% spot on!

[ElsewheresDaughter]

134. thank you!

[George II]

140. What's your option to Obama?

You seem to be on the attack (a lame one at that!) but provide NOTHING as an alternative!

[KLee]

23. Ok this kills me from liberals! This is NOW! and they proved nothing...This Obama

has not been found to have a dirty connection to him.

Where is the innocent until proven guilty?

OMG! So it's okay for you to excuse the Clintons in the 90's for something that was known, but yet condemn Barack for something that has not been proven?

[Captain_Nemo]

43. You're kind of missing the point. You want to put this guy up against repubs. HA HA

[George II]

144. What is the purpose of all these primaries, caucuses, debates??

It looks like in YOUR mind we should choose a candidate based on how the republicans will attack him personally? If that were the case we would NEVER have nominated Bill Clinton TWICE!

Personally, I want the candidate that will do the best job as president, not the one who will do the best job countering republican personal attacks.

You seem to have your priorities skewed.

[Name removed]

62. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Egnever]

74. lol now you are making shit up?

Obama didnt accept a thing from Auchi

[Tellurian]

96. So, you were there?... Tell us more..

[Tellurian]

72. It's never been that for Democrats..It's "guilty until proven innocent"..

The more you dig trying to prove Obama's innocence, the dirtier he gets.. and thats digging with a teaspoon..

Fitzgerald is using a backhoe!

The London Times strongly implies that Rezko got the money for Obama’s house from Nadhmi Auchi. (a new name to familarize yourself with)

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/us_elections/article3433485.ece

[tabatha]

95. They are facing a lawsuit right now in LA.

[sueragingroz]

135. Proof that "Obamatons" aren't really all that "liberal"

[LSK]

156. SO THEN WHY USE TRICKS ON OBAMA LIKE THE CLINTONS HAD TO GO THROUGH????

THERE WAS NOTHING THERE WITH WHITEWATER

THERE IS NOTHING THERE WITH REZKO

STOP IT NOW!

[barb162]

31. What did all those special prosecutors find? NOTHING!

Not a damned thing on Whitewater, not a damned thing on Vince Foster. Nothing.

[Captain_Nemo]

49. Thank you very much. Do you think the Dems are sabotaging us with this Obama?

[barb162]

73. I think certain Democrats are deluding themselves with this Obama run.

I wish they'd wake up already. I can tell you I'd never be chanting "yes you can" or chanting anything else at a meeting for him. This man, as you mention elsewhere, has not been property vetted; the press has been giving him a free ride (can we get a pillow for you" on SNL wasn't much off the mark).

[bellasgrams]

68. Oh of course, any time anything negative about BO is said

he or his cohorts whine and point their fingers at the Clintons.

[Andromeda]

108. You're just spreading bullshit

right-wing propaganda that has no basis in fact and was invented to smear the Clintons. Nothing was proven but the lies go on and on.

Only good sheeple for the anti-Hillary and Bill crowd repeat this crap.

The movement to impeach Bill Clinton was started BEFORE he was actually elected. Bill Clinton wasn't and isn't dirty---but his enemies are.

[rug]

146. "also". Bears repeating. Also.

[CyberPieHole]

148. "ALSO"??? At least you admit Obama is DIRTY...

but then we all know that.

[AtomicKitten]

3. Maybe he should have hooked with Clinton buddy, Norman Hsu.

[Captain_Nemo]

6. Again, Clinton's life is open. We know it all. Obama is secretive and has skeletons. This is trouble

[AtomicKitten]

8. Speaking of skeletons, I'd like to hear more about Hillary's "foreign policy experience."

Oh, and when is she going to release her tax returns?

[Captain_Nemo]

12. another low progressive blow - wow. She has been vetted by the SENATE ETHICS COMMITTEE

Why should she release her taxes so barack can point a spotlight at it and have the spotlight off his dirty record?

Barack belongs in jail alongside his buddies.

[AtomicKitten]

14. Barack released his. Why is she withholding hers? Hmmmmm?

Something to hide, perhaps?

[barb162]

39. She's not "withholding " it. She clearly stated she'd supply it

in the last debate. And if I were her I'd wait because the media will check everything line by line in hers and give St. Barak a free pass on his.

[Forkboy]

82. It's all the media's fault.

[Andromeda]

110. Yes, partly.

They are Obama's enablers.

[George II]

145. Yeah, she'll release here tax returns "some day"

We're 80% through the primaries, and now she's "thinking" of it?

[dionysus]

20. with statement you lost your credibility

[DearAbby]

30. How can you even say such a thing? n/t

[Captain_Nemo]

35. Becasue my fellow liberals have obviously cast a blind eye to this guy and the facts are out

that he has a shady background.

[Forkboy]

83. You actually know fellow liberals?

:rofl:

[DearAbby]

100. you have no facts

what you have are accusations. What of due process? You actually believe that he would be stupid enough to run for President if there were any basis to this claim?

You easily call someone a crook without proof or trial. A fellow Democrat.

[Omega3]

152. any basis? where did all his money come from? how did he get it? he was in the US Senate for 2 yrs

b/f running for POTUS. Don't tell me he's a good speaker, you don't get to where he is so quickly by being clean.

[neverforget]

71. Belongs in jail? He's been tried and convicted already? i must've

missed the trial! Was it at Gitmo?

[Forkboy]

81. LOL...another "progressive low blow" "this kills me from liberals"

Tell tellurian and wyldwolf we said hi.

[Andromeda]

111. Tell 'em yourself...

They send their love.:evilgrin:

[Forkboy]

130. They don't have any to spare from what I've read.

Tell them to keep it. In another week or so they'll need all the love they can get.

[emilyg]

19. Yep.

[tabasco]

29. Where are those tax returns?

Obama has made his public.

[malik flavors]

34. We know it all except she won't release her tax returns or white house papers. Vetted? I think not.

[bellasgrams]

75. If I was a candidate I wouldn't release tax papers until after the

the primaries, and before the GE. It's no one's business until then. A tax return isn't going to change anyone's mind.

[peace13]

60. Show me her tax return. n/t

[MonkeyFunk]

103. Give her the nomination and she will.

[peace13]

122. By then it will be too late if there is a problem with it.

Why is that so hard to understand?

[MonkeyFunk]

126. and do you understand

that no candidates have released their taxes in the past prior to securing the nomination?

This is some new standard being applied this year to Clinton alone. Edwards didn't release his taxes - where was the outrage?

I'll tell you - there was none, because it wasn't expected. Obama released his as a tool with which to attack Clinton. It's stupid to suddenly apply this new standard, and act as if it's traditional, normal and expected.

[peace13]

128. No, her opponent has raised the bar.

If she has nothing to hide why would she not comply. Bill's dealings could be a deal breaker for many conscientious Dems. Just saying.

[MonkeyFunk]

147. comply with what?

This entirely new, made-up requirement?

[peace13]

150. It's not a requirement but it is information that voters need

to make an informed decision. Like it or not there are questions.

[gateley]

89. We don't know it all about the Clintons.

If we did, Clinton would have never made it to the White House.

[blm]

142. Really? You know Clinton deep-sixed BCCI matters for Poppy Bush and Jackson Stephens?

And Dubai and Saudi royals - Bill has recently been lining his bank accounts by the MILLIONS from the same Dubai royals he protected.

[babylonsister]

78. Speaking of, US Democratic fundraiser FOR HILL Hsu pleads not guilty to fraud

US Democratic fundraiser Hsu pleads not guilty to fraud

http://wiredispatch.com/news/?id=64646

US Democratic fundraiser pleads not guilty to fraud

REUTERS
Reuters North American News Service

Feb 28, 2008 16:59 EST


NEW YORK (Reuters) - A Democratic fundraiser whose troubles prompted Hillary Clinton to return $850,000 in campaign contributions pleaded innocent Thursday to orchestrating a $60 million fraud and making illegal political donations.

Norman Hsu, 56, pleaded not guilty in federal court in Manhattan after he was indicted in December for mail fraud, wire fraud and violating the Federal Election Campaign Act.

The latest case follows similar charges that arose in California that prompted Democratic presidential candidate Clinton to return $850,000 in campaign contributions.

Hsu, a clothing entrepreneur, was sentenced in January in San Francisco to three years in prison for stealing about $1 million from investors.

In the New York case, prosecutors allege he swindled investors out of $20 million between 2000 and 2007 by getting them to invest $60 million in a Ponzi scheme and promising them high returns on short-term investments.

If convicted, he faces 20 years on each fraud charge and five years on each campaign finance charge. (Reporting by Christine Kearney, editing by Daniel Trotta and David Wiessler)

[FrenchieCat]

4. This was posted twice ......see page 2

as the threads are sinking low just like you do.

here--work with this!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=2856579

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=4306591

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=4473288

[Captain_Nemo]

5. Why is it low to read news and actually look closely at a candidate? Obama is bad news.

[barb162]

7. When people want to view a candidate as Mr Clean and he isn't

they try to stop those items that show he isn't clean.

[Captain_Nemo]

9. I am disgusted by my fellow progressives. They have stopped thinking. This mania for

a guy who has this type of background is not better than voting for a guy becasue you "want to have a beer with ihim."

And, look where that got us.
This is why Hillary is still in the race (thank god!!)

The thought of Barack in the Oval office is chilling.

[Kittycat]

17. Nemo, we haven't stopped thinking. We've thought long and hard.

And came to the conclusion that we reject Clinton and her Repuke politics. If she's the nominee, we'll vote for her - but it's looking more like you're the one that has about a week or two to fall in line, or find a new website.

[barb162]

27. Hillary HAS to win is what it comes down to. St .Barak is going

to get his ass handed to him by the GOP when they "vet" him. It's very important Hillary stays in the race to give Democrats an alternative from "he who walks on water" because the GOP will sink him fast when they start checking on his backroom deals.

[Forkboy]

84. You don't seem to like liberals and progressives much.

Tell the Hillaryis44 gang we all miss them.

[Adelante]

109. Are they gone?

[Forkboy]

131. No, just using sockpuppets because they are cowards.

Funny how many of the most obnoxious ones "disappeared" when Hillary starting sucking pond water, and yet others grew from the turds they left behind to carry on their same inane tripe.

[Adelante]

133. There are a lot of socks today

I started seeing them this morning. It seems like every weekend is especially bad. I think there is a training camp.

[Forkboy]

138. Idiot Certification Program

Personal Certification

For many people the questions they need to ask before considering a personal certification program are these.

1. Am I a Certifiable Idiot

2. Do others already see me as an idiot.

3. Do I have the skills to become a recognized idiot in my chosen field.

Corparate Ceritifcation

RentAnIdiot can provide customized training based on its massive collection of psychological profiles and with modifications and enhancements, we can create a customized training solution that promises a highly recognized industry idiot, but is uniquely based on your organizational objectives.

Certified Corporate Idiot can often be a more effective alternative to other testing options, and has the added advantage of meeting issues specific to your organization. The decision to bring a Certified Corporate Idiot in house is not just for larger organizations. Many smaller businesses can benefit from having a Certified Corporate Idiot. These certifications programs can be delivered on site or at a RentAnIdiot Training Facility.

http://rentanidiot.com/

[FrenchieCat]

21. Obviously, you haven't click on the links I provided......

figures. :eyes:

[Captain_Nemo]

51. I did. They are weak. Obama is new - not vetted and linked to auchi and rezko. Creepy.

[peace13]

64. For many Americans NEW is good. n/t

[bellasgrams]

76. New is not good when you're talking about someone 'new'

running the US only a middle school student would think that way.

[peace13]

121. Are you slamming a DU member?

Not allowed...sorry.

[AZ Criminal JD]

137. Hyper-sensitive aren't you? Not allowed...sorry.

[Drunken Irishman]

104. Vetted, vetted, vetted, vetted!

Mondale was vetted, where'd that get us?
Gore was vetted, where'd that get us?
Kerry was vetted, where'd that get us?

The only candidate who entered the general election without really being vetted was BILL CLINTON. Vetted is a bullshit buzz word used by Clinton and some of her supporters to scare people into supporting her failed, humiliating candidacy. Don't vote for Obama because he hasn't been vetted. Well shit, don't you think if there were some really nasty skeletons in Obama's closet, your Wonder Girl would've trotted them on out already? And don't give me this bullshit the Clintons are better than that, because they're not. If Obama fucking farted mustered gas, they'd leak it to the goddamn New York Post as proof he was a terrorist. So for all this bullshit, bogeyman living in Obama's closet nonsense, we've yet to see any evidence to suggest there is a nasty secret waiting to be exposed once he wins the nomination.

Take your pathetic, irrational fear-mongering and give it up already. You want to start linking Obama to asshats, well then you better be ready for a laundry list of people Clinton is linked to. And it won't mean a damn thing if those names have been released in the past, the Republican Machine will have no problem reminding the American people why Bill Clinton had huge credibility gaps with the American voters. But there is one difference, Bill was liked, Hillary isn't.

[Omega3]

153. all 3 were long time politicians, not a 2 year junior senator from Ill. give me a break

[woolldog]

10. I never thought Clinton supporters

would have the temerity to bring up the character argument against Obama in favor of the Clintons :eyes:

[Captain_Nemo]

13. Give me all your FACTS on Hillary. It is shocking you would put this obvious criminal

in the oval office and still try and trash Hillary Clinton.
Get the blinders off.

[emilyg]

22. They're mesmerized.

[Kittycat]

25. Obvious Criminal?

I'm sorry - can you please point to his convictions? Or at least where he has been named in a case? he hasn't - he is cleared, and not subject of what's going on here in my state. It's our Governor - which I'll note is going to fuck up a lot of good programs for kids, because the pukes don't want them here - now they'll have cause to roll them back. We can only hope that Obama gets in, and is able to push his ideas through the house - because that's likely the only chance we have now to save those programs.

But keep on keeping with your hate. You know there are more questions about the Clinton's than there ever will be over Obama. For starters, i want to see some tax returns, her calendar and I need some honest explanations on bill's pardon's, and HRCs campaign donations.

[Name removed]

52. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[woolldog]

28. lol

:spray: *love* the faux outrage....that can be very effective.

How about travelgate? filegate? Hsu? Donors to the Clinton presidential library? donors to the Clinton foundation? WJC's various affairs (which continue to this day)? failure to release tax returns? Is that enough to get you off your high horse?

I haven't seen anything other than presumed guilt by association and innuendo when it comes to Rezko. Rezko is sleezy; Obama knows Rezko and had some dealings with him; therefore Obama is sleezy and shouldn't be president. That's a weak argument to me.

[zulchzulu]

136. You even wrote that Obama is not involved in the Rezko investigation

As you may know, Patrick Fitzgerald has found Obama not having been involved in any wrongdoing. Get that...not having been involved in any wrongdoing. Repeat after me, not having been involved in any wrongdoing.

OK. We can discuss the Hsu connection, the Clinton outsourcing connections, Bill Clinton involved in uranium trading with former Soviet henchmen and various other matter if you want.

[BeatleBoot]

18. Exactly. In fact, I heard Rush Limbaugh say the same thing on the radio last Tuesday.

You must have been listening, too.

[KittyWampus]

11. Rezko?

[Johnny__Motown]

15. None of this will ever fly,. please look into it a little more

You can start here

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/1/29/171056/015/838/445627

[Captain_Nemo]

32. I rad that article. Plus ALL of the articles in the Sun-Times. This is bad news for Dems

[Johnny__Motown]

42. Did you read the Chicago Tribune's endorsement of him? Says no chance anything illegal was done by

Sen. Obama


I am paraphrasing the no chance thing... but the tone of the message was clear. I don't feel like researching it again just because you are grasping at a straw.

[Captain_Nemo]

44. HA HA. That's Funny. Read all of Novak's articles from the Sun -Times and then ask yourself this:

"Can I honestly say Obama is 100 % honest and will be an honest candidate that the repubs can't rip apart?"

[Johnny__Motown]

50. NOVAK,, omg You are believing the prince of darkness... sorry dude, try someone who isn't a traitor

[Captain_Nemo]

53. Traitor? Hmmmm. Auchi gave money to Rezko who gave money to Obama. Iraq $.

[Johnny__Motown]

56. wow, stretching a bit. You think we can't link Clinton to lots of people with 2 go betweens

[Name removed]

86. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Captain_Nemo]

151. Tim Novak. (Not Robert Novak.) I'm alerting your post for the insult and expletive

[DearAbby]

101. Jesus horatio keerist...............NOVAK??? n/t

[Name removed]

37. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Captain_Nemo]

41. Exactly, its creepy. an Iraqi billionaire who is persona non gratis in the USa is funding Rezko who

funds Obama.

Way to go!

[Double T]

24. obama is the product of Chicago politics; enough said!

[Political Heretic]

45. Thank you Cunningham.

[Double T]

58. WELL.............

he is.

[sandnsea]

26. Chatwal, Gupta, Giustra

no we do not know everything there is to know about the Clintons. Their tax returns are going to be a gold mine. The Rezko story has been investigated to death. There is no there there.

[bellasgrams]

88. I guess Rezko has been investigated, that' why he's been

indited. I'd like to know when BO changed from Atheist to Christian. I wonder if it was just before he decided to go into politics. Also his mother was a lot like his wife when it comes to the US. Michelle lied out of her gaff about her 'not proud'
statement, inspite of making $200,000 or $300,000 per year she didn't feel pride in the US because of her color until now. How many people can get jobs like that. Then there's his father, that he wasn't truthful about in his book. All this stuff will come out. It may not be important to some but it will to many.

[stillcool]

125. you make some very ugly...

and yet predictable accusations. I've read a litany of such crap being plastered all over the place for a long, long, time now. It's gotten very old, and tired. No truth, no facts, just blanket bullshit. Who's pulling your string?

[lastliberalintexas]

33. I really don't understand the vitriol

Clinton and Obama are much more alike than they are different, and yet you people act like we have Pol Pot running against Tony Benn. I just don't get it, or why some feel the need for such nasty threads.

[Captain_Nemo]

36. It's a factual thread exposing the hypocrisy in my liberal left party - casting a blind eye to Obama

[Binka]

54. Defend The Dem Candidate In The GE And I Will Donate To DU In Your Name

Game Nemo? Two other Hillary supporters have declined my offer why is that? Got a game face? Money for DU if you agree.

[lastliberalintexas]

59. I'll agree if you agree to donate to your local foodbank

I am not a Clinton supporter, either, but I had entertained thoughts of writing in someone in Nov just because the 2 remaining candidates are so much more conservative than I. I live in Texas, which will not be in play in Nov, so I felt I was safe making such a protest vote.

But the more I've defended each on DU lately, the less I've felt the need to do the write in. We could help feed a few homeless in the process. :)

[Binka]

123. I will work at the food bank two days a month as well as donate

Rock on!

[Forkboy]

87. Yeah, "your" liberal left party.

:rofl:

[Eurobabe]

85. Because they want McLame in the White House n/t

[bellasgrams]

93. because for a month we've been bombarded with BO supporters

nasty posts about Hillary, and yet all they can say about BO is that he makes them feel good.

[CatnHat]

40. The Obama crowd

close their eyes and ears. Obama acts more like Bush everyday. Obama and his supporters actually think the media or anyone can't criticize him. Well, this guy is no saint. He's secretive, vague, delusional, and egotistical, and has not been properly vetted.

The public has a right to know exactly what kind shaky politics Obama was involved in. If Obama supporters have no problem criticizing Clinton, Bush or whoever else with vengeance, why can't the Obama supporters admit that their candidate is truly a real poser.

It took Bush's supporters about 8 years to wake up, hasn't anyone learned their lesson yet? Like the old saying, you can tell alot about a man by the company he keeps. All the distancing and hiding away Obama does with his old manpals only makes him more suspect.

[Captain_Nemo]

47. Its a scary time for us Dems - our own kind are thinking like republicans.

[mtnsnake]

61. You nailed it but good, and you should post that as an OP.

Right on the money, CatnHat

[Forkboy]

90. Yeah snake, go along with the idiots quoting Novak.

You were never for Kucinich and you know it. Your act was fun for awhile, but now you've become another partisan clown. Too bad, you almost had a sense of humor.

[mtnsnake]

119. Here, I'll tell you something

Call me dirty names, call me anything you want, but don't you fucking dare ever tell me I wasn't for Kucinich. If I wasn't for Kucinich I wouldn't have posted these threads a long time ago. Lie about me all you want but dont ever lie about that one. What the fuck did I do to you to cause you to pull that shit?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=3795006

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=3696132

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=3241893

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=3906119

[Forkboy]

129. My apologies snake, I wasn't being fair.

Short fuse this week (ask my landlord). You didn't deserve that, and I apologize for it. Seeing people use and defend Novak though is crazy, and that's what makes me wonder about people. They say they're for something, but it seems their ideals go right out the window when they find something that pushes their agenda forward, in this case, seeing Hillary get elected. It's sad, and would be sad from either side.

However, my post was a low blow and unfair, and I offer my sincere apologies.

[mtnsnake]

132. Thank you, Forky

Hey we all have short fusees from time to time, but my feelings for Dennis Kucinich are sincere. They always have been. My father opened my eyes up to Dennis Kucinich years ago, and I've been a big fan of his ever since. It's just that I spend most of my time defending Hillary, so people automatically assume that she has been my number one favorite candidate all along, when I've consistently stated that Kucinich is. Trouble is, my posts about Kucinich are rare compared to how often I post on Hillary's behalf. Anyway, no problem my friend, and thank you for posting to me again.

[Captain_Nemo]

160. You're thinking of Robert Novak. It's Tim Novak who is the investigative reporter.

[Political Heretic]

46. Yawn. There's nothing there.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/1/29/171056/015/838/445627

[Captain_Nemo]

48. Daily Kos is crap. read Novak's Sun-times articles.

[Political Heretic]

55. I have. It's crap.

Myth #1: Obama did legal work for Rezko

Claim: Hillary Clinton during a debate denounced Obama for "representing your contributor, Rezko, in his slum landlord business in inner city Chicago."

The truth: According to Factcheck.org, "Obama was associated with a law firm that represented the community groups working with Rezko on several deals. There's no evidence that Obama spent much time on them, and he never represented Rezko directly. So it was wrong for Clinton to say he was ‘representing ... Rezko.’ That's untrue."

Myth #2: Obama knew Rezko was a slumlord

Claim: The Chicago Sun-Times reported that in 1997, Rezko’s company failed to turn the heat back on in one of his buildings, while giving $1,000 to Obama’s campaign fund.

The truth: There’s no evidence that Obama knew about problems with Rezko’s buildings. A state senator doesn’t deal with tenant complaints, and the Chicago newspapers never reported on Rezko’s problems as a landlord until after he was indicted. According to the Chicago Tribune, "in the years before 2005, Rezko enjoyed a reputation in Illinois as an up-and-coming, even enlightened entrepreneur with a strong interest in the risky low-income and affordable housing markets." http://www.chicagotribune.com/...

Myth #3: Obama underpaid for his house in a deal with Rezko

Claim: Chicago Tribune columnist John Kass wrote: "Rezko paid more than the asking price for the side lot, and Obama paid less than the asking price for the big house. It’s the Chicago way." Kass claimed that Rezko was "Obama's Real Estate Fairy" and this is "the story of the dream house the Obamas wanted and couldn't quite afford and how the Rezkos helped."

The truth: None of this is true. The seller decided to divide the lot in offering it for sale, not Obama or Rezko. Rezko had paid the list price for his lot, not an excessive amount (as the resale value later proved). The owner reportedly had already been offered $625,000 for the side lot, so Rezko didn’t offer any more money and there was no way Obama could have gotten a special deal this way. The only special arrangement Rezko provided was selling the two lots on the same day, which simplified matters for the seller. Obama paid $1.65 million for a house originally priced at $1.95 million. His was the higher of two bids for the main property. It’s not unusual at all in the Chicago real estate business to see a 15 percent price cut on an expensive house that’s been on the market for four months. Nor is it unusual that a vacant lot next door would sell to a condo developer without such a discount. In the Hyde Park market, there are a lot of upper-middle-class residents making six figures, but not very many millionaires (it’s not Lincoln Park or the Gold Coast). Therefore, a pricey mansion is very difficult to sell, while a $300,000 townhouse is very common.

Myth #4: Rezko’s lot was a front (yard) deal

Claim: One blogger declared it was "a $925,000 favor to a sitting US Senator" because "the Rezko property was never intended to be a separate piece of land."

The truth: It’s insane to think that Obama arranged for Rezko to buy the lot as his front yard, and never intended for anyone to develop it. If Obama had arranged such a deal, it would be crazy for him to spend $104,500 to buy part of the land from Rezko. There is not even the slightest evidence to support this notion.

Myth #5: Obama underpaid (or overpaid) for the slice of Rezko’s lot

Claim: John Kass declared: "Obama’s appraiser told him the fair market value of that slice was $40,500. Since that’s one-sixth of the Rezko side, it means Rezko paid $625,000 for property that was actually worth $243,000. That would make Rezko a complete fool. But he’s no fool." Fox News Channel incorrectly reported that Rezko "sold half that lot to Obama for 1/3 its original value."

The truth: The appraiser was clearly wrong (probably basing the low value on the fact that 1/6th of the lot was too small for any house, which would dramatically reduce its value standing alone). That’s why Obama decided to buy 1/6th of Rezko’s lot for 1/6th of what Rezko paid for it ($104,500). A year after the 10-foot-wide strip of land was sold to Obama, a Rezko business associate bought the rest of the lot for $575,000, resulting in a profit for the Rezkos of $54,000 from the two land sales. This sale proved that Obama paid fair market value for his portion of the land.

Myth #6: Obama hasn’t returned all the money linked to Rezko’s donations

Claim: The Chicago Sun-Times accused Obama of downplaying the $50,000–$60,000 in donations he received from Rezko (Rezko, before his legal troubles started, had cohosted a fundraiser for Obama). The newspaper claimed the actual amount was $168,000.

The truth: The Sun Times came up with that figure by counting every donation to Obama from anyone ever associated with Rezko, even if there was no evidence Rezko prompted the donation. Obama donated additional money to charity, but he’s under no obligation (legal or even moral) to return every dollar ever linked to Rezko. If you play a game of "six degrees of separation" with Rezko, he’s linked to almost every politician in Chicago.

Myth #7: Rezko had a special relationship with Obama

Claim: The Clinton campaign denounces "Sen. Obama's 17-year relationship with the indicted influence peddler."

The truth: Rezko attached himself to lots of politicians. Rezko donated money to every major Democratic politician in Illinois, then helped organize a $3.5 million fundraiser for President George W. Bush in 2003. After giving large campaign donations to Democratic Illinois governor Rod Blagojevich, Rezko arranged to have his buddies appointed by Blagojevich to state boards such as the Teachers’ Retirement System Board and the Illinois Health Facilities Planning Board. With his friend Stuart Levine, Rezko threatened to hold up a $220 million deal to invest teachers’ pension fund money unless $2 million was paid to Levine or $1.5 million was donated to Blagojevich’s campaign. Rezko and Levine also demanded a $1 million cut from a developer to build a hospital. Rezko was indicted for pretending to sell his Papa John’s pizza restaurants while secretly maintaining control of them, and fraudulently using the transaction to get $10 million in loans. It is Blagojevich, not Obama, who did favors for Rezko. Rezko’s eye for scouting political talent was amazing, but he did not capitalize on Obama’s influence. Obama said he had known Rezko for twenty years and "he had never asked me for anything. I’ve never done any favors for him."

Myth #8: Obama did favors for Rezko

Claim: Chicago Sun-Times revealed that in 1998, Obama wrote a letter endorsing a low-income housing development for which Rezko was a codeveloper. As the Sun-Times put it, "NOT A FAVOR? As a state senator, he went to bat for now-indicted developer’s deal." Chicago Tribune columnist John Kass wrote, "No favors? When you transcend politics and walk on water, I guess it all depends on what your definition of favor is."

The truth: The common definition of a favor in this context is a political action done in exchange for donations. Rezko’s lawyer reported that Rezko had not asked Obama to write the letter. Instead, Obama (along with a local state representative and an alderman) endorsed the project because it had widespread community support. It’s difficult to imagine any politician on the south side of Chicago who wouldn’t have a routine letter written to endorse government funding for affordable housing and social services for low-income senior citizens in that area. When it came to political influence, Obama didn’t do any favors for Rezko. The Chicago Tribune reported, "when Rezko pushed for passage in Springfield of a major gambling measure, Obama vocally opposed it."

Myth #9: Obama should have known about Rezko’s sleazy background

Claim: The Chicago Tribune, although endorsing Obama, wrote: "His assertion in network TV interviews last week that nobody had indications Rezko was engaging in wrongdoing strains credulity: Tribune stories linked Rezko to questionable fundraising for Gov. Rod Blagojevich in 2004."

The truth: At the time Obama bought his house, there was no public indication of Rezko’s problems. When Obama bought a small strip of Rezko’s land in 2006, rumors were swirling around Chicago that the federal government was investigating Rezko, but he wasn’t indicted until October 2006. The Tribune stories before 2006 reveal that Rezko was a tightly connected political player, but the evidence of criminal misconduct wasn’t proven.

Myth #10: Obama hasn’t been forthcoming about his mistakes with Rezko

Claim: The Chicago Tribune editorialized, "Obama has been too self-exculpatory."

The truth: Obama has been honest about the mistake he made, and the fact that Rezko was trying to buy future influence with him. Obama declared, "I am the first one to acknowledge that it was a boneheaded move for me to purchase this 10-foot strip from Rezko, given that he was already under a cloud of concern. I will also acknowledge that from his perspective, he no doubt believed that by buying the piece of property next to me that he would, if not be doing me a favor, it would help strengthen our relationship." Obama’s mistake was in allowing the appearance of impropriety. He never actually did anything wrong. And that’s the key issue here.

Despite all of these rumors about Obama and Rezko, none of the evidence indicates any actual wrongdoing. Conservative Republican Tom Bevan called the evidence against Obama "pretty darn weak." Conor Clarke of the New Republic reported that Obama’s real estate deal with Rezko was a "nonscandal." According to Clarke, "journalists have followed the smoke and haven’t found the fire. At that point, accusing someone of something that looks wrong stops making sense."

[ExtraGriz]

63. dailykos is indeed crap n/t

[Forkboy]

91. KOS is crap but we should read Novak?

Fuckin' idiot.

[peace13]

57. Don't know if you are a Hillary person or not....

but if you are then you are responsible for what has happened. Hillary and others were happy to thin the field when she had a perceived advantage. Hey, my original pick was weeded out first so I understand your pain. Get over it and help make this country a better place. If by some chance you are not a Hillary person then I am speechless and apologize. Peace, Kim Hussein

[ExtraGriz]

65. rezko's wife sold obama 10 feet of land

on the 2nd property that she owned, which made that piece of land worthless because you cant build anything on it...but it sure gave obama quite a nice yard on that 2nd lot for next to nothing.

[Adelante]

113. Obama paid one sixth of the purchase price for one sixth of the lot

next to his house. It wasn't a gift or even a discount.

[Omega3]

154. and the property was in Rezko's wife's name so Mr. Rezko's creditors couldn't get at it, this is

money Rezko most likely borrowed from Auchi(sp?) , the Iraqi millionare business man on the outs with the US Gov't.

[RememberWellstone]

66. Character does not matter

according to the stepford Obamanites kids..they do not care if this guy was a mafia hitman.

[Dogmudgeon]

67. Most of this is crap

Guilt by association has to be proven; otherwise, nearly all of us would be considered "tainted". The same bullshit that the Clintons have been attacked with is now starting with Barack Obama. It happens to every Democrat -- Carter, LBJ, Kennedy, Truman, FDR, all were attacked for being "dirty" for simply knowing people. It also happened to the more illustrious "losers", like Stevenson, Gardner, Humphrey, McGovern, and Gore. Only 'Publicans are exempt -- people expect it from them.

Investigating politicians for criminal connections is perfectly kosher. We should all support the practice, and demand it if it's not being done. But the problem is that people automatically assume guilt where there usually is none. It's fashionably cynical, it's an easy cop-out, and it involves neither investigation nor refutation.

Politics is too important to leave to our depressive fantasies. We ought to demand definitive investigation of all suspect information -- and observe the legal maxim "innocent until proven guilty". Otherwise, we might as well just have a king.

--p!

[mrbluto]

70. Rezko, Whitewater, NAFTA, Etcetera, etcetera...

This sort of fighting and back and forth is why you might want to read about http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4829034&mesg_id=4829034">The Three-Arm Baby

[CatnHat]

94. That's a take on

a Biblical story. (My version is kinda sketchy)

Their are two mothers who happen to claim the same baby as their own.
They are standing up to the king both asserting that they are the mother of the baby.
So to solve the dilemma, the king summons the guard to take his sword and cut the baby in half.
As the guard is ready to cut the baby in half;
The "real" mother steps up and falls on the baby; ready to give up her life to save her baby
After seeing this, the king then stops the guard from killing the baby.

In a way, Hillary and Obama have claimed the same baby.
Who will actually protect the baby from the sword.

I'll put my confidence in Hillary Clinton. She has been a true public servant of the people; and will initiate policies that will benefit working men and woman, children, and healthcare. (She also has great foreign policy experience) What better reason is there.

[jgraz]

77. Your concern is noted.

[Forkboy]

92. This bozo isn't even good at this shit.

But hey, I learned KOS is crap but Novak is worth reading! You learn something new everyday.

[Tom Joad]

79. who would want anyone in the oval office? i would rather it be made into

something useful. and the pentagon converted to a hospital and schools.

[gateley]

80. Your comment about the Clintons' crap not being proven --

You really have no idea the depth and breadth of vile, smarmy and ILLEGAL enterprises and actions Bill Clinton was up to his ears in.

And no, no links. I'm not going to go to the effort to PROVE what I'm saying. If you're interested, you can research them. If you don't believe me and think I'm full of shit, that's fine. Think what you want.

But knowing what I know about the Clintons -- this is NOTHING in comparison. And for the record, I don't like it at all and I do think it reflects poorly on Obama. Leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

But between the two, I'm opting for Obama.

[CatnHat]

98. That the point

both Clinton's have been vetted fully, there is next to nothing on Obama. That's what this thread is about. So you're a Clinton hater, yeah, real good reason to vote for Obama.

Let the press dig into Obama's past, that's part of the political process, guess what--can't make up "new" rules for Obama and his supporters. This guy hasn't proven anything, we, as voters have every right to know what motivates him; other than his love for himself.

[gateley]

106. How dare you presume to know who I am or what I feel.

I personally don't care what they dig up on Obama, as I don't have a vested interest in him.

The person I most wholeheartedly believe in is not in the running. I will vote for the nominee.

I've never liked Bill Clinton since my best friend lived in Arkansas when he was the Governor, but I voted for him because he was the Democratic nominee.

So what the fuck is your problem?

[bellasgrams]

99. gateley, I would expect nothing less of you than to vote for BO.

You don't seem to know the difference between good and bad. Clinton=GOOD, BO=BAD.

[gateley]

105. And you know me so well, don't you, bellasgrams.

EDIT to add - but thanks for spelling my name right -- really! :hi:

[stillcool]

97. Yes!

[cali]

102. Hill and Bill's politial friendships with corrupt slime are far more

pronounced than Obama's. Far more. Chew on that fact. Gupta, Giustra, Rich, Stevens, Hsu, Paul and many more.

You can't possibly want that shit back in the White House.

Desperate Hillbots are almost done here. Can't wait until they STFU.

[gateley]

107. "Can't wait until the STFU."

Oh, God. Especially the new ones with the hidden profiles.

[JTFrog]

112. I wouldn't call most of them "new". Maybe "reincarnated". n/t

[gateley]

118. "Risen from the dead" as it were..... :-) nt

[Adelante]

114. And yet ... from the same article

"That's a noble version he is describing. He is not talking about Illinois when he does that," said Stewart, who acknowledges Obama was "a cut above" most state legislators and reliably supported ethics legislation.

[The Backlash Cometh]

115. This is my nightmare.

Obama will change nothing if he is beholding to corrupt Democratic politicians.

[dcindian]

116. Let's see if I get this straight

unproven allegations count if they are against Obama.......unproven allegations don't count if they are against Hillary.

Suggestions of wrong doing count when they are made against Obama....... Suggestions of wrong doing don't count when they are made against Hillary.

If a state votes for Obama it doesn't count....... If a state votes for Hillary it does count.


I think I now know why Hillary supporters are so extreme in their views. They think just like her.

[sendero]

120. If everyone who had questionable friends..

.. were ineligible, HRC would be eliminated as well as about 90% of all presidential candidates over the last 20 years.

[IsItJustMe]

124. Every politician I ever knew seem to have a Rezko somewhere around. You are beating a dead horse.

[Vinca]

127. Why won't Hillary release her tax returns?

Maybe we'll find out money is being run through the Caymans to avoid U.S. taxes (the Burkle affair) or not all the uranium mining money went to the foundation or Bill actually does rake in a half mil a day in speaking fees (talk is not cheap). What's she hiding?

[Omega3]

157. dream it all up, you sound like a Repuke. It is NOT NORMAL for a politician to realease their tax

returns b/f getting the nomination, there just isn't.

this is just his attempt at a wedge issue and the Obamabots are following like lemmings off a cliff.

[LizW]

159. Snappy comeback.

Be sure and try it after Hillary drops out and the Repugs are savaging Democratic nominee Obama. It should work great. I'm sure they'll shut right up.

[George II]

139. This is trash posting - no need for this - can't you say anything positive about YOUR candidate???

[RBInMaine]

141. Are you really buying this corporate media biased propaganda?

This Rezco thing has been vetted, and NOTHING has been found in terms of anything illegal on the part of Obama. ALL politicians have regular donors, and as I understand it Rezco donated to Bill Clinton (and MANY other Dem candidates). Once it was found there may have been actual illegal actions on the part of Rezco, all campaign money Obama with any possible connection to Rezco was given to charity.
Hillary and dirty money? You gotta be kidding me. Remember Norman Hsu and her connection to him? Remember her sitting on the board of the anti-union pro-sweatshop slave-wages Walmart Corporation? How many fat cat clients did she work for as a member of the Rose Law Firm? Let's just drudge up travelgate and Whitewater again before the R's do. Let's talk MOSTLY about how she currently GLADLY takes pots of money from corporate PACS (especially insurance corporations, prescription drug companies, etc.) and lobbyists and goes so far as to DEFEND this awful and corrupt practice. GIVE ME A BREAK !

[Caro]

143. The question I have about that house ...

... purchase is why would the Rezkos buy a PART of a lot? Their portion is so small they can't build on it. What could they possibly have gotten from that deal?

Carolyn Kay
MakeThemAccountable.com

[Freida5]

149. It was more than a "bone-headed mistake", it was an ethics violation.

[LSK]

155. Pivotal?????

:rofl:

[ProSense]

158. Rezko's trial has nothing to do with Obama, but if you're interested in potential scandal,

read this.