I will not under any circumstances support a candidate that isn't against all torture.

[rhett o rick]

Torture is abhorrent and not something to rationalize as situational. Torture isn't a method of interrogation, it is strictly to terrorize. Only terrorist use torture. Please spare me the stupid rationalization about the ticking time bomb. I can not believe that a progressive would ever buy that bullshit. Only sick twisted individuals would perform torture and only stupid individuals would rationalize supporting it. This is not a nation that tortures. If you think you want to live in a nation that tortures then move to Russia or Syria and get out of my nation.

If the Democratic candidate either supports torture or doesn't have the guts to say they don't, then i will not vote for them in the general. If the country is going to be a torture country then let it do so under a republican president.

[Mme. Defarge]

1. I'm with you 100%!

K&R.

[rhett o rick]

2. Thanks but it looks like you may be the only one. nm

[robinlynne]

18. oh no. There are millions of us. Give us a minute to find the Op and k&r it.

[rhett o rick]

22. Thanks, some times frustration takes over. nm

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

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[rhett o rick]

7. And exactly how do you assure that only terrorists are getting dunked? You trust BushCorp??

You aren't a progressive are you?? You believe that anyone that is arrested is guilty. And that the republicans only speak the truth? Right?

[TheWatcher]

19. Rick, Take A Deep breath

And back away slowly from that one.

It has been brainwashed beyond the point of redemption, and you know that.

It does not have the mental capacity to use reason, and logic, as we do.

You can't save people like that.

[Mme. Defarge]

9. How do you know

if someone is a terrorist? If they admit it under torture?

[rhett o rick]

13. In the USA we don't torture. That's what distinguishes us from the terrorists.

If you support torture, you ain't one of us. Anyone with half a brain (leaves out repukes) knows that torture doesn't yield good information. It is only used by the sick and demented that think it makes look tough, which is important to someone that aint a real man. It just makes them look like the sick they are. If you think that the sick individuals only torture the guilty terrorists you must be simple minded. They round up a group and torture all to see who is guilty. And that is ok with you because it aint you. repukes support torture, they are ignorant simpletons.

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

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[rhett o rick]

25. Deleted by edit. Dup. nm

[rhett o rick]

27. Of course torture works.

As a form of terrorism. That's the only thing it's good for. Oh yeah and to give some weirdo's their jollies.

Interesting that you'd like to "dunking 'em just on principle", is this Shaun Hannity?? Curious, just how would you pick out the 'em that you'd dunk?

And for keeping hope alive, you bet i do. I hope that someday the gullibles that watch Faux News get a brain.

I hope that the monitors let you stay.

[The Magistrate]

28. You Make An Excellent Point, Sir

You are quite correct about the true reason for the utilizatio of torture against prisoners in a conflict. "Information" is claimed as a motive because people can be got to agree, rightly or wrongly, that the need for certain information can outweigh the shock to the conscience of the action. But the real reason is to make people fear to be taken by your forces, and so to fear acting against your forces, as this might well lead to capture and torture. Even by the standards of peeple ruthless enough to embrave this motive honestly, we are botching the job badly, because while this policy can be made to work, making it work requires precision in arrests, to a degree that people can feel they are themselves safe if they do not act against the torturer's forces. Our arrests in Iraq and elsewhere have been so poorly conducted that people have no reason to feel not acting against us will make them safe, or that acting against us will put them at much greater risk than just going peaceably about their personal business does already. That is the worst of both worlds, and the best breeding ground for recruitment to resistance that can be contrived.

[rhett o rick]

30. Thank you and I do apologize for post #4 and I understand why it got deleted.

I did go overboard. Felt good,but I apologize. But why was his posts deleted. He was an obvious freep but they can be fun. I love to read their half-assed posts.

In my defense I am very passionate about torture. This country does lots of things wrong but torture is not in the least acceptable.

Edited for spelling

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

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[rhett o rick]

21. Very good post but do disagree with one part.

"you'd rather fight and die for any lie that appeals to your diseased sense of logic, than see any real truth."

Most of "them" are actually cowards. Look at their leaders. None ever fought for anything. They want others to do their fighting.

[Elidor]

6. That is some sig-worthy material right there.

"First thank you for responding. And now I think you are full of shit."

:rofl:

I love it! :thumbsup:

[rhett o rick]

8. Well you ain't the only hard head. nm

[Gregorian]

16. It's important to find out why there is terrorism. Terrorism is a symptom.

Not only does torture accomplish nothing, but it doesn't solve the problem of why there is terrorism.

See American foreign policy, for almost all of the answers. People don't go out of their way to terrorize. There is always a reason. Torture does not address those reasons. It only creates more terrorism.

Personally I believe the word terrorism should be eliminated from the language. It ignores responsibility. It focuses completely on only half of the problem. And the symptom, at that.

Terrorism is a symptom. You don't treat the symptom. You treat the patient.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

26. Well then...

I am sure you will have no problem when it is our soldiers being tortured by an enemy army. :shrug: After all, if it accepted US policy then other governments can also use it without fear of violating the Geneva Conventions, right?.

So, when we see pics of a US infantryman standing on a wooden box with electrodes clipped to his dick, I don't want to hear a peep of protest out of you. Mr. Man!

[ClarkUSA]

10. I agree.

Anything else just won't do. :thumbsup:

[AtomicKitten]

11. I adamantly agree.

"When I'm the Democratic nominee I will offer a clear choice. My opponent won't be able to say I ever supported the war in Iraq, because I haven't. He won't be able to say that I don't support a clear timetable to bring our troops home, because I support such a timetable. He won't be able to say that I voted to use our troops in Iraq to counter Iran, or that I supported the Bush-Cheney diplomacy of not talking to leaders we don't like, and he won't be able to say that I wavered on something as fundamental as whether or not it's okay for America to torture, because it's never okay." * Barack Obama

[rhett o rick]

14. Good for Sen Obama. Do you know what Edwards stance is on torture?

I know that Sen Clinton is triangulating on the issue.

[AtomicKitten]

15. I do.

"Torture is morally wrong, it is illegal, it is ineffective, it endangers our own troops and citizens, and it plays into the hands of our enemies. My administration will uphold and protect the law rather than trampling over it." * John Edwards

[saracat]

17. Edwards is right on as well! Edwards and Obama get it on torture.

[rhett o rick]

24. To me torture is the definitive issue in this campaign. It may not be the most

important but, as I have stated, I will not vote in either primary or general for a candidate that hasn't spoken out against torture. It looks like this may be an important issue to you also. Might I avail myself of your research once more? Do you have a quote from DK re. torture? Thanks so much for what you have provided to this point.

[JohnLocke]

29. More links for you

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDew97r1gAk - John Edwards at the CNN debate
John Edwards at the CNN debate says that when he's President, no torture will be tolerated, we will end racial profiling, and illegal spying on Americans, and close Guantanamo.

http://johnedwards.com/news/press-releases/20071005-torture-memos/ - Edwards Statement on Justice Department Torture Memos

"George Bush has a long record of trampling on the Constitution and failing to be straight with the American people. Yesterday we learned that -- even after the Justice Department abandoned its defense of torture -- it continued to write memos endorsing the harshest interrogation techniques ever used by the CIA. Today, the president asserted that `we don't torture.' Pardon me, but I have my doubts that George Bush is finally being straight with us."

http://johnedwards.com/issues/civil-liberties/ - Protecting The Constitution And Respecting Our Freedoms
"We are not the country of Abu Ghraib or Guantanamo. We are not the country of secret surveillance and government behind closed doors. We are Americans, and we're better than that." -- John Edwards

As president, I will work to restore America's moral authority in the world by upholding the rule of law and safeguarding our civil liberties. I reject the Bush Administration's twisted logic justifying torture, release the legal opinions justifying it, and end the abuse of classification and legal privilege to hide un-American legal judgments. Saying no to torture will protect our troops and our values by upholding the Geneva Conventions anywhere American security forces, military or civilian, are engaged.

Say No to Torture - The Bush-Cheney Administration has undermined our standing in the world and endangered our own troops by sanctioning the use of interrogation techniques long considered torture. Edwards will protect our troops and our values by upholding the Geneva Conventions anywhere American security forces—military or civilian—are engaged. He will issue an executive order setting clear guidelines for interrogations and prohibiting torture. He will also ban the shameful practice of outsourcing torture to other countries through "extraordinary rendition."

[Mme. Defarge]

12. Kick!