Why aren't hip hop/rap artists taken to same level of outrage as Imus?

[zulchzulu]

What's incredible to me about Imus' unfortunate comments and the outrage by the Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson and others is that there doesn't seem to be the same level of outrage to those organizations and record companies that support and allow rap and hip hop artists (and other music artists) to say the exact same type of demeaning language and worse.

Is it OK for misogenous or racist commentary to be digested by the masses and get a free pass via music yet given a special standard for people like Imus, who pretty much talks in Republicanese racist homophobic Bushbot dialect all the time.

While Imus made an ass of himself (again) and apparently apologized for what I feel is second nature commentary by him, I don't think it even compares even to people like Michael Savage or Rush Limbaugh either. That's another story...

The solution is not to take away free speech but, if there is to be some consistency to the outrage, certainly there should be a huge protest crowd outside the Warner Brothers or RIAA's headquarters for their sponsorship of hateful, misogenous messages for profit.

Double standards suck.

[DubiousLee]

1. I can at least say that the outrage here is mostly a load of crap. eom.

[ThomCat]

9. Really? How so?

:shrug:

[Bluzmann57]

2. Good question

Racism is wrong. Period. Be it by Imus or Sharpton or anyone else, it's just plain wrong and ugly. There is no doubt in my mind that whwen Sharpton gets Imus on his show later on that there will be any fairness at all, since Sharpton is an asshole too. Imus has apologized. Whether it was sincere or not, I guess we will never really know. But I know for sure that Sharpton never ever apologized for the Tawana Brawley affair.

[Mike Daniels]

17. Until Sharpton apologizes to everyone he slandered and accused re: Brawley

I have no use for the self-promoting jackass.

There have to be better spokespeople out there than Sharpton.

[arcos]

3. ...

:popcorn:

[vi5]

4. I'm not excusing it, as I'm not a rap fan or anything...

...but music and the music industry is entertainment. It can be chalked up to fiction, etc. Imus for god knows what reason has been accepted as a news personality who discusses politics and has politicians on his show who engage him in conversation regarding supposedly important topics. That's why I draw the distinction personally. I'm not even saying Imus should lose his job. I don't believe in that type of reaction. But I think all politicians who consider themselves in any way democratic or progressive should not appear on his show. And if they do, they should hear about it. And as for why not the same level of outrage at Savage and Limbaugh, etc. is that Imus is somehow regarded as different from them (hence why he gets democratic and liberal politicians to appear on his show). I definitely think this distinction is ridiculous since he's just as bad as those others. Which is why I get irritated when people who are supposed to be liberal watch his show and feel the need to updated us all on here as to what dreck he is spewing.

[NormanYorkstein]

5. because it's not cool to complain about music

You might raise the hackles of the anti-PMRC faction, since putting a parental advisory sticker on an album full of sexist, homophobic, racist filth might hurt record company profits. Er I mean violate free speech.

[RaleighNCDUer]

6. You must be kidding.

A parental advisory does not hurt profits - it guarantees sales.

[NormanYorkstein]

8. sort of but not necessarily

The fear was that if there was a parental advisory sticker then stores might restrict those albums to those over 18, like they do for movie tickets, pornography, etc. But the industry squashed that proposal.

But yeah, putting on a sticker and selling racist, homophobic and sexist music to teenagers is a sure way to make profits - hell think about the market for porn if they could sell it to 15 year old boys.

[divineorder]

38. Label Stickers Don't Matter with Downloadable Music

Itunes may mark something as explicit-but as far as I know, that's it. And of course file-sharing doesn't care about age. But the fear was overblown in any event. More racist kids are made by racist parents than anything else, and the kids most fear are made by abuse and neglect. All of that stuff occurs long before the entertainment industry can get hold to them.

"With great power comes great responsibility". No rapper has the access to moderate Americans that an Imus does. People who don't like rap music aren't going to listen to anything they say-especially older people. But Imus is considered an authority figure who has the ear of powerful people and who those people believe is a conduit to popular opinion. These leaders believe that Imus is channeling popular sentiment.

[FredScuttle]

7. When Holy Joe and Howard Fineman guest on the next RZA album, then we'll talk

Until then...:wtf:

[flpoljunkie]

24. Great point, Fred!

[Torgo Johnson]

10. Why aren't rock musicians taken to same level of outrage as Imus?

Oh, I'm sorry, I guess we all know that male rock musicians have never used demeaning language and misogyny in rock music. :eyes:

Double standards suck.

[Laughing Mirror]

11. Sharpton has been constantly hammering on this for years

These are just three samples, although loads can be dug out of old articles.

A few years ago he said "I went to a hip-hop conference in New York, and one of the main topics of discussion was a fight for the right to use bitch and ho in lyrics . . . With all the stuff going on in this world, all they’re worried about is being able to call a woman out of her name?! That’s their cause?"

He told students at a student rally to out the vote in 2004: "Achieving against the odds, begins with realizing black people are not "hoes, bitches and niggas" and by choosing not to celebrate ignorance.

A protégé of the late James Brown, Sharpton said that Brown "was also disappointed that a lot of the artists had lowered their standards. He didn't like the profanity, calling people niggers in records and calling women whores and bitches."

I do not know about the others, but Sharpton has been a constant vocal critic of the Hip Hop community and its language and morals.

[zulchzulu]

12. I know James Brown was disappointed...

I'm not sure if Sharpton gets a pass for saying things about the issue but not taking it up a lot more often. Perhaps this recent issue can get him back into discussing that issue as well.

[Laughing Mirror]

13. He talks about it all the time

It is one of his pet peeves. You just haven't been listening.

[zulchzulu]

19. Granted, I don't listen to all of Sharpton

If he's fighting to bring those responsible for proliferating hate in music, I tip my hat to him....

[BronxBoy]

21. It seems that you don't listen to much Black media at all.

There were at least 3 nationally syndicated shows that delved into the issue over the last couple of weeks. Tyler Perry has covered this a a subtext in several things I have seen of his. And as others have pointed out, Reverend Sharpton has dealt with the misogyny and lyrics in Black music.

And as far as Reverend Sharpton not being a fair arbiter on this issue, I ask where are our other spokesmen. Imus CALLED him. Bill Cosby can bemoan the state of certain aspects of the Black community but a white man who has a national audience of millions can denigrate a group of women at a time when they should have been enjoying reaching a goal that didn't and you can hear the crickets chirping from not only Mr Cosby but also from many of the Democratic candidates who profess to have our best interests at heart.


So excuse me if I don't share your consideration for Mr. Imus's feelings or whether he is given a fair shake. If my daughter had been on that team, I would have agreed to meet with just so I could kick his sorry ass.

[zulchzulu]

25. Wow..did you ever misread what I said...

Perhaps you thought we should give Imus some kind of consideration for his recent remarks.

Perhaps you don't know that I think he's a scumbag and pretty much laid it out in my original message. It's nothing new with what he said.

My objection goes to how this event gets all kinds of outrage and protestation for the cameras while there isn't much being done regarding other forms of hate in music (hip hop, rap...)

I listen and watch "black media" when I get a chance and it just seems that while people like Bill Cosby, Tavis Smiley, Tyler Perry and Chuck D talk about the matter, not much gets done. I remember hearing James Brown talk about the sad state of street poetry in music a lot.

Being level and consistent on the outrage is my point.

[ldf]

32. well, geez!!!

what the hell do you think rosa parks was fighting for???

for the oblivious.. :sarcasm:

[ileus]

14. They're down for the struggle.

[Vinca]

15. It works both ways. Anyone remember the rap number called

"Kill Da White People?"

[bamacrat]

16. What if Imus were black?

Black people can say the "N" word, without retribution, maybe nappy headed hos would fly too.

[pink-o]

31. Of course African Americans can use the "N" word and we can't!

..I'm a member of a religious minority, and I can make all sorts of stereotypical comments about my own people....but God help anyone else who does it! It's just human nature.

This is how it works: Say you're always insulting your sister's looks. That's okay, but you'll beat the crap outta anyone else who calls her ugly. How DARE an outsider diss your family????


The problem with the "N" word is that the community started using it amongst themselves to render it ineffectual as a slur from white people. However, it's to the point where now the only people who utter that word are either ignorant moran racists or the hip-hop community. Whatever power was taken from that word, whatever shock value it might have once had in either context is long gone.

Time to put the "N" word to rest for good, guys.

[sampsonblk]

18. Comedy and music are art

Even if they are not funny or entertaining in the least. Imus was making a joke for laughs. He does this all the time. If you don't like it, don't tune in to Imus.

[Moochy]

20. Big Eddy Schultz is that you?

He's hammering the same talking points.

[zulchzulu]

30. Well...

Actually I posted this thread before Ed came on the air...I did notice that he was kind of talking about the same thing...like...whatever...

[BronxBoy]

22. Double Standards cut both ways

I seem to remember that the US Congress fell all over themselves to officially condemn Khalid Muhummad when he said some absolutely disgusting things about jewish people. Why are they silent now?

Yes we have some pathologies in our community that need to be dealt with. But don't think for a minute that the Black community should minimize the impact of Imus's words because of rap. People like Imus, Coulter Hannity et al have consistently mouthed these racist sentiments and unlike 50 cent, their words can have politcal consequences faar beyond hurt feelings.

The fact that mostly Black New Orleans was left to fester after Katrina can be directly traced to the depiction of us as sub-human in the media.

[slackmaster]

23. If racism and misogyny were banned

Hip-hop and rap artists would be in a world of shit. They'd have to rewrite so many lyrics it would put them out of business.

[BronxBoy]

26. As well it should...n/t

[slackmaster]

27. I'd be happy if the fans would just keep the volume down on their damn car stereos

There is going to be an epidemic of hearing loss caused by loud car stereos, if there isn't already.

I've noticed that the incondiderate assholes who play them really loud happen to be some of the same people who speed.

[BronxBoy]

29. Well Rap fans aren't the only ones to play loud music.

I agreed with your post because the minute I heard about these comments, I knew that inevitably, the "Well rappers so it so it's not to bad" meme would start. Hopefully this will wake people in our community up to the fact that "Its not the same thing when we say it" routine has no basis in reality. Society will treat us only as well as we treat ourselves.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

28. The same reason Johnny Cash wasn't arrested...

for killing a guy in Reno.

[Dinger]

33. That From A SONG. You Do Know That Johnny Cash Never Killed Anyone, Right?

Folosm Prison Blues . .. "I shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die."


Geez, I love that song.

[roseBudd]

34. Because they were born with nappy hair too. And ashy. Straight haired people should not disparage

African descent hair.

[iconocrastic]

35. If you're not thuggish enough you're not considered a "real black"

The language and body language is degrading. An educated black man is called an Uncle Tom. The black rappers call their own women "ho" - and I sure see a lot of black women enjoying that music. What hypocricy.

[Catherine Vincent]

36. That's BS. n/t

[iconocrastic]

42. No, it's absolutely true.

n/t

[bluedawg12]

37. Imus' comments are more than "unfortunate"

Imus' comments are more than "unfortunate" they are ugly, tiresome and infuriating because of this double standard: that the gold standard is obtaining an education, participating in healthy activities for mind and body such as sports and then, when black women enter college, participate in sports they are reduced to racial and sexual stereotypical ugly, hate filled slurs.

Gosh what is a black woman to do?

No kids out of wedlock, no drugs, no welfare, no promiscuity, just meeting the standards of society and THAT is not good enough?

Gee, what would excuse a limp d*cked, shriveled sack of an, aged senile, mildly demented, hypoxic, dry alcoholic and drug addict personality piece of cr@p like the "Me"-man from attacking some decent young women- the fact that he panders to a certain demographic, makes money for GE, coarsens the general discourse of our nation, contributes to the dumbing of America, panders to the RW, and pretends he simply has a comedy show- when he is a political activist for the right? Naw.

We have a new perfect RW couple: Mann KKKulture and his/her twin Don I-KKKulture.

As far as rap, I am a caucasian, I don't tell the black community what to listen to and how to speak. I agree about the misogynist strain in some rap and I do not approve of it. But that's cold comfort for black sisters who get it from both sides. For now, this aged hag is on the menu and he has to go.

BTW- misogyny has been a recent topic about women bloggers being attacked not for their ideas but on a sexualized vulgar personal level. This society is sick and we are seeing the tip of the iceberg.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

39. Thank you

The whitey-patriarchy gives no points for near misses. Women who don't resemble Barbie are failures. It doesn't matter how hard they worked to be good at thier their studies or their sports.

Yeah, Imus has to go. I don't give a shit what Black rappers have said. Like you, I don't justify their misogyny, but Imus has never experienced anything but unearned privilege so he doesn't get to quote them.

[zulchzulu]

40. Agreed...

As my post mentioned, he is a scumwad.

But the truth is, and he implied it in his interview on Sharpton's radio show, his conversational style is just "freeform" and he was just talking like he was with the fellas.

His likeability and popularity is somewhat like Rush Limpole's appeal. He's "just sayin' what we are thinkin'." Of course, he's a right wing racist, homophobe warmonger who hates them fags 'n shit. That's why at least 30% of Bushbot America loves him. The fact that he was basically making fun of women playing basketball was due to the innate feeling that wimmims shouldn't be playin' no sports anywho...

So he got slapped and can take some time off to play some golf in Hawaii with his buddies and laugh about how the n*ggers made him go have a good time and maybe score a whore on Saturday night.

[Ninja Jordan]

41. Because they're black.