I support HOWARD DEAN 100%

[Nimrod2005]

He is doing an absolutely outstanding job for all of us, and for AMERICA!!!

Results of his hard work and accomplishments will be felt for many years to come.

Howard Dean speaks for me!

Any questions?

[movonne]

1. I do too..I may not agree on all his policies but he is the best for this

job...

[William769]

2. Howard can rot in a very warm place.

Any questions?

[Nimrod2005]

3. You mean South Florida? Warm and muggy this time of year...

[AtomicKitten]

5. yeah, when are you going to quit holding back

and tell us how you really feel?

[OzarkDem]

7. Good luck with the GOP

I'm sure they'll be very receptive to your point of view.

[William769]

9. At least I know where they are coming from.

I like an enemy I can fight out in the open, not one thats hides.

[Nimrod2005]

11. I don't think Howard Dean is your enemy...

He is really doing great things for our party...

[OzarkDem]

22. That's just silly

You may want to be careful to not be exploited by the GOP. Someone I know who is a long time GOP troll on this forum recently told me they changed their identity to say they were a gay man (they're actually a conservative, hetero housewife).

[Tarheel_Dem]

42. i've had my suspicions for quite awhile now....

i agree with a poster on another thread, who asked....why now? with the specter of dems possibly taking back one or both houses of congress, are we suddenly being inundated with angry gblt threads (feigning outrage)because dean went on the 700 club as a form of outreach? these latest attacks almost seem planned and/or coordinated.

i am all for equal rights under the law for everyone, but i think gblt's run the risk of making themselves irrelevant by being unwilling to take baby steps. frankly, i don't care about marriage period. i am nearly 50 y.o. and have never been married. however, i do care that nearly 2500 americans have been killed since "mission accomplished"; countless iraqi civilians killed & maimed for life; thousands of katrina victims displaced & barely clinging on; millions uninsured; government intrusion into the personal lives of its citizenry, etc. i'm sorry but i care about more than just this "marriage" issue.

[libnnc]

48. Question: If Dean wanted to make in-roads with the religious right

Why didn't he redirect the interview to talk about poverty and what a horrible sin it is that there are children going hungry in this country? Why did he agree to talk about an obvious wedge issue that has been used to alienate and divide our party ad naseum?

[Tarheel_Dem]

52. i'm sorry, i can't answer what was going on in.....

dr. dean's head, and not having heard the interview or having read the entire transcript, i don't know all the topics discussed in the interview. i do know, that this one issue seems to have been plucked from the interview, and now all gblt's are leaving the dem party. i just fear that this is another tactic to distract & divide, and possibly even ignited by our good friends, the LCR.

look....i'm not trying to pick a fight here, but i'm just saying that for me, personally, there are just way more important bread & butter issues right now.

[enough already]

56. Good question

I've been a huge Dean supporter, he was by far my first choice in '04, but this is all very disconcerting to me.

[WildEyedLiberal]

62. I'm sorry, but what if the issue was women, and not LGBT?

What if women were told repeatedly to not be so uppity about their rights? I would be livid. I completely understand the anger of LGBT Democrats about this interview.

No, I don't want him to resign. But I do think he needs to clarify or apologize, and I think it's shameful for people to imply that gay issues are just a burden and that gay DUers are "undermining" the party by being angry about these comments. I think saying Dean should go is going overboard, but so is accusing those who disagree with Dean of being covert operatives. Democrats get trashed on DU every day, but suddenly when Dean is the target, it's psyops? .

[demigoddess]

60. exactly the idea that repubs want us to believe, like Kerry would win be

cause he was a war vet.

[Jacobin]

10. What'd he do?

I must have missed a slip up

[William769]

12. Go into the GLBT forum.

You know the group thats get ignored the most except when it comes to wanting our financial backing.

[AtomicKitten]

16. Oh, please.

The drama.

[Jacobin]

26. Ya know.....

I live in the deep dark south. Among people, the majority of whom are very very proud of their homophobia, and who are encouraged in that mindset by their parents, their siblings, their teachers, their government and their church. Many of them are obviously closet cases who are too afraid of their sexuality to come out and feel the need for the church to tell them they'll get their penises fricasseed in hell when they die, so they can live a 'straight' life.

I'm not gay. But I spend a lot of time trying to discourage that kind of talk and behaviour. I have four boys who I'm proud to say do NOT participate in that gay bashing culture, and who in fact speak out against it....receiving in return, I'm sure you know what.

Why do I say this?

Fuck, I don't know, because I happen to believe it. I don't give a rats ass about gay lifestyle or who puts their genitals where, not because I'm on some gay crusade, but because I don't think its any of the government's goddamned business how people get off. And if nature made people that way, there's a fucking reason for it.

So, I'm not looking for any awards or sympathy. But, goddamnit, does the gay cause have to de-rail the leadership that our party has, when it goes off a bit? Who the hell else in the country in a position to help is out there? Can't we take this a step at a time? I mean, this thing is hanging the rest of the country with issues a lot more important than who can say "i do" and then get divorced than a lot of other issues....like getting us all fucking killed in WWIII.

I'm not mad.

I just wish you coulda answered my question instead of being so glib. That is asking too much.

Ignore the above post.

[William769]

29. I wasn't being glib, just stating fact.

[AtomicKitten]

44. Yes, the "let's go eat worms" philosophy is so much more productive.

I would say ignore your post, but I'm not an insufferable pompous ass.

[Jacobin]

45. If you would re-read my post

you would see (maybe) that I didn't say to ignore YOUR post, but saracastically to ignore MY post.

But thanks for the name calling.

Made my fucking day

[AtomicKitten]

46. No, it isn't clear

"My above post" would have conveyed what you claim you meant.

I took it exactly the way it was written. If it isn't what you meant, that's not my fault.

Peace out.

[0007]

58. Very clear explanation. I do support Dean 110% and see

no need for any Dean bashing.

Dean apologized for this deed now let's move on.

[Jacobin]

13. Been a Howard Supporter When Howard Supporting Wasn't Cool

(Oh, I guess its not cool again, but yet I still support him)

I think he's practical, honest, intelligent, understands policy, and is an actual human being, as opposed to the political automatons we are all sick of.

Howard is/was and always be my choice for president, although I know that is not possible.

[terrya]

15. I'm trying not to feel disillusioned right now.

I'm trying, as a Democrat and a gay man who has supported Dean for several years, not to be pissed off about his appearance on "The 700 Club" and his comments. First of all, what the hell was he even doing on that show? And one would think that the chairman of the DNC would have a pretty good idea about what's in the party platform.

[OzarkDem]

20. He does know

and he also knows the Party decided that gay marriage legislation belongs at the state level. Recall these same arguments were made during the 2004 election. It wasn't a big deal then, it shouldn't be now.

[Nimrod2005]

50. Well said, thank you.....NT

[HardWorkingDem]

23. Should we all be one issue Dems?

Let's be honest here, okay?

Throwing gay marriage, abortion and other controversial issues back to the "State" level is just a passing of the buck by federal politicians. Sadly, I would venture a guess that the majority of states, if forced to make the decision, would make a very similar comment that Dean did - that marriage is between a man and a woman - and then they would probably try to push this decision off onto local politicians.

Don't get me wrong - I believe that all Americans should be equally protected under the law and receive all benefits that everyone else does. I believe that a gay couple should be eligible for insurance, health care and other benefits married couples receive.

All I think Dean was doing was trying to reach out to those socially conservative Democrats that are sitting right on the edge. He might have even been trying to reach a few other persuadable voters as well.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

33. DU is chock full of one-issue Dems.

It sucks.

[Stinky The Clown]

54. One issue Dems and Fan Club members

you're right.

It sucks

[enough already]

57. An issue here....an issue there....

pretty soon it starts to add up. We've got Democrats voting to fund Bush's illegal war, an openly "choice"-hostile candidate for governor in Pa who has the party support, officials who won't consider filibusters of nazi judicial candidates, others who have turned a blind-eye to 2 stolen elections, and now Dean pandering to the fringe kooks of the religious right. Sorry, but the picture is much bigger than just "one issue". This is all very disappointing.

[William769]

36. You say one thing but write another.

What are we to believe?

[tishaLA]

38. It's not a "one issue" thing

It's about actively--and, according to the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force, repeatedly--misrepresenting the platform of the Democratic Party. It is a plank in that platform many LGBT people and their friends worked very hard. Instead, the party chair went on CBN and said that ""The Democratic Party platform from 2004 says that marriage is between a man and a woman. That's what it says."

I have no problem with him going wherever he wants to deliver his message, but he can do it without misrepresenting what the party platform says. Find common ground--great--but this is not the way to do it.

[madfloridian]

24. A lot of good people watch that show.

They are good religious people. My parents watched that show when they were alive.

I think seeing people who watch that show painted with such a broad brush and laughed at and made fun of is very much a commentary on our community.

[terrya]

30. Maybe it's just me....

but I really don't know if Pat Robertson and the people who are his supporters are all that sympathetic to Howard Dean and the Democratic Party as a whole.

I'm not saying that the people who watch that show are all evil or anything. But to be honest, I just don't see a lot of support for Dean and the Democratic Party from Pat Robertson.

[madfloridian]

34. Well, I haven't seen them say Dean can rot in a warm place...

and someone in this thread just said that.

I am amazed at the way people who watch those shows are belittled here. It is changing my mind about a lot of things.

I left my church because of the war. But there is as much hatred here toward a man who cares about the party as there ever was in our church about anything.

[William769]

37. That would be me & I should have said ROT IN HELL!

ON EDIT: Whats really sad is having a idiot as the DNC chair. That for sure will make us lose in November!

[madfloridian]

39. My church never had that much hatred toward any group or person.

My eyes are being opened here since last night. I have seen prejudices I did not realize. I had turned from religion because of the war, but it left an empty space.

Now at a Democratic forum I see the hatred that is far worse than any I saw in my church.

[William769]

40. When I get attacked by someone like Dean

I come out fighting! I supported him in so may ways for the DNC chair to have him do this to something that I hold dear to my heart Just pisses me off!

[madfloridian]

41. And you said he could rot in hell.

And no one cared.

[madfloridian]

47. I don't ever remember saying anyone could rot in hell.

I don't think many here go around calling others idiots. That is a puzzle, that DU has become a place where stuff like this is ok.

[madfloridian]

27. Well, I feel disillusioned that someone just said he could rot...

in a very warm place. I am disillusioned that is ok at DU now. Kind of sad.

[On the Road]

4. I Support Howard, Too

He is beginning the process of taking back the country.

Clinton was a brilliant politician and a good president, but he didn't the tide of party identity or local and state elections. That's what Dean is doing.

[Xeric]

6. Howard Dean

May well snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

14. Based upon what? Your baseless ignorant negativity?

[Xeric]

21. Based upon his history of falling into right wing traps

Like going on the 700 Club and giving that nut credibility.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

28. That nut has millions of devoted viewers that need to be reached.

That, my friend, is credibility, whether you like it or not.

[Xeric]

31. Those sheep

will never vote Democratic, assuming he actually has as many "devoted followers" as he claims. Robertson used Dean as a useful idiot and got him to say something that pissed a lot of us off. Robertson is nuts and evil but he isn't stupid. He would never have had Dean on unless it benefited him and his political goals. And it did. Those are the facts, whether you like it or not. That's why Dean had to issue his little Mea Culpa today. He screwed up. Thankfully it wasn't as big a screw up as it could have been.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

32. Well, I don't totally support the move myself,

however, most people do seem to support his 50 states campaign. Frankly, this is part of it. You can't do a 50 state campaign without reaching out to these people. I can see where he's coming from.

[Berserker]

55. YEAH and he hates kitties too

[pepperbear]

8. I would like a little more explanation for that gaffe....

on the 700 club though. He looked bad on the left....and, as if they needed more reason to doubt his credibility, pretty disingenuous to the far right. Sorry guys, this is as serious a :wtf: moment as it gets.

Just question it is all I'm saying.

[knitter4democracy]

17. Me too.

This is a man who got gay marriage in VT when he was governor and almost lost re-election because of it. He lost the Michigan primary due to his gay rights stance (just my theory, as I was phone banking for him at the time here in SW MI). We know where he stands and has always stood. I would like to know what went through his head when he said that.

[xchrom]

25. he did not get gay marriage in vermont.

what he got was civil unions -- and the two marriage and civil unions are not equal.

[knitter4democracy]

59. Oh. My bad. I had read that it was gay marriage.

No, civil unions are not the same. Hmm. Maybe it's a first step, but it's not definitely not equal.

[OzarkDem]

18. There wasn't a gaffe

he made the point that gay marriage is a state issue, not a federal one. Dems made the same argument during the 2004 presidential election.

Apparently, Dean was very successful in scaring the GOP with his interview. They've activated a lot of divisive spin.

[tishaLA]

35. That's not the point he made at all

He said that ""The Democratic Party platform from 2004 says that marriage is between a man and a woman. That's what it says." Except that it doesn't and some of us would never belong to a party whose platform said that. What you say he said--that marriage, same-sex (i.e., "gay") or not, is a state issue--is what the platform actually says.

His performance caused the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force to issue the following statement:

Statement by Matt Foreman, Executive Director
National Gay and Lesbian Task Force

"Governor Dean is wrong about what the Democratic platform says about marriage equality. Disturbingly, this is not the first time he has misrepresented this important and affirming plank, and he has been asked before to correct the record and to cease making these misleading statements.

"Governor Dean's record on lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender issues since becoming DNC chair has been sorely and sadly lacking. The Democratic Party chair should stand by and fight for the party's own platform and values. In light of Governor Dean's pandering and insulting interview today with the Christian Broadcasting Network, we have decided to return the DNC's recent $5,000 contribution to us. We do so with great sadness, knowing that the Democratic Party has long been a champion of our rights. Once again, we urge the governor to accurately represent the party's commitment to equality for LGBT people and our families, and to do everything in his power as chair to realize this vision. This would include but not be limited to fighting anti-gay ballot initiatives in various states this November. We urge him to take the money we are returning today and spend it to defeat these attacks on LGBT people and our families." link

[IndyOp]

19. When is it ever reasonable to suport anyone 100% of the time?

My answer: Never.

Seriously. My Guy Right or Wrong sounds a little too GOP to me.

I support Martin Luther King, Jr. I support Gandhi. I support the Buddha and the Dalai Lama. Not 100% - no one 100%. Not myself. No one.

:hi:

[WildEyedLiberal]

63. Good post

When someone fucks up, just admit they fucked up. I love John Kerry but he's not perfect. I'm not perfect. Dean's not perfect. He fucked up. If he's smart, he'll apologize. I certainly don't think we should throw him out over this, that would be inane.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

43. K&R!

:yourock:

[BrightKnight]

49. .

[Upfront]

51. Hell Ya!!!!

Dean is by far the best thing we have going. He speaks for me!

[Odin2005]

53. I support Dean too.

Saying you are for gay marriage is political suicide, that a fact some DUers need to get through thier heads.

[WildEyedLiberal]

61. Self delete

I don't want to join this thread. I think both sides need to take a deep breath and calm down. I understand the outrage, but I do not think throwing Dean to the curb is the way to deal with that outrage.

[FrenchieCat]

64. I support Dean too!

He doesn't speak for me, but then My mouth is big enough on its own...thank you!