9/11 Truther Lawyer - Philip Berg - Files Suit Alleging Obama Disqualified

[jberryhill]

Philip Berg, the attorney who represented "Keymaster" Rodriguez and runs 911forthetruth.com, has filed a suit in the Eastern District of Pennsylvania, alleging that Barack Obama is disqualified to run for president.

The allegations are a re-hash of the "birth certificate" nuttiness.

In short, he has sued Obama and the Democratic Party on the theory that:

1. Obama was actually born in Kenya and his Hawaiian birth records are faked; or

2. In the alternative that Obama lost his citizenship in Indonesia.

The birth certificate nuts are a special breed, and believe that a child under ten is capable of renouncing US citizenship by birth.

Complaint here:

http://www.gigasize.com/get.php?d=yqgpoky4x5d

Motion for injunction here:

http://www.gigasize.com/get.php?d=7wlvvzgl3dd

For those with Pacer access, the case is 08cv4083 in the EDPA.

[whatchamacallit]

1. 911 OCTer - George Bush - Plots To Invade Iran

Stupid smear by association posts suck ass.

[LARED]

2. Freakin amazing

So you don't like smear by association, yet according to most CT'er anyone even remotely associated with the Bush administration (like getting a paycheck from the federal government) is clicking their heals in submission to his every whim.

[Bolo Boffin]

3. Thank you. n/t

[whatchamacallit]

4. No, just the tools assisting him in covering up the Crime of the Century n/t

[Realityhack]

5. Yet you present no evidence for your coverup theory. n/t

[William Seger]

10. ... and the whim is to commit mass murder

Apparently, the civil service entrance process can filter out any shred of morality.

[Realityhack]

6. It would be unfair to smeer ALL CTers because of this...

but it it is fair to point out that this particular person is willing to believe in long discredited ideas (willful ignorance).

[KatyMan]

7. You can't really give up citizenship

If you go into a foreign embasssy, tear up your passport and renounce your citizenship, you can still go in the next day and get a new passport. US law allows for dual citizenship. (ETA--I know, because I'm a dual citizen)

[jberryhill]

8. Oh, the lawsuit is fevered bullshit from beginning to end

But if the nutters are going to chase it, then they are welcome.

[BuyingThyme]

46. ..

[Realityhack]

9. Gigasize blows... is that the only place this complaint can be found? n/t

[jberryhill]

12. I didn't want it on my server....

so I googled free file storage.

Is there a better one?

[Realityhack]

14. Not sure off hand. Just had issues with that one. n/t

[Redstone]

11. Why didn't the judge just tell that lunatic to

get the fuck out of the judge's courtroom and stop wasting the Court's time?

And why hasn't this crackbrain been disbarred?

Redstone

[jberryhill]

13. Give it time - it was filed yesterday /nt

[Realityhack]

15. I read the complaint... does anyone have a good legal take on the contents?

Issues with the quoted law etc.?

[jberryhill]

16. The "facts" are utter fiction....

As a "legal" issue, his Indonesian stepfather could have claimed Barack to be from Mars on a school enrollment form. It would not alter Barack's status as a natural born citizen of the US.

Bottom line - your parents/guardians cannot revoke your US citizenship if you are a minor born in the US, and even you can't do it until you are 18. Barack was long back in the US before he was 18.

The relevant law is the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, Rule 11. Berg is relying as "facts" on Wikipedia entries, hearsay, and general "stuff posted on the internet".

That "Canadian birth certificate" to which Berg refers is a joke. It is signed by "Dudley Doright" and "John Kennedy" and states a birthplace of British Columbia while purportedly issued by the province of Ontario.

It's a giant big ball of "what were you smoking?"

[Realityhack]

17. Ok. I caught most of those. What about...

the issue of the law at the time that he sites? I just want as much information as possible because eventually some idiot will bring this up.

[jberryhill]

18. "The law at the time"

...and which has always been the law at any time is that a minor is not competent to renounce US citizenship by birth.

Even if Lolo Soetero had attempted to adopt Barack - and you have to put all this in the context and social circumstances of the history of Indonesia in the 1960's - Barack Obama has at all times been a natural born citizen of the United States, and the action of no adult could have changed that fact.

If you are born in the US, any adult might take you anywhere in the world and perform any legal act in any other country they want - they cannot take away your US citizenship, and you cannot renounce your US citizenship until you are 18.

These theories are thoroughly screwy, and those espousing them are laughingstocks. They are trying to claim "divided loyalties" of a six year-old child on the basis of a school enrollment form he's probably never seen in his entire life as a US citizen.

The obvious fact that he returned to the US at age ten demonstrates his continued and, at that age irrevocable, US citizenship.

The punchline is that the theories require bizarrely-intended machinations of the Dunham family relative to a minor child for the purpose of qualifying him to run for president some 40 years after the fact.

I was chatting with one of the local news anchors outside Biden's house this afternoon, and he said he's constantly bombarded with crap weirder than even this and it all comes from the basic impulse of folks who think Barack is "different", but they need some justification for what would otherwise be unvarnished racism.

[Realityhack]

19. Ok so...

their is no way for custodial parents to renounce a child's citizenship on their behalf? And that includes if they get the child citizenship in another country that requires dropping previous citizenships? (not saying any of that happened just trying to get some facts so I can pound someone in the face with them later) I was poking around the INS but I couldn't find any info on that.
-- on edit --
found it http://travel.state.gov/law/citizenship/citizenship_776.html
-------------

Obviously he is taking the throw all the shit and hope something sticks method. But just for fun...

*IF* Obama actually had been born outside the US, he would not be a natural born citizen because of having only one citizen parent who did not live long enough in the US right? I found the INS section on that law but I am no scholar of Obama's family history. (INS http://travel.state.gov/law/info/info_609.html)

[jberryhill]

43. Once more with feeling...

A minor cannot renounce US citizenship. Period. End of story.

NO - a parent or guardian cannot renounce US citizenship "on behalf of" a minor. I've traveled abroad with my own children. Even if while abroad, I decided not to return to the US and to revoke my own citizenship - they would have an absolute right to return to the US whether I wanted them to or not because *I* cannot "revoke" *their* citizenship.

When you are born in the US, you are a US citizen by birth, and nobody can change that for you. Period. End of story. When you are 18, you make up your own mind.

This is irrelevant to Obama, but there is a lot of confusion over the subject of "dual citizenship". The US for example does not recognize dual citizenship. That doesn't mean *YOU* can't have dual citizenship and be a US citizen. If you are a US citizen and have an Irish grandparent, for example, you can apply for and receive Irish citizenship. A LOT of Irish Americans do this. The US Government does not recognize them as Irish citizens - the US sees them solely as US citizens. But the Irish government recognizes them as both Irish and US citizens.

I guess it is because people fundamentally don't udnerstand sovereignty. Even if some other country required immigrants to renounce other citizenships, it doesn't matter. Because the US will not recognize the "renunciation" by a minor. A US citizen must be at least 18 to renounce citizenship. Obama left Indonesia when he was 10. It is IMPOSSIBLE for Barack Obama to have somehow "lost" his US citizenship between the ages of 6 and 10.

The mere fact that we are talking about willful legal acts by someone between the ages of 6 and 10 underscores the absolute inanity of the entire subject. It can't be done, because you can't "revoke" anyone else's citizenship - even your own child. The US will not, and has not, recognized "revocation" by a minor, because a minor is not competent under US law to revoke his/her citizenship.

I hope that's clear. I don't think it can be made any clearer. And it is really that simple.

Yes, if someone was born in Kenya in 1961 to an 18 year old US mother and a foreign father, that person's status would be questionable in 1961, because the law at that time would have required the mother to have resided in the US for at least five years past the age of 16. HOWEVER, the "smuggled baby" theory is also insane. The idiots do not understand that 1961 was not the age of Star Alliance airlines and Travelocity. One could not jaunt about the planet on a whim. Oh, and yes, somehow the newspaper would have had to have picked up the birth records for that week in Hawaii in order to publish the corresponding birth announcement.

There was even one freeper on one of their threads who said, "This doen't make sense. It doesn't even make good nonsense."

He was probably banned.

But, RH, don't spoil the show. Let the freepers and PUMAs do their gorgeous swan dive into the empty pool below.

[Realityhack]

48. Sorry I didn't mean to be an ass...

I did eventually find the INS info on renouncing citizenship. It is quite hard.

I know the smuggled baby theory is junk. I just like having as many facts as possible when some jackass who didn't do the research starts babbling about things.

As for the swan dive... I let them hang themselves... then I want the facts to show them up as an idiot so the audience they don't have the facts.

[jberryhill]

50. No problem....

However, I do notice that some "nobody can renounce a minor's citizenship" stuff showing up in the freep threads now.

What's interesting is that they also think FactCheck is run by the Obama campaign - totally forgetting that Dick Cheney referred people to that site in 2004.

[Realityhack]

52. "FactCheck is run by the Obama campaign" LOL Freepers n/t

[Realityhack]

20. "...he said he's constantly bombarded with crap weirder than even this..."

That must be insane. This is some pretty crazy shit. The only things I can dream up that are wilder include space aliens... but then my imagination may just be failing me.

[jberryhill]

42. You're not far off...

A secret muslim army is being smuggled into the US to take over at his command.

[Realityhack]

49. WTF?!?

That is some seriously racist fucked up paranoid shit.

[jberryhill]

51. Yah...

Since the guy is a local television news reporter, whenever he goes on location people ask him "Why aren't you reporting on this stuff? I got it in my email."

I met a young man in the Marines last week at a restaurant who told me he's glad Hillary didn't get the nomination because she planned to disband the Marines. But he didn't think it would be right for Obama to swear into office on the Koran.

There are some amazingly fucked up people out there.

[jberryhill]

21. 9/11 Truther Lawyer - Philip Berg - Files Suit Alleging Obama Disqualified

Philip Berg, the attorney who represented "Keymaster" Rodriguez and runs 911forthetruth.com, has filed a suit in the Eastern District of Pennsylvania, alleging that Barack Obama is disqualified to run for president.

The allegations are a re-hash of the "birth certificate" nuttiness.

In short, he has sued Obama and the Democratic Party on the theory that:

1. Obama was actually born in Kenya and his Hawaiian birth records are faked; or

2. In the alternative that Obama lost his citizenship in Indonesia.

The birth certificate nuts are a special breed, and believe that a child under ten is capable of renouncing US citizenship by birth.

Complaint here:

http://www.gigasize.com/get.php?d=yqgpoky4x5d

Motion for injunction here:

http://www.gigasize.com/get.php?d=7wlvvzgl3dd

For those with Pacer access, the case is 08cv4083 in the EDPA.

(If someone wants to put those .pdf's on a better file sharing service, please do)

[Egnever]

22. Wow the article that just has to be pushed aparently

How many get pizza with this post so far?

[scheming daemons]

26. Last night, at least 2 pizzas arrived with this story

[dionysus]

35. who got it?

[CK_John]

23. The Cheney forgery factory is geared up to provide the documentation. n/t

[Junkdrawer]

24. Well that proves it. A 20 minute office fire DID bring down WTC7....

I'm convinced.

[Epiphany4z]

25. oh good lawrd

what next...

sniff sniff...smells desperation in the air.

[rurallib]

27. Extra! Extra! read all about it! McCain born in Panama!

[Lucky 13]

28. Now he was born in Kenya?

I thought it was Indonesia?

Keep wasting your time on this, Berg. We're busy winning the White House.

[jberryhill]

30. Someone is gaslighting the freeptards on this, but good...

...and sooner or later, someone is going to figure out that Colon, Panama was neither on a military base, nor was it in the Canal Zone.

[scheming daemons]

29. This story resulted in two people being tombstoned last night... it is being pushed hard by Freepers

You might want to be careful with this one, Mr. OP.

[jberryhill]

31. oh shit, really?

I think the thing is absolutely absurd.

Mods - delete the OP if it's off topic. My impression was that the suit shows how nutty the nuts have become.

IMHO the freepers should put ALL their chips in on this nonsense.

They couldn't figure out a scanned document in freeptardville, so Fact Check published a photograph:

[jbnow]

32. Factcheck.org has seen, touch, examined birth certificate

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

He was born in a galaxy far, far away as we all know but his birth certificate makes him look like an earthling. Magic you know. This is very recent (8-21)

Recently FactCheck representatives got a chance to spend some time with the birth certificate, and we can attest to the fact that it is real and three-dimensional and resides at the Obama headquarters in Chicago. We can assure readers that the certificate does bear a raised seal, and that it's stamped on the back by Hawaii state registrar Alvin T. Onaka (who uses a signature stamp rather than signing individual birth certificates). We even brought home a few photographs.

[PatGund]

36. And it doesn't convince them......

The PUMAs in PUMAland are already claiming FactCheck is an Obama surrogate and is therefore lying.

There's NO amount of evidence that will convince them. Giant flaming letters 10 feet high written from on high saying "the damn thing is REAL already, so knock it off" won't convince them. Except to claim that God is obviously an Obama surrogate.

PUMA isn't about Sen. Clinton. It isn't about reforming the Democratic party. It's sole purpose now is hating Sen. Obama.

[cobalt1999]

38. Isn't that how 9/11 conspiracy fans behave?

I see that behavior here daily.

[still_one]

54. moving to a foreign country does not negate an American's citizenship

Berg is also a disgruntled Clinton supporter

[jberryhill]

57. I doubt Berg was ever gruntled in the first place /nt

[rateyes]

33. delete

[Rosa Luxemburg]

34. Obama's father was born in Kenya with the same name, Berg is a fool!

[jberryhill]

37. Big time fool

I'd like to see some Rule 11 sanctions against him.

[Realityhack]

41. is that possible...

ohhh please say it is. I firmly believe in the constitution, but this is just abuse of the court.

[jberryhill]

44. There is some weird stuff that gets filed by prisoners....

If I have time, I'll post a lawsuit by a prisoner v. just about everyone, alleging a massive conspiracy to screw with his life, and these are routinely thrown out.

Berg is a different story, as an attorney, he can't just file bullshit with the court.

The "Canadian birth certificate" to which he refrers is "signed" by Dudley DoRight. If he can certify that allegation and keep his law license, then I'm thinking I might just turn mine in and go start a farm somewhere.

[Realityhack]

47. Yeah I remember a couple cases of lawyers getting in trouble over stupid stuff like this...

I was just wondering if this particular case would provide grounds for disbarment. I sure hope it does.

[BuyingThyme]

39. That's too bad. The work he did on 9/11 was/is very important.

[jberryhill]

40. He's decided something else was more important

...and fits in with predictions made here some time ago about the "course change" we'll see in 9/11 conspiracies if a Democrat is elected president.

[BuyingThyme]

45. I heard him on Coast to Coast last night.

he made a fool of himself. He hasn't got anything and his lawsuit says, "Well, if I'm wrong, there might be something else..." (Twice.)

Tell me more about the "course change."

[jberryhill]

56. It's not a course change

"9/11 truth" is bad for far right nutjob politics.

Corsi, the Obama Nation author is a 9/11 truther.

Berg, who is trying to disqualify Obama is a 9/11 truther.

Webster Tarpley, who also is selling a book about how Obama is going to effect a coup, is a 9/11 truther.

The fact that nobody, including me, trusts or likes the Bush Administration has made the subject fertile ground.

What I've been saying for months, and what you are seeing now, is that these guys need to lay the groundwork for the fact that an Obama administration is not going to come out with an investigation or evidence of the "inside job" stuff (that's not to say there won't be investigations of a number of things that need investigating), and the 9/11 truthers who were attracted to the subject by opposition to Bush/Cheney are going to need some other narrative to explain why getting rid of Bush/Cheney doesn't result in any of the various flavors of "9/11 truth" becoming the "official story".

The folks that like to refer to "OCTabots" and "BushCo shills" are going to have to learn new lines.

That's also why you see videos from the likes of WeAreTruth stalking Sen. Obama and even Mrs. Obama with their usual crap.

You think Berg suddenly became an idiot, but he was right on the money with his pimping of Willie Rodriguez?

[still_one]

53. phillip berg is also a disgruntled clinton supporter. Obama was born in Hawaii

in 1961. Hawaii became a state in 1959.

"Berg, a Hillary Clinton supporter, announced he's filing a federal lawsuit today, claiming that Obama lost his citizenship when his mother relocated the family to Indonesia when Barack was a boy.

Under the law, however, moving to a foreign country does not negate an American's citizenship."

http://www.philly.com/dailynews/local/20080822_Clout__Law_tells_conventioneers_to_get_the_fork_out.html

This country actually deserved the last 8 years of bush. Between the MSM, PUMA, and the lack of critical thinkers, this country is fuc*ed up in a major way

between corsi, rove, and this piece of work berg, I only wish that when their time comes they suffer a great deal

[Make7]

55. RE: "This country actually deserved the last 8 years of bush."

If you are referring to George W. Bush, I am going to have to disagree. The American people voted for Al Gore - no matter how fucked up you believe this country is, at the very least it deserves to have the person who actually won the election sworn into office.

-Make7

[petgoat]

58. That they voted for Gore is not enough.

They allowed the Supremes to steal the election, they allowed
9/11 to silence the media and stampede Congress into a quavering
mob of Quislings, they allowed the crooked voting machines to
subvert elections, they allowed the election of 2004 to be stolen,
and they allowed the members of Congress to abdicate their oaths
to defend the Constitution.

America deserves what it's gotten, and what it's going to get.