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Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Israel/Palestine |
muriel_volestrangler (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat May-26-07 11:22 AM Original message |
Secret memo: Israel knew settlements were illegal |
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Jim Sagle (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat May-26-07 11:30 AM Response to Original message |
1. Bzzzzzttttttt...wrong answer. Israel's existence was menaced in 1967...BEFORE the settlements. |
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Lurking Dem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat May-26-07 11:35 AM Response to Reply #1 |
2. Hell, it was menaced in 1920 |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat May-26-07 11:54 AM Response to Original message |
3. You know what they say about opinions and assholes. |
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Violet_Crumble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat May-26-07 09:30 PM Response to Reply #3 |
10. Yeah, and that post is a great example of it :) n/t |
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papau (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat May-26-07 12:29 PM Response to Original message |
4. the settlements are the fundamental problem and a waste of money - but in the |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat May-26-07 01:03 PM Response to Reply #4 |
6. I'm not completely disagreeing with you . . |
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papau (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat May-26-07 02:13 PM Response to Reply #6 |
7. Hamas does see the problem as the existence of Jews and Israel - but |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 09:06 AM Response to Reply #7 |
20. In 1967 there were no settlements, no IDF checkpoints, . . |
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breakaleg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 09:17 AM Response to Reply #20 |
21. The UN's hands are tied because the US allows it. Don't mistake lack of action |
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Tara_NM (89 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 12:31 PM Response to Reply #20 |
86. question |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 01:58 PM Response to Reply #86 |
89. Hi Tara. Thanks for the question. |
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Tara_NM (89 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 05:02 PM Response to Reply #89 |
98. and thankyou for the reply |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 02:41 PM Response to Reply #86 |
90. Tara, the Palestinians have long wanted peace and have even offered to |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 04:02 PM Response to Reply #90 |
92. All the polls in the world on this topic are useless. |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 04:45 PM Response to Reply #90 |
95. this is what was offered in the early 70's as a Jordanian/Israeli confederation |
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breakaleg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 05:00 PM Response to Reply #95 |
97. Isn't it obvious that these offers tend to be too insulting for Palestinians to accept? |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 04:52 PM Response to Reply #90 |
96. Hamas's official offer of a truce with Israel from Ahmed Yousef: |
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Tara_NM (89 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 05:11 PM Response to Reply #90 |
101. I guess I just don't get why that wasn't enough :( |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 05:34 PM Response to Reply #101 |
102. I will try not to give you a biased or unbalanced view... |
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Tara_NM (89 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 05:40 PM Response to Reply #102 |
103. I'm saving to read |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 05:47 PM Response to Reply #103 |
104. "The King of Links" --- thank you that's one of the nicest things anyone has ever called me |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 03:18 PM Response to Reply #86 |
91. Tara, Shaktimaan recommended an excellent book to me |
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Tara_NM (89 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 05:04 PM Response to Reply #91 |
99. thanks I'll check it out |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 04:36 PM Response to Reply #86 |
93. this comment from the former Director of Shin Bet (Israeli domestic intelliegence) |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 04:41 PM Response to Reply #93 |
94. Is that why Gaza has become such a peaceful garden . . |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 05:05 PM Response to Reply #93 |
100. those are the comments of the former Director of Shin Bet; not me |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 09:51 AM Response to Reply #7 |
22. As far as the settlements . . |
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breakaleg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 09:54 AM Response to Reply #22 |
23. You are right - the WB is not part of any state. Even Israel. So it's not their place |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 10:01 AM Response to Reply #23 |
24. So, buying and selling land is only . . |
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breakaleg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 10:09 AM Response to Reply #24 |
25. It's the state that sets the rules. What if pray tell, a future state of Palestine decided to |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 10:19 AM Response to Reply #25 |
26. States can do whatever they wish along those lines . . |
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breakaleg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 10:30 AM Response to Reply #26 |
27. What difference does it make if they are settling for religious reasons? |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 12:12 PM Response to Reply #27 |
33. Why do you say the land was not theirs? |
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Tara_NM (89 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 12:36 PM Response to Reply #23 |
87. News from House/News from Home |
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peacetalksforall (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat May-26-07 12:50 PM Response to Original message |
5. There are layered reasons for people wising up (as in wise) about the |
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papau (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat May-26-07 02:21 PM Response to Reply #5 |
8. I thonk the Roman 1000 years, Arab Sunni 1300 yrs, Ottoman 350 yrs do suggest that |
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Robson (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat May-26-07 03:55 PM Response to Original message |
9. Why does the UN allow the settlements? |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun May-27-07 09:26 AM Response to Original message |
11. Self delete |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun May-27-07 09:27 AM Response to Original message |
12. A practice quite common here at I/P . . |
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breakaleg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun May-27-07 12:28 PM Response to Original message |
13. This is not an opinion from a random guy with a lowly post within the government. |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 12:01 AM Response to Reply #13 |
14. Are you suggesting there is a correlation . . |
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richards1052 (205 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 02:48 AM Response to Reply #14 |
15. Dismiss Meron at your peril |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 08:38 AM Response to Reply #15 |
17. Like, should I be expecting a little visit from . . |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 08:46 AM Response to Reply #15 |
19. What about your opinion? On what basis do you . . |
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breakaleg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 08:26 AM Response to Reply #14 |
16. I'm suggesting this guy knows what he's talking about. His opinion is in line with |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 08:40 AM Response to Reply #16 |
18. I think you should write a letter . . |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 10:41 AM Response to Original message |
28. The illegality of the Settlements is not a debatable subject |
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henank (755 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 11:15 AM Response to Reply #28 |
29. On the contrary the legality of the settlements is quite clear |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 11:32 AM Response to Reply #29 |
30. The 1967 war was an aggressive war of conquest. |
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henank (755 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 11:52 AM Response to Reply #30 |
31. Aggressive??? The 6 day war was a clearly documented defensive war |
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richards1052 (205 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 01:12 AM Response to Reply #31 |
45. Carelessly argued... |
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oberliner (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 01:31 AM Response to Reply #45 |
47. What should have happened to the West Bank after the 1967 war? |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 04:03 AM Response to Reply #47 |
49. that is exactly what was being discussed at the time |
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eyl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 12:08 PM Response to Reply #30 |
32. AFAIR the reasons for the Six-Days War |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 01:23 PM Response to Reply #32 |
37. That is a different issue. |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 01:47 PM Response to Reply #37 |
38. Ah yes, the long discredited Arab narrative. |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 02:07 PM Response to Reply #38 |
39. I mentioned nothing said by any Arab. nt |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 02:32 PM Response to Reply #38 |
40. Here, I can't find the guy I was thinking of, but this is a heck of an interesting read: |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 03:04 PM Response to Reply #40 |
41. Anyone who has read about the Six Day War knows . . |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 09:50 AM Response to Reply #41 |
50. You can't very well refute my argument if have failed to understand it. |
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eyl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 10:28 AM Response to Reply #40 |
52. First of all, another inteesting quote from that page |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 10:42 AM Response to Reply #52 |
53. Yes, I read the whole thing. |
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eyl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 10:54 AM Response to Reply #53 |
54. Not neccesarily |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 11:06 AM Response to Reply #54 |
56. You do not mass troops for an attack and expect your enemy not to notice. |
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eyl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-30-07 06:18 AM Response to Reply #56 |
58. By your logic |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-30-07 07:49 AM Response to Reply #58 |
59. Well, they obviously should have expected an attack. |
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eyl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-30-07 11:26 AM Response to Reply #59 |
60. Now you're changing questions |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-30-07 08:30 PM Response to Reply #60 |
62. Are you really asserting I don't know what I meant? |
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eyl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 01:38 AM Response to Reply #62 |
68. No, I'm asserting that |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 07:01 AM Response to Reply #68 |
72. I'm sorry, I've done the best I can. |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-30-07 03:07 PM Response to Reply #59 |
61. eyl makes a strong point. |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-30-07 08:32 PM Response to Reply #61 |
63. As near as I can tell from what you write, you haven't the foggiest idea what I'm talking about. nt |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-30-07 09:08 PM Response to Reply #63 |
64. You could be right. I was following your post 59 . . |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-30-07 09:14 PM Response to Reply #64 |
65. I see you finally got part of the issue right. |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-30-07 09:43 PM Response to Reply #65 |
66. It would be helpful if, instead of repeatedly . . |
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Violet_Crumble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 01:01 AM Response to Reply #66 |
67. There's nothing unclear or muddled about what bemildred's saying n/t |
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eyl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 01:39 AM Response to Reply #67 |
69. well, than maybe you can explain it |
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Violet_Crumble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 02:06 AM Response to Reply #69 |
70. What exactly is getting you lost? n/t |
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Shaktimaan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 03:13 AM Response to Reply #70 |
71. How exactly the Yom Kippur War and the six day war are similar. NP |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 07:12 AM Response to Reply #71 |
73. They were both surprise attacks on an unprepared enemy? |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 08:42 AM Response to Reply #73 |
74. It seems you often delight in carrying on lengthy . . |
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breakaleg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 08:48 AM Response to Reply #74 |
75. I'd like to hang around long enough to see |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 08:57 AM Response to Reply #75 |
76. All you have to do is show how Israel's purpose . . |
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breakaleg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 10:00 AM Response to Reply #76 |
78. Really? I thought it would more simple. Like stating that Israel is responsible for its actions. |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-31-07 09:02 AM Response to Reply #74 |
77. That's it, stick with what you do best. nt |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 12:34 PM Response to Reply #53 |
57. I have been too busy to give your post its due consideration . . |
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richards1052 (205 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 01:24 AM Response to Reply #38 |
46. Only "when they have to???" |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 04:23 PM Response to Reply #37 |
42. I see, you don't want to let yourself get in that muddle . . |
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eyl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 10:24 AM Response to Reply #37 |
51. Huh? |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 11:00 AM Response to Reply #51 |
55. I know. |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-01-07 07:50 PM Response to Reply #32 |
79. The 'gold mine' on the border |
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eyl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-02-07 06:11 AM Response to Reply #79 |
80. If you read the last sentence of the first paragraph you posted |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-02-07 07:48 AM Response to Reply #80 |
81. I didn't think it proved or disproved anything. |
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eyl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 05:09 AM Response to Reply #81 |
82. fair enough n/t |
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bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 09:04 AM Response to Reply #82 |
83. For what it is worth ... |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 12:17 PM Response to Reply #28 |
34. and here is the website for.... |
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Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 12:34 PM Response to Reply #34 |
35. and more U.N. Security Council Resolutions regarding settlements |
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msmcghee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 01:00 PM Response to Reply #35 |
36. All non-binding resolutions. |
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Violet_Crumble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 06:37 PM Response to Reply #36 |
43. That's an interesting line of 'thought'... |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon May-28-07 07:47 PM Response to Reply #43 |
44. Deleted sub-thread |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-29-07 03:00 AM Response to Reply #35 |
48. the point is that even the one dissenting Judge on the ICJ still stated categorically that the |
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Tara_NM (89 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 12:07 PM Response to Original message |
84. They knew ???? |
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pelsar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 12:13 PM Response to Reply #84 |
85. WHY do BOTH sides continue killing eachother |
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Tom Joad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-03-07 01:05 PM Response to Reply #84 |
88. Tara, the reason for the violence is that it takes violence to enforce occupation |
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