Swiss Vote to Keep Guns at Home

[cowcommander]

ZURICH—Following an emotional debate over gun control, Swiss voters firmly rejected a referendum that would have forced soldiers to end the longstanding practice of keeping army-issue firearms at home and tightened restrictions over civilian gun ownership.

According to exit polls, 57% of voters rejected the initiative. The referendum sparked a heated debate over the right to bear arms in a country that has one of the highest rates of gun ownership in the world.

Between 1.2 million and 4.5 million firearms are estimated to be in circulation in Switzerland, putting the Alpine country behind only the U.S. and Yemen in guns per capita.

The number is particularly high because members of the Swiss militia have traditionally keep their army-issued rifles or pistols at home, to be ready to defend the nation at a moment's notice. Switzerland has virtually no standing army, relying instead on conscripted militia for national defense.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703515504576142190857662716.html

[jpak]

1. So?

:shrug:

[MicaelS]

5. So?, Here's the important points from another article....

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/Home/Archive/Swiss_reject_anti-gun_initiative_.html?cid=29484482

A majority of cantons voted against the initiative. Support came from several, mainly urban regions including Geneva, Basel and Zurich. Opposition was strongest in rural areas in eastern and central Switzerland as well as in the southern Italian-speaking canton of Ticino.

Early opinion polls in January showed the anti-gun initiative enjoying widespread support, but the 13 per cent margin dwindled to just two per cent in the space of three weeks.

(1) Just like in the US, rural voters have a much different values set than urban voters.

(2) Just like in the US polls are often meaningless. People will say one thing in a poll, because they tell the pollsters what they think the pollsters want to hear, then vote the exact opposite when they actually vote.

As the related links to other stores on the left side of the page show, there are many similarities between the debate in the US and Switzerland.

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/Specials/Gun_debate/Campaign/Entrenched_views_prevail_in_Swiss_gun_debate.html?cid=29356690

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/Specials/Gun_debate/Campaign/Emotions_and_tradition_clash_over_anti-gun_move.html?cid=29083616

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/Specials/Gun_debate/News/Results/NGOs_demand_tougher_laws_on_weapons.html?cid=1023954

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/Specials/Gun_debate/Campaign/Doctors_back_anti-gun_move_to_save_lives.html?cid=29182208

[jpak]

8. So, what does the Swiss military have in common with rural America?

not a fucking thing

yup!

[YllwFvr]

9. read it again

There is no military, its a militia

[jpak]

11. It still has nothing in common with rural America

nope

[benEzra]

12. This was about much more than the Swiss policy on government owned weapons.

Here's the text of the initiative, from proTell:

http://www.pro-tell.ch/cms/images/stories/dokumente/initiative/4.1.002d_d_Initiativtext_0901224.pdf

Die Bundesverfassung vom 18. April 1999 wird wie folgt geändert:
Art. 107 Kriegsmaterial
1 Aufgehoben
Art. 118a (neu) Schutz vor Waffengewalt
1 Der Bund erlässt Vorschriften gegen den Missbrauch von Waffen, Waffenzubehör
und Munition. Dazu regelt er den Erwerb, den Besitz, das Tragen, den Gebrauch und
das Überlassen von Waffen, Waffenzubehör und Munition.
2 Wer Feuerwaffen und Munition erwerben, besitzen, tragen, gebrauchen oder
überlassen will, muss den Bedarf dafür nachweisen und die erforderlichen Fähigkeiten
mitbringen. Das Gesetz regelt die Anforderungen und die Einzelheiten, insbesondere
für:
a. Berufe, bei denen sich der Bedarf aus der Aufgabe ergibt;
b. den gewerbsmässigen Handel mit Waffen;
c. das Sportschützenwesen;
d. die Jagd;
e. das Sammeln von Waffen.
3 Besonders gefährliche Waffen, namentlich Seriefeuerwaffen und
Vorderschaftrepetierflinten
(Pump Action), dürfen nicht zu privaten Zwecken erworben und
besessen werden.
4 Die Militärgesetzgebung regelt den Gebrauch von Waffen durch die Angehörigen
der Armee. Ausserhalb des Militärdienstes werden die Feuerwaffen der Angehörigen
der Armee in gesicherten Räumen der Armee aufbewahrt. Angehörigen der
Armee dürfen beim Ausscheiden aus der Armee keine Feuerwaffen überlassen
werden. Das Gesetz regelt die Ausnahmen, namentlich für lizenzierte Sportschützen.
5 Der Bund führt ein Register für Feuerwaffen.
6 Er unterstützt die Kantone bei Aktionen zum Einsammeln von Feuerwaffen.
7 Er setzt sich auf internationaler Ebene dafür ein, dass die Verfügbarkeit von
Kleinwaffen und leichten Waffen eingeschränkt wird.
Bundesblatt vom 04. September 2007
Initiativtext
24.02.2009

Looks like the prohibitionists were trying to turn Switzerland into a clone of the UK as far as civilian gun ownership, and the UK's policies are out-there even by European standards (which is why the UK Olympic team has often had to travel to continental Europe to practice for various Olympic sports).

Outlawing civilian pump shotguns and semiautos in Switzerland? Seriously?

[lawodevolution]

14. Awww are you mad?

[msongs]

2. if we could keep ALL the gun users' guns at home that would be good nt

[Hoyt]

16. Agree. They can have thousands of them, even sleep/shower with them. But keep em out of public.

[rl6214]

19. That's right, no credible debate

so just be an ass.

[Hoyt]

20. What do you want to debate? Go to it. Tell us why our society is better off w more guns in public.

[Lucian]

3. I wish we'd do the same here.

[spin]

4. Good. The Swiss have commonsense. (n/t)

[Vinnie From Indy]

6. Where did you think all those holes in their cheese came from!

When was the last war that the Swiss people had to be ready for at a moments notice?

[YllwFvr]

10. and who would dare attack the Swiss...

... when they have everyone's money in the bank?

[petronius]

17. They did invade Liechtenstein a couple of years ago - that was a surprise

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/mar/02/markoliver

[TheCowsCameHome]

7. How'd the Ovaltine protection amendment turn out?

Did they boot Nestle?:rofl:

[slackmaster]

13. People usually vote to retain personal power and choice when given a chance to do so

As it should always be.

[lawodevolution]

15. Hitler didn't invade swizzerland for a reason.

I guess the Swiss didn't want to lose the tradition that kept them safe in the past.

[CTyankee]

21. A bit too simplistic.

Other reasons include: questionable strategic advantage in doing so, the difficulty of mountain combat, and, probably the best reason of all is that the Swiss were "doing business" with the Nazis anyway so why would the Nazis want to do anything to screw that up?

[burrfoot]

18. I'm all for them keeping the rifles at home....

but as an aside, wtf is the use of a statistic like: "Between 1.2 million and 4.5 million...."

I hate statistics.


YMMV, of course :)

:toast: