Interesting: Mitt Romney -- AWB brouhaha devoping

[aikoaiko]

Preface: Sorry for the typos and poor wording, but I wanted to get this up and I'm still at work ;). I post about this here because it could cause problems for Romney in Iowa and NH should the MSM pick up on it, and also it is a lesson the the Assault Weapons Ban is still being used to hurt supporters.

Mitt Romney has had some problems with the gun folks in the recent past, but he seemed to deal with his overstatement as a hunter. A new problem has inadvertently arisen from a supporter (although we'll have to see if he'll be supporting Romney much longer).

A small but respectable gun manufacture, http://www.robarm.com/ "> Robinson Arms, is based out of Salt Lake City, UT, recently threw their support to Mitt Romney to be the Republican candidate in 2008. For those who don't know, Robinson Arms recently came out with a rifle called the XCR (which has gotten mostly excellent reviews), but would qualify as Assault Weapon under the now repealed federal Assault Weapons Ban and Massachusetts Assault Weapons Ban. Robinson Arms intitiated stated:

Happy New Year 2008!!! Support Mitt Romney!!!

As a manufacturer of firearms, we have received countless calls from our customers who are buying because they’re afraid a Democrat will be in the White House a year from now. Based on the 1994 “Assault Weapon Ban”, I completely understand their fears.

In speaking with you and listening to the media, it has been a given that a Democrat (and most probably Hillary Clinton) will win this coming November. I want you all to know that this is not a foregone conclusion.

There are lots of great Republican candidates running for President. I can say great things about each and every one of them. Ron Paul and Fred Thompson are definitely conservative. Mike Huckabee is religious and down to earth. However, there is one candidate who is everything one could want in a candidate and more.

Mitt Romney is probably the most qualified candidate to run for President in decades. He is intelligent, a great organizer, and has the ability to accomplish the impossible. He has proved this time and time again in business, government, and with the 2002 Olympics.

America faces challenges on every side: the War Against Freedom (Some call it the “War against Terror”. This is inaccurate), energy, immigration, and firearm ownership to name a few. We need a leader who can unite Americans and get the right result.

Not only is Mitt the best Republican candidate, he is the most electable in November. There are many moderate Democrats who will vote for him because he’s simply the best leader for America.

Mitt Romney is a strong supported of the Second Amendment. I’ve worked on his campaign and find him to be exactly what he purports to be – a true American with the same values you and I hold dear. He’s running because he knows he can make a big difference. I’ve ask him to put his views on the Second Amendment in writing. They’re attached here. I haven’t seen a stronger written statement from any of the candidates.

Let’s stop worrying and start supporting the man who can and will make a difference. The sooner we all support Romney, the easier it will be to get him into the White House and the more secure our nation will be. If you have any questions or concerns, please contact me. (Oh, and keep buying our products so I can continue to help campaign.)


Sincerely,
Alex J. Robinson
Manager
Robinson Armament Co.
Email: [email protected]

The online gun forums, at least the ones I frequent, were stunned that a gun manufacturer would support someone who signed AWB legislation, especially since such legislation banned their own product in MA and nationally should the AWB be reauthorized. Some gun folks speculated that maybe he had a pragmatic epiphany about the RKBA, but then someone found a recent, December 16, 2007, Meet the Press interview with Russet. Here is the relevant part:

MR. RUSSERT: Let me turn to gun control. Here's the headline: "Romney retreats on gun control. Romney, who once described himself as a supporter of strong gun laws, is distancing himself from that rhetoric now as he attempts to court the gun owners who make up a significant force in Republican primary politics. In his '94" Senate race, Romney backed two gun-control measures strongly opposed by the National Rife Association and other" guns rights "groups: the Brady Bill, which imposed a five-day waiting period on gun sales, and a ban on certain assault weapons. `That's not going to make me the hero of the NRA,' Romney told the Boston Herald.'" "At another campaign stop" "he told reporters, `I don't line up with the NRA.'" Suddenly Romney decides to run for president and signs up for a lifetime membership in the NRA.

GOV. ROMNEY: You know, it's, it's wonderful, and you'll appreciate this. There is a great effort on the part of, in some cases, my opposition, in some cases, just folks that are interested in writing an interesting article to, to try and find any change at all. And my position on guns is the same position I've had for a long, long time. And, and that position is that I don't line up 100 percent with the NRA. I don't see eye to eye with the NRA on every issue. I...

MR. RUSSERT: You're still for the Brady Bill?

GOV. ROMNEY: I supported the assault weapon ban. I...

MR. RUSSERT: You're for it?

GOV. ROMNEY: I assigned--and I--let me, let me describe it.

MR. RUSSERT: But you're still for it.

GOV. ROMNEY: Let's describe what it is. I signed--I would have supported the original assault weapon ban. I signed an assault weapon ban in Massachusetts governor because it provided for a relaxation of licensing requirements for gun owners in Massachusetts, which was a big plus. And so both the pro-gun and the anti-gun lobby came together with a bill, and I signed that. And if there is determined to be, from time to time, a weapon of such lethality that it poses a grave risk to our law enforcement personnel, that's something I would consider signing. There's nothing of that nature that's being proposed today in Washington. But, but I would, I would look at weapons that pose extraordinary lethality...

MR. RUSSERT: So the assault ban that expired here because Congress didn't act on it, you would support?

GOV. ROMNEY: Just as the president said, he would have, he would have signed that bill if it came to his desk, and so would have I. And, and, and yet I also was pleased to have the support of the NRA when I ran for governor. I sought it, I seek it now. I'd love to have their support. I believe in the right of Americans to bear arms.

MR. RUSSERT: How about the Brady Bill?

GOV. ROMNEY: The Brady Bill has changed over time, and, of course, technology has changed over time.

MR. RUSSERT: But the idea of a waiting period.

GOV. ROMNEY: Well, we have, we have a background check. That's the key thing. I support background checks to, to--for people who are going into a store or whatever and buying a weapon, I want them to have a background check to make sure...

MR. RUSSERT: But you stand by your support of the Brady Bill.

GOV. ROMNEY: ...to make sure, to make sure that the, that the crazies don't buy guns.

The, the current Brady Bill is, is a different measure than the original. The original had a waiting period because it took a long time to check on people's backgrounds. Today we can check instantly on backgrounds. I don't want to cause a waiting period that's not necessary based upon today's technology. But my position is we should check on the backgrounds of people who are trying to purchase guns. We also should keep weapons of unusual lethality from being on the street. And finally, we should go after people who use guns in the commission of crimes or illegally, but we should not interfere with the right of law-abiding citizens to own guns either for their own personal protection or hunting or any other lawful purpose. I support the work of the NRA. I'm a member of the NRA. But do we line up on every issue? No, we don't.

When faced with this recent interview Robinson Arms is backpedaling and considering changing their endorsement.

7:31 a.m. Jan 3, 2007

After posting the following statement in support of Mitt Romney on www.xcrforum.com, and www.ar15.com, I've received lots of input, mostly negative regarding Mitt Romney. Much of it could be regarded as hate mail. My email box is so full I can hardly get through it. Though not all of the comments are kindly written, I am, nevertheless, very thankful for all who have taken their time to write and post.

Our common goal, if I dare state it, is to get someone in the Whitehouse who will say no to gun bans (and fix the rest of the problems our country faces). Before supporting Romney, I asked his staff for his position on firearms. I was given the statement which I have linked below in July.)

Two of your comments have trouble me: 1) That he did sign a ban of "Assault Weapons" in Mass.; and 2) He stated he would sign anti-gun legislation if it came across his desk on "Meet the Press." I was not aware of this comment on "Meet the Press."

I have forwarded your (and my) concerns to his staff by email. I have asked for a clear statement that he will support and not ban the assault weapons. I also spoke to one of his top staffers who is in Iowa today. He promises a quick response.

I do still believe that in general Mitt Romney is the most qualified candidate for President. However, if he will not state unequivocally that he will protect and not ban our beloved assault rifles, I will not be able to continue to support him.

I will post any reply I get here. I thank you all for your fervor in protecting the Second Amendment. Be assured that I stand by you in this effort.

I sincerely hope for the sake of America that we can protect this most vital of all liberties.

Sincerely,

Alex J. Robinson
Manager
Robinson Armament Co.

8:36 a.m. Jan 3, 2007

Here's the initial response from Romney's team:

I'll try to get more info for you... but I doubt if I can get a response out of Boston today. They are just neck-deep in the Iowa caucus and New Hampshire. But, I'll take a look at some of those articles.

Thanks for taking a shot or two on behalf of Mitt--it's an important work you're doing. We are very grateful for your support. If we can't get a response before Wednesday, ***** and I will both be in Boston and collect some extra facts.

Talk to you soon!

*****************

Here was my response back to their campaign staff.

I just finished viewing Mitt's statements on "Meet the Press." See You Tube Clip http://youtube.com/watch?v=F9Ygw9CQ9po

No wonder the gun owners are so angry with Mitt and me for supporting him. He comes right out and says he'd sign and Assault Weapon Ban and ban any other "weapon of high lethality" or something to that effect.

I hate to say it but what Mitt said couldn't have caused much more damage. All he had to say was that he would protect the lawful ownership of firearms and prosecute those who misuse firearms. He didn't have to alienate a huge portion of his current and potential support base.

Do you realize that the Democrats who voted for the Federal Assault Weapon Ban in 1994 were run out of office in the next few years precisely because of angry gun owners? Do you have any idea how active gun owners are politically? Do your realize that the Department of Justice determined that the 10 years of the ban had no positive effect on crime? The reason the Assault Weapon Ban wasn't re-instated is that most of the Democrats were too scared to vote for it again and the Justice Department found it unenforceable and unnecessary.

Mitt is not running for the Governor of Massachusetts. He's running for the President of the United States. There's no need to cater to the ultra-liberal left. He's not going to get that vote anyway. He seems very ill advised to have made the statements he made.

I've asked you campaign guys several times to clarify this Assault Rifle issue. You guys kept sending me Mitt's statement on the Second Amendment. If Mitt really doesn't feel the Second Amendment applies to Assault Rifles, I wish you would have made that clear when I asked the question at least twice before.

Now I've stuck my neck out in support of Mitt trying to make a small difference in these primaries. I had no idea that gun owners were so angry at Mitt. You cannot believe the email I'm getting from current and potential customers. They've threatened to stop buying our products and sell the ones they have. They've threatened everything short of killing me. I kid you not.

Whoever is in charge of firearms policy for Mitt's campaign needs to talk to me and fast. There's no one in the country who knows more about this subject or who can talk about it more intelligently than I can.

Sincerely,

Alex J. Robinson
Manager
Robinson Armament Co.

Is this a big deal yet, no. But it could be if the mainstream press picks up on a gun manufacturer pulling support (if they do) and Iowa and NH moderate gun owners make their decisions accordingly.

[DS1]

1. Nice read, but goddamn, Russsert is such a tool in every transcript

[aikoaiko]

2. Yes, he really kept interrupting Romney and asking him questions that were relavant 10-15 years ago

I have a feeling Robinson Arms is going to have to pull their support in order to keep their standing among gun folks. They are about to get Zumboified if they don't.

They were some other posts by Alex Robinson, listed as Manager of Robinson Arms, that suggested the Romney people promised no AWB, but when faced with the Meet The Press interview he realized he may have been flimflammed.

[DS1]

3. He always interrupts people to get a yes/no answer, then nails them with either one

even when the answer isn't as plain as a yes or no. I hate that dumbing down shit. It's part of the reason why most of our politicians suck, they don't have to really explain anything, ever.

[Oddball]

13. That's because Russert is a tool..

..in real life. You can't edit it out of the transxcripts. They'd be blank.

[SteveM]

4. MSM may not touch this if they consider Romney pro-AWB...

MSM remains the last effective gun-control special interest group in the U.S., yet some candidates and politicians are responding to more than MSM when they equivocate on something like the AWB. I think these politicians still see MSM as a summary of some mythical "middle ground" on many issues, gun-control being one. Part of this comes from MSM's success in portraying their interests as Middle Ground or Moderate (even though both terms are not synonymous). This allows MSM to promote policies and philosophies which are outside the mainstream (the individual right to keep and bear arms is one; to a lesser extent, the War on Drugs is another). The result is that while some folks, including politicians, may feel uncomfortable with a position by MSM, they are "afraid" that taking another position will paint them as extreme in the eyes of a mythical public opinion.

Within liberal/progressive circles, MSM's influence on gun-control is augmented by a self-perpetuated aura (or odor) of intellectually and worldly cultural superiority. The language of the anti-gun "culture" was brought to bear during the modern gun-control movement, but has retreated to threads like these in the last few years because its hatefulness is seen as counter-productive. Romney's back-tracked centrism still responds to this MSM myth. (The political right has gun-control impulses as well, but clearly does not identify with the lefty cultural style.)

Last March I wrote and pitched an article about Jim Zumbo's keel-hauling, but got no response from lefty publications. In it I concluded the political right must feel a bit uneasy if "one of their own" can get blasted so quickly for not being politically correct, a term the right virtually invented. Zumbo's personal and professional fate was sealed on the Internet; Mitt's political future won't suffer the same if MSM chooses to can this.

[aikoaiko]

9. True, but an anti-AWB candidate might try to make hay if Robinson pulls the endorsement

I dont know where Huckabee stands on these things, but I think McCain is now anti-AWB.

[mvccd1000]

5. Robinson Arms = Utah, Utah = LDS, Mitt Romney = LDS

LDS = Mormon.

Mormons stick together, patronize Mormon businesses, support Mormon politicians. An admirable trait, and one that I wish we saw more of among Americans, but - possibly as shown in the article - one that they stick to whether or not the candidate is the best person for the job. Not so admirable in those situations....

[aikoaiko]

8. From living in northern AZ, I concur that club membership has its privileges

The endorsement was likely a poorly informed one on Romney's AWB stance and motivated by supporting an ingroup member who is otherwise politically consistent.

[Tejas]

6. knee-jerk reaction to Robinson = moronic

Sad to see how many morons have already gathered to burn Robinson at the stake. Trigger-happy doesn't even begin to describe some of the BS that Robinson is being assaulted with.

Sheesh!

[aikoaiko]

7. Well, I see why black rifle gun folks were angry

Here is a small new gun manufacturing company that is relying on civilian sales to make money and they endorse a candidate that has signed into MA state law an AWB and explicitly supports a federal AWB which would make their firearms illegal for civilians to purchase (as well as many, many others). It doesn't seem to make any sense. It especially doesn't seem to make any sense because the original endorsement sounds like it is informed. Upon evidence that Romney is willing to ban the current products of Robinson Arms, the owner is now asking tough questions. Those are the tough quesitons he should have asked before making the endorsement.

I think Robinson Arms didn't realize that Romney supported a federal AWB and maybe got hoodwinked a bit by some conversations between Robinson Arms and Romneys staff (if I'm reading between the lines correctly).

For a black rifle manufacturer to endorse someone who pledges to ban their flagship product as well as many other black rifles on black rifle gun boards was really stepping in a big pile of pooh.

[Tejas]

10. True, so true. Still, the fallout

being in the form of droves of anxious witch-burners uttering some of the gems they have is inexcusable. Blows my mind that they actually put down their PS2 joysticks long enough to comment here and there on the web. A certain EBR forum that claims 100,000 members comes to mind but I'll leave it at that.

[Tejas]

11. ps: By the way, that was not

meant towards you in any shape or form. It was meant towards the keyboard rambos at "that" website.

[L1A1Rocker]

12. My letter to Robenson Arms

I have just been made aware of your support of known gun banner Mitt Romney and am VERY disappointed in your actions. I've read some of you comments posted on various gun boards and I am SHOCKED at you comments. The truth seems to be damned by you cause you've made your decision and come Hell or high water you'll stick by it. This is the kind of attitude that will NOT make for a successful business. Despite being shown the truth of a matter you will stubbornly stay on the sinking ship.

Of the current presidential candidates Mitt Romny is NOT the best choice for gun owners and especially for a gun manufacturer as yourself. Talk about cutting your nose off to spite your face! What a colossal mistake and blunder on your part. I do not know what is worse. Your decision to support a candidate that would put you out of business, or you hard headedness in continuing your support after being shown the folly of you decision.

I am currently in the market for a piston driven AR type rifle. As of now you have been stricken from my list of suppliers. Unlike you however, I will revise my decision based on any new information that I may get.

Regards,

[Tejas]

14. Wonder how many Repubs

that are griping out Robinson on that EBR forum have actually gotten off they're duffs to write a letter to Romney.

from Alex Robinson:
"If I fail in trying to change Romney's campaign, what is that to you all? It's my time not yours.

Many of you won't even contact him because you think it's not worth it. If he wins you may wish you'd have helped me try to sway him when we could.

It's easy to anonymously sit back and take whacks at me. I have never seen so many cowardly and patently unfair posts in my life anywhere."


The man does have a point...... ;)

[aikoaiko]

15. The brouhaha is settling down

Apparently this little fiasco wasn't newsworthy or interesting to Romney's opponents, but it did intrigue a lot of gun people.

The latest from Robinson Arms is below. They are sticking with Romney even though he vows to sign a federal AWB. They want to be associated with whom they think will be the Republican winner, reap those benefits, and hope to keep Romney from signing an AWB.

It will be interesting to see how Robinson Arms fares. Others like SW and Ruger ticked off the hard core gun owner crowd for collusion with the federal government and many vowed to not buy their products. Those companies did OK in the long run, but they were well established and had a diversified product line. Robinson arms has one gun and many from their main civilian market don't like them endorsing a Republican gun grabber. On the other hand, maybe it is just a vocal few who claim to never buy an XCR. Plus, if Robinson arms gets their man in office, there might be government contracts in their future -- even a small one could be a boon to a company like Robinson Arms.

The lesson for Democrats -- the AWB is still a hot issue for gun owners and supporters of the 2nd Amendment. Tread carefully.

6 January 2008 Update.

After responding to lots of email (much of it very civil thanks), I've decided to share with you my political analysis and my thoughts about what should be done. Here goes.

There are several Republican candidates still in the game: Mitt Romney, Mike Huckabee, Fred Thompson, John McCain, Rudi Guiliani and Ron Paul.

Mike Huckabee, Fred Thompson, and Ron Paul have pretty solid pro-gun stances. Mitt Romney, Rudi Guiliani, and John McCain have stances that are questionable or down right bad.

Many of you are supporting one of the very pro-gun candidates. That's great. The question is: What if Mitt, Rudi, or John get the nomination? I think this is fair question.

If one of the solid gun stance candidates do not win and we totally alienate the other candidates, where are we?

If we were all really smart and working together to make sure all the bases are covered, we would make sure that we have some people working with the candidates who have less than stellar pro-gun records. Just in case they make it.

The reason I've been working with Romney is that I knew early on that he would be a contender. He's got a lot going for him that a lot of people like. Though gun control issues are the biggest issues for you and I, many Americans feel there are bigger and more important issues. I completely disagree. A candidate's stand on the Second Amendment is a litmus test. Candidates who want gun control are typically for big government, want to tax us out of existence, and support lots of other liberal ideas.

Despite being very weak on the Second Amendment, Romney is very popular with lots of Republicans whether you like it or not. He's charismatic, a hard worker, an excellent organizer, and gets things done.

Many of you are playing an offensive game. You're backing a candidate who is strong on Second Amendment issues. That's great as long as your candidate gets the nomination AND wins the election.

I'm playing a defensive game. I don't think any of the Second Amendment stalwarts are going to get the nomination AND win the election. I'd say Ron Paul has no chance. Fred Thompson and Mike Huckabee have a slight chance. Huckabee did a good job in Iowa, but I don't think he'll do that well overall. Thompson has not done well in Iowa. He started late and didn't gain momentum. I don't think he'll do well in New Hampshire. McCain, who was all but dead, has come back to life in New Hampshire. Who knows where Guiliani is? Once a touted front runner. I wouldn't be surprised to see him drop out soon.

With the current political landscape, we need to cover ALL the bases. We cannot put all our eggs in one basket. Someone should be working to get Romney to change his opinion. That's what I'm trying to do. Many of you are positive that he won't change his mind. That may be so. But we would be both blind and foolish not to try. Why? Because it is still likely the will win both the nomination AND the election.

Of you who claim to be patriots, I humbly ask the following: Contact each candidate that you feel is weak on the Second Amendment (especially Romney) and demand that he support the Second Amendment by promising not to sign a ban of any type of firearm. Remember guns don't kill people; people kill people.

You can see from my posts that I have not said anything derogatory about Fred Thompson, Ron Paul, or Mike Huckabee. The only thing I've said is that I don't think they'll win the nomination AND the election.

If we don't work hard and cover all the bases, the result will surely be what none of us want. I will post any new info. as soon as possible.

Sincerely,

Alex J. Robinson

[Tejas]

16. Point taken, but

a batch of giggling schoolgirls editing the XCR Wiki page do not an informed/knowledgeable voting block make.

[SteveM]

17. I see his point, but he owns a gun company, for chrissakes.

[Tejas]

19. I don't see mass boycotts of movies starring anti-gun actors

I'm just saying. ;)

[pipoman]

18. Forgetting Mit is a Pug, I could never vote for someone whose name is the same as man boobs..