Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

The Plastic Bag That Dissolves In Water

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Environment/Energy Donate to DU
 
n2doc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:09 PM
Original message
The Plastic Bag That Dissolves In Water
Mon, Dec 28, 2009



Vanishing without a trace might not be appreciated in friends and lovers but is an excellent relationship to have with ones used packaging material. What becomes a pile of plastic garbage is that it should just disappear into thin air, right? Well, a newly developed plastic bag does just that it completely dissolves in water. Companies use it when sending their products, magazines for example, to users, who can simply dissolve it at home no trace of the bag left, less plastic on the environment. Our only question is: Why hasnt anyone come up with this concept before?

Cyberpac, a UK-based packaging company, has developed a range of products called Harmless that use a hydro-degradable plastic that is up to three times stronger than polythene, lighter and leaves no damaging residue after dissolving in water. A bit skeptical of this promise, weve taken a look at the dissolving bags actual disappearing act.




http://www.environmentalgraffiti.com/featured/plastic-b...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Jkid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
1. More companies should do this.
K and R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hlthe2b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:17 PM
Response to Original message
2. I could see the value of one that SLOWLY dissolves in water...
But, not immediate.... Otherwise, can you imagine the very unpleasant realization of a doggy owner using one? LOL
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:23 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Vitter Doggie Diapers. I see a whole new market for the Senator. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Graybeard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:23 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Or walking home from the grocery in the rain?
Not for supermarket bags please.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cognoscere Donating Member (381 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #2
21. Ha Ha
Good one.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
livvy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:24 PM
Response to Original message
5. For the dog owners out there...may I suggest Flush Doggy Poop Bags
Biodegradable, flushable poop bags. They dissolve in water and pretty quickly, too. I use them and I have 2 large dogs. No problems with the plumbing and no more poop in a landfill. If one prefers to toss them instead, they will break down when exposed to the elements. They are reasonably priced and shipping is quick and inexpensive.



http://www.flushdoggy.com/
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TxRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #5
20. Yup the tech is not new, dissolving dog poop bags have been around.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:24 PM
Response to Original message
6. Ok. So, how toxic is the solubilized residue? And does it just result in TEENY bits
of plastic in the water, or is it BIODEGRADABLE???
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:31 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. You'd have to watch out for heavy metals in inks.
That's the main problem I can see.

Dissolving bags in the hospital were gelatin based.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. Probably have to dispose of in a hazardous waste facility because of
heavy metals. No thanks.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
izquierdista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. Everything is biodegradable
Given enough of the right fungus: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XI5frPV58tY
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bfarq Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. I notice that they didn't drink the final solution
My guess it is basically mobile plastic. Instead of staying put in the landfill, this plastic can go right into the water supply. The fact that these dickweeds didn't even ask that question makes me think they have no idea what they are talking about.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 07:00 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. Yep. Microscopic bits of plastic are STILL PLASTIC, and still have no business
being released to the environment IMHO. I worry about effect on microbes necessary for life to continue on earth.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Goldstein1984 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:25 PM
Response to Original message
7. There's a biodegradable plastic made from corn
They use bacteria to product lactic acid from corn, then polymerize it to polylactic acid.

The "bioplastic" does not dissolve in water, is used extensively in disposable medical devices and baby products, and can be composted.

It's made by Natureworks, LLC in Blair, Nebraska.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 07:02 PM
Response to Reply #7
16. Does it actually biodegrade, or just break into smaller bits so we THINK it's gone?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Goldstein1984 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. It actually biodegrades
The negative side is that, like ethanol, it is energy intensive. Biodegradability is it's main selling point.

Polylactic acid is very susceptible to microbial metabolism. Chopping it up increases surface area and biodegradation rate.

My Engineering MS was in biodegradation of organic compounds, and my biology MS was in ecology. I was offered a job as environmental engineer and public spokesperson for this company, so I did quite a bit of research into the product.

Took a job in Alaska instead--closer to my grandchildren.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. So, it is consumed by the microbes with no nasty by-products?
And are the microbes normal kinds?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Goldstein1984 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-29-09 12:37 AM
Response to Reply #19
22. Yes
Lactic acid is a normal product of anaerobic metabolism, and is easily metabolized aerobically by fungi and bacteria that occur naturally in the environment. Polylactic acid is a slightly tougher molecular nut to crack, but it still degraded, albeit a bit more slowly, by naturally occurring bacteria. The end products are CO2 and H2O.

The recommended method for disposal of the sturdier products is by shredding and composting.

This is a quick summary. There is more-detailed information at the Natureworks LLC website.

Again, like all products produced from corn, the end products are a bit energy intensive (e.g. the net energy yield for ethanol once all energy going into the product is considered is only 1.2 Btu out per Btu invested, and that is likely even exaggerated a bit), but the advantage is a biodegradable product.

One of the weird things about this plastic is that it can only be used for bottled water if the water isn't going to be stored for very long. The H20 molecules are small enough to diffuse out through the plastic over time, but O2 and N2 molecules are too large to diffuse in through the plastic, so the bottles will slowly shrivel over time. It also doesn't stand up to heat very well.

I was impressed. It was a difficult job to turn down; I liked the product and I really liked the people; but, as I said, our grandchildren are in Alaska.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:30 PM
Response to Original message
8. We've used dissolving bags in hospitals forever
as an inner lining for contaminated linens. It provides a barrier for the laundry workers who tossed the whole thing into the boiling hot water, detergent and bleach. That takes care of the contamination as the bag dissolves very quickly.

The problem we had with them was with wet linens, they didn't work out all that well.

Likewise, getting your magazines in the rain might be problematic because they'd have to dry out a bit before you read them.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Speck Tater Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:44 PM
Response to Original message
10. So if it rains on my mail my magazine will get soaked, right? Then what use is the bag?
They might as well send me the magazine without the plastic bag in the first place.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
timeforpeace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 06:57 PM
Response to Original message
13. If carbon in the air is bad, carbon in the water is bad.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
formercia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-28-09 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. Antidote for mushroom poisoning
An Activated Charcoal Shake. You will have the sweetest smelling stools on the block.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue Feb 18th 2020, 02:40 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Environment/Energy Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC