Am I being unfair?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

So Lisa and I have been engaged for a while. Our plans were to have a wedding at some point in 2009, after I graduate. With the new ruling in CA, we could fly over and get married in CA. This marriage would then be honored in NYC. Lisa really wants this.

However, I don't really want to do this. I mean if by next year, our parents still dont want to finance our wedding, and I am still so busy that I haven't been able to find a dress, I will fly to SF and get married.

But quite honestly just because I am gay doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to have a wedding. I dont want to get used to the idea, that I will always be second-best in the world.

Quite frankly right now, I don't have time to get a haircut let alone a bloody wedding.

So am I being unfair to Lisa because I dont want to hop on a plane and have get a quickie wedding in SF?

on edit: I really want to marry lisa. She isnt forcing me into a marriage. Our argument is more around the need for a wedding/ceremony.

[Kerrytravelers]

1. It's hard to say you're necessarily being unfair.

It's unfair to everyone involved to do something as big as getting married if you're not ready.

I think sitting down with Lisa and going over the pros and cons from both your points-of-view would be the most fair.

I dunno if I've been much help. Sorry!


:hi:
kt

[La Lioness Priyanka]

3. i am already to be married but i want the time to have a wedding.

i dont know if that helps any

[Kerrytravelers]

5. Ah. I see.

Maybe you and Lisa can put together a time-line to budget and plan. That way, there is a destined date, but it is one that takes both points-of-view into account!

:hi:

[LynneSin]

2. Can't you just have the wedding in New Jersey or Massachusetts?

Both are also legal and will save you massive airfare bills

[La Lioness Priyanka]

4. we can have a wedding in new york but for us to have marriage rights

we would have to get married in CA

NJ doesnt really have marriage. MA requires residency.

the wedding would be in nyc. the signing woudl have to be in CA

[NJmaverick]

6. Consider this- The opportunity to marry is still not written in stone

it may end up being a limited time offer. If that happens, how will you feel if you pass up the opportunity?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

7. we could still get married in canada and have it be honored in ny

[NJmaverick]

18. If that's not a problem than no, you are not being unreasonable

you agreed to a 2009 time frame and it doesn't sound like your SO has come with a compelling reason to change that.

[XemaSab]

54. But California might rescind our marriage rights

It's on the ballot for this fall. :shrug:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

73. but canada wont. nt

[ghostsofgiants]

40. If THAT happens, I want an invite!

:P

[La Lioness Priyanka]

41. i think we should do the legal thing in montreal. i love montreal

[ghostsofgiants]

48. I've only driven through, but I would totally put in the effort to go if you did.

[Midlodemocrat]

8. IMHO, have the ceremony now

and have a big celebration in a year.

Two parties. :woohoo:

[Withywindle]

46. Yes, this.

I'm thinking of a couple friends of mine who are Pagan, and wanted to be legally married but the High Priestess they wanted to do the ceremony wasn't certified.

So they had a private legal marriage at City Hall, and then had a separate ceremony that married them in the eyes of their religion, and this was a terrific party with friends and family and a very festive mix of Pagan and Jewish wedding traditions, and both families were delighted. The couple found both events meaningful, but the latter one much more so. And yeah, they took a lot more time to plan it, and it was worth it.

[malta blue]

9. It depends on the type of wedding you and Lisa are looking for.

It sounds to me like you are thinking of a planned out event that would involve your actual wedding vows. If that is the case, then you are already halfway through 2008 and if you are looking at 2009 - you had better be planning at this point.

If you are looking to have a celebration with family and friends, then your actual wedding vows can happen at any point.

Does this make sense?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

11. yes. i think i want something in the middle. nothing elaborate, not a backyard BBQ either

[Zuiderelle]

10. I think you both need to be happy about your decision, and I understand both sides.

We are going to wait until it's legal federally to get married, UNLESS it is more than a year from now, and then we are going to go to Toronto to get married. That way, we won't have to deal with the portability issues of our marriage being recognized in one state and not another. It will just be recognized EVENTUALLY by our federal government when they finally recognize other countries' marriages.

But it is an attractive notion to go to SF and do it right away. It sounds like you guys need to compromise on this one. If it were me, I would agree to a date in 2009 after you graduate as you planned, and then go to SF even if you can't have the wedding, then have the wedding later.

[Haole Girl]

12. For what my opinion is worth:

No one - gay or not - should feel pressured into marriage. :hug:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

13. its not being pressured into marriage. i guess i should emphasis that in my OP

its being married without having a real wedding.

[Midlodemocrat]

14. Consider this.

A lot of people get married by a judge or JP. It is a 'real' wedding to them.

[bicentennial_baby]

15. Yep...We were married by our good friend

Most fun and funny wedding ever. :D

[La Lioness Priyanka]

17. to them it is, i think a real wedding depends on what you want your wedding to be

some people want a beach wedding, asking them to do a formal black tie event may be 'unreal' for them.

for me a very casual wedding would not be a 'real' wedding.

[Midlodemocrat]

26. Do you want the whole big church wedding?

Or a smaller affair with a large reception?

Obviously, from what you've indicated, you want the whole white dress/flowers/music deal. Which I had and don't blame you for for a moment. It was a very special day. (despite the fact that I walked down the aisle with a fever of 103 degrees and had strep throat so bad we had to postpone the honeymoon by a day, but I digress)

If that is what you truly want, and you really don't want a quickie JP wedding, then I don't think you're being unfair at all. It's your day. It will only happen once, so it should be as magical as you've always dreamt.

I can understand Lisa's point, though. It's different for you guys because the stupid fuckers in this country won't give equal rights everywhere, so it has to be considered more than it did for me.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

29. small affair and a medium sized reception

red sari and possibly just an exchange of vows (i happen to like the judeo-christian vows)

i understand lisa's point and mine... which is what puts me in this quandary

thanks for all your input :hug:

[Midlodemocrat]

33. I think you're in a tough spot.

Planning a wedding is stressful from the get go. Planning it and getting all that input from your partner... :wow:

I didn't have a lot of input from Mr.Midlo. He just wanted to know where to show up and when. My cousin's husband micromanaged every single detail of the event. Drove her completely crazy. I think a lot of women dream about their day and essentially have it planned in their minds prior to even getting engaged and since Lisa hasn't really ever wanted a wedding, your desire trumps hers.

JMHO.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

34. thanks for the advice and the support.

i think we need to sit down and calmly talk about it.

i think lisa doesnt understand why one cares about the wedding and i dont understand why one wouldnt

[Haole Girl]

24. Sorry lionesspriyanka

Guess I misread that. Well... my advice to couples getting married is this: "Do what you want to do... there is no way to make either everyone or anyone else happy but yourselves."

I tried to appease my husband's parents by marrying in the Catholic church & it didn't make any difference-- either in the short term or long term.

:hi:

[petronius]

16. Why would a wedding in SF have to be a quickie?

Couldn't you have a satisfactory wedding (large, elaborate, elegant, adjective-of-your-choice...) in California? Or is it that the whole idea of a wedding is a bit soured for you because you're not able to have it where you actually live?

Either way, I don't think you're being unfair - a wedding should be a joy to both parties. What would be unfair woud be to not discuss your feeling with her at all...

[La Lioness Priyanka]

20. all my friends are on the east coast or in india.

having a wedding in SF would be impractical.

that, and i still dont have the time to plan it

[Gormy Cuss]

19. Why does she want to get married now?

Have you written up the pros and cons list to a quickie marriage now instead of waiting until next year? For example, are there legal reasons to push up the date? Would an elopement make it more or less acceptable to the family (if that matters)?


Here's a sample Pro/Con list

CON: Most of your friends and relatives wouldn't be part of the actual wedding.

PRO: I'd volunteer to be a witness at your quickie ceremony in SF.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

23. i think she does because its possible to do so

you know, no residency required in SF, we both want to visit SF.

[Gormy Cuss]

31. That's a tough one, then.

If you had the time it would be a wonderful place for a short vacation after the wedding. As others have said, you both need to be happy with the decision.

[Midlodemocrat]

35. Just don't bring your cat.

[Gormy Cuss]

50. Flowers are good at weddings. n/t

[Parche]

21. I Just Want To Arrange Your Honeymoon!!!!

:woohoo: :hi: :hug: :hi:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

25. lol

:rofl::hi:

[Fran Kubelik]

28. are you a travel agent?

I was wondering if travel agents have access to better deals than we could find on the internet.

[RadiationTherapy]

22. I think I understand.

In simplest terms, you two have differing ideas on what the wedding will be. One way is easier and cheaper, but less romantic (good luck selling "unromantic" to a leo) the other way, more elaborate and time/cost intensive. Normally i would say, "let the bride choose her wedding"...

As it is, I tend to side with the person to whom "it means more to".

[La Lioness Priyanka]

27. i agree and i think it means more to me. she has never wanted a wedding

and i always have.

:hi:

[RadiationTherapy]

36. I suspected that. You win in my book.

The corollary being who would be most disappointed, resentful and waiting to serve her revenge on a cold, cold dish? She'd better reconsider!

[Writer]

30. Wow... okay. Let's see what if I can provide any useful advise...

But before I do...

So what I'm gathering here is that your parents don't want to finance your wedding, but that you won't be able to have a proper wedding if you fly to SF and marry there? Lisa would like to go to SF for your wedding, but it seems that you'd like to marry closer to home? Closer to family, perhaps, and with a proper wedding?

What kinds of conversations have you and Lisa had so far?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

32. we haven't really sat them down and asked.

they have to meet this summer. then we will ask.

thats another thing... our parents havent had the time to meet.

[Writer]

37. Ohhh. Well then it seems you may have some time, then, while you finish school, etc.

In the meantime, you can get the parents together. Let them meet each other and attach faces to the names they've heard over the years. Sometimes that can make a great big difference. If your parents do agree to finance your wedding, then would that negate the SF plans?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

38. we would still have to get the legal stuff done in canada or california

[Writer]

39. Okay.

I think someone said above that it probably would come down to whom the wedding matters more, so I think that's a good way to go.

:hug:

[huskerlaw]

42. How about this...

what if you agreed to Lisa's timeline regarding the legal ceremony in California...with the agreement that you would throw a bigger, more elaborate party in the future (say, your 1st anniversary)?

In answer to your question, no, you're not being unfair. I think it's totally normal to want a "traditional" wedding, and if you don't have time to plan it, that makes life pretty difficult. At the same time, I can understand Lisa's point of wanting to do it now, while the getting's good, as it were. So maybe a compromise?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

43. an anniversary party lacks the meaning of a wedding to me

a wedding mean, you make your vows with your family and friends to witness. i think it lends gravity to an event.

maybe its just me

[huskerlaw]

44. No, I don't think it's just you

I think that's a totally normal feeling, shared by many. And I totally understand it.

If you had the ceremony in Canada, would more of your friends/family be able to attend since it's closer than CA?

It sounds to me like you need to have a sit-down with Lisa (if you haven't already) and offer up a timeline that would work better for you. Would you be able to move up the wedding if Lisa was able to do more of the planning? Maybe that's your compromise...she gets the timeline she wants, you get the wedding you want.

[latebloomer]

45. I would feel the same way

You want to be actually getting married at the wedding!

[redwitch]

47. my 2 cents.

Get married in SF, just the legal part. Have the actual wedding with family and friends and red sari and special part, after, at your convenience in NY or whever you are most connected. And you can have a beautiful and elegant affair w/o spending a fortune. Imagination, a few good friends who are total foodies/great cooks. Someone to arrange beautiful flowers, a pretty cake, champagne. I'll bet you have friends who make great music too! Really, a few thousand, donated services from friends and you have a wedding extaordinaire! Then you just need a place to hold it. And I would bet you have a friend with that too!


Edited to add that no, you are not being unfair. If a beautiful wedding ceremony is important to you, you should have it. And it doesn't have to be overly stressful for anyone. Best of luck with this! I'm pretty good with flowers if you need help.

[Rabrrrrrr]

49. If you go get married, you have the legal part done and you have legal protections now.

The wedding you can then have later.

That's the only real advantage I could see to getting married right away - to get the legal benefits. Also, it would be kind of neat to be in the vanguard of some of the first to do so.

I don't think you are being unfair, and I don't think Lisa is being unfair, which is a good thing that no one is really wrong here, and both of you are right, in your own ways. It's just a situation of needing to compromise on things that are purely binary, and thus difficult to compromise on.

Good wishes and best of luck to ye!

[SPKrazy]

51. Just Hop A Plane and get married

have a ceremony when you can

:shrug:

:hi:

[XemaSab]

52. Sounds like you don't really want to make it official

If you can't be bothered to take a weekend off, then why are you wanting to do this at all?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

53. sounds like maybe you need to learn how to read. nt

[XemaSab]

61. Oh?

With the new ruling in CA, we could fly over and get married in CA. This marriage would then be honored in NYC. Lisa really wants this.

However, I don't really want to do this.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

64. yes, not because i dont want to marry her, but because i want to have a ceremony too

since i think ceremonies are integral to weddings.

[XemaSab]

66. But if you want to make it official in the eyes of the state

it will have to be a two-part process. And unless you wait until after the big ceremony, you don't sound like you want to come out to California.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

67. which by the way isnt weekend. its a whole week in california.

there is nothing to indicate that ny wont have marriage rights by next year. having a ceremony and a signing so far apart is not something i desire

[Tektonik]

55. Have the wedding in NYC then go to SF for a honeymoon and get the legal stuff done there?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

57. weddings take time to plan. this is the problem

i cant just have a wedding out of thin air. weddings take a few months. i finish classes at the end of this week only to start back again in august.

[Tektonik]

68. Can you delay the wedding until winter vacation?

Hopefully gay marriage in CA would remain legal 'til then.

You could also elope in Atlantic City and tell no one in the family until you're ready to have a more thorough ceremony.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

70. yeah. i think this is where my objection is. i want a normal wedding

and no running around and assorted weirdness. i dont really care for the rights, since states rights are so limited. to me we will be married when we have a ceremony not a paper signing that isnt even recognized by the federal govt

[Shine]

56. Decide what your priorities are, as a couple, then choose.

why not come out to CA, get married, and have the party later? :shrug:

Who knows what the future brings? Who knows if the CA ruling will stand, come November?

Life is unpredictable, but True Love surpasses all of life's changes. :hug:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

59. the CA rule not standing isnt such a big deal, because we can get married in canada

[Shine]

Oh, that's cool....plus, it's closer!

:thumbsup:

I likey!

[DarkTirade]

58. Have you discussed this with her?

Seems to me that making sure the lines of communication are open so that you two can decide together is the most important part of getting married. :)

[La Lioness Priyanka]

60. yes we have, but the problem here is both of us are right

:)

kinda like rabrrr said

[DarkTirade]

63. Yeah, that always sucks.

Well, I hope you two figure it out somehow. :hug:

[Maddy McCall]

62. Why change your status right now at all?

If you two are happy right now, why feel the need to move forward with either Lisa's proposal or with what you envision?

Enjoy where you both are--that you are happy and neither are going anywhere else with anyone else. When your schooling is done and you can take time off to enjoy preparing, enjoy celebrating--when you are ready--then do it then.

When you're working towards your master's degree, you don't have time to breathe, bathe, and eat. Put off all "big" or "emotionally laden" decisions until you get your degree. I barely remember stuff that happened while I was under the stress of working for my MA. Kid's birthdays, parents' anniversaries--so much happened while I was working on my MA, under so much stress, and I hate that I barely recollect any of it.

She knows you love her. You know she loves you. You know that you're going to be together regardless, so why not hold off until you get your degree, where both of you can be involved in the planning and all.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

65. thats exactly my point.

[Shine]

69. How sensible of you.

:hug:

You raise excellent questions. And besides, I'm sure they already feel "married in their hearts". :loveya:

:hi:

[skygazer]

71. I think it all depends on your definition of a "real" wedding

I read about couples who decide to elope but then have another ceremony later for their family and friends. Which is the "real" wedding?

To me, what is real - and what is important - is the legal binding of a couple as joined in marriage. It is not about everyone else - it is about you and Lisa.

I understand your wanting what you want and she wanting what she wants. This is not something that invites easy compromise.

Let me ask you a question - would you feel less married if you jumped on a plane and came to California (hopefully to the Bay Area where I could attend your wedding if so honored with an invite - *hint, hint*) than you would if you waited until 2009 and had whatever it is you envision?

If so, I respect that but I guess I look at it in a different light. To me, what is important is the legal significance, not the trappings.

:hug: :hug: :hug:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

72. to me the legalties are less important right now

because we are still young and we wont have federal rights no matter what

to me marriage (right now, between lisa and me) is a social recognition of a commitment

i think if i got married ten years from now, maybe the legal rights would take far more precedence.

if i go to SF to get married.. i will invite all of you!! especially you

[skygazer]

75. ....

:hug:

:loveya:

[IndianaJones]

74. I'd like to congratulate you on snagging a white woman. nt.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

78. you too nt

[Fleshdancer]

76. weddings are designed to be a complete nuisance

Whether you plan something in town or across the country, the entire process is time draining and flat out annoying when you have a full life already. The ridiculous clothes, the flowers, the food, the guests...none of it's necessary. Add to that the very harsh reality that gay marriages are still very new and many people do have problems with it and I completely understand (to the best of my abilities) what you mean.

To answer your question though...yes, you are being unfair but not in the way you think you are. All the planning and all the annoying issues you have to deal with won't benefit Lionesspriyanka 2009 at all. It honestly won't benefit Lisa 2009 either. At the end of the day, all the headaches and the schedule conflicts and the ridiculous bickering will be for the creation of an incredible memory that will make you smile for the rest of your life. Sweetheart, you're being unfair to Lionesspriyanka 2059 by denying yourself this. Regret is such an awful thing.

Right now it's "gay marriage" but in the past it was NO marriage. Before you die, it will simply be called marriage because of what you do and how you fight today. No it's not perfect yet, but we fight tooth and nail to secure the rights for future generations and not necessarily our own. Please don't deny yourself your right to equality due to inconvenience or because the system isn't perfect yet. That would defeat the point.

ON EDIT: It's been a long day and I fear I misread your OP. I thought the plan was to fly to CA after you graduated. Are you feeling rushed into things now?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

77. i feel like i have too much on my plate and cannot possibly organize

a wedding by end august

[MichiganVote]

79. matrimony with acrimony usually doesn't bode well. better solve the problem or cancel it all.

[NewJeffCT]

80. A wedding is something that should never be rushed!

If you get married, it is supposed to be forever. If you're going to be together forever, there should be no need to rush into it.

Of course, I can't follow my own advice there - my first marriage lasted less than a year before she filed for divorce, and we'd been together for almost 2 years before that.

However, my 2nd marriage is going on 7 years now, and we were together for less than a year before we got married (of course, her wielding a shotgun helped move it along...)