What's going on? Cops upset me to no end.

[BiggJawn]

I was at the grocery store tonight, and saw 3 cops walking around. they weren't pushing carts or shopping, indeed, I don't know what they were doing. But it pissed me off to see them swaggering down the aisle in their buzz-cuts and black ballistic-nylon BDU's and lead-palmed "sap gloves" and combat boots.

What ever happened to the days when cops dressed like they wanted to help the public, instead of trussing-up for a major hoe-down? What's next, Robo-cop armour?

Doesn't do a thing for their public image, IMO. They wanna instill fear, OK, they scare me. but after they're gone, then I get pissed.

This doesn't seem like a normal, logical reaction. Am I coming off my spool, or does anyone else feel their short hairs prickle whan Johnny Law comes strolling by?

And I'm a 47-y-o "Law-Abiding citzen" who's never been in a beef with the law.

Is it Arschloch's fault?

[kalian]

1. Don't FEAR them...that is what they want you to feel....

they are NOTHING. NOTHING! :mad:
Just like Hitler's brownshirts....they have no power over us, just
violence and when the time comes violence they will receive right
back.
The American people should never bow down to anybody. Not even their
so-called government. We put them up there and we sure as hell can
get them out of there.

I want my country back! NOW! :mad:

[BiggJawn]

3. Uh, kalian, you forget ONE important facet....

They carry GUNS, and have a modicum of authority to use them...

[Mikimouse]

4. GUNS?

Nickle plated phalli would be a better description. Not all of them, but many of the ones I have known.

[LastKnight]

6. we have the right...

to carry guns too... mind you... and if they or anyone else for that matter, were to take unlawful violent action against you, you would have the right to defend yourself.

(i am NOT advocating unprovoked violence of any form)

-LK

[TexasMexican]

21. irrational fear of guns.

I dont let police intimidate me.

I especially refuse to fear them just because they have guns.

Maybe when that gun is drawn and pointed at me then I will have a will have a rational reason to fear it, but as long as its in that holster it doesnt mean anything.

[leftyandproud]

10. YOU are absolutely...

INSANE

Don't break the law...Don't lie, cheat, steal, or commit violence, and you have nothing to fear from cops. The absolute HATRED I see from some DU'ers makes me gag. My father was a vcop and I've gotten to know several over the years...They are the nicest people on the planet who risk their lives to protect yours. Show a little more respect.

[BiggJawn]

16. OK, so maybe I *AM* insane.

"Don't break the law...Don't lie, cheat, steal, or commit violence..."
Cool, consider it done, no problem.

Now, they still intimidate me with all that black shit they wear. what's your ideas on that?

[DrWeird]

17. "you have nothign to fear from the cops"

Unless of course they shoot you and then plant a weapon on you and call it self defense.

[liberalpress]

29. Unless of course..

...you might be a "terrorist." And the definition is so loose, that it could apply to anybody. You can then be arrested with no charge, incarcerated for an indeterminate peroid and denied counsel and visitation. The Patriot Act. As we like to say down south: "John Ashcroft -- Bless His Heart." We use "bless his heart" down south as euphemism for "too dumb to live."

[Occulus]

32. about three years ago

seven officers showed up at my door for a noise complaint. They proceeded to conduct a warrantless search, woke all my guests, slammed me up against the wall when I tried to get their badge numbers and CO's names, and even threatened me with arrest as I followed them out into the parking lot, still asking questions. I never once threatened them with anything but pen and paper.

Despite the fact that I didn't lie, cheat, or steal anything that night, and despite the fact that that we were all nonviolent that night, I ended up with a cracked rib.

You'll pardon me if I feel less secure when I see a police car these days.

---

A few weeks ago, my husband tried to call his eight-year-old daughter, who lives in Detroit. His ex-wife's new man got on the phone, was very, um, verbal, and threatened his life. We took it seriously; the man has connections to a major and well known Detroit gang. Perhaps you've heard of the 'Crips'?

Our local police did not take us seriously, so we went to the FBI. As it turns out, this guy has a rap sheet a mile long, including assault with a deadly weapon, attempted murder, etc. Our local police refused to investigate the matter. It took the FBI to armtwist them into an investigation.

--

Over a month ago, we witnessed a major drug deal taking place in our parking lot. It was a classic example of drug dealing in action: A man in a Caddy parks. A Man in a truck also parks. The man in the caddy gets out, as does the man in the truck. The man from the truck has a paint can, and he hands it to the man from the Caddy. They both walk to the Caddy, the driver of that car went flip-flip-flip through a wad of bills, hands the driver of the truck the dough, and that driver leaves. The Caddy driver leaves a few moments later.

Once again, our illustrious locals didn't say boo.

So you'll also pardon me if I have less than complete faith in police to "serve and protect". For many of them, the only things they serve and protect are themselves and the Blue Wall of Silence.

[murielm99]

2. I understand what you are saying.

I am 55, and I have never been in trouble with the law either. And I know most of the cops in my small town, and some of the sheriff's police. I am friendly with some of them.

But there are times I have the same reaction that you had...Dunno why.

Were they looking for something or someone, at the store where you shop?

Are they as scared as we are, sometimes?

The world is upside down.

[zbdent]

5. Are you in a concealed-carry state?

Would explain why they are putting on the tough show.

[BiggJawn]

9. We've always been a concealed carry state.

It's only been in recent years that your average Patrolman has been grabbing his clothes from the SWAT team's locker.

"Tough Show" pretty much puts it in a nutshell. "Me Cop, You PERP!"

[bluestateguy]

7. The militarization of police must stop

Police should do police work. The military should do military work. When these two institutions mix you have a recipie for totalitarianism.

[alwynsw]

33. Police are by design a paramilitary organization

I'd prefer to see the trditional blue uniforms, but I understand the appeal of tactical gear. It's generally made of tougher material - you don't have to replace nearly as many torn garments after wrestling matches with suspects. Lots of places to put things - extra pockets on the trousers and blouses (yes, blouses - not shirts or jackets) and cops have extras stuff to carry these days such as latex gloves, face shields (for CPR), tactical radios, etc. Sewn on, cloth badges don't generally get lost in scuffles and they don't offer any opportuntiy for injury during a scuffle as do metal badges. The tactical clothing, which is patterned after military BDU's is also more comfortable nad has a looser fit in the blouse to accomodate bullet resistant vests. There are more reasons in favor of tactical gear, but there are a few to mull over.

Do cops look more imposing or threatening in tactical gear as opposed to blue serge? You bet. Is that a good thing? Only in a few instances. Do I personally care what they wear on duty? Hell. I don't care if the were Godzilla suits with tutus so long as they get the job done.

How to reduce the fear of cops? Instead of doing something I have observed several times (and gotten into a fistfight over my comments concerning it on one occasion, but that's another tale) such as telling a misbehaving child that you're going to "Have that policeman/woman over there take you to jail if you don't behave". Try pointing out a cop - or a firefighter EMT, ,paramedic, etc. - to your child and tell them that if they ever are lost need help; look for someone in a uniform like that: those people will help you.

I understand your concern, but in this case, clothes don't make the man (or woman). The clothes just make it easier for them to do their jobs.

[Cleita]

8. Okay, if someone in the store called them because there was

a problem or maybe they spotted someone they think is wanted, I guess they shouldn't look like they are stalking but they do look that way unfortunately.

[alwynsw]

34. Good point

It's hard to look as though you're not hunting when that's exactly what you're doing.

Perhaps this store had had a rash of robberies or shoplifting and the cops were "showing the flag" to dissuade future activity of that kind.

[Pobeka]

11. I think you are over-reacting.

Look at it this way -- they have to face potentially life-threatening situations when they go to work. All the equipment is to help them do their job.

Is there the occasional bad apple in the barrel -- sure, just like any group of people. (And there are also some towns/cities with whole forces that are rotten).

But I'll bet most of them are there because they are sincere about the work. And if you look past the equipment and uniform, you'll find another person ready to smile and have a friendly chat about the weather.

I say give them a chance. They deserve that.

[BiggJawn]

14. Can't do it.

It's too high a wall for me to get over. All that nylon, leather and steel screams "Totalitarian" to me. Why don't they just "complete the ensemble" and carry M-16's when they're out of their cruisers?

"Officer Friendly" is a thing of the past. These days look more and more like a bad Sci-Fi movie come to life.

[david_vincent]

15. I had a friend in college

whose friend was raped by an on-duty, uniformed, cop.
My personal experience has been simply that police have been of no use
whatsoever to me. In all four instances in which I've been victimized,
reporting the incidents resulted in no arrests, no action, and, as far as I could tell, no real interest on the part of the police.
On the other hand, I have friends who have definitely been exploited by police in the Seattle area in their competition to win a trip to the Caribbean for writing the most tickets.

[Pobeka]

23. Seems to me all these (save the rape), are about police mgmt, not cops

I'm making assumptions here, so forgive me if I'm assuming wrong.

The rape qualifies as a "bad apple". I'm sorry it happened.

In regards to the other events:

I think we've failed as a society to keep our police well funded. So, they have to prioritize what to do with their time. If you weren't the victim of a violent crime, I'd expect little from the police. They just simply don't have the manpower to investigate non-violent crime.

The Seattle ticket-writing episode does not say the cop on the beat was doing anything wrong. Blame that one on police administration. Also blame it on your friends -- after all, you don't normally get tickets for obeying the law...

[LastKnight]

12. i can sometimes get carried away...

when the cops come around too... not when thier in their regular dress but when they bring out all the fancy intimidation dress like you are describing. that and when they bring the dogs to my school and search our cars and lockers just cause were teenagers... sure there are one or two hits in the school but rarely a posative (at my school anyway). even talk of martial law and police state possabilities gets me a bit angry at the police and military. but i wont get started... sure thier here to supposedly protect us, but i think alot of em are just doing it for the power trip. and i have family in law enfocement... so im not exactly proud of my thoughts on these things.

-LK

[Wonder_Cow]

13. I'm in a semi-rural bedroom community of 33,000

in Northern California, and I've noticed (in the 4 or so years that I've lived here) that our police are getting younger and much heavier armed. Most all of their squad cars have M4s in addition to the standard shotgun. To me, there is something discerning about having a squad car with 2 shoulder arms parked outside a middle school.

We had maybe one murder last year.

Overkill?

[IronLionZion]

18. If you were being robbed, you'd want a cop to help you

ok so they shouldn't try to intimidate people but show some respect. A sizable majority of them are good people who will help you. The corrupt ones and bullies will always be there so what can you do?

[Art_from_Ark]

20. Off topic, but that's quite a sig line you've got there

Democrats don't like to spend the money they earn? Says who?

And back on topic, police on "routine patrol" in Darth Vader outfits are just plain creepy.

[TexasMexican]

22. If I was being robbed...

I would want a gun in my hands and something behind the robber to distract them.

For the most part Police dont stop crimes, they investigate them.

[HalfManHalfBiscuit]

19. Relax

In Italy they carry machine guns.

[pink_poodle]

24. I hear you!! -nm

:

[solinvictus]

25. Militarization of the police

Since the attacks in 2001, I've seen national trends of police militarization in actions and appearances. Locally, they've obtained an armored personnel carrier and some have, like another message indicates, begun to carry M4 carbines in their vehicles. Unfortunately, there is an "us vs. them" culture in many departments. This concerns me if we have a seizure of power from the top because more than likely, they won't hesitate to fire on us. Keep your powder dry.

[TexasMexican]

26. M4 Carbine in the car

IMO having a rifle in the car is justified, there are times when a pistol or a shotgun just cant do the job.

Such as in that bank robbery in LA with the guys that had AKs and body armor had the regular cops had rifles they would have faired alot better.

So I think having a rifle in the car or in the trunk of the car is okay.

However I definately see the potential for the US to turn into a police state.

When the police start having random checkpoints being guarded with rifle toting guards then that is pretty fucked up.

[solinvictus]

30. Rifle in the car...

Yeah, I have to admit that I agree with you because a 9/mm service weapon isn't enough for the job in that case. My problem is when the police act like ninja wanna-bes and completely ignore the fact that they're public servants. A line from the trailer for the recent movie "SWAT" about getting into a killing mode comes to mind. Yes, I know it's Hollywood, but at the same time, that attitude of "us vs. them" is not good for the country. Look at the recent Miami protests as an example.

[Nostradammit]

28. Uh...seems to me that seizure of power from the top -

is a done deal. Can't imagine what else to call it - when you start getting away with rigging elections, you done grabbed the reins.

Used to be they enslaved you with brute force. Then they realized it was easier to do it with the fear of God. Now they do it with money, which has become their god, and you can still maintain the illusion that you are free.

As for the police, many of them believe they are fighting for Truth, Justice, and the American Way, and some of them are just high on their own little sphere of power. God help them if they ever truly have to decide to fight for the people or for the powerful.

I just try to see them as brothers and sisters trying to make it through life and treat them with the respect they deserve.

[Hogarth]

27. Yeah, I was with a Wisconsin Sheriff's Department ...

... for eleven years, and it was my observation that most cops (90%) adopt an attitude of superiority, treating the accused like shit, simply by virtue of the fact that they've been detained.

I once got in trouble for commenting in a report that a very fine line separates the behavior of the police and the "misbehavior" of the accused.

Over the course of those eleven years I was able to get to know inmates and cops alike, and the experience impressed me to that extent: It's a very fine line that separates the criminal from the local police.

Maybe I could have carried on longer as a department supervisor had I not reported my opinions, but what the hell ... that's all in the past.

[bobthedrummer]

31. I have a step-brother who was a City of Milwaukee police officer

for about 5 years. He was forced to resign for the good of the Department after they learned about his 14 year old girlfriend.
In the racism department of my step-brother, there's no discernable difference from the KKK IMO.

Today it's a real ugly paramilitary ATTITUDE, too many hot-dogs on the police forces IMO.