don't f*&^ with my family. round 437,786

[mopinko]

really, i try to be a sane, calm person. but, damn it, do not fuck with my family.
i have 5 genius children. 4 are misfits, like me. the baby is an almost flawless being. she has a few bad spots in her immune system. other than that? pretty much nada.
so, here in chicago, there is the annual ritual of frenzy for the 3000 spots in what they call selective enrollment schools. in a perfect world, they would be considered an appropriate education, which all 12,000 kids that are allowed to apply for them (yes, allowed) deserve. there is a formula that takes 7th grade grades, iowa scores, attendance, and entrance exams.
you have to get about 900 of the possible 1000 points to get in. the letter says perfect got 809 points, SOL. no wait, let me add that up. gee, i get 898. damn. strap on the battle gear. look out you bureaucrat. i'm comin' to get you. answer your fucking phone.

[ZombieNixon]

1. Wow. Good luck.

:hi:

[mopinko]

2. thanks but

you might want to call that bureaucrat and wish him good luck. i may not win, but i am gonna get my pound of flesh.

[ZombieNixon]

3. Bureaucrats don't deserve my good wishes.

:P

[mopinko]

4. true.

but for this guys family's sake, i hope he owns an asbestos suit.

[Rabrrrrrr]

5. But wait - isn't it the DU position that smart kids should be swatted down?

And that you should be flamed for even thinking that intelligence is any kind of matter to be quantified and/or celebrated? And that we shouldn't even talk about "smart" kids or people, certainly not "geniuses"?

:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

Ah, I can't wait for the flamers to appear.

:popcorn:

[Critters2]

7. It's also the DU position that Chicago is the greatest city in the world

So, what's with this effed-up school system? :shrug:

Speaking of asbestos suits...

[mopinko]

12. folks like you don't want to pay their taxes.

so they have to scrimp and scrape.

[Critters2]

13. I pay my taxes, and never even complain about it

Who are "folks like me"?


On edit: A HUGE percentage of my taxes go to your fair city, though I never do myself. And, apparently, there's plenty of money to build Olympic stadiums. Maybe that money should be educating children.

[mopinko]

22. olympics will not be using tax dollars.

and, i doubt any of you tax money goes to my city. we are a net tax donor, by a lot.
in fact, city schools have improved greatly under daley. new schools built, repair backlogs being cleared. more specialty schools, more honors/magnet programs in local schools. most of the decay can be blamed on rethug governors. even my own gripe- there are 3000 seats now. there were about 1200 ten years ago.
find it hard to believe there is anything that you don't carp about, tho.

[LSK]

15. Not.Taking.The.Bait.

:hi:

[mopinko]

16. you're a better man than i. nt

[LSK]

18. I ALMOST fell for it

[grace0418]

19. Wow, do you do a keyword search on threads that say "chicago" just so you

can make a snarky comment?

I don't think it's greatest city in the world by any stretch (I personally want to move to the west coast). But it's astounding how many threads with even the slightest passing mention of Chicago have some kind of negative comment from you. Even if the thread isn't actually about Chicago.

Why so much hatred for a geographical location? Isn't it hard work coming up with new ways to insult Chicago and anyone who lives there? Did Chicago beat you up and steal your lunch money? Did Chicago call you names on the playground?

[Critters2]

20. Why do you care?

Besides, in this thread, mopinko is the one complaining about Chicago. Scream at him.

[grace0418]

25. I don't, really. Just find it curious that anyone could hate a place so much that they

have to complain about it ad nauseum even when it's completely off topic.

And mopinko was complaining about getting a kid into school. The fact that the school was in Chicago was pretty incidental as far as I could tell. School systems all over the country are having problems. That's hardly the same thing as making blanket statements, repeatedly, about an entire geographical location.

And by the way, I wasn't screaming at anyone. Notice nothing was in all caps.

[bicentennial_baby]

21. Thank you!!!

:rofl:

[mopinko]

24. yes, apparently chicago did.

been down this road before. hard to resist joining in the sport of it now, i'm afraid.

[grace0418]

27. Oh I know. It's utterly bizarre.

I think, from now on, every thread I start is going to have the word "chicago" it just to see what happens. Even if my thread is about the Oscars, or foot odor, or Australia, or Scooter Libby. Somewhere in there I'm going to mention "I live in Chicago..." or "I was reading in the Chicago Tribune..." or "I was on the corner of Chicago and Damen and..." just to see what new creative ways this person can insult the evil sinkhole I live in.

We should start keeping a record.

Except that I don't care enough.

:)

Oh, and p.s., stop complaining about Chicago mopinko. That is apparently what your original post was about. :eyes:

[mopinko]

32. somehow folks missed that fact that i was just

bragging about what a bitch i can be. my city is perfect, and i would never compain about it. :eyes:

[Critters2]

67. Perfect?

What about that snake pit of a high school you're fighting to keep your kid out of?

[Susang]

34. But Grace, you don't understand!

Somebody stole her car when she lived here for a single year!!! And we Chicagoans didn't feel the appropriate sympathetic horror at her situation!!!
:cry:

[mopinko]

35. hey, i packed my bags as soon as i heard.

but it was in the middle of the school years, so i waited. then i started stealing cars myself, just to keep up our image. then....

[Susang]

41. I had my car stolen twice while living in Detroit

I that really does mean Chicago is a horrible, horrible place! :scared:

[Critters2]

44. I have a right to my opinion

Even if it's an opinion you don't agree with. Even a negative opinion about your city. And I have the right to express that opinion as often as I please. Welcome to free speech.

[grace0418]

51. And everyone else has the right to think your endless repetition of

that bizarrely and disproportionately negative opinion is incredibly tiresome. And we have the right to tell you so.

Welcome to free speech.

[Critters2]

52. Yes. Yes you do.

Won't improve my opinion of aforementioned city, though.

[grace0418]

58. Nobody's asking you change your opinion. I just still can't for the life of me

figure out why you insist on repeating it so much. I swear, I don't talk about my loathing of George Bush nearly as much as you talk about hating Chicago. And George Bush has had a hell of a lot more negative effect on my life and the lives of everyone on this planet than Chicago could've ever had on you. But hey, if it makes you happy to repeat yourself, go for it.

[Critters2]

62. So, if you don't care, why do feel the need to respond?

Why do Chicagoans get so defensive? People bitch about NYC all the time, and New Yorkers take it in stride. Chicagoans take it personally. Why is that?

[grace0418]

65. I've never seen a DUer bitch about NYC or any other place on earth

as much as you bitch about Chicago. And if I did see someone doing that in threads where the OP just happened to mention they lived in NYC (or Auckland, or Timbuktu, or wherever), I would ask them the same questions I'm asking you. It's one thing if the OP said "Hey everyone, what is your honest opinion of New York City (or Chicago, or Auckland, or Timbuktu)?" It's another thing entirely to perk one's ears up at the faintest, passing mention of a place on any thread anywhere on DU just to chime in with your already well-traveled opinion.

As I said before, I don't think Chicago is the greatest place on earth, so that hardly qualifies as defensive. And I certainly don't care what your opinion is of Chicago or anywhere on earth. It's more a curiosity, like a car accident.

[Critters2]

66. Really? When you see a car accident, do you get out and

bitch at the people involved about how they screwed up your drive? Or do you ignore it and drive by?

And you may not be defensive about Chicago, but others are. I don't know why, but they are.

You just can't drive by a car accident without commenting on it. That is fascinating.

[grace0418]

68. Fascinating indeed.

Like carrying around a huge amount of bile for a place on a map.

[Critters2]

70. No. Not really like that at all.

If Chicago is a wonderful place, and I somehow missed that fact, what difference does it make to you?

You are defensive, and I don't see why. So I don't like Chicago, and I don't. How does that affect you?

[grace0418]

74. Your opinion doesn't affect me. Your tiresome repetition of it everywhere I turn

does though. I ignored it on many, many threads. But good lord, give it a rest already. We get it, you don't like Chicago. Point duly noted in the Great Chicago Record Book. No need to reiterate it any further. Really. I swear.

Bejeezus. If anyone is defensive, I'd say it's you.

[Critters2]

76. Does it. Continuing to be fascinating. My repetition of an opinion

(a widely held opinion where I live) affects you. Amazing. Really.

[grace0418]

78. That's generally how it works when you post things on public message boards.

If you repeat the same (usually completely off-topic) opinion over any over again without anyone having asked for it, you start to annoy people. Not really fascinating or amazing, really. Just the way it is.

[Critters2]

80. You're the only one responding

Why is it such an issue for you? If you stopped responding, this conversation would end.

Like this...

[grace0418]

83. Everyone else has had their shot, I've seen the many threads with others responding.

And if you look, there are several people that either said they wouldn't take the bait this time or they thanked me for saying it. I guess I'm just hoping that one of us might get through to you.

Hopefully you meant it when you said the conversation was ended. Hallelujah.

At least until your search button finds another thread that mentions C-h-i-c-a-g-o.

[mopinko]

84. or a thread started by the evil chicago defender-

mopinko.

[grace0418]

87. Yes, how dare you utter the name of that horrible place in a thread!

Even if it's just in passing, and has nothing to do with the subject of the post,

[Critters2]

88. Referring to the public schools as snake pits isn't much of a defense

You like parts of Chicago, other parts you avoid. I avoid the whole city. We're not that different.

[grace0418]

91. You're not really clear on the concept of sarcasm are you?

Fascinating.

[Name removed]

71. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Critters2]

77. Yes, I know New Yorkers. Most of 'em are proud of the fact that not

everyone likes New York. They like it that way. I've spent a good amount of time in NY. They don't see life as a popularity contest. You don't like New York? They shrug, or maybe tell you to F off, once, and that's the end of it. They don't care.

Chicagoans take it as a personal affront, and go on the defensive.

[Rabrrrrrr]

99. And a NYC person will go "Yeah, it IS a filthy, dirty, bad-air, hot humid too-expensive crap-hole"

but then go on to say "But I love it anyway".

I don't know if you'll find anyone who disses NYC more than the people who live in, and love it.

We really don't care what other people think of it, though we are happy when they like it the way that we do.

I've never felt the need to go on ad nauseum to defend it, though - certainly my sense of self-worth isn't tied to whether someone thinks it a shithole or not.

Maybe NYCers are just more honest.

Yeah, it's dirty, loud, obnoxious, and not as nice as more modern cities. But it's also the only place you're gonna see a 60 year old guy with a wild beard, wearing a bunny suit with tinfoil wrapped around his head with an attached sign saying "The CIA was reading my mind with lasers and turning my brain into diamonds for secret experiments!" and his dick hanging out singing Disney show tunes and telling people to try to be happier and enjoy life.

[Midlodemocrat]

90. .

:rofl:

:thumbsup:

[grace0418]

53. Oh, now that you explain it. Wow, I need to move tomorrow. I guess the 15 years

I've lived in the city and 22 years prior that I lived near the city are all a big waste. I should really go now. It's been tainted for me.

[Midlodemocrat]

8. Having been on the receiving end of those flames

I totally agree with you.

:rofl:


:thumbsup:

[Shakespeare]

17. How in fucking hell did I miss THAT flamefest?

Jesus Flipping Christ. There are smart kids and not smart kids. Both have different needs. And thanks very much, but I'll be calling on the brain surgeon with the higher med school GPA.

[Rabrrrrrr]

23. There have been quite a few, especially during a tim when

a few of us were asking for a forum for people with high-IQ kids and/or who were the abused/scorned high-IQ kids in school, to talk about the trials and tribulations of being high-IQ, ether as a kid or an adult.

The hate that came out in those threads was fucking appalling. And amazing. I don't think anyone saw it coming, and I found it shameful.

And, as you'll notice, no, there are no discussion groups for that group of people.

[Shakespeare]

26. How very Lord of the Flies.

How very Bush-like. We don't understand what the smart kid is saying, so let's hit him with sticks! And variations thereon.

Sign o' the times, comrade.

[Rabrrrrrr]

28. It's fucking weird - go start a thread, and see what happens.

You'll drop your pants in amazement at the bile and hate.

[mopinko]

30. or kick this one a few times. i think they have

the scent, now.

[mopinko]

29. yeah, that spot still

"smarts"
threads are in my journal.

[BluePatriot]

42. no kidding...

remember when they wanted to create the Gifted/Talented forum? Oh man.

:popcorn:

edit for typo...i'm smart, really!

[Rabrrrrrr]

47. Yes, I do - and the hatefilled shitbags really came out of the woodwork.

I was stunned at the vitriol and hate being expressed toward those who, through no fault of their own but only the quirk of fate, are smarter than the average person.

Sheesh. Really solidified the low feelings I already had for the normals.

[BluePatriot]

59. *nods*

That whole thing really wierded me out too. A definite "there's no such thing as smart people" vibe which was really creepy. Eh. Best to not think about it I guess.

[MsKandice01]

95. Yeah, I got flamed pretty badly also...

For asking if anyone here was a member of Mensa. I personally see my high IQ is more of a curse than a benefit but I guess it's hard to understand if you haven't been there yourself.

[jpgray]

6. They'd probably be harrassed in that school full of kids 2+ points better than them

The dumped books, the pantsing, the smug "like mopinko's kids but +2" armbands... they're better off.

[Critters2]

10. The pantsing!! LOL!! nt

[mopinko]

11. the school she wants is really good one

heavy into the humanities. place is full of humans.

[Name removed]

9. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[grace0418]

14. I'm sorry mopinko. Good luck with everything.

Why children should have to compete to get a good education is beyond me.

[mopinko]

36. 30 years of republican in the governor's mansion

and a good plan to fix it that came, unfortunately, from a woman who was not pretty. nuts. just nuts.
thanks for the good wishes.

[EFerrari]

31. Give them hell, Mo. Make 'em sorry they were born @ssholes.

:mad:

[mopinko]

33. evil grin back at ya.

thanks.
looking forward to seeing you.

[Susang]

37. How do we know they're assholes?

I'm all for Mo fighting to get her kids the best education possible, but why are we automatically assuming the administrators & teachers who make these decisions are assholes just trying to keep her kids down? I'd hate for every person who didn't agree with a judgment of mine to automatically brand me an asshole. Hardly seems fair. :shrug:

[EFerrari]

38. Sorry -- I had two kids that were systematically abused for having

learning differences and high IQs. By @ssholes who couldn't be bothered. I'm sure not an impartial observer here, that's for sure. And that was in liberal Berkeley!

Not to mention, if Mo says she's having trouble with @ssholes, I believe her, every single time.

[Susang]

39. Her OP didn't say they were assholes

Just that she was "comin' to get them". Confrontational, yes, but not the same as accusing them of being assholes before she's even spoken to them.

I know a few people who work for or with the Chicago public schools, doing jobs that involve evaluating kids, something that no parent is ever happy about. You can disagree with their assessments and believe their opinions are wrong, but that I don't think that makes them assholes.

[EFerrari]

40. Then we disagree. I hope Mo reams the @ssholes.

90% of the contacts I've had with people in public health, education or psychiatry have been in the context of dealing with @ssholes. They are condescending @ssholes who somehow have lost track of the reason they went into public health, education or psychiatry.

Most parents have no reason to be "happy" that their kids are being handled by @ssholes.

You haven't lived till your 6 yr old kid comes home and asks you what "IEP shit" means because he heard it from his "specialist".

Well, I'm a doctor, too. And in my considered if free opinion, our system is infested with @ssholes.

:)

[Susang]

43. There are assholes everywhere

The come in all shapes and sizes. I'm assuming you've never been struck physically by one of your child's therapists or teachers? Or had them threaten (and actually try) to get you fired for having the audacity to tell the truth and not give them the diagnosis they're hoping for?

And no, I've never had my 6 year old come home and say anything to me, as I don't have children. Have you ever had your younger sister come home bloody and bruised from the child she's been working with has kicked the living crap out of her? The child who's parents insist is perfectly normal refuse to believe he/she has a developmental disorder.

Just because your experience has been with assholes, doesn't mean that all people in that profession are assholes. Unless everyone in the world is an asshole, which at this point, may be entirely possible.

[EFerrari]

45. Susan, I don't want to share my medical record with you

because I don't go around traumatizing people on a whim.

Yes, I've been there with a family member who made me look like Mike Tyson after a bad bout. It's ugly as hell.

And I'm so sorry. Our kids are not getting what they need from a sonambulent system. It doesn't please me to think or to feel this way. It's just the way it is.

[Susang]

48. I wouldn't ask you to

That's nobody's business but your own. What I'm trying to get across is, I just don't think it's right to judge an entire profession based on a single person's perspective. If that were the case, people would be justified in hating all of the doctors, lawyers, waiters, retail clerks, police officers, entertainers, bad drivers, etc., etc. I'm sure a lot of my clients are sure that I'm a complete asshole. For all I know, they could be right. Pretty much the only people that wouldn't be considered assholes would be Mother Theresa, Ghandi and Jesus Christ (if you even believe he existed).

[EFerrari]

50. When an entire profession stands down to abuse and neglect,

yes, we can get out the tar.

[greatauntoftriplets]

46. My niece is a psychiatric nurse practitioner, who works a lot with adolescents....

in underprivileged neighborhoods. We worry about some of the neighborhoods she has to visit. You have never met a more compassionate individual.

A good friend is a psychiatric nurse at a local VA hospital (and you should hear what she has to say about the VA...it'd curl Jim Nicholson's toes). She has done significant research through her career on PTSD patients.

Both are trying to do their very best. Very hard and in often difficult circumstances.

[EFerrari]

49. And God love her. She is in a minority.

I manage a mental health list where people speak pretty freely. I'm sorry to say that isn't their experience most of the time. :(

There are many reasons for this situation. But, I can't help thinking that people have to take a stand, at a personal level, for what is happening.

I don't mean to sound horrible and must sound that way, I guess. But we have to fight back at every level to maintain even the most minimal standards of service.

It's not happening.

[mopinko]

60. nurses, in my experience

are the best part of any of these systems. but like so many who could change things, they are treated like dirt, and kept in a state of panic, until they are too overwhelmed to put their foot down.
the best teachers i know are as angry at the system as me. rock-hard place.

[mopinko]

55. you're the best.

that's all i can say. susang is a good person, too, tho.
now everyone jsut send those angry vibes to mr selective enrollment, eh. tomorrow i will not be polite any more.

[EFerrari]

57. We really are all on the same side.

We want the kids to get what they need.

You, go, Mo.

:hug:

[mopinko]

61. i got no choice-

the neighborhood high school is a regular snake pit.

[Critters2]

63. Which high school? nt

[mopinko]

73. sullivan

or senn.

[Critters2]

81. Sullivan is really diverse.

I'd think that would be good for kids. Would teach 'em progressive values.

And I thought Senn was being turned into a ROTC academy or something.

[mopinko]

85. hey. my kids live in the city. they like diverse.

they don't even notice what color people's skin is.
but that doesn't mean they like violence. sullivan is not that diverse. it is populated mostly by kids whose parents can't do any better than a snake pit, for one reason or another. whatever color they are, they are moslty not nice people.
senn has a school within a school, rickover naval academy. it remains a neighborhood high shcool. not a warm fuzzy place either.

[Critters2]

64. But SOMEBODY's children will have to go to that snake pit,

won't they? Just not yours. I see.

[mopinko]

72. so what should i do? firebomb it? nt

[Critters2]

79. Send your kids to school there. That's what other parents will have to do. nt

[mopinko]

89. you don't have any kids, do you?

i should ignore the needs and interests of my kids to satisfy your f'ed notion of what? fairness? democracy? and in the meantime, you live out in the exurbs, where all the other big city haters live, and you wag your finger at me? really, you are a couple of card shy of a deck, pal, you really are.

[Critters2]

93. I'm in the process of adopting and my kids will go to public schools

in whatever community we live in.

My work has brought me to live here. I trust you have good reason to live where you do. I've lived in places city-dwellers looked down their noses at. You've chosen to live where you do. Not everyone has choices. I worry that public schools in both large cities and small towns, are becoming the dumping grounds, where people who can get something else believe those less fortunate should be. While the more fortunate get something better. No community benefits from this. And our communities will be here long after we are, with the consequences of our choices for generations to come.

Oh, and I'm further out than the exurbs. Not as far as I'd like to be. I'd like to be smack in the middle of rural.

[mopinko]

96. you don't know me at all pal

i live in a what used to be a crap ass neighborhood. so don't give me lectures about abandoning communities. i agree that many idiots fled the city to stay away from people of color. that is not the same as fleeing a school where kids are not even safe. to make using your kids as an implement of policy some sort of test of citizenship is sick.

my kids went to the local elementary school, and for a big institution, it is fine. i am grateful for the diversity that they have been exposed to. they honestly barely even notice the color of peoples skin. unfortunately, they were not able to reach their highest potential. they would have been much better off academically in a magnet school. but i also had a kid that did that, and decided that attending the local school was overall the right thing to do. they need community, too. so they got it.
chicago schools have improved greatly. i like my mayor, he cares about the schools, and has worked hard to make them work. magnet schools are part of that, but the local schools are important to him, too. when i moved up here, roofs leaked, windows rattled, and pretty much no special needs were address. kids had weapons in school. every high school needed a full time, armed cop. that has changed tremendously. the new principal at the snake pit is working hard to overturned decades of neglect. why? because people like me, who could afford to live in the burbs, voted with our feet, and made a deal with the mayor that we would stay in the city, but the school had to be cleaned up. i would say that they are half way there.
your entire scenario is wrong. people protecting their kids sent a powerful message. it was heard and heeded. giant leaps have been made.
if you end up with a kid with special needs, i hope that you will fight for that kid. sounds like you approve of sacrificing kids for principles, tho.

[Critters2]

97. I will have a kid with special needs

I won't have geniuses like your kids, and I will fight for them. I will also fight for all kids, as I do now. My children are no more important than the children of those without the resources to fight. Someone needs to fight for those kids, too. I consider that my responsibility.

I don't approve of sacrificing ANY kids--not mine, not ones I'll never meet. They all deserve good schools.

[mopinko]

98. and when the local school is populated

by drug dealers and felons- then what?

[Critters2]

100. Someone's children are dealiing with those conditions

Are you seriously saying only the children of those not clever enough to harangue some poor bureaucrat into letting their kids into a magnet school should be in the schools not good enough for your kid?

How do you decide which kids should be in the bad schools? Skin color, ethnicity, income levels? Oh, that's right--IQ. The kids who really need the best schools shouldn't get them, because that space is reserved for your geniuses.

What do you say to the parents of kids who will be in the "snake pits"? Do you know them? Do you care about them and their children? If they were to ask you what they should do with their children who won't have the opportunity to go to a magnet school, what would you say to them? What, tough shit?

Really, what do you say to those without your good luck?

[mopinko]

101. i say- keep voting for mayor daley.

he has done a lot to turn the schools around. keep him on the job. but i didn't really have to tell them that. they voted for him, 4 to 1.
and i would tell them to fight for their kids. yes, i know them, they are my neighbors. but a lot of these kids don't really have "parents" in the meaning fo the word- a competent adult who can help them. not a crack head, not mentally ill, not overwhelmed by life. i cannot do anything about that.
but you have a woefully inadequate view of the situation if you think that one person can fix it, or should be responsible for it. if i were the good witch of the west, i would wave my magic wand. don't have one though.
and just fyi- this has nothing NOTHING to do with 'GOOD ENOUGH" high iq kids have special needs. they just do. every child is entitled to an appropriate education. every child. they do not muddle along in regular school. they get twisted up, and loose their potential. plain simple fact, of which you are blissfully ignorant.
and quit pointing the finger at me. you ran. i stayed. you have no idea what i have done for cps. here's a clue- lots.
i'm done with this. good luck with your kids. they will need it.

[Critters2]

102. I never said one person can fix it.

The whole community must work together, and you are part of that community. Your local school needs support, even the kids who are different from yours, especially the kids who are different from yours.

[mopinko]

54. wow, i shouldn't go watch a movie with a thread cookin'

just to set a couple of things straight-
for the most part, i think that cps is full of terrific people who work their butts off. and also full of lazy crackpots, and all manner of scum. it just is. i try to sort them carefully.
at this moment, i think i have my hands of a bad one because- he does not answer his phone, or his messages. the a.p. at kiddo's school tried to get him yesterday, and i tried a couple of times today. voicemail, voicemail. this is a really busy time for him, i'm sure, since notifications came out, and, like i said it the OP, they have 12,000 deserving kids fighting for 3000 seats. (this is the part that is SERIOUSLY WRONG! as we know from previous discussions around here, average folks don't see things quite that way, but geez, educators ought to.) still, it's his job to take those calls. and when there is a problem, like a kid whose score came out wrong, that is one call that you can do something about. like, before it is too late. like it will be on soon. friday all those seats are officially accepted by kids whose score was correct.
when i called, the person who answers the phone seemed like she had been covering for days. 'is he in today?' 'well, he's in and out' hmmm. had that 'tired of taking the screaming calls while this guy hides under the desk' voice. if i loose, i loose. but if the score keeper makes a mistake, they better get it fixed. i gave him all the info that he needed to check it out. i just got the feeling that i will not get the benefit of the doubt, here.

[Critters2]

56. I don't mean to offend with this question, but I'm genuinely curious

Why would it be so awful for your kid to go to a neighborhood school, or whatever the alternative is? In small towns, there are no magnet schools. Kids go to the school in their neighborhood, or even the only school in town. Most seem to do okay.

[mopinko]

69. the neighborhood school is a snake pit.

i hear it is getting better. but for over 20 years it had a principle that never left his office. guess he was scared of all those brown children wandering the halls. eventually, the gangbangers owned the place. they had a librarian who thought her job was to protect the books from the kids. they had some of the most jaded, horrid, evil teachers i have ever had the misfortune to meet. i had 2 kids there for a year, and i wouldn't send barb and jenna there.
totaled up, the 5 of them have been in every type of school, including home school. the local elementary school is a good one. we had 2 go through it, including this one. we were active parents, and left it a little better than we found it. miss perfect did ok, her brother- smart but missing something, had a harder time. but at least they had good, competent, caring teachers, with only a few exceptions. they were safe. they were valued.
but, if you don't think that gifted kids have to put up with a lot, go to my journal, and read the threads about a forum for "us". read how supposedly liberal, caring folks look at it. would you want your kid to have to put up with that?
the big thing is that they have also had a chance to do 'geek camp' where they got to be with kids like them. it has brightened up that already bright kid immeasurably to find out that there are other weirdos like her. nobody resented them- kids or teachers. yes, we have dealt with both. they got to learn the way these kids ought to be taught, and i would spend my last dollar, and a bunch i do not have yet, to get that for them all the time.
most of all, they were not bored. they got to do things at the level that they need to be challenged. normal kids can't keep up with what these kids can do. when you do it right, they fly. that's what i want for this kid. she deserves to fly. all the kids like her do, too.
if there was a private school that would work for her, i would cough it up. ain't none.

[Critters2]

75. What would you do in a place with no magnet schools?

Out here, there are no such things. Kids go to school. Four elementary schools, one middle school, one high school. Everyone goes to them--the smart kids, the dumb kids, the perfect kids, the kids with every disability, everyone.

Most of the teachers seem good, but certainly they all aren't. But it's the only game in town, so one makes do.

Having been in communities like this most of my life, I don't understand the idea of trying to get kids onto one school, which seems like abandoning other schools to, well, other kids.

I mean, honestly, someone's kids are going to go to that snake pit. How does one decide which kids they are? And, really, why shouldn't they be your kids?

[mopinko]

82. well, for one thing, that's the kind of thing i love about

the big city. there is pretty much no such thing as the only one in town.

but your logic escapes me completely. should i go live in a cha high rise, since someone's children have too? should i feed them crap food, because children in china are starving? maybe you should move back to chicago, because somebody has to live here. you make no sense.
maybe if all the parents in that district refused to send their kids there, something would happen.

[Critters2]

86. This is what happened to CPS,

people who didn't want their kids in those kinds of schools found ways to get 'em out. Some by moving to the 'burbs, some by insisting on the creation of magnet schools. And thus, ordinary CPS schools were left with difficult kids, the children of people without the resources to get them into "better" schools. This has happened all over the country, in urban and rural schools. People who could get out did get out, and the public schools became "snake pits" to use your terminology.

I lived there when they first created local school boards (can't recall the official name). They were a great thing, putting the neighborhood schools in the hands of the neighborhoods. But in my neighborhood (South Lakeview/Lincoln Park), so many people were sending their kids to private or parochial schools that there was little interest from much of the community. People were shocked when I said that, if I had kids, I'd send my kids to the neighborhood school (Agassiz Elementary, Lakeview High School). BUt I think one has a responsibility to one's community, and should work for the good of all children, not just one's own (for more on my understanding of the role of the citizen in community--called "social contract theory", read pretty much anything by Hobbes).

Ultimately the question is, why shouldn't your kids go to the neighborhood school if someone has to? It is, after all, your neighborhood.

[Midlodemocrat]

92. Been there, done that. I got RESULTS by doing the following.

I got nowhere with the teacher, principal, etc.

I called my DIRECT representative on the School Board.

Whatever your comparable entity is, that is, the entity that is voted in, call him/her.

They HAVE to respond. I have to say, it was amazing the response I got within 24 hours.

PM me for details in you are interested. You may have already decided to go this route, in which case good on ya!

:bounce:

[mopinko]

94. sadly, we have an appointed board.

but after leaving this yokel one more voice mail, i am going to try to get through to the school that she wants to go to. i am hoping that at least i can find out what the cutoff score was this year. completely serendipitously, i am having lunch with a friend who is a retired cps teacher, now education advocate. we have a lot to talk about.