Leaving for Navy on Tuesday

[LiberalSailor]

I'm levaing for Basic Training in the Navy on tuesday and was wondering if anybody had any advice on how a liberal can survive the republican swarm that is present in the military. or any general advice for going to boot camp.
all help appreciated.

[La_Serpiente]

1. It's a good thing you're in the Navy

At least the won't kill you since you are on the boat. Hmm...well...it is going to be hard I must say. You're going to have to listen to your drill sargeant, and that's not easy. You're going to change the entire way you perceive things perhaps.

But I am not in the armed forces. I was in ROTC, but that's it. Were you in ROTC?

[LiberalSailor]

3. rotc

Nope never did rotc was actually raised by my sister as punker since 5th grade so it took quite(sic) a bit of swallowing my morales just to join the military. But after doing roughly 3 years of computer work it was the best option in my life.
though with "the Day" coming up so soon im getting quite nervous.

[La_Serpiente]

4. Perhaps you should ask yourself

Why you are joining the Navy?

[7th_Sephiroth]

10. just one thing

Don't drop the soap

[LiberalSailor]

14. Lol

Thats actually the reason i changed from Submarine to aircracft carrier surface(way to many horror/love stories)

[7th_Sephiroth]

26. that and

you can use deodorant on aircraft carriers

[rppper]

39. actually, subs are more liberal than the surface navy....

smaller crews, waaaayyyyy beter food, better pay and true bonding and life long friendships. submariners are a club that dates back to the early 1900's...they are a brotherhood not unlike that in the marines, from the old diesel boat sailors to the modern nuke boats, from boomers to fast attacks...we are all submariners. we all respect each other for being a submariner. every qualified submariner knows what the other had to go through to EARN that title. you would have been in the top 10% of the navy's brightest. submariners are required to know about each and every one of the ships systems, and unlike the SW pin(surface warfare)which is optional, the SS pin is mandatory. all homosexual jokes aside, you missed out on a great opportunity. have fun being a nameless face among 7000 other sailors on your aircraft carrier...AKA=target...

a word of advice...don't discuss your political leanings unless it is among friends. vote your conscience but don't try to convince the 25+ year master chief or division officer who has voted republican since the reagan era that you are right. believe me when i tell you they will reflect your view via your evals. i have been there and done that.

USN...SK2/SS....'88 thru '97

[thom1102]

41. I have to agree with rppper here

also a voice of experience: USN...ET2/SS... '90-'95. It is real easy to get lost on an aircraft carrier, and easier for you to be the victim of an "accident" if there are any violent RWer's there. As a gay man in the Navy who was nearly outed early in my career, the smaller number of shipmates on a sub makes it easier for you to be tolerated.

You're in for an interesting few weeks. Boot camp is a psychological game designed to break you down and rebuild you in their image. the first week will be relatively light as they let you get accustomed to your new surroundings. After a week, on 1-5 day they get to play their new toys. Nothing you do will be done correctly, nothing you say will be right, and they will PT you and make you do things like crawl across the floor on your back on a dust rag. Then when they have completely exhausted you, they gather you around in a circle, bring out the flag, and turn on Lee Greenwood, and the weak minded will start to cry, and if you manage to see through the facade, you will be choking back your laughter (like I was). If you can keep your mind focused on the fact that it is all a psychological game, and just play along, it isn't that bad. Life get's significantly better after bootcamp, and you will make friends who will mean a lot to you for the rest of your life. It will be fun, and tough at the same time. Good Luck!

BTW, what rate are you going into?

[Elidor]

2. Google "navy boot camp"

There are web sites that can give you valuable info on how to adapt and survive. At least there are for the army and the marines - I'm assuming the same is true of navy boot camp.

Best keep your politics out of it until you clear boot camp. You don't want to draw any attention to yourself. Just blend in and be quiet. This advice applies to people of any political persuasion going to boot camp.

Good luck, you poor bastard.

[LiberalSailor]

5. Yup

Ye i realise im definetinly gonna have to bite my tongue (alot) but was wondering if anyone has any good advice on how to let it all wash over you as i really dont want to come out towing the corporate line after 2 months of indoctrination.

[La_Serpiente]

6. Try and ask the question tommorrow morning....

All the military folk are sleeping in here right now.

[alfredo]

35. don't make the mistake I made

by wearing a numbered jersey. I was picked for everything. Wear neutral colors when you go in. You do not want to stand out from the crowd.

Most of all, keep your mouth shut, ears open. You will do just fine. Once out of basic things will get a whole lot better. Basic is freshman English.

[Journeyman]

7. Good advice. . .

keep your head down, your opinions to yourself, and try to blend into the scenery. Remember: Until you're out of basic, they own you, and they can and will make your life miserable if given cause -- and cause need only be their own pique.

Best of luck! Remember: Basic doesn't last for ever and once you're past it, life gets a lot better.

[LiberalSailor]

8. Thanks.

Thanks for the advice. I'm hoping they dont hold on to my soul after basic but i dunno. Kinda on a posting rampage tonite because im so nervous and the last time i tried to sign up my account got banned immediately dont know why just made a recommendation about the sign up page(but thats neither here nor there).

[neuvocat]

11. You won't have a chance to worry about that.

I was in your shoes when I joined the army. You'll be so busy with all the training that politics will be the last thing that enters your mind. When you get to your permanent duty station there might be more time to reflect on your politics. Rest assured that you'll see you're not alone at all when you go in. There are plenty of like minded folks who don't buy into all that propagandizing-especially when they've dealt with it for a while. You'll be alright.

[RuB]

9. Be prepared for the hardest most PUNISHING physical and

mental trial of your life. You will be pushed to the absolute limit of your physical and mental ability, but you must endure, and remember, "pain is just weakness leaving the body."

And from what I understand you can change your mind right up to the point you step off the bus. If you step off the bus your ass is theirs. Be sure your mind is made up and you are absolutely positive you want to do this. Your going to be ruled by assholes for the most part who on the outside would only be burger king managers(not that all burger king managers are assholes). The key to a successful military tour is taking the tests for advancement. Its better to be the one telling others what to do than to be told what to do. But saying all that its better to go to college and forget the military! Why anyone would go in now with that moran AWOL asshole Bush as CIC is beyond me.

[LiberalSailor]

13. Special Circumstance

I definatley agree about * being the commander a bad thing but i qualified for the nuke field which means im in school for a minimum of 1 1/2 years which hopefully will be enuff to get him out (diebold willing) but my options of financial debt/getting paid for schooling were convincing to me. And I have worked for a ex marine drill sergeant that acted like he still was one (Sure I'll be laffing about this after i get off the bus). Thats the one thing im looking forward to in the military is the advancement by test as ive been passed up by so many people that are just better at sucking up than I am(anyone seen office space?)and as far as Burger queen managers you havent seen some of the people at (insert massive french media conglomerate). Thanks though the replies so far have helped to solidify my ideas maybe not coddling me but hey life is real and it aint always pretty.

[RuB]

17. Well good luck to ya! And one things for sure

you ain't seen nothing till you've seen a 20 or 30 foot wave! And above all DO NOT THROW UP INTO THE WIND!

[HEyHEY]

12. Good luck

Enjoy the sea

[sventvkg]

15. Navy Basic is pretty Easy physically..Not as easy as Air Force...

I was an Army Ranger so That should give you and Idea of the level of training that I had to go through..In a word, it was EXCRUCIATING!!! but very personally rewarding to actually get through..I have known many Navy men and women and their Boot Camp is on the easier side physically but it's still a Mental game as far as everything else..You will get yelled at alot, they will try to confuse and trip you up..it's all a game, just keep telling yourself that, do what they say and get through it..It's only 8 weeks of your life..Your A school will be much more liberal..My advice..DO NOT stick out..Don't make comments or act like a wise ass..Just Do what you need to do when they tell you and realize all the instructer's yelling is just a game to keep you stressed and confused, is all just a really funny game for them most part..They instructers actually laugh about it when you are not in their presence..Anyway, you'll be fine if you just think of it in that light and play the game...:)

[captainamerica101]

21. I'm with you sventvkg! A CUSHY PLACE!

Ever dug dirt (sand really) with your nose?

That was a hoot!

This sailor has nothing to fear above deck, or from his BT.

I hear the Navy puts the mental screws down pretty good but is way softer of the body (half the kid's battle).
(It must have something to do with making sure they stay at their post which is often under or near the water line, eh?)

(Really guy, you'll be allright. Stay out of "sight" was GREAT ADVICE. Do so! DON'T laugh when they are trying to screw with your head either. They'll really give it to you then if they know you are are far stronger up there than they thought! ZONE IN DRILL! FIND A BLANK ZONE IN YOUR NUGGET! PUT IT IN "FRONT" OF YOU AND USE YOUR EARS. EYE CONTACT WITH HIGHER RANK is the kind of "standing out" mentioned above that will find you swabbing decks real fast matey! And good luck from me too! We'll all hang back here and make sure you get a welcome home from a nice Democratic man in a flight suit this time as well. Our gift to you.)

[TreasonousBastard]

16. Back during the 'Nam years...

most of us were draftees, so it was a little different. The potential lifers had their groups, and we had ours. It might take a bit to find the occasional left-winger in there now. Should be a bunch of them, though-- a lot of people are going in for the training and the college money, and the not the thrill of hunting down Ay-rabs.

Navy Basic probably still is a lot easier than Army Basic, but the idea is to break you down as an individual and make you part of a team. Uniform regulations, close order drill-- all that sort of thing is to turn you into a military automaton.

They can't steal your soul, though, unless you let them. In some ways, it's kind of neat. They run your entire life for you, so you don't waste time worrying about stuff like clothes shopping, career choices, or rent increases. You just make up your mind to go with the flow and see where it takes you. Your thoughts are your own, but keep your mouth shut most of the time.

School was always great. They used to be geared to the dumbest guy they expected to take the class, so it was a piece of cake to ace them. That may have changed, but most schools probably still keep you out of the grunge work for as long as it lasts. I used to volunteer for every class that was available.

[captainamerica101]

23. Thanks for NAM my friend!

Well, maybe that came out wrong...
I mean thanks for GOING there (despite the fact that it was wrong and you were all suckered into it).

We owe you much!

What did you "do" to earn MY praise?
NO DRAFT FOR MY SON!
(Well, at least until Bush tries to fix that little hangover from 'nam.)

Had there been a draft for Mr. Bush to exercise today, who knows how far up the Middle East we'd be and how many we would have lost.

Peace!
Thanks!
You guys were like the spark of a mini-revolution man!
Something to be proud of in all, eh?
Ever think of that?

[jcc]

18. All but one military guy I know is a liberal

I don’t know much about boot camp, but what I have heard from several friends in the Marines is that there is no such thing as a conservative or liberal there…you are all scum owned by some of the most bitter men and women this earth holds.

Rest assured that there are all types in all branches of the military. You will find people that share your views and tastes even though you may be outnumbered by those who do not. Perhaps my boyfriend’s current efforts would shed some light…he is an Army NG reserve in Iraq right now. He is liberal in both politics and religion. He has been able to find at least five other pagans in a war zone swimming with conservative right-wing Christians for ceremonies during the equinox. You should be able to find at least a small handful that fit you too. I hope this story helps.

Good luck to you and keep your head down.

[nadinbrzezinski]

19. You are not allowed to have a political

opinion while in the service... that is the UCMJ.

Now be careful and I would just NOT DISCUSS politics
right at the moment..

Most of this will be clear once you finish Boot Camp...

Oh and as an aside, do nto take anything to basic you mind
would get ruined, where tehy store your things they get moldly.

[imax2268]

20. Hey Liberal Sailor...

What bootcamp are you going to...?

I went to Great Lakes IL, it was easy...for me anyway...it affects people differently...

First of all, just remember one thing...they are just playing with your head...there's a bunch of yelling and screaming when you first get there but that's just to try to inimidate you...don't let it get to you...just do what they say when they say it and you should be ok...whatever you do...don't back talk...whatever they say to you...just remember...it's all a mind game. Once you get settled into your company things will start to get better...if your Company Commander(usually a Chief or 3rd to 1st Class Petty Officers)is cool...you will have a good time...just remember...and I can't stress this enough...they are playing with your head in the first few days...after that...it's cake...

Second...days are long...you wake up @ 04:30 every morning and you don't get to sleep until 10:00 at night...usually a day starts out with a trip to the mess hall for breakfast...then some down time before your classes begin...then it's off to lunch...more classes...dinner...more classes in your dorm...lot's of marching in formation...that get's fun after awhile because you start to learn some really cool moves and other companies that can't do it watch while your company show's off...!

Third...make sure you pay attention...attention to detail is everything...so...remember that...PAY ATTENTION. You don't have to do this but I did...you should learn your General Orders before you go...study them and memorize them...you will be asked at inspection to recite any one of them at a moments notice...

Now when I was in...if we screwed up majorly...we got cycled...which is a grueling exercise session...my company commander would shut all the windows in the dorm and work us out until moister would start falling from the ceiling...but...don't worry about that...doesn't happen that often...just when your company screws up...but when it's over you will see it's not that bad...

Lastly...just remember those things...It's all a head trip...it's very easy...do what they tell you when they tell you...pay attention to details...and don't talk back...just focus on what you are told to do...

I was on several air craft carriers...depending on your rate(job)...you will enjoy it...I worked up top on the flight deck...if you do that you will need to have your head on a swivel...it's quite dangerous up there...but...nothing beats seeing a F-18 blasting off at full afterburner...it is quite amazing...

If you have anymore questions...just pmail me...

Good luck...

[LiberalSailor]

22. All the advice sounds really good!

Definetly not gonna try to be the sqweeky wheel,which will be hard as im a notorious smart ass in town. but regardless gonna keep my head down eyes on the goal and off the higher ranks.Just gonna try to fit in as I don't see anypoint in sticking out (I have a too many tattos so I'm gonna try to stay low anyways).
Much love to everyone that has given advice as the only other forum I have been active in was a MMOPRPG forum and I didn't receive nearly as many replies as I have tonite.
And I hope to be more active in here once I'm done with basic as one of my reason for joining the service was to hopefully make some contacts necessary to be active in politics( hey if you cant beat the system join it and change it from with in huh?).
and I would just like to say I've been reading DU for awhile ,almost a year now but being young and still somewhat naive I have just been absorbing what I can and didn't want to contribute to conversation that I wasnt fully informed about. But Please keep up the job that DU is doing and all the forum regulars are doing as freedom of dissent/questioning and rational thought are some of the reasons that I joined the armed service. I also wouldn't feel right not mentioning one of the articles/writers that echos some of the feelings/expereinces I have already felt even before leaving http://www.graffiks.com/dylan.html
Anyways I would just like to say that this forum has been like a family to me for the last year or so even though I didnt particpate until now. I will try to keep you people posted on how my life goes in the navy(even if it lingers on the last pages of the archives:) )
And thanks again for all your replies

/edit spelling as usual

[imax2268]

25. Best of Luck man...

I don't know how much traveling you have done...but you will meet some very interesting people from all walks of life...you will see countries that you may have thought you would never get the chance to see...my first time in Japan and Hong Kong were quite amazing...

Like I said...if you don't make any ripples in the pond...you will walk right through this...and also I can't state this enough...pay attention to details...no matter how small or insignificant that may be...you do that...you will be just fine...

Wait till you do the firefighting classes...those were fun...and the gas chamber is quite intimidating...but don't sweat it...basically you will be wearing a mask when you go in...then tell you to take it off...at first your eyes will burn and you will cough...but it doesn't last to long and it will be over before you know it...

Mess cranking(working in the mess hall)was kind of cool...but the days are very long...show some motivation and you will more than likely get into a lead position...line captain, scullery captain...etc...etc...

When you get paid...send most of your money home...you don't want to keep your money around...someone might steal it and you really don't need a lot of money anyway...you don't get to many trips to the store at first...


All in all it will be an experience that you will remember and later down the road you will be able to say that you did it...and you may end up like me...learning a trait and getting a job working for the DOD as a civilian and make some serious coin...

Best of luck...

[Lexingtonian]

24. not one myself

But the rules are pretty much the same all over. Everything said here is good. The hardest initial part is probably going to be all the people from other walks of life in other parts of the country, who will draw you off your guard into a state of :wtf: by the ways of seeing and dealing with things they do that will seem utterly alien to you. A good part of the abuse from above is intended to make you feel you have far more in common with your co-sufferers than your CO, and all the hoops they make you stumble through are part of giving you some common experience. But with Americans so inhomogenous a lot, the bruising they dispense can be pretty extensive.

Basically, boot camp is always about convincing you that your opinion doesn't matter but what you get done does. Power is when your opinion matters, so you will feel utterly powerless throughout boot camp. Smart people are often unused to this not-being-listened-to; but it's an unaffordable vanity to fight back. The way to think about it for the worst parts is that it's a hard role-playing game in which talking or appearing smart or asserting what you really think about yourself and others gets punished, but getting the right things done gets rewarded. And most of the crude stuff that happens all around you is either simple stupidity or, perhaps mostly, some form of behavior that is all about egos trying survive the bruising they're all getting.

[seventhson]

27. Two things:

1. You will make some incredible friendships from the unlikeliest of places. Keep an eye out for kindred spirits and the ones who are having the hardest time and who need a friend.

2. I think it was the guy who draws Boondocks that said that for the oppressed survival depends on being one step ahead and MORE prepared than everyone else. Don't just be on time - but be early. Think in advance. Get to slepp early as you can and get up at 4:29 a.m (NOT 4:30)so when the drill sargeant or whatever comes in you are on it and not jangled. Be mentally prepared to be ahead of the game: but don't try to get there ahead of the others, necessarily. Just try your hardest but DON't make yourself a target by trying to look better than the others (just KNOW that you are trying to be the best and try to be ahead of what is going to happen)

[izzie]

28. You do not say what you believe in the Navy .

n/t

[imax2268]

29. I have to say one more thing...

that I found pretty odd during my first night of bootcamp...

When we got there and were all done with indoc...they took us to a room to get blue sweatpants, a blue sweatshirt and a blue beanie cap(thus the name "smurfs" is applied)...what I found to be odd was that they made us turn the clothes inside-out and remove the tags from the clothing that said..."Made in China"...go figure...

[BlueCollar]

30. I did my time in San Diego

My advice...

1) If they ask for volunteers for the drill company (can you play an instrument etc.) volunteer... even if you can't play...they'll give you a flag or something to carry. The advantage is you're company won't be doing the KP duty in the galley...

2) KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT! Do not stand out until you know who and what you're dealing with. If someone overhears you say something liberal like "Why are we stuck in Iraq" or "Why can't we just leave gays alone?", life will be hell for you for the duration.

3) ATTENTION TO DETAIL: The fastest way to get invited to a marching party is to screw up the detail items. If they want your towels folded a certain way...get it right...it's important...believe me.

4) On those rare occasions during the day that you get a few minutes to yourself, take them.

5) It's about teamwork. If you see someone in your company having trouble..quietly offer to help. It's about looking out for your shipmate.

6) Enjoy yourself...believe it or not, the Navy is a great branch of the service. Firefighting school is a blast!!!

7) Watch out for Jetblast, Propwash, and Propellors on the flight deck.

8) Be aware at all times where you are on deck, and where your nearest safety point is.

Good luck !!!

Let us know when you get out...

[Creideiki]

31. I did my basic at Great Lakes

but #1 holds. I was going in as a Musician, so I was put in there automatically.

Also, if they ask who can type and you can, let them know. I worked as division yeoman and it also helped to ease the load a bit.

[oneighty]

37. Can you play

an instrument? Very important..I was forced to play in the marching band all through boot camp. A WHOLE BUNCH OF FUN! Really Navy Boot Camp is a piece of cake, keep a sense of humor, you will have a good time. "Air Craft carrier, sigh".

180

[rppper]

40. heheheeh...i was a san diego "hollywood" recruit too

division 7, co.186

FF school is a blast.....

navy boot camp is 30% physical, 70% mental.....

fold your clothes the right way, you'll be fine....

volunteer for the education p/o or the laundry p/o.....best boot duties, esp laundry, because you get to choose people to help you and you miss out on a lot of the more difficult drills. you also go to chow with your little group...a big bennie in boot....

[thom1102]

42. Ha ha, I was in Orlando!

We had women! (not that I was particularly interested in them!) Plus we had the theme parks! I got to go to Universal Studios for Controlled Liberty! I was later stationed in San Diego, when I was on my sub. I loved San Diego! I am heading back in a week and a half for vacation. That is one really great thing I got from the Navy... I got to live in the city that I would love more than anywhere else.

[ewagner]

32. Good luck, Man!

The people who said earlier that they'll try to play with your head...they're right.

The point of Basic is to get rid of individuality and replace it with an obedient, mision-oriented person. Sleep depravation and the constant yelling are all part of the game. You will have ZERO free time at first; they will keep you rinning (literally) from one place to another for a couple of weeks until you get with the program.

Aircraft carrier flight decks are dangerous places. Be careful. Follow the rules closely, they're there for your own safety.

Ears open and mouth shut works pretty good.

Good luck.

[Loonman]

33. At least it's the Navy

Not the USMC.


Gunnery Sergeant Hartman, Drill Instructor: Who said that? Who the fuck said that? Who's the slimy little communist shit, tinkle-toed down here who just signed his own death warrant? Nobody, huh?! The fairy fucking godmother said it! Out-fucking-standing! I will PT you all until you fucking die! I'll PT you until your assholes are sucking buttermilk.

Gunnery Sergeant Hartman, Drill Instructor: Was it you, you scroungy little fuck, huh?
Private Cowboy: Sir No Sir!
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman, Drill Instructor: You little piece of shit you look like a fucking worm, I bet it was you!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman, Drill Instructor: Jesus Christ Pyle, don't try too hard. If God would have wanted you up there he would have miracled your ass up there, wouldn't he?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman, Drill Instructor: Were you born worthless, or did you have to work at it?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman, Drill Instructor: A rifle is only a tool. It's a hard heart that kills. If your killer instincts are not clean and strong you will hesitate at the moment of truth. You will not kill. You will become dead Marines. And then you will be in a world of shit. Because Marines are not allowed to die without permission! Do you maggots understand?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman, Drill Instructor: Private Pyle, I'm gonna give you three seconds, exactly three fuckin' seconds, to wipe that stupid lookin' grin off your face or I will gouge out your eyeballs and skull fuck you!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman, Drill Instructor: Bullshit! It looks to me like the best part of you ran down the crack of your mama's ass and ended up as a brown stain on the mattress.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman, Drill Instructor: What is your major malfunction, numbnuts? Didn't Mommy and Daddy show you enough attention when you were a child?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman, Drill Instructor: Pyle, you had best unfuck yourself and start shitting me Tiffany cufflinks or I will definitely fuck you up!

==================================================================



The reason you get harassed and yelled at in Boot is because when the shit comes down in a combat situation, you have to not panic and do what you are supposed to do. It's about knowing how do you your job while under a tremendous amount of stress. Nobody will come down on you if you are scared. Everybody will come down on you if you panic, though.

[newyawker99]

34. Good luck LiberalSailor!

:-)

[Don_G]

36. The Best Person To Ask Is HawkerHurricane

He is serving in the Navy now and has internet access. You might try sending him a PM.

[mbartko]

38. Boot camp sucks, period

The first thing I encountered when I arrived at boot camp was a little redneck chief boarding our bus and screaming, "Shut up, ya triple-bawled mowrons!". It went downhill from there.

They will try to mindfuck you. Pretty much the whole point of boot camp is to get you to conform. As far as physical training, the Navy wasn't so bad. It was more bunk making, ironing, etc. A lot like home ec with more screaming.

Just remember it is a very short time, although it seems like an eternity. Is it still six weeks?

If you smoke, they give you like five minutes at night for the "smoke and coke". This is like bizaaro Christmas. I don't know if they still do that, I was at Great Lakes approximately 172 years ago.

Try to get into drill team or band company if you play an instrument. That will get you out of some of the bullshit rifle drills (why does the Navy feel it's important for you to march with rifles? I dunno.)

Good luck

[Skittles]

43. hey

are you going to Great Lakes in Illinois. LOL, used to go to the Helm's Club on weekends when I was in high school. I dated a few sailors - they were always fun. :D

on edit - I did Air Force basic training in San Antonio. I got in so much trouble I was never allowed off the base, ever.