What is your opinion on Joan of Arc?

[sasquatch]

Why is she important in the study of History? If you're a Agnostic or Atheist do you believe that her orders from God were just her serving a higher purpose that was unselfish? Why is her image and symbols that she used is used by other groups or leaders? Are there any "Joans" at work today or in the past?

[Indiana_Dem]

1. After watching the movie, she's my heroine!

If I was in that era, my hope would be that I would be just like her! I never really realized the significance of what she went through and accomplished until I saw the movie they made.

[gold_bug]

7. if it's "The Messenger"

you're referring to, that was a very historically inacurate Joan of Arc.

[Indiana_Dem]

11. No it was "Joan of Arc" made in 1999 made by

Alliance Atlantis....it starred Leelee Sobieski.

[Dookus]

2. She's a fascinating study

in the power of delusions.

[sasquatch]

3. Do you have any opinions about her

Do you feel what she was doing was good or bad?

[Dookus]

4. well

I find it hard to find good in people who engage in nationalistic warfare due to schizophrenic delusions.

But I admire her accomplishments. I just think they were done for horrible reasons. I'm pretty sure God didn't bless France over England.

[DFLforever]

5. You would have made a fine churchman , Dookus

They liked to think they were only ones God spoke to if he bothered to speak at all. No freedom of conscience or conviction was honored by them. Which is what Joan points toward...brave woman, soldier and saint.

[Dookus]

6. No....

as an atheist, I would've made a very bad churchman.

I think by any of today's standards, a person who hears voices and has visions is mentally ill. I believe Joan was. She was luckier than most, but that doesn't make her right.

Do YOU believe God blessed France over England, and spoke thus to Joan?

[BrotherBuzz]

8. Bon! Tr�s Bon! - She freed France from the English

I learned that from Bill & Ted's Excellent Adventure. So-Crates was good, too. Party on, dude!

[REP]

9. Read Shaw's "St Joan"

Shaw's play used actual testimony from her trial, and Shaw's preface and afterword do an excellent of job of explaining this remarkable woman's place in history.

Leaving aside her 'voices' - what she did and how she did it was so extraordinary, as was her intelligence. Those things alone make her worthy of study. Whether or not one believes in the Christian gods, her steadfast belief and the courage to act on those beliefs is amazing. It is not necessary to share Joan's beliefs to admire her, or even follow her example.

Joan was one of the bravest humans whose story we still know. I doubt there will be another like her.

[Indiana_Dem]

14. Owing to the fact I only received my education on her from

a DVD movie, I'm not really an expert but the movie gave me the impression that you've described above.

[PassingFair]

17. Joan was horribly used..

a mentally ill teenager used, abused and eventually murdered when her handlers began to lose control. I certainly HOPE there will never be another one like her.

[priller]

18. Actual testimony

That's one of the unique things about her, that the testimony from her trial survives, and that trial covered nearly her entire life, interviewing many people who knew her. I read a book years ago about her that was composed almost entirely from these eyewitness accounts. It was fascinating. And no, I don't remember the name. I loaned it to a friend and her husband dropped it in the pool and ruined the paperback.

[sasquatch]

10. Kick

:kick:

[m-jean03]

12. I fell head over heels in love with a wax museum statue of her once.

It absolutely enchanted me -- I didn't want to leave (it was when I was a kid).

I think she was a fantastically brave woman and her story is very romantic; furthermore I will always have a place in my heart for women who risk everything and do what is forbidden of them.

[The Lone Liberal]

13. Joan was a "kick-ass" kinda lady.

and a hell of a lambada dancer. She could shake that booty.

[ornotna]

19. I agree

She was one hot babe. :evilgrin:

[NewHampster]

15. If I'm and Atheist or Agnostic why

would I think her orders were from some God?

Did you actually read your question?

[sasquatch]

21. I didn't ask that

I asked do you think her orders from God were just her serving a unselfish purpose or cause?

[NewHampster]

22. I think her orders came from the same place as Shrubs eom

[sasquatch]

23. That's very rude of you

Are you English or something.

[Dookus]

24. Why is that rude?

I agree with him.

Such "orders" are internally-generated. True for Joan, true for Bush.

[sasquatch]

26. So is what Joan did the same as Bush in your opinion?

[Dookus]

27. Huh?

I wish you would just state what YOU think about Joan so we could have a real discussion.

Of course I don't believe Joan=Bush. I said, as an atheist, that I believe NOBODY receives "orders" from God. People who think they're acting on orders from God are mentally ill.

[sasquatch]

28. Okay here's what I think

Joan could have heard voices from God telling her to run off the English but I doubt it. I think she decided to inspire/lead the army of France herself unselfishly. I think after witnessing the murder of her family she decided to take justice into her own hands.

[Dookus]

29. "witnessing the murder of her family"?

huh? I never heard any such thing.

on edit: A quick search of 4 different online biographies shows no mention of such a thing.

[sasquatch]

30. From what I know her sister was murdered in front of her

and her parents were killed in a English raid.

[Dookus]

31. well

can you provide some proof of that? As I said, I checked four online biographies, and none of the mention what I would expect to be a seminal event in her life.

[Indiana_Dem]

16. What symbols of hers do leaders use?

What leaders use them?

[sasquatch]

20. Hitler, Napolean, the French Resistance of of WWII etc.

[solinvictus]

25. "Now I know how Joan of Arc felt...

As the flames rose
to her Roman nose and her hearing aid started to melt"