The Dean phenomena

[MGKrebs]

chaska posed a question in another thread that got locked, but the question might be worth exploring. chaska's post is at the bottom.

I think the Dean "mania" is as much about the empowerment we have been given through the internet driven campaign as it is about him. Let's face it, the campaign was initially driven by the internet.

I suspect that many involved in the campaign, like myself, have been internet junkies for quite a while, and I have participated in discussions over the years regarding the question of what can we do with the internet that is IMPORTANT? This is a wonderful tool that we have, and we have spent years playing games and chatting, and now finally we have a chance to MAKE A DIFFERENCE.

I think many of us also believe that this is not a one-way street, where we just get our information through this medium. We get to contribute to the ideas, and they listen!

I suspect if Edwards or Kerry and almost any of the other candidates had built a campaign like this, there would be a similar following. It won't be the same nex time around because it will have already been done. That extra "mania" that we see is because we feel we are part of something new and special.

Dean is inspiring (to me), but not to the point where I think he is some "savior" or "rock star". He is a good candidate for me, but I think Trippi should get a lot of credit for making this phenomena happen, because my understanding is that Dean was very uncomfortable with a "bottom up" campaign at first.

One other thing that is serendipitous in this situation is that many of us leftists are really pissed off at Bush, and we want to DO SOMETHING. The internet driven Dean campaign lets us who have done little in the past, do something, relatively easily. And as the momentum has built, we are inspired to do more.



chaska (375 posts) Sat Nov-15-03 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
71. Thread in search of a topic?
Here's a thought I would like to present to the more thoughtful Dean folks. No bash, just something to ponder. I have no preconceived conclusions about this, only questions.
Clearly, there is, as someone mentioned above, an air of mania about the Dean candidacy. This is not necessarily a bad thing. In fact, it is the only reason that I feel confident that Dean could win. Based on positions, record, etc. I remain convinced that he will lose to Bush. Mania could be the thing to put him over the top.
But can he sustain it for another year? Dean is the equivalent of a rockstar right now. Rockstars come and go - and thank god, the thought of spending the rest of my life tolerating Britney Spears makes me ill. But as I was saying, Dean has an evangelical, charismatic quality to his candidacy that makes me worry about him going out of style.
There are a lot of people who are Deanies just because there are a lot of people who are Deanies. This is not a slam, there are people in all camps that are like that. This is not to denigrate his supporters at all. And as I implied earlier, this is one thing I find intriguing about his candidacy. Dean's maniacs could prove to be an extremely important element in ousting Bush.
I would suggest that thoughtful Deanites open their fellow supporters minds to the possibility of transfering that enthusiasm to other candidates should Dean not get the nom. We will need them to defeat the great Satan. Unity remains the single most important goal for Dems. We should never lose sight of the goal. Contention is, and will continue to be, an unavoidable fact of life. But never forget that Dems are your friend.
Perhaps some would volunteer to try to steer discussions in that direction. We can never hear the message too often. One for all, and when the time comes, all for one.

[wtmusic]

1. If Dean loses, Deanies will crawl off in a corner and sulk?

The sky will not fall if Dean loses. Democrats will regroup; we will have the largest solid opposition in the party's history. Bush is toast.

[Renew Deal]

3. Democrats will regroup

The question is whether many of these Dean supporters care about more than Dean. Will they still join their local democratic comittees? WIll they support the nominee? There is reason to believe they wouldn't.

[ComerPerro]

5. I think that most Dean supporters will vote Dem

No matter what. Hell, they are energized, they want Smirk gone. So I think that, even though some may just go sulk, most of them will vote for whoever the nominee is.

[MGKrebs]

8. It's hard to say regarding those here at DU, but

I can assure you that those of us who are active volunteers for Dean here in Atlanta are very involved in the Dem party, the BBV issue, local campaigns, gay rights, volunteering for shelters, collecting supplies for local schools, and other issues too.

And I have yet to hear one of them who would not support whoever is the Dem nominee (except maybe Lieberman). Of course we want Dean to win the nomination, but we look forward to bringing our organization to The Candidate in the general election campaign.

[Scott Lee]

13. I can gaurantee you that hate and vitriol against Dean supporters

Will certainly alienate many of them from supporting a Dem nominee if it's not Dean.

The nastier of you Deanophobes need to listen up. If you are intending to drive away future support of your nominated candidate, you are doing a great job.

[wryter2000]

2. Close

The internet helps me tremendously stay involved and excited about Dean, but that isn't what really got me. He was the first one I heard who seemed to get the fact that the whole government, our whole society, really, had been hijacked. He was the first I heard to say we had to get our country back.

Others certainly have since. And maybe even before, but I hadn't heard them. I love the other candidates, too. (Well, most of them.) But I think Dean is the one who changed the conversation. Turned it around to where it ought to be headed.

[Scott Lee]

4. But what if Dean does get the nomination?

Chaska's scenario is well written and thought out but relies only on one outcome - that of Dean not getting the nomination. Almost daily reports are making Dean's potential nomination more likely, not less.

With all due respect given to "all for one", which to me is a one of the finer aspects of the old Democratic beliefs I still hold, I would like to put the shoe on the other foot and ask those who oppose or are skeptical about Dean: Where would your support lie if Howard Dean is indeed the nominee? Would you clamber under the tent marked All For One then, or would this be a repeat of animosity and vote split that occurred with the Dems and Greens in the 2000 Selection?

Us "maniacs" aren't quite the sheep that you paint us out to be, chaska. We are thinkers, writers, people who glean and strain out virtues from the vices and weigh a lot of information before we endorse a policy or candidate. For myself, I am a radical leftist who supports Dean at this point mostly because he provides a needed shake up of stodgey Democratic establishmentarianism that is making opposition to the fascists completely impotent. Pragmatic? Sure. But not a sheeple, I assure you.

So what say you? Would the unified push disintegrate should Dr. Dean get the nomination?

[Zomby Woof]

6. he knows your anger - he knows your dreams!

Look into my eyes, what do you see?
Cult of Personality
I know your anger, I know your dreams
I've been everything you want to be
I'm the Cult of Personality
Like Mussolini and Kennedy
I'm the Cult of Personality
Cult of Personality
Cult of Personality

Neon lights, A Nobel Prize
The mirror speaks, the reflection lies
You don't have to follow me
Only you can set me free
I sell the things you need to be
I'm the smiling face on your T.V.
I'm the Cult of Personality
I exploit you still you love me

I tell you one and one makes three
I'm the Cult of Personality
Like Joseph Stalin and Gandhi
I'm the Cult of Personality
Cult of Personality
Cult of Personality

Neon lights a Nobel Prize
A leader speaks, that leader dies
You don't have to follow me
Only you can set you free

You gave me fortune
You gave me fame
You gave me power in your God's name
I'm every person you need to be
I'm the Cult of Personality

[wabeewoman]

7. I first heard about Dean

over a year ago from a poster on Democrats.com. She had heard him speak and was excited about him. At that point I was leaning toward Kerry. I was reading what all the democrats were saying but Dean was the only one who got it. He was the only one that gave me hope bush could be defeated. He had the enthusiam and the excitement. I have never written letters to the editor, donated to a political campaign or tried to influence my friends until Dean. I have always voted and tried to be informed but this year I'm campaigning for Dean. I'm getting involved because I feel I can help change who is our president. Its true the internet started his early following but his ability to put his finger on the pulse of what is wrong in this country and enpowering people to act for him are what is going to get him elected. I find it funny that people keep saying he can't beat bush and on paper Clark is better. What really counts is the ability to excite voters, draw them in, and give them hope that our country should be what it could be.

[Eloriel]

11. Me too -- that reflects my own experience very well

Here's a good article that sums up Dean's appeal this way:

http://www.fundrace.org/moneymap.php?cand=RepVDem&zoom=Zip3

And yet, none of these revelations has furrowed the brow of the Deaniacs one whit. And they haven't because Dean's appeal is not chiefly ideological.

He's the only one of the Democratic nine who is what sports commentators would call an "impact player." He understands how to make an impact on people. He thinks big. He saunters into battle without fear -- and sometimes with less judgment than one might prefer, but even that helps make him interesting. Notice how he managed to prevent his refusal to accept public financing from turning him into a plaything of the fat-cats, instead converting it into yet another glorious manifestation of his ingenuity and his sacred connection to the people.

See him with a crowd and it's not hard to glean the basis of that connection. At the endorsement event, his speech (pretty much his standard stump speech) was about American history, the political culture today and, most of all, the people in the room. Scarcely two sentences were devoted to himself. In an age when Clinton-imitating pols ache to cull the life-shaping events from their past to establish the perfect bio, Dean does none of that. The impact he has on people when he speaks to them is bio enough.

Can this carry -- to swing voters, and into the South? I have no idea. But I do know that Dean's been consistently underestimated, and that there's only one Democratic candidate who's fun to watch.

-- more --

Eloriel

[ozone_man]

9. Sorry, but my internet enthusiasm is not transferrable.

Its Dean for me, and if not Dean, then Kucinich or whoever might be the 3rd party candidate. I refuse to vote for an IWR or DLC candidate.

Regarding the internet wave that Dean is riding well, don't read too much into it, but it is a strong force. Dean is not just a "rock star", but is principled and stands for real issues, such as health care, civil rights, environment, no Iraq war, jobs, etc., .... He connects with people in a way that the others don't or can't. Don't trivialize this by thinking that its just a quirk of the internet.

[Bombtrack]

10. Dean is as much a DLC candidate as any

other serious candidate is.

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

14. It is hoped you are the exception in the Dean camp.

getting Bush out is the goal.