How to call you guys?

[aneerkoinos]

Here's my problem:

I think calling citizens of USA "americans" is wrong, non-PC, and whatever. For the simple reason that there are many other americans or américans who do not live in United States. And it's rude and wrong languague to call only citizens of US americans.

So how to call you people in non formal discussion, if Americans is too wide term?

Yankees?
Gringos?
Muricans?

Do you feel any or all of these terms are offencive or bad otherwise, and do you have better suggestions? I expect many of you do, and they are used in offencive way, but what to do when there just doesn't seem to be any objective and nonoffencive way to call you people???

I am language sensitive, perhaps too much, but I feel and know there are many Américas, and USA is just on part of them, despite the poor name of your state/union...

[trof]

1. usasians?

Nope, I think somebody already got that one.
How about call us all "trof"?
I'm OK with that.
;-)

[slackmaster]

2. Cracker works OK for me

I'll accept honky or peckawood as well. Whatever blows your skirt up.

[Clete]

4. So what would you call the non-white Americans?

[slackmaster]

7. "people"

O8)

[tkulesa]

3. That's a good question

I first heard this from a friend in Canada who was quite upset that we call ourselves Americans as if people from the rest of this hemisphere do not live in the Americas. Canadians even live in North America. Aren't they just as 'American' as we are here in the states?

So she only refers to the US as the US, not as America. Instead of referring to Americans, she refers to 'people from the United States.' Though, that is a bit clunky.

[dpbrown]

5. I'm a Minnesotan

But "US citizen" would seem to suffice for what you're looking for.

[Tigermoose]

6. You'll call us what we tell you to call us.

:P j/k

[jagguy]

8. Yanks is the obvious choice but that will rub the Johnny Rebs wrong

I'm fine with Americans.

[trof]

10. Damn right!

Doan go a-callin' me no dam yanky.
;-)

[HalfManHalfBiscuit]

9. Peckerhead will do nicely

Dick weed is a bit strong.

[foo_bar]

11. you're too late

http://sa.daveware.net

[DagmarK]

12. Terrorists,........

If the USAers can call ALL muslims terrorists.....it should be good enough for us........... no double standards, dontcha know.

[SOteric]

13. I think 'Americans' is acceptable.

It is correct usage of the language and I feel most of the other suggestions are offensive, while 'American' is not.

I appreciate your wish to be sensitive to the language. True there are other populations on the continents of the Americas. But that does not negate the U.S.'s proximity within the continents. Moreover, other populations on the continents of North, Central and South America have distinctive identities to separate them from confusion. Citizens of Canada are Canadians, citizens of Mexico are Mexican, citizens of Panama are Panamanian and citizens of every country in Central and South America are known by their country.

The United States are not the only 'Americans,' but we are Americans. The only other correct answer would be to call us "U.S. citizens" and that is too cumbersome to make it a consideration.

[aneerkoinos]

18. Thanks for all the funny answers

I appreciate the self irony.

About this answer I must appreciate the sincerety, and I do. I think SOteric got my point on the cumbersome of US citizen, but he/she is still bit too innocent on 'American'. If every other American nation except US has to be called by name other than "American" and US people remain the lingistically "default Americans", what does that mean for continuation of Monroe Doctrine and Big Brother attitude towards all other Americans, including Mexico and Canada?

And hey, in my language we don't make distinction between masculine and feminine, and we were the first people in the world both to allow women to be elected and to vote (1905). Maybe you can guess my nationality? Whatever, the point is that language and reality affect each other...

[SOteric]

38. The name of this country

Is "The United States of America." How is abbreviating the name of this country to 'America' making us international bullies? If the other countries on this continent were called "The Canadas of America" or "The American Mexicos," then your argument might be valid rather than foolish and picayune.

This isn't about "big brother," this isn't about "The Monroe Doctrine." You're making a mountain out of a rather ridiculous mole hill.

[Ripley]

14. Easy disruption folks.

Why bother?

[Stephanie]

15. "Yankees? Gringos? Muricans?"

Very nice. I can see where you're going with this. Tell you what - don't call us. We'll call you.

[aneerkoinos]

20. Easily offendable???

I thought and hoped that I made it clear that to my knowlegde there is no midway language, and asked if someone might know. I stated that I understood that those terms were offencive to at least many people, so "where do you see me going with this"?

Tell you what. I won't call you, personally, and you won't call me, personally. But I choose to believe that there are also intelligent US citizens/gringos/muricans/yankees/give me better name... that can discuss also these kinds of problems ingtelligently, and tell you what: I side with those people and diss you, whatever you wish to be called!

[kixot]

16. You're right, aneerkoinos.

There simply is no word in English for our nation, mainly because it isn't a nation, it's a "union" of seperate sovereignties. It's a new concept in national identity and it seems that it's never been truly addressed.

So, although we live in a land known as the "United States of America", we are Floridians, New Yorkers, Californians, Georgians, etc. Our indidvidual states are bound by an agreement much stronger than an ally but still resepective of one another's sovereignty. The Federal Government exists as an arbitrator between the states and to provide services a national government would normally provide only it also respects state sovereignty within a given frame.

Long story short, you call us by our state residency, identity with the union is implied.

[aneerkoinos]

26. This leads me to further thoughts

I disagree with you that USAns are not a nation, USA is a federal state where the federal part has too much power in some things (and too little in some things) but culturally I think it is the same nation, very cohesive, though the unity of the nation is challenged by the closeness and differencies by the peoples of Mexico and Canada.

EU might end up the same way if it got too federal, but I doubt. I think we are saved because of the multitude of different languages and deep rootes of our cultures, and Euro-ideology can thus only be multi-cultural and non-chauvinistic. I hope.

[ConsAreLiars]

17. USAns

Works fine as an identifier and carries no baggage. Might be unclear in conversation, but is unambiguous when typed.

[trof]

19. Yew-sans?

Might confuse the Japanese.
;-)

[aneerkoinos]

22. Thanks bubler

still bit cumbersome (in the ways you said), but I'll think I'll start using that.

Anyone find that offencive and if so, why?

[karlschneider]

21. How about "Users"? It's a fairly accurate description.........hang on

This is actually something that has bothered me for many years. When I first started travelling throughout the western hemisphere I met lots of folks from Canada to Argentina who essentially thought of themselves as "Americans". Many of them acknowledge the distinction between North and South, but do not understand (as I do not either) exactly where is the line of demarcation. Most assuredly, Canadians, US people and Mexicans are "North Americans", everybody south of Panama is a "South American" and those in between are "Central Americans". I think most everyone understands that, but it does seem to me just a little bit unseemly for those of us in the USA to arrogate the title "American" more or less exclusively to ourselves.

That being said, I have no good suggestion, although given the way things have gone the last 2 1/2 years, the apellation "Murkin" (probably often coupled with 'asshole') might begin to have some traction.
:eyes:

[Cooley Hurd]

24. USA-holes? Aren't they calling us that, already?

:shrug:

[dweller]

28. USA-sses

easy enough to say...

dp

[chadm]

23. Global Citizen?

or just "Human"?

[moondust]

25. A Canadian once told me

he was offended by it. I understood and respected his position. Since then I have virtually never referred to U.S. citizens as Americans. It's been 27 years now

[aneerkoinos]

29. Respect

But the question remains, is there any less formall and easier way to address you people than US citizens?

[moondust]

31. No, there isn't.

"Canadian" is four syllables. "U.S. citizen" is five syllables. "Nicaraguan is five syllables." "Outer Mongolian is six syllables!"

It's not peachy keen, neato, kool, or razzmatazz but it's accurate and PC. Everything does not have to be easy.

[aneerkoinos]

34. LOL

literally...

[Bandit]

27. We are Americans from the USA

Just like Europeans from wherever. Canadians are Americans from Canada.

[aneerkoinos]

33. With all respect

there are no people in Europe called Europeans (She was a girl charmed by Zeus ;)). Actually nowadays it is a very important question about identity: do you feel more Greek than European, or other way around? In every EU-member the European identity is slowly growing, even though most people still feel more attached to their national state (Greeks are nowadays more European than Greek)

I get your point, but I can't help thinking in the line "We are Venezuelans from Venezuela, América, and we should be respected just as equal as USAns from Central North American Continent. Hell, when it comes to democracy, USA seems to be now far behind the democratic standards set up in all the continent?!!!

[Bossy Monkey]

30. I generally use United Statesians

Even though that might cover Mexico as well (as they are also the United States), I figure that putting it in English makes clear that I mean the USA.

Xenophobe resource-hog culture-destroyers works pretty well, too, if a little wordy.

[aneerkoinos]

35. Thanks mate

people like you keep up the belief in humanity.

So, afraid of FBI or...?

[Bossy Monkey]

37. I've got my top bunk picked out already

at the Helen Thomas Memorial Re-Education Camp

[Pocho]

32. TREATSIE ON THE WORD "GRINGO" FOR A COUNTRY WITHOUT A NAME

My wife and I expatriated to Mexico 16 years ago from pre retirement life in Illinois. We regularly hear the word "Gringo" and understand its intent. Despite white skin, a national origin deservedly not well looked upon, and stumbling but trying language, Mexican friends may non maliciously refer to us as "gringos" while embracing our hearts as Mexican. It is a different world with different values, and one's heart has more importance here than what one is and where they were.

"Gringo" is not necessarily a derisive name. One problem is that people from the country between Canada and Mexico really have no name. You may use "American" and think it describes you. But to someone of another country it may not. That's because it also applies to Argentina, Brazil, Canada, and yes Mexico. It is the name of the continent.

OK, so how about North Americans? In Mexico the word "norteamericano" is sometimes used on documents such as visas. Trouble is that also includes Mexico, Canada, and Iceland, all part of the same sub-continent. Well then does "United States" cut it? Not quite, though on some official documents we are referred to as estadosunidienses, or united statesers in translation. But even that falls short. What you call Mexico is really Estados Unitdos Mexicanos or The United States of Mexico. It's their name too. (And, yes we have them, 31 not counting Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, Utah, Nevada, California, and Oregon.)

So what's left? Gringo works fine.

Mexican Spanish is a different kind of language than English. Translation and understanding of meaning is not simply a matter of replacing word for word. The culture of the person using a word, the context in which it is used, its intensity, and body and facial expressions can cause a word here to take on many meanings. That is much more true of Spanish than English. An example in English might be the expression SOB. You might meet an old friend saying "How ya doin' you old SOB?" with no problem. One the other hand, shouting "Cut it out you stupid SOB" could start a fight. A mild swear name is Cabron. It literally means Big Billy Goat but sort of corresponds to the English SOB. Ay Cabron, como estas? is ok to a friend. "Tu pinche cabron" in reply to a display of arrogance is an insult.

The point of the above is that English words tend to have distinct meanings. Written English makes for easy communication. With Spanish it's more difficult. The language is more emotional and word meaning varies. In order to communicate in written Spanish it is necessary to write in a very formal and flowery style. In conversations among gringo strangers we say what we mean and be done with it. With Mexicans that would be unfriendly and rude. One talks around the point until the meaning is clear. The relationship and feelings between the people communicating become as important, or even more so, than the words used and their literal intent.

There are also cultural differences in what it is ok to refer to. You won't call someone Fatso. In Mexico, Juan el Gordo is simply a description that you're talking about the fat Juan, not the skinny one. It's the same with the word gringo. Depends on whose using it in reference to who and how. If someone spits out "Tu pinche gringo" with a snarl, you are being insulted. Es gringo listo, or He is a smart gringo, is simply a description.

Languages are not just collections of words with varying spelling and arrangement but also carriers of a culture. The use of words can only be fully understood from within the culture. To view language from the perspective of a foreign culture is to mistakenly attach aspects of the foreign culture to the meaning. The same confusion arises between various cultures using the English language. That's true even across different parts of the US. The same is true of Spanish. Mexico is also a large country like the US, and it has many subcultures. Same confusion. The way out is to hang loose and don't assume what you think is meant is what is necessarily intended. Get it said several times.

Part of the confusion for Americans with regard to "gringo" could be due to their history. Bigotry has always used words such as such as Mic, Dago, Kike, Nigger, Polack, Redskin and the list goes on. The intent is always hateful. It is natural therefore for a person of the US culture to assign the same implication to the word gringo. From the perspective of the Mexican culture, however, it isn't necessarily so.

DU wouldn't let me have the name my parents gave me, George W, on first sign in, saying it was already taken. Then I tried George W II, posted a couple, and quickly realized it was a bad choice. On final try, and I came up with our dog's name, Pocho, and it stuck. The word does have meaning besides a misspelling of "Poncho, the common nickname for Fransisco.

The word "Pocho" derived from the verb "Pochar" of the Ocetl natives of Sonora. It meant to cut the crops and was applied to persons who worked across the border as field hands. Over time it came to be used as a not so nice word Mexicans used for Mexicans who went to the United States. Pocho was born and lives in Mexico but has traveled with us to the US. So Pocho is a pocho. He illustrates sharing our politics by urinating on as many bushes as possible. Currently, the word "pocho" is usually applied to persons of Mexican heritage who live in the US. Even the not so nice aspect is disappearing. As evidence, US citizens of Mexican ancestry have taken it to themselves as a matter of pride, much as blacks once decided that name was preferred to the white applied moniker of "Negro". An example of that can be seen on the hilarious and hard hitting satirical and political Pocho web site http://www.pocho.com/ (in which I have no personal interest). It's worth a look.

[aneerkoinos]

36. Thanks for a good article

Actually I though that the word Gringo had a chance in Europe also. Spanish is one of the major languages in Europe.

Please let me explain. I think we the people in EUROPE need another word, not least because we are building closer and closer relationship with Latin America and hail all the democracy that is going on there wright now. Lula is a world class leader close to Mandela, at least in minds of European left. ALSO, EU and Mercosus + Andean Community have very tight relations, I dare to claim that part or the democratic revolution (socialist democratic revolution) in Latin América is because EU is bigger donator than US in many countries south of Panama. In the future I see Latin América and EU making alliance for social model against neoliberal model of globalization, maybe we'll see US and China taking the same side for monopolies and oppression of workers wrights?!!!

On the level of public opinion, the war against drugs has also been lost both is Latin America and Europe, In Vienna few months ago it was only Chiraq (and Dane Rasmussen) who stopped EU from making unified claim to write of the two latest UN drug treaties.

Anone who knows anything knows that the worldwide drugwar has lost all popular support among thinking people. Please tell that also to Dean. The people in both Américas and Europe know that.

[ScreamingMeemie]

39. How about Humans...

because that is what I am.

[BritishHuman]

40. Merkins?

Okay, maybe not Merkins.