Kerry on "Today"

[phillybri]

Kerry was terrific this morning. He told Matt he "felt sorry" for Tom Delay and that * has completely neglected 1st responders in NYC and around the country.

Great stuff.

[meegbear]

1. I saw him on Late Edition this past Sunday ....

if he keeps this up, I got my candidate.

[vi5]

2. It was a good appearance I thought.....

Every other appearance I've seen by him he's been stiff, long and rambling and overanalytical. This time he was casual, straightforward, amiable, and funny.

I had been really dissapointed in him but now I'm beginning to think he's just really being wise and pacing this campaign. I'm still not convinced he's my/our man but he's doing more to win me over.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

14. He's pacing his campaign

I've felt this for a while. I have the utmost confidence in him.

[chimpymustgo]

3. Caught the end. He looked "Presidential".

Serious, yet relaxed.

[CWebster]

4. He demonstrated alarming lack of leadership

in the face of a massive deception and bowed to political winds of change instead of standing in defense of the truth and all this country ideally values.

End of subject.

[Octafish]

7. Did you see the program?

Or did someone tell you what happened?

EDIT: Removed relative reference. Sorry, CWebster.

[sangh0]

9. Pay no attention

CWebster has amply demonstrated that s/he has let his/her emotions overrule reason, and criticizes anyone and everyone that is not Dean.

Meanwhile, CW's idol is talking about how we should give Bush* the "benefit of the doubt"

[Terwilliger]

11. REASON???? Reason says that the Democrats are traitors like Bush is

because thy allow his treacheries to go unanswered

[sangh0]

12. Here's Kerry's position

""He misled every one of us," Kerry said. "That's one reason why I'm running to be president of the United States." ...

"I will not let him off the hook throughout this campaign with respect to America's credibility and credibility to me because if he lied he lied to me personally," he said.

[CWebster]

20. Nope

Bush's transparent lies were as glaring then as they are now. Kerry argued against the invasion and then voted for it, trying to cover his bases. When the lies were indisputable, when there was no denying the lies and Kennedy proposed a second resolution to nullify the first one, Kerry refused. Kerry's schtick was to prove how strong and tough he was, and he salivated at the opportunity to capitalize on his Viet Nam experience,(the irony of which, led him to protest the war), to appeal to the basest nationalism-based military hero worship. He blew his wad on that one and now feigns outrage that we were all misled. We were not.

We can do better and we deserve better.

[molly]

23. What are you going to do when he's the DEM candidate?

[CWebster]

25. What are you going to do when he is not?

Something the party better be concerned about if Kerry wins the nomination is the reimerging third party threat of disaffected voters who either don't bother to vote or leave the party. Because when they were out on the streets protesting this war, Kerry was kissing ass. And this is the demographic most spurred to participate politically--part of the wave Dean is riding.

[sangh0]

29. Answer the question, if you dare?

Many of us have been clear on this point - We will support whoever gets the nomination. Why are you avoiding the question?

And Dean thinks we should give Bush* "the benefit of the doubt". He's real weenie, eh?

[Terwilliger]

32. I won't avoid it...if the Dems float a twit, I'll vote for somebody else

PERIOD.

You don't own people's votes, and when you realize you MIGHT have a clue.

[Frederic Bastiat]

35. Take your ball

AND GO HOME!!

[Terwilliger]

42. I am home

go shoot a gun

[RichM]

37. I will also not vote for a twit, & I'll actively work for a 3rd party.

No Dem cowards, no Dem hypocrites, thanks very much.

[DinahMoeHum]

40. IMHO, if you go third-party, you are giving your vote to *. . .

The voting machine does not tabulate who you vote against, only who you vote for.

And in a 3-way race running near dead-even, whoever has 34% wins.

Do you really want that 34% going to * ???


:kick:

[Terwilliger]

45. IMO, if you vote for Democrats, you are giving your vote to Bush

PERIOD!

You folks JUST WONT SEE IT! What is WRONG with you?!?! I'm serious here! You think everything is gonna be "allllll riiiiiiiight" Everything will work out in the end because these things take time and Watergate and blah-d blah-d

George Bush has been caught in a lie that calls into question the ENTIRE FUNDAMENTAL BASIS for going to war, killing more than 200 Americans, killing tens of thousands of Iraqis (in the recent conflict alone, much less 12 years ago and the ensuing time)

Bush lied and people died. They're dying now and all Bush can do is bungle sentences and slur his words. Halliburton is doing business with Iraq and all the Democrats can say is "There should be formal inquiry...please...yes...next Tuesday. Ok no...next week. YTes, new news story...something something ....what? You can't provide evidence? (media)OH DEMOCRATS! PLAYING POLITICS! (bush)T-hih-hih-hih...lets bomb Syria too! We'll fuck up everything! (Dems)*mewwwwwwl* *mewwwwwwwwwwwwwl* Please listen to us! Bush is bad!"

:nuke:

[NewYorkerfromMass]

47. Do not abandon the ship

we need a new captain and a new course. Jump off and you will drown.

[sandnsea]

70. Better, we're looking for better

The difference between you and me is, I'd vote for any candidate over Bush. We are in a whole different world in 2004. Maybe us oldsters get it, I don't know. I'd vote for Dean. I'd vote for Green. I'd vote for Lieberman, Biden or a Crispy Creme.

And I've got some more news for you. You name a candidate, any candidate. If that candidate succeeded in pushing Bush into an impeachment, created an interntional war crimes crisis, and drug the U.S. into the darkest days of our history; they WOULD NOT BE ELECTED!!!! Idealistic people think you just charge ahead, have a two week trial and get on with governing the country. Well guess what. We'd have Hastert as President at best, it would be Republicans as usual and the Dem would not win in 2004. Maybe we'd have President Bush 3. You've got to think here. Maybe you just don't understand what you're asking people to believe. A President intentionally killed American soldiers. People are not just going to wake up tomorrow and believe that. They have to come to it on their own. Investigations are the answer right now. The Party needs to be united behind that, no matter anything else. Beating the hell out of every Democratic candidate isn't going to accomplish your goal of exposing the truth about George W. Bush. You want to take on the rest of the bullshit in this country, that's great. Let's do it AFTER we get Bush out, hopefully run out on a rail.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

41. So when Bush wins another term

I hope your sacrifices in the support of continued war and occupation around the world don't hit too close to home. Not to mention a whole host of other plagues I don't need to mention.

[Terwilliger]

49. You've got to be kidding

Democrats have had the opportunity to stand up for the American people since November 7, 2000

[sangh0]

51. Rich, you've already made it clear

that you will only vote for losers.

[CWebster]

39. tsk tsk

"LiberalOasis: What do you think were the motivations for the Bush Administration to go to war with Iraq?

Howard Dean: I can't speak to his motives, because I can't read his mind.

I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, though, and presume that he believes Saddam Hussein was an imminent threat to our security.

I happen to disagree with that; I think we had Saddam pretty well contained. My problem with the war in Iraq isn't with motivation; it's with justification.

I don't believe the President was able to show that Iraq was an imminent threat to our security; his whole rationale for using force was based on the idea that they might be a danger to the United States at some point in the future.

Frankly, I've never understood why he was concentrating on Iraq, which had been successfully contained for twelve years, while every day a country like North Korea develops its nuclear capability."


http://www.liberaloasis.com/dean.htm

[Terwilliger]

50. new heights in double-speak...Dean trusts B*sh but he doesn't?

That will be just fine with me IF they carry through...in short order! If they don't attack hard they won't get another chance.

[Eloriel]

57. Terwilliger

That's not doublespeak at all. The quote from Dean is from weeks ago. this is what he released yesterday:

"I Seek Accountability"
http://blog.deanforamerica.com/archives/000690.html#more

WASHINGTON—While campaigning in the nation’s capital today, Governor Dean made the following statement regarding recent developments: “It only becomes more and more clear every day what a mistake this administration made in launching a pre-emptive war in Iraq. The evidence mounts that not only did the Administration mislead the American people and the world in making its case for war but that it failed to plan adequately for the peace.

“Today, we are paying the price: in lives lost, in a $100 billion price tag that only rises daily, and in the toll on our reputation around the world.

“There was a time and a place for questioning the veracity of the evidence being presented about the war. There was a time for asking the tough questions about the rationale for war, the planning for peace and the cost of the mission—and that time was before the first shot was fired. It was the duty of our elected representatives in Congress to ask the toughest possible questions about our purpose and our plans before signing a blank check for the Bush administration to wage pre-emptive war.

“Before the war began, I asked these questions and made it clear that the evidence did not support a pre-emptive war and that our failure to engage the international community would damage our credibility and security in the long-term.

“Today I ask: why are members of Congress running for president asking the tough questions today that they failed to ask before the war?

“I seek accountability. There are those in the administration who clearly misled the American people and the world. There needs to be an immediate bipartisan independent investigation and those responsible in the administration shouldn’t wait for the outcome of the investigation, they should resign today. But I also seek accountability from those who voted to give the President a blank check without asking the tough questions when they needed to be asked and long after it’s clear how mistaken this path was for our nation.

“The challenge now is to move forward. Our intelligence on the ground continues to be weak. Our soldiers are increasingly in harm’s way. We still don’t have adequate plans for securing the peace. And the administration is still not being honest about the realities of occupying Iraq and the commitment and resources necessary for the long-run.

“These are the serious questions that need to be asked: how long will we be there? How much will it cost? All of these are questions that should have been debated and discussed beforehand. That we are only debating those questions today is a failure of the leadership in Washington, both of this administration and of Congress.”

[sangh0]

60. Dean still won't call Bush* a liar

If he's so big on "accountability", why does he refuse to hold Bush* accountable? Why does he continue to blame the "administration" and not Bush* himself?

[SEAburb]

66. Dean still tap dancing around the issue of Bush's lies.

Just like he tap danced around his pre-Iraq war stance.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

24. Hundreds of thousands of AMERICANS wrote letters and e-mails,

called and faxed Congress re: the Iraq War Res. before the vote. Now I am to believe that you were misled? Misinformed?

As Sean Penn said, "I was born at night, but not last night."

This dog doesn't hunt.

[RichM]

27. CWebster is exactly right. Kerry talked out of both sides of his mouth,

meeting the greatest issue of recent times by caving in to political expediency. He has the C.V. of a leader, the gravitas & intelligence of a leader - just not the character or the guts.

[CWebster]

15. Nah, sanghy

Not so much a kick to Kerry to elevate Dean.
But why let Kerry off the hook? He already played his cards, and if we have a shot, why back someone who wasn't willing to back us when it came down to showing his hand?

[sangh0]

16. Dean gives Bush* "benefit of the doubt"

But I'm sure you'll let Dean "off the hook"

[CWebster]

21. As to the story behind the lies

not that there weren't any.

[sangh0]

30. Dean says we should give Bush*

"the benefit of the doubt"

Why won't Dean call Bush* a liar?

[Terwilliger]

33. WHY DONT YOU APPLY THAT TO KERRY, EDWARDS, and EVERYBODY ELSE

huh?

[sangh0]

52. Kerry said "Bush* misled"

and that we should have a "regime change" here in the US. Graham has also said something similar. But Howard Weenie is to afraid to call Bush* a liar. Dean wants to give Bush* the benefit of the doubt.

[theemu]

43. Actually, Dean never used that phrase when referring to Bush

You're quoting me and a few other Dean supporters in our attempt in one thread to explain why Dean didn't call for Bush's resignation (which, by the way, would STILL be political suicide). "The Benefit of the Doubt" was the phrase we used to describe the strategy of the Dean campaign - to isolate Bush by revealing the corruption of his administration and then going for the idiot king himself.

[sangh0]

53. You are being dishonest

I am quoting Dean, not you. It's dishonest for you to imply that I'm not quoting Dean.

http://www.liberaloasis.com/dean.htm

"LiberalOasis: What do you think were the motivations for the Bush Administration to go to war with Iraq?

Howard Dean: I can't speak to his motives, because I can't read his mind.

I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, though, and presume that he believes Saddam Hussein was an imminent threat to our security...."

[Eloriel]

See my post #57 just above

You're purposely misrepresenting what Dean said -- or rather WHEN he said it. It was weeks ago. Post #57 has his comments from yesterday.

He has consistently been the first out of the box and the boldest in his criticism of Bush and the war.

Eloriel

[Terwilliger]

10. I know how you feel CWeb

but he will be the candidate for the Democratic party

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

26. Hmmm. I don't know about that, T.

40% Kerry. 40% Dean. 20% Edwards. Follow the money.

[Terwilliger]

31. I do...and you should too

I thought it was all about unity? Well then tell Dean to go packing, because he won't be the nominee for President in 2004.

[molly]

5. I'm sorry I missed it

he's the man!

[tpub]

6. he was also on CNN

earlier this morning, also looking relaxed and sounding good!

[chimpymustgo]

8. Even though Edwards is my favorite, Kerry really comes across

well on TV, dealing with this kind of subject matter. You do feel like he understands the issue and will handle it thoughtfully.

[Bunny]

13. I liked that he got in a reference to his service in Nam.

And mentioned that half the names on the Wall got there because politicians were too proud to admit that they screwed up. Then he called for a complete investigation into the whole mess, said it was imperative for our national credibility, the safety of our troops, etc. that this be fully examined.

Said (paraphrased): there are days when he feels sorry for Tom Delay, and this is one of them. Made a comment on how inappropriate Delay is for tying this to the Democrats. Said the issue is above politics.

Kerry looked good. I like him. I haven't made up my mind yet, but I'll vote for whichever Dem is most electable. I will, in fact, sell my soul (figuratively speaking) and compromise most of my beliefs, if that's what it takes to get Bush the HELL out of Al Gore's house.

[phillybri]

17. That was an AWESOME point about Nam....

A lot of impact.

[tpub]

63. me too

<<I'll vote for whichever Dem is most electable.>>

God, I wish everyone here felt that way! We need to get rid of Bush ASAP. Vote for your dream candidate next time around.

[PROGRESSIVE1]

18. Kerry, Kerry, Kerry...

President Kerry Handled himself well on the "TODAY" show. Though I was turned off by his wishy-washy views before, today he showed himself a to be a leader.

:dem:

[Terwilliger]

36. He'll be a leader when he explains his Iraq vote

and when he explains his "get over it" comment

[noonwitch]

19. I'm liking Kerry more and more

I'd narrowed my choices down to Kerry, Graham and Edwards.
Edwards needs more experience, but could be a good VP pick.
Graham is a good guy, but I don't think he has much of a chance. Again, he'd be a good VP pick.
Kerry has experience-I am concerned that a northern democrat will have trouble against Bush, but not if this whole WMD/Niger story keeps on, or if the media finally realizes that it is just the tip of the iceburg. I saw him on the Today show and I liked what I was hearing from him.

I'm not a big Dean supporter, but he is out there getting the young people involved, and that's a good thing. If he doesn't get the nomination, he still can have a lot of impact with the platform due to the numbers of people he's getting involved in the party.

[oasis]

22. Kerry is looking and sounding better and better

:thumbsup:

[quinnox]

28. I missed it

Sounds like he did well. Kerry is picking up steam, he leads the money list for the first two quarters and just keeps getting better on the campaign trail. Bush is going down in 2004.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

34. Beating Bush Is A Moral Imperative

All politicians are trimmers even the best ones:

FDR promised to balance the budget if elected in 1932.

JFK said there was a missile gap caused by the Eisenhauer administration's failure to spend enough on defense. He also voted "present" on the motion to censure Joe McCarthy.

Bill Clinton signed the homophobic "Defense of Marriage" Act.

Politicians do what they have to do maintain their "political" viability.

I am not going to hold one vote against Kerry if he has the best chance of beating Bush.

My raison d'etre is to see a Democrat in the White House in 2004.

[Jeff in Cincinnati]

56. Wasn't it Clinton who said...

'Don't let the "Perfect" become the enemy of the "Good"?'

Dean isn't perfect (I like him, but he's not without his weaks points as politician). Kerry isn't perfect either, and neither is any other candidate.

I'll settle for -- and work like hell for -- the candidate who gets the nomination and can turn those bastards out of office.

[ThorsteinVeblen]

38. Kerry is a clown.

Kerry likes Tom Delay's dick up his ass - so much so, that Kerry feels sorry for Dealy when Delay can't stick his dick up Kerry's ass.

[Bunny]

44. Wow.

How very charming.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

48. Third Party.... Third Party..... Third Party

The only thing the Green Party accomplished in 2000 was electing George W Bush....

Ralph Nader got a paltry 2.75% of the vote in 2000. Hell, some of the
posters on this board could have done better.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

54. some of the posters on this board....

they wish. :)

We cannot afford to lose .001% of the vote in '04 to another vanity candidate.

[Terwilliger]

46. YOW!

there ya go

[retread]

58. They have a name for the candidate that fits the qualifications

you want. Unelectable!

[CWebster]

62. Funny

how y'all condemn him for selecting a loser when you're all rarin' to settle for one.

[dsc]

68. Gee I am glad you support my candidate

with a mouth like that. (not) Not only is it vile it is also homophobic. Plus I may never get a stiffy again from the mental image of Delay with a stiffy. A true trifecta.

[HalfManHalfBiscuit]

55. Our next president

It is so obvious.

[CWebster]

59. Its's so obvious

That he is a mouse?

Why yes, I agree.

;-)

[sangh0]

61. Yes, I agree. Dean is a mouse

who is afraid to say that Bush* lied.

[CWebster]

65. You're just baiting Sanghy

Clutching at straws. Consistantly Dean has been at the forefront of the most viable contenders in confronting the entire scope of those responsible for elevating the smirking fool to the heights of emperor.

Reality is a bitch when the walls come crashing down.

[HalfManHalfBiscuit]

64. That is a RAT

Don't worry, Kerry will be a great president.

[CWebster]

67. That works

too

[Nashyra]

69. What a sorry site

after reading here it's no wonder the Repugs aren't worried about losing. Some of you get a grip on reality. I will work hard for my choice of candidate in the primary, I'm hoping Clark runs but will work to support our nominee, I hope it's not Lieberman. I would never vote green because now is not the time for a protest vote, and * as a lameduck pres would have disasterous consequences.