The Decadence and Downfall of Modern American Society

[IrateCitizen]

Our "leaders" like to talk incessantly about how America is still on the rise, still looking forward to an even brighter tomorrow. The truth of the matter is that we've been on a decline for quite some time.

America's true golden moment was the years following WWII. Although there was a certain amount of self-interest involved, the Marshall Plan was our greatest foreign policy achievement, IMHO. In fact, I would go so far as to say that it exceeded even our contributions during WWII, because it helped melt away serious resentment from arising, as had happened following WWI and the Treaty of Versailles.

We also had the luxury then of containing over 50% of the world's manufacturing capacity, due to the rest of the industrialized world literally being in ruins. That made our economy boom beyond rational boundaries, and the generation that grew up in the post-war boom expected things like that to continue forever.

When Germany, Japan, and the rest of the industrialized world finally started coming back "on-line" and gaining greater shares of manufacturing capacity, it put a crimp into the US economy. Since we had invested almost all of our manufacturing capacity in private industry and created an economy based on the endless purchase of consumer goods, the only way we could maintain neverending growth was by basically mortgaging the future. This really began with Nixon's backing off of the gold standard and the Bretton-Woods system in favor of free currency exchange. It accelerated even further with Reagan's eroding of the social safety net, widening of the gap between the rich and the poor, and massive military overspending to run up huge deficits. Also, during this time, the US made the transition from a manufacturing economy to a speculative finance economy. During the post-war boom, something like 90% of all investment capital was directed toward manufacturing and R&D, while 10% was speculative finance. By 1990, the ratios had flipped. Funny thing is, John Kenneth Galbraith was warning about the direction of our economy going back to the 1950's, and if you read his book The Affluent Society today, you will be amazed as to just how much he was on the mark in 1958.

And despite what many here will say to the contrary, the Clinton years did not do much to change this. Much of the economic expansion of the 1990's was due to a technology boom brought on by the internet. While Clinton deserves some credit for better tax policies aimed at slightly reducing the rich v. poor gap, he really did very little to try and substansively change our economy. It continued through the 1990's to be based on short-term speculative finance, with corporate interests constantly trying to squeeze one last drop of productivity out of each individual worker while conducting layoffs in order to focus solely on next quarter's profits. The fact that Clinton's treasury secretary was someone like Bob Rubin (and later Lawrence Summers of Harvard fame currently) should show his administration's economic policies for what they really were.

Now, under Bush the lesser, we've taken these self-destructive policies into hyperdrive. We are running up record budget and trade deficits. We're overstretched militarily, and the primary thing holding our economy together is rampant consumer spending financed primarily through the hogging of the world's investment capital through the IMF and World Bank. The only question that remains is how long it will be before the fall, and how hard that fall will be. It's not like the US will enter some kind of dark age after this fall, but we can expect a 20-25% reduction in living standards across the board. We will diminish from our current status as a global hyperpower to just another major regional player in the greater community of nations.

Europe has realized that the use of military means to extend power and influence is a thing of the past. Real power in the world is wielded economically now. The US is incredibly vulnerable in this regard. Also, if nations want to gain influence in the world today, it is achieved through acting within the community of nations according to international standards, not through endless bullying and sabre-rattling, as the US now does.

Added to this is the lack of critical thought prevalent in America today. We are witnessing the final death throes of the Enlightenment in American society. Whereas people, before the advent of television, actually investigated, read about, and openly discussed a wide variety of issues at one time, that kind of inquiry has been replaced by the passive reception of belief.

Witness the way in which Enlightenment scientific principles have been rejected in pursuit of pushing Creationism in public school science classes. There is no way to prove or disprove Creationism through the application of the scientific method, it is simply a belief system. Also witness the polarization of our society along political lines. It used to be that you could disagree with someone but still discuss issues. Now, since people on the right receive their "talking points" from the likes of Bill O'Reilly, Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh, there is no breaking through to them to find common ground. They simply tune in each day to receive their marching orders, without a single instance of independent, critical thought.

Emmanuel Kant recognized this phenomenon all the way back in the 1700's when he said that people are generally lazy, and will have someone do their thinking for them if given the opportunity. It's just that this problem has been amplified by popular culture and mass media. That's what led Max Horkheimer and Theodoro Adorno to essentially recoil in horror at what they saw in American popular culture back in the 1950's. They already saw the trends toward groupthink and homogeneity that are so much more prevalent today. And in these trends becoming a reality, the seeds for fascism are sown....

For further insight into these phenomena, I'd recommend reading the following:
The Sorrows of Empire by Chalmers Johnson
Wealth and Democracy by Kevin Phillips
After the Empire by Emmanuel Todd
The Affluent Society by John Kenneth Galbraith

[ck4829]

1. Nominated

Great Thread

[Butterflies]

2. thanks for this

I heard about two of those books, but didn't get around to reading them yet. I'll have to get to the bookstore this weekend - you've gotten my interest going.

[flygal]

3. Good job!

So true so true - even the Clinton part. - nominated.

[H2O Man]

4. Look at that!

Four nominations already!

With all of the problems that admittedly were an everyday part of millions of Americans' lives, the era you point to was clearly the high-point of US society. It is no coincidence that this is the era that many people long for .... even a dimwit like President Bush2 has said he wishes he were part of WW2.

Certainly that era held the potential to be even greater .... but for a variety of reasons, the country did not live up to that potential, and did not fulfill the dream.

A common characteristic of psychotic people is that they try to go back to what was a happier time, and they try to "find" or recover some lost happiness, or sense of security. I think that this is a reoccuring theme in America .... trying to go back to 1950.

[NewJeffCT]

5. great post

I think groupthink is prevalent in many places, however, not just the US.

But, I am scared about things like creationism being taught in schools and the fact that our colleges & universities are being bastardized as elitist, while women are told to stay at home & be in the kitchen.

Nominated.

[IrateCitizen]

8. Regarding "groupthink"...

I agree that groupthink is not a phenomenon that exists solely in the US. However, I would say that it is far more prevalent here than in other parts of the world, especially other industrialized societies.

Perhaps most to blame for this is the lack of public spaces in the US. When my wife and I visited Europe, we were amazed at how much time people actually spent out of their homes. At 11:00 PM in Paris on a Tuesday you could walk along the Seine and regularly encounter groups of 15-20 people picnicking, drinking wine and talking. You NEVER find scenes like that in the US.

Here, every space outside your home (and in many cases, even inside of it) is treated as a possiblity for consumption. Gone is the Main Street that provided a public and commercial space, replaced by the mall that is strictly commercial. We have very few cafes where you can just sit and talk, and tons of fast food joints where the goal is to hustle you out as quickly as possible.

Personally, I think this is a HUGE reason behind the prevalence of groupthink in our society. People have been conditioned to no longer be citizens -- they are simply consumers.

[NewJeffCT]

15. well, it is changing a bit here in CT

In Connecticut, the most recent "mall" to open up was an outdoor mall, complete with a few cafes in it. Personally, I thought it was a bit cold here most of the year to have an outdoor mall, especially since it opened late Autumn... but, it seems to be a trend.

They may also soon break ground for a similar place in West Hartford, CT (a liberal small city of 60,000 or so - big for CT, small for the rest of America), much to the chagrin of the huge, old indoor mall a few miles away. West Hartford also has a very lively Main Street section with a ton of good restaurants, cafes and coffee shops and outdoor dining that you will find packed with people late on Summer nights.

[IrateCitizen]

23. There are certainly pockets of resistance about...

I myself live in a nice little town in Westchester Co., NY. We've got a nice walking mall in the main part of the village, and my wife and I can walk to a number of places -- the movies, the bookstore, restaurants, shops, etc. Plus, there's a nice village green along the creek that runs through town.

However, this is STILL not the norm. Most growth is done to maximize developer profits, which means more malls, more cul-de-sacs, more development that creates only private spaces and encourages car culture.

[starroute]

6. Here are a few online resources

No substitute for reading the recommended books, but good as a primer.


The Real Reasons for the US Invasion of Iraq—and Beyond
http://www.rupe-india.org/34/reasons.html

How America Lost Its Industrial Edge
http://www.insightmag.com/news/437040.html

[NewJeffCT]

16. the Insight link didn't work for me

I'd love to read it, however.

[starroute]

30. The article is widely reproduced online

If that link doesn't work (and it does for me), try:

http://www.pushhamburger.com/edge.htm

or

http://www.samnow.org/schollaert/how_america_lost_its_industria-edgel.htm

[Protagoras]

7. bravo

Now we need to figure out how to get words like this into the popular consciousness.

[IrateCitizen]

9. BWAHAHAHA! That's a good one!

To put words like this in the popular consciousness would require the elimination of the groupthink that is so prevalent in keeping words like this OUT of the popular consciousness.

Sadly, I think we need a crash-and-burn before more people wake up. And even in that event, I'm not entirely hopeful. I think that if we suffered another great depression here, people would actually welcome fascism as a solution to their problems, because they don't really want to think and trouble themselves with details and issues.

[Protagoras]

12. It's terrifying

how much I agree with you.

[IrateCitizen]

13. Yeah, well it's a lonely business being the few sane people left...

... in a world gone mad. ;-)

All you can do is buckle up and enjoy the roller coaster ride....

[unblock]

25. ah yes: where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise....

[IrateCitizen]

26. That's a damned good quote, unblock! Too true, as well. (nt)

[unblock]

31. it's from thomas gray, ode on a distant prospect of eton college

the very last line.




Thomas Gray


Ode on a Distant Prospect of Eton College
Ye distant spires, ye antique towers,
That crown the watery glade,
Where grateful Science still adores
Her Henry's holy shade;
And ye, that from the stately brow
Of Windsor's heights the expanse below
Of grove, of lawn, of mead survey,
Whose turf, whose shade, whose flowers among
Wanders the hoary Thames along
His silver-winding way.

Ah, happy hills, ah, pleasing shade,
Ah, fields beloved in vain,
Where once my careless childhood strayed,
A stranger yet to pain!
I feel the gales, that from ye blow,
A momentary bliss bestow,
As waving fresh their gladsome wing,
My weary soul they seem to soothe,
And, redolent of joy and youth,
To breathe a second spring.

Say, Father Thames, for thou hast seen
Full many a sprightly race
Disporting on thy margent green
The paths of pleasure trace,
Who foremost now delight to cleave
With pliant arm thy glassy wave?
The captive linnet which enthrall?
What idle progeny succeed
To chase the rolling circle's speed,
Or urge the flying ball?

While some on earnest business bent
Their murmuring labours ply
'Gainst graver hours, that bring constraint
To sweeten liberty:
Some bold adventurers disdain
The limits of their little reign,
And unknown regions dare descry:
Still as they run they look behind,
They hear a voice in every wind,
And snatch a fearful joy.

Gay hope is theirs by fancy fed,
Less pleasing when possessed;
The tear forgot as soon as shed,
The sunshine of the breast:
Theirs buxom health of rosy hue,
Wild wit, invention ever new,
And lively cheer of vigour born;
The thoughtless day, the easy night,
The spirits pure, the slumbers light,
That fly the approach of morn.

Alas, regardless of their doom,
The little victims play!
No sense have they of ills to come,
Nor care beyond today:
Yet see how all around 'em wait
The ministers of human fate,
And black Misfortune's baleful train!
Ah, show them where in ambush stand
To seize their prey the murderous band!
Ah, tell them they are men!

These shall the fury Passions tear,
The vultures of the mind
Disdainful Anger, pallid Fear,
And Shame that skulks behind;
Or pining Love shall waste their youth,
Or Jealousy with rankling tooth,
That inly gnaws the secret heart,
And Envy wan, and faded Care,
Grim-visaged comfortless Despair,
And Sorrow's piercing dart.

Ambition this shall tempt to rise,
Then whirl the wretch from high,
To bitter Scorn a sacrifice,
And grinning Infamy.
The stings of Falsehood those shall try,
And hard Unkindness' altered eye,
That mocks the tear if forced to flow;
And keen Remorse with blood defiled,
And moody Madness laughing wild
Amid severest woe.

Lo, in the vale of years beneath
A grisly troop are seen,
The painful family of Death,
More hideous than their Queen:
This racks the joints, this fires the veins,
That every labouring sinew strains,
Those in the deeper vitals rage:
Lo, Poverty, to fill the band,
That numbs the soul with icy hand,
And slow-consuming Age.

To each his sufferings: all are men,
Condemned alike to groan,
The tender for another's pain;
The unfeeling for his own.
Yet ah! why should they know their fate?
Since sorrow never comes too late,
And happiness too swiftly flies.
Thought would destroy their paradise.
No more; where ignorance is bliss,
'Tis folly to be wise.

[tom_paine]

14. I'm afraid I agree with that assessment

The way I say it (of course) is that our National Personality has gone from the Free Citizens who Defeated Hitler to those who's Cowardly Totalitarian Apathy allowed Hitler to Achieve Power.

But that is only a different way of saying what you are saying: That when the Bush-engineered economic catastophe occurs, the people will be ready to follow THE LEADER and scapegoat/blame the ususal Liberal, Jewish, Black, homsexual suspects, which is what Germany did.

We (and to be honest we must include ourselves collectively with the Imperial Subjects of Amerika) will NOT do as Free America did during the Great Depression, which is roll up our sleeves and look for Free World Solutions with a minimum of blaming scapegoating.

Because the Busheviks, who basically control everything, will not allow that, and will as they always have utilize Nazi Propaganda Tactics, to exploit the latest tragedy for their own personal/political gain.

[SoCalDem]

56. First off. It should start with "Ahh Teyull Yooo Wut"

and then maybe it would go "mainstream".. Add some pictures of monster trucks and mud-wrasslin..
Load it up with Nascar references.. toss in "personal responsibility"... and have American Idol & Survivor lingo..

People are hopelessly ignorant these days.. they are concentrating on trivial nonsense and by the time they "get it", it will be too late.

We have cast our lot with idiots..

[BreweryYardRat]

10. Well said, by God!

Nominated!

Edit: Or it would be, if I had enough posts. :(

[IrateCitizen]

11. Welcome to DU, seawolf!

I'll welcome you even if you can't yet nominate my thread! :D

[Hoping4Change]

32. Hey there mate-y.

Welcome seawolf. Glad you're aboard. I agree this is a terrific post. This post is yet another example why DU ROCKS. I too nominate it. :kick:

[Logansquare]

17. What frightens me is that the U.S. *does* have huge military power

and the decline in influence you describe above may trigger even more aggressive use of our arsenal. In this case the sore loser won't just take his ball and go home; he'll nuke the court.

[IrateCitizen]

18. If the US "nukes the court", then the US will end as well...

Let's not forget that the US isn't the only country with a huge nuclear arsenal. Russia still has one as well.

The US military machine will simply collapse in upon itself, especially as we run out of money to pay for it. That's not to say there won't be a few death throes -- we're witnessing one in Iraq right now -- that will make things unpleasant, but I don't think the world will be blown up in the process.

[Logansquare]

19. God, I hope you're right n/t

[IrateCitizen]

20. The USSR didn't "nuke the court" for those very reasons...

I sincerely hope that the neocons aren't crazy enough to do so, if even the former Soviet hard-liners weren't.

[raccoon]

21. America's glory days are over

Great post.

As you pointed out in your post, the years following WWII were America's best years economically. I'd say about 1945-70. After that things slowly but surely went downhill.

Those years were an aberration when you look at the country's history as a whole. But things were so good for so long that I guess people came to take good times for granted.

Those days are gone. For those who are in their 20's now, and the generation(s) after them, it will be much more difficult to get started in life, much less have an affluent lifestyle such as many of their parents/grandparents had. Some will; most won't.

It seems that since I've been old enough to pay attention to economic trends (my 20's), life has become harder for most Americans. Inflation rates got higher. Rates, official rates, that is, (and I believe they understate the reality) got higher over the decades. It's true that inflation rates have come down since the 70s-early 80s, but rates that we consider livable now would have been appalling in the '50's. Most people's wages haven't kept up with inflation. More and more "good" jobs go overseas, are automated, or simply disappear. Fewer and fewer jobs offer benefits, especially health insurance. Housing, medical care, including prescription drugs, and higher education prices soar way past the official inflation rates.

I don't know where it'll all end but an awful lot of people will have to get used to living at a lower standard of living than they ever expected to.

As for another economic collapse on the order of the Great Depression in the US, I would be dismayed but not surprised if it did happen.
If it does, it's going to be a heck of a lot worse than the last one.

Something to think about: in the Great Depression, many Americans were still farmers, and could at least produce their own food. I doubt if ConAgra or similar corporations will help anybody out.

I read somewhere that the Great Depression produced a lot of disillusioned people, but another depression would leave America's cities in ashes.

[ulysses]

22. damned excellent analysis.

:thumbsup:

[sendero]

24. Color me..

.... in complete agreement.

Funny how the "liberals" of yesterday are the "conservatives" of today - yet I have not changed.

Those of us longing for a "sustainable" society have gone from being wild-eyed leftists to being the only realists. What a world :)

[Beetwasher]

27. Sensational Post!

:thumbsup: Nominated!

[IrateCitizen]

28. Self-aggrandizing KICK!

:kick:

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

29. Americans are clinging to a notion of a "Golden Age" reclaimed.

The Republicans and many Democrats yearn for the mythical times of the '50s, when minorities and women knew their place and were "happy" in it.
When (white) men went off to the office and made money to bring home to the dutiful wife cooking dinner and the mischievous but good kids. While blacks were unseen and jolly Mexicans tended the garden. The country where American soldiers were seen as dispensers of candy bars to grateful citizens in little countries heroically fighting off the dirty, murderous, Commies.

Birmingham and Oxford and My Lai and a naked girl covered in burns changed that. For a brief period, Americans were confronted with the reality of the "Golden Age". Improvements were made. Americans began to question everything from the consumer society to the wisdom of endless wars to protect the corporations.

But, it was a brief period. Superceded by "Morning in America" which meant nightmares for the 3rd world. Reagan telling us about millionaire "Welfare Queens", "Trickle down economics", the destruction of labor as a political force, the reglorification of the military, the emergence of "Family Values", the demonization of the "cultural elite", the measure of "success" measured in money and things, education reduced to producing workers for the corporations...
etc.

We have become a nation devoted to Bread and Circuses. Or, in today's terms, SUV's and the Superbowl. News as entertainment and Donald Trump as an ideal.

All capped off with "Have a Nice Day" and bumper magnets that proclaim our patriotism.

[Joe Chi Minh]

43. Very perceptive and dry,

as a counterpoise to the thread header, Tierra y Libertad - which was nevertheless also on the mark in significant ways, I think, notably in the matter of the negative economic developments.

[Hoping4Change]

33. Brilliant post iratecitizen. Thank you for taking time to compose

a very informative analysis.:yourock:

[DrGonzoLives]

34. A question about manufacturing

You say: "Since we had invested almost all of our manufacturing capacity in private industry and created an economy based on the endless purchase of consumer goods, the only way we could maintain neverending growth was by basically mortgaging the future."

Thing is, what else is manufacturing used for, other than to create consumer goods? There's the military, but I think we can both agree that we don't want to keep increasing the size of the military without bound. And when Germany and Japan came back together, they were making consumer goods as well.

This doesn't invalidate the rest of the essay, by any stretch of the imagination, I'm just a little confused at what else manufacturing capacity should have been invested in.

[IrateCitizen]

35. Perhaps I should have said "industrial capacity" instead...

"Manufacturing" is a bit misleading, as you pointed out.

John Kenneth Galbraith was saying back in the 1950's that way too much of our industrial capacity was invested in production of private consumer goods, and not nearly enough was being invested in public works. That's the point I was trying to make. We've put all our eggs in production of consumer goods to the neglect of our public works. Given the fact that the ASCE recently gave US infrastructure a D- grade overall, it seems things have only gotten worse since JKG's warnings.

[DrGonzoLives]

36. Point taken

Although it seems to me that there is some kind of limit as far as public works go - you can only build so many roads, bridges, government buidlings, and so forth.

I think the problem was irrational exuberance, as Greenspan would say. We were so happy after winning the war and being basically unscathed, that we just wanted to buy a bunch of shit.

[IrateCitizen]

37. But there's a different way of looking at it than that, Doc...

When you invest money in infrastructure, such as roads, railroads, schools, power generation, parks, etc. -- you aren't simply sinking money into manufacturing a single item. Rather, you are creating an ongoing source of societal wealth. Investment in schools (programs and physical structures) is an investment in future generations. Investing in railroads and roads helps improve commerce. Investing in parks makes cities preferable places to live, resulting in more bright people choosing to live there. Investing in a world-class power grid and generation facilities helps prevent problems like the blackout of 2003.

When that capacity is used strictly for consumer goods, however, little of lasting value or creation of return is developed. Consumer goods are simply used and then tossed away.

You're also neglecting the rold of the advertising industry in this "irrational exuberance". The 1950's was the boom of the ad business in the US, and its methods gradually shifted from simply marketing products to helping create dissatisfaction in order to make people think those products were a necessity. JKG talks about this a good deal in The Affluent Society.

[Joe Chi Minh]

44. All those investments

in the fabric of society at every level, that you allude to, also create extraordinarily beneficial synergies.

[IrateCitizen]

46. You just summed up in one single sentence....

... what I tried to sum up in a couple of paragraphs.

"Extraordinarily beneficial synergies" -- I like the sound of that. A lot.

[Joe Chi Minh]

49. Thank you, IrateCitizen.

My style of writing is usually turgid, so I'm grateful for your plaudit. But the ready availability of so many richly beneficial synergies, if only our societies were run responsibly, is a theme I ruminate on all the time, and the newspaper headlines just drive me mad.

Knowing the price of everything and the value of nothing, they putatively "rationalise" what should never be "rationalised", (at least in the meretricious and harmful way they do it) and complicate and render chaotic, a host of areas, such, for example, taxation, which should be rationalised and simplified.

[Emboldened Chimp]

38. Great analysis, but there is one false assumption...

"Added to this is the lack of critical thought prevalent in America today. We are witnessing the final death throes of the Enlightenment in American society. Whereas people, before the advent of television, actually investigated, read about, and openly discussed a wide variety of issues at one time, that kind of inquiry has been replaced by the passive reception of belief."

While it's true that the leaders of the past were more learned and insightful than the ones we have now, the typical American has always been a dolt. Looking back, it does appear that regular people knew more facts and figures, but the penchant for hyperbole, sensationalism and religious fervor has long been part of the American character. It's because of the advent of television--and later the Internet--that stupidity and extremism have seemingly become more prevalent, but it has always been there. It started with the Salem witch trials and really hasn't stopped since.

[IrateCitizen]

39. Oh, I'm far from saying that Americans as a whole...

... were ever an "enlightened" people. Quite the opposite. But, at least before the advent of mass media like television, people did have to think for themselves a little more.

Perhaps what I find to be most alarming is the willful ignorance that exists within the "professional classes" nowadays. I cannot even begin to count how many people I know who are college graduates, working in successful jobs, who will actually BRAG that they haven't read a single book in years. But they all have the big-screen TV with over 300 channels of digital cable!

I am led to believe that the fact that I read dozens of books each year makes me a complete outcast in my own society. I don't think it was always like that.

[Ezlivin]

41. If you read, then you are a threat to those that don't

Like you, I'm a voracious reader and love challenging myself with new genres periodically.

Apart from my wife and a good friend, no one I know reads. These people are completely informed via television and, in some cases, the newspaper. They are completely unaware of the world of literature.

I have a big collection of books. I have signed artwork. I have a big-screen television. In the past 20+ years, guess how many people have commented on the books or art? They don't seem to exist. Eyes glaze over when people see the television. It commands their attention like few other things (apart from the ubiquitous cellphone).

Being erudite is not what it used to be.

[IrateCitizen]

45. Yeah, ignorance is the new cool....

When my sister-in-law and brother-in-law (wife's sister and her husband) recently bought a new house, they had a bunch of bookshelves in the livingroom. Their immediate question was, "What are we going to put on these shelves to fill them up?"

They didn't own ANY books between the two of them. And my brother-in-law is a college graduate. They ended up filling the shelves with pictures.

The first thing I do when I'm in somebody's house is look through their books. I ALWAYS have gravitated to bookshelves, ever since I was a kid. Of course, I grew up in a house with a lot of books and a mother who read constantly, so it rubbed off on me. Now, my wife and I have more books than we know what to do with!

But yeah, we're definitely the anomaly. It's just much, much more cool to be ignorant these days. It amazes me when I actually hear people BRAG about not reading books, like it's some kind of badge of honor.

[anarchy1999]

59. Thank you IrateCitizen for your excellent essay!

We had a young man in our home recently who works with my husband selling shares in gas wells. We were talking politics and I tried to share a book with him. He told me he doesn't read books, never has and not going to start now. He bragged and was proud of making it through school without ever having read a book! I still don't know what to think!

I tried to give my brother John Dean's book for Christmas, he gave it back to me. He and his wife make 3 figures, live in a 250kplus house, have two young sons and go to a large Methodist church every Sunday! His philosophy is to just take care of his family and not be concerned with the world.

Once again, thank you for such a well written essay, I wish I could do just half the job, just once. It is certainly deserving of Front Page and all the nominations!

[IrateCitizen]

60. I'm always tempted to confront people like that...

He told me he doesn't read books, never has and not going to start now. He bragged and was proud of making it through school without ever having read a book! I still don't know what to think!

I know exactly what to think. This guy is expressing pride in the fact that he's an ignoramous? If anything, he should be ASHAMED that he's never read a book. As someone who takes pride in being erudite, I am sick to death of this "pride in ignorance" that so permeates our society.

From now on, when I hear people say such things, I'm going to start responding, "So let me get this straight... you think that being ignorant is a GOOD thing, and you're PROUD of it? If I was as willfully stupid as you, the LAST thing I would do is go around telling others like it's something to BRAG about!"

[DinahMoeHum]

40. There's a Middle Eastern saying about progress and decline. . .

it goes like this:

My father rode a camel.
I drive a car.
My son flies a jet-plane.
His son will ride a camel.


:evilfrown:

[Joe Chi Minh]

47. Brilliant, Dinah.

They're so much wiser than our materialist go-getters

[PROGRESSIVE1]

42. kick

[Pooka Fey]

48. Good essay. Thanks for book recommendations.

[kaitykaity]

50. Too many opt for the blue pill, drink the Kool Aid,

Bread and circuses all over the place, distractions,
people numbed with anti-depressants or food or gambling
or alcohol.

The only question really is is there a cure for what
ails us or is the system too sick to be fixed.

[0007]

51. Number one post for sure.

[KoKo]

52. Nice! and this Kant quote thrown in....sort of says it all...

or alot of it, anyway...

Emmanuel Kant recognized this phenomenon all the way back in the 1700's when he said that people are generally lazy, and will have someone do their thinking for them if given the opportunity. It's just that this problem has been amplified by popular culture and mass media. That's what led Max Horkheimer and Theodoro Adorno to essentially recoil in horror at what they saw in American popular culture back in the 1950's. They already saw the trends toward groupthink and homogeneity that are so much more prevalent today. And in these trends becoming a reality, the seeds for fascism are sown....

[KoKo]

53. BTW...my feeling is folks aren't lazy. It's that our CMSM takes advantage

of lack of time and instead of information gives us "entertainment and disinformation." How are folks supposed to deal with this? We expected our Government Reps to do this. It takes a long time for folks to get that those they vote for give shit about them...a long time.

It's only when it hits their pockebooks they wake up. That's why some are always the "canary in the coal mines...or Cassandra's" who see it first and it's up to us to hold fast until they get their "butts in gear." That's what I think...for 2 Cents, anyway. :shrug:

[IrateCitizen]

61. CMSM just amplifies it. It's always been there, Susan.

Back around the turn of the century, there wasn't any TV or radio, but people still flocked to see the vulgar displays of Billy Sunday and other fundamentalist preachers who simply filled their heads full of what they should simply believe and left no room for critical thought.

If Kant noticed it back in the late 18th century, then it certainly has been a constant. People, as a rule, don't like to think, because thinking is so damned HARD. It means that you have to try and make sense out of a complex and chaotic world. Why trouble yourself with such endeavors when you can get someone to just tell you what to believe and what to reject, and give it to you wrapped up in a nice neat box?

I've come to see DU at times as like a modern-day enlightenment project. Sure, we get our fair share of meaningless drivel here, but every once in a while we get a discussion that really spurs people to think in greater detail about the world around them. In effect, at times these forums act like an online "salon" in the tradition of 18th century France.

[achtung_circus]

54. Nominate & Kick nt.

[RandomKoolzip]

55. It's a sure bet we won't see THIS thread quoted in a conservative column..

IC, I swear you hit it out of the park every time you're at bat. I'm in awe.


Great fuckin' thread! Kick.

[IrateCitizen]

57. .

[LeftHander]

58. Excellent post...

Kick...
and nominate...