US fires missiles at Baghdad crowd

[leftchick]

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/B13F5DC7-E9A9-4D86-8C05-235CBF641973.htm

<snip>

Up to 10 Iraqis have been killed and 35 others injured after US helicopters fired missiles at a crowd in a central Baghdad street.


The attack, which also killed a Palestinian journalist, follows fierce clashes which began when US military vehicles, firing stun grenades, entered Haifa street in the centre of the capital at about 2am (1100 GMT) on Sunday, an Iraqi journalist told Aljazeera.

A US armoured vehicle was set ablaze and as a group of Iraqi men gathered around the burning vehicle, US helicopters swooped in and fired machine guns and missiles at the crowd, killing up to 10 Iraqis and injuring 35 others.

Twenty-eight year old Palestinian television journalist, Mazin al-Tumaisi, was also killed and two photographers wounded, when the US missiles struck.



The casualties were all civilians, said an Iraqi journalist

[izzie]

1. Like the English we seem to have our own Gen Dyer

Some day we will look back on all this, or you young people will, as our fall into a second rate country.These things are starting to add up. Any one study history out their?

[IndianaGreen]

2. And like the English, both political parties seem to like imperialism

In the end we will leave Iraq, with our tail between the legs, and deservedly so for being so arrogant and boastful that we could convince ourselves that we could reshape the world into our own image.

[asjr]

3. Our invasion of Iraq is sending a terrible message to the

young people of this country. It has recruited many more warmongers, politically. And the ones who buy the lie about Hussein and Al Queda will be the first to want to invade other countries. The current administration is so power-hungry there is nothing they will not do to gain it. Those who support it I call betrayers of this country.

[louis c]

29. I agree with you

and I am also distressed by Kerry's Iraq position.

Here's my take on the matter, however.

If Bush wins, the War in Iraq will continue. Even if a large majority of Democrats continue to oppose the war, Bush and the Repukes will have enough political strength to continue the war for years.


If, as I expect, Kerry wins, he cannot alienate a large majority of Democrats and continue this war. The only good thing about how divisive this election is, is that Kerry can not expect any support from Repukes.

Therefore, this war can end because Kerry can't continue it if his base disapproves.

He will end up like LBJ, only this time we won't let them kill Bobby.

(on edit). We have to be realistic, and increase our chances of success in the future.

[DavidDvorkin]

8. History doesn't apply to America

We neve make the mistakes previous empires did. We're much smarter than they were, and besides, God really is on our side, whereas they just thought he was on theris.

[tabasco]

11. We don't have to become a second-rate country.

Just an equal among the community of nations. I do look forward to the day that we no longer consider ourselves a superpower, and no longer consider it necessary to spend more than the rest of the world on "defense."

[Strelnikov_]

14. "America is the strongest and most prosperous nation on earth,"

Nately informed him with lofty fervor and dignity. "And the American fighting man is second to none."

"Exactly," agreed the man pleasantly, with a hint of taunting amusement. "Italy, on the other hand, is one of the least prosperous nations on earth. And the Italian fighting man is probably second to all. And that’s exactly why my country is doing so well in this war while your nation is doing so poorly."

"The Germans are being driven out, and we are still here. In a few years you will be gone, too, and we will still be here. You see, Italy is really a very poor and weak country, and that’s what makes us so strong. Italian soldiers are not dying any more. But American and German solders are. I call that doing extremely well. Yes, I am quite certain that Italy will survive this war and still be in existence long after your own country has been destroyed."

"America is not going to be destroyed!" Nately shouted.

Never?" prodded the old man softly.

"Well. . " Nately faltered.

The old man laughed indulgently, "Rome was destroyed, Greece was destroyed, Persia was destroyed, Spain was destroyed. All great countries are destroyed. Why not yours? How much longer do you think your own country will last? Forever?"

From: "Catch-22" by Joseph Heller

[ClintonTyree]

4. I imagine the people of Iraq.....................

are at the florists this very moment buying more flowers to throw at the feet of their liberators. :eyes:

[NeoConsSuck]

5. This is a dupe..

but then again, you show pictures..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x820857

[mom cat]

6. Tieneman Square. It is only bad if "they" do it. .Any "they" but us.

[Rose Siding]

7. MSNBC's report matches this one about the journalist

At least 24 killed in Baghdad fighting
U.S. helicopter opened fire on disabled U.S. vehicle
snip>
Witnesses said several people milling around the Bradley, including a correspondent for the Arabic language Al-Arabiya television station, were killed. An Iraqi cameraman working for the Reuters news agency was also injured.

Al-Arabiya broadcast videotape showing its employee, Mazen al-Tumeizi, preparing to make a report. Suddenly, an explosion occurred behind him. He doubled-over and began screaming "I'm dying, I'm dying" and colleagues tried to help him.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5949556/

Also in this report:
Elsewhere, a suicide attacker detonated an explosives-packed vehicle at the gates of Abu Ghraib prison, killing himself but causing no other casualties, the U.S. military said. American guards fired at the vehicle before the driver could reach the gate, the military said.
-----------------

It doesn't say, but I've been wondering about those 12 loaded humvees that were taken.

[leftchick]

16. on This Week with Little George they showed video....

of the Helicopter attack. It only lasted a few seconds but it was awful, with blood splattering over the camera lense. I have no idea if it was the same cameraman who died or not. :(

[Cocoa]

9. maybe this is what Rummy meant

when he said violence would increase as we near the election...

[UCLA02]

10. So when do the rules allow you to bomb a "sovereign" nation??

I thought Iraq belonged to Iraqis again?? Let THEM bomb it!

/sarcasm off/

[Ohio rules]

12. digital cameras in the back ground make it

a small small world.



wonder what other images will be released ?

Now where is that dinosaur main stream media

[Gyre]

13. Obviously our missles are designed

with special sensors to detect Palestinians. Must be the Israeli spies in the US have made some mods to US missles so they prefer Palestinians to other targets. "Made in the US, designed for the IDF."

The tactics as well, are straight from the Israeli playbook. Kill a couple of them on the street, wait a minute for medical and media people to respond and then launch some missles into the crowd that gathered to help.

Ain't it great to have the Israelis helping us kill and torture Arabs? They have so much more experience. It's just so darn nice of them to help. :grr:

Gyre

[shadu]

15. you are right

[Radius]

20. We

designed the hellfire missile for ourselves, to kill armor. The Israelis bought it, modified it to lower its yield and use it to kill hamas scum. It has a lot more guidance than some jackass blowing himself up on a bus full of non combatants. Not as much as the hamas guy who shot the pregnant lady her kids and her infant in a car seat with an AK-47. How much oppression does it take to shoot an infant at point blank with a rifle?

We don't get or need help from Israel on making effective weapon systems. They buy from us and Europe, dont tell anyone, the arabs may start considering Germany the great satan too.

AP link has the Bradley knocked out, insurgents mugging for al-jiz, and being killed when we blow it in place to prevent it from being scavenged for ordinance. "jubilant fighters" was the quote from AP.

If we wanted to kill civilians in mass I can think of better ways than blowing up a bradley.

[thebigidea]

22. al-jiz? The satellite semen channel?

"If we wanted to kill civilians in mass I can think of better ways than blowing up a bradley."

Yeah, we could invade a country and dismiss any deaths as "regrettable."

[Radius]

26. AP

report identifies the dead here as "jubilant fighters". I'm sure they were jubilant after knocking out an apc.

Hit arabic al-jiz's cartoon section and search for yahud, you'll get the picture.

[The_Casual_Observer]

23. What are you talking about?

Save the explanation for FR please.

[Radius]

27. AP

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=540&ncid=736&e=2&u=/ap/20040912/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq

A Bradley fighting vehicle rushing down Haifa Street, a major traffic artery near the Green Zone, to assist a U.S. patrol disabled by a car bomb about 6:50 a.m., the U.S. military said. Two Bradley crewmen were wounded in the attack and four more were injured by grenade and small arms fire as they fled the vehicle, the military said.

Jubilant fighters, curiosity seekers and young boys swarmed around the burning vehicle, dancing, cheering and hurling firebombs. Several young men placed a black and yellow banner of Tawhid and Jihad in the barrel of the Bradley's main gun.

Fearing the crowd would loot the vehicle of weapons and ammunition, the Americans called for air support, and as U.S. Army helicopters flew over the burning Bradley "they received small-arms fire from the insurgents in vicinity of the vehicle," a military statement said.

The helicopters "fired upon the anti-Iraqi forces and the Bradley preventing the loss of sensitive equipment and weapons


AP

[leftchick]

33. "jubilant fighters"...

tell that to them....



Women gather to mourn the death of Saad Muchawet and his three sons, Haider, Ali and Karar, at Sadr City, Baghdad, Iraq (news - web sites), Sunday Sept. 12, 2004. Locals said the family was shot by U.S. soldiers while travelling in a car early in the morning as fighting from overnight continued into the morning in many parts of Baghdad. (AP Photo/Karim Kadim)

[Radius]

34. I don't write for the AP

If you have a complaint with their story don't attack the messenger.

[leftchick]

35. "the U.S. military said"... is what the AP reports....

they rarely stray from the official military version of events which are hardly reflective of reality on the ground in Iraq.

[drdtroit]

17. Winning those hearts and minds n/t

[Barrett808]

18. Reuters reports that this was videotaped - anybody have a link? n/t

[leftchick]

32. no but I saw a few seconds of it...

on This Week with georgie of all things. It was very brief but quite frightening. I saw blood splattered on the lense of the camera person who was filming it. I don't know if this was the person killed or not.

It got me thinking of all of the footage coming out of Iraq that must be getting censored by the WH*.

:grr:

[Comadreja]

19. Likudization kicking in

I realize there are those who disagree, but I see the bloody hand of Sharon behind these tactics. How long before the US builds a huge wall around the oil fields and just drops bombs or lobs missiles over to quell disturbances? I doubt there will be any desire to colonize the majority of iraqi land, though.

[Radius]

21. Always the Jews

There is a great jewish conspiracy....

Maybe they can lend us a hand, since they wiped out their neighbors attacks in 6 days..

We developed the weapon system used by Israel to kill hamas slime in their cars. When jews start blowing themselves up in west bank restaurants full of women and kids, I'll be more sympathetic to their cause. They are pawns in an arab cold war.

Didn't the Chinese have a wall to, to keep the bad guys out?

I'm not even jewish and tire of this stuff.

[The_Casual_Observer]

24. Let's start building more walls

The world needs more walls!

[Radius]

25. If it keeps him out more power to them..

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/album43/is33


http://www.showmenews.com/2004/Mar/20040325News017.asp

[gottaB]

28. latest explanations, Reuters and AP

Reuters

The U.S. military said two of its helicopters opened fire after coming under attack from the crowd. Reuters television footage showed no evidence of shooting from the ground.

"As the helicopters flew over the burning Bradley they received small-arms fire from the insurgents in vicinity of the vehicle," a military statement said. "Clearly within the rules of engagement, the helicopters returned fire destroying some anti-Iraqi forces in the vicinity of the Bradley."

Earlier, the U.S. military had said a helicopter destroyed the vehicle "to prevent looting and harm to the Iraqi people" after four U.S. soldiers were lightly wounded in the attack on the Bradley.

Violence Sweeps Baghdad

AP:

Jubilant fighters, curiosity seekers and young boys swarmed around the burning vehicle, dancing, cheering and hurling firebombs. Several young men placed a black and yellow banner of Tawhid and Jihad in the barrel of the Bradley's main gun.

Fearing the crowd would loot the vehicle of weapons and ammunition, the Americans called for air support, and as U.S. Army helicopters flew over the burning Bradley ''they received small-arms fire from the insurgents in vicinity of the vehicle,'' a military statement said.

The helicopters ''fired upon the anti-Iraqi forces and the Bradley preventing the loss of sensitive equipment and weapons,'' the military said in a statement. ''An unknown number of insurgents and Iraq civilians were wounded or killed in the incident,'' which is under investigation.

Insurgents hammer central Baghdad, 25 dead in surge of violence in the capital

[kayell]

30. That'll teach 'em about their right to assemble

:eyes:

[semillama]

31. note the semantics...

Anyone catch that western media consistently characterizes the crowd as "anti-Iraqi forces?"

That's quite interesting, considering it was Americans that were attcked by the car bomb, and Americans who responded by firing into the crowd.

I will say that while it's disgusting that we value not letting insurgents get a hold of our weapons over civilian lives, it's probably not smart in any situation to get close to a burning military vehicle containing live ammunition.

My best friend is in the military and it's a miracle that he hasn't been sent over there yet. He was deployed to Afghanistan last year, and that was a real eye-opener for him, however. I just hope he keeps dodging that deployment bullet...

[UCLA02]

36. When I used to load bombs and missiles on F/A-18s in the Navy...

on an aircraft carrier in the Gulf, we used to call our job "population control and landscaping." Pretty fucking twisted, I know. When I see actions such as this I just shake my head...

Who was that brainwashed 20yo I used to be...