Army Corps orders thousands of trees chopped down (within 15 of levees)

[Tab]

Source: Associated Press

COLUMBIA, La. – The Army Corps of Engineers is on a mission to chop down every tree in the country that grows within 15 feet of a levee — including oaks and sycamores in Louisiana, willows in Oklahoma and cottonwoods in California.

The corps is concerned that the trees' roots could undermine barriers meant to protect low-lying communities from catastrophic floods like the ones caused by Hurricane Katrina.

An Associated Press survey of levee projects nationwide shows that the agency wants to eliminate all trees along more than 100,000 miles of levees. But environmentalists and some civil engineers insist the trees pose little or no risk and actually help stabilize levee soil.

Thousands of trees have been felled already, though corps officials did not have a precise number of how many will be cut.

The corps has "this body of decades of experience that says you shouldn't have trees on your levees," said Eric Halpin, the agency's special assistant for dam and levee safety.

The saws are buzzing despite the outcry from people who say the trees are an essential part of fragile river and wetland ecosystems.

"The literature on the presence of vegetation indicates that it may actually strengthen a levee," said Andrew Levesque, senior engineer for King County, Wash., where the corps wants trees removed on the six rivers considered vital to salmon populations.

The anti-tree policy arose from criticism directed at the corps after Katrina breached levees in New Orleans in 2005. The agency promised to get tough on levee managers and improve flood protection.

In 2006, the corps began sending hundreds of letters to levee districts across the nation, ordering them to cut down "unwanted woody vegetation," a prospect that could cost many of the districts millions of dollars each in timber-clearing expenses.

Inspectors began an inventory of the levee system and told districts to fill in animal burrows, repair culverts and patch up erosion.

If they fail to comply, the agencies risk higher flood insurance premiums and a loss of federal funding.

"The corps' new edict was regarded as a major change in policy," said Ronald Stork, senior policy expert with California Friends of the River in Sacramento. "Something that is cheap and inexpensive is a chain saw. It was something to do that didn't cost a lot of money that made you feel better."

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090609/ap_on_re_us/us_treeless_levees

[jody]

1. Sadly that is a good policy. n/t

[elleng]

14. Please explain.

'Last summer, the cutting crews came to Columbia, La., on the wooded Ouachita River levee at Breston Plantation, an 18th-century French colonial estate.

The plantation is surrounded by sycamores, live oaks, elms, pines, cedars, magnolias and crepe myrtles. Hundreds of trees grow within 15 feet of the levee. In theory, they would all have to go.

But after months of negotiations with landowners and the Tensas Basin Levee District, the corps agreed to let the district chop down only a few dozen trees on the levee.

"We don't know how long the trees have been here, but they've never caused any problem up until now," said Hugh Youngblood, 61, whose ancestors came to Breston in the 1800s.

On a recent afternoon, his son, who is also named Breston, was upset as he walked the levee, pointing to a heap of limbs.

"They didn't even find a buyer for the wood or the pulp," the son said.

In 2007, the corps sought to clear oaks, cottonwoods, willows and other vegetation from 1,600 miles of levees in California's Central Valley. But state wildlife officials complained that the policy would destroy habitat, and residents in Sacramento and elsewhere objected that it would have turned rivers into little more than barren culverts.

The corps eventually dropped the idea.'

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hYTAEgLNJfsFs2ED9JyhtLgUiG1gD98NBV5O0

[tularetom]

2. About time they got their head out of their ass and started to maintain levees properly.

The roots of these trees can damage the levees. And when the trees are undermined by high water and fall over, the root systems can take large amounts of the levee with them and cause major failures.

[HardWorkingDem]

4. It would make sense to....

use rocks/concrete encased in steel webbing.

This is a myth. And most often peddled by those who have some sort of ulterior motive.

[HardWorkingDem]

3. Personally, I believe the "tree root" issue is a myth...

We put steel rebar in concrete, correct?

If anything, tree roots would most likely act as an additional measure verses erosion.

Also, some ignorant folks who believed this did this same thing along a road/levee where I'm from. Oddly, before they cut the trees down they used the same excuse. But prior to cutting the trees down, guess where the gaps from erosion were at? Yes, the areas that were treeless.

[WriteDown]

20. I used to work as a concrete laborer in my teens...

Back when you could find those kind of jobs. Rebar is put in the concrete after its set and doesn't move. Once concrete is set though, it can fissure fairly easily when something is driven into it such as a persistent tree root.

[WriteDown]

21. Dupe

[Botany]

5. It has to be done

The levees are built of earth and the roots of the trees can grow into that earth .....

Say you have high water and winds and the tree falls over and pulls up a big hunk of the earth from the levee ....
then you have a weak point on the levee with major water pressure on the other side of the levee.

[PaulaFarrell]

19. deforestation

it's well known deforestation is one of the prime causes of mudslides. trees roots stabilize soil, not vice versa

[Botany]

23. There is a big difference between natural forests and man made structures

In many cases having trees in areas that flood normally over the course of year (Flat woods, Wetlands, and flood plains) is
very much needed. Trees and vegetation along streams and river banks are good too but I can understand the need to remove
trees from levees too. A large cottonwood with roots deep into an earthen levee being blown over in a storm / high water event
has the potential to cause the failure of the levee.

Don't get me wrong vegetation is critical in helping to control floods, storm surges, erosion, and pollution those are facts.


BTW we need an integrated ecologically and hydrology based system to handle floods ..... natural flood plains, proper storm water
management, prairies, forests, marshes, and smart levees* are all needed.


* In many cases levees just send the flood down stream.

[BeFree]

6. Corps of dumbasses

When you find severely eroded river banks you find a lack of woody vegetation. Tree roots keep erosion to a minimum.

All the levys that failed had no woody vegetation.

This idea is as ass backwards as any I have ever seen. Idiots.

[MadMaddie]

7. I was thinking the same thing

In WA state we had a lot of mudslides the big paper company Weyerhauser cut down thousands of trees on large mountains and hills, they destroyed the root system and all the vegetation and guess what we had massive mudslides.....

The Corp is asking for more trouble....

[BeFree]

9. The corps..

...hates anything natural. They actually think they can do better than nature.

Mudslides are just another example of the benefits of natural woody growth.

[CEShooter]

8. Pot calling the kettle black..

When the COE builds a levee, they typically have very tight guidelines as to what type of soil can be used. In the upper midwest that material is typically a heavy clay. When the material is placed, it is compacted to a specific density with multiple passes of heavy equipment rollers in order to make the dike as impervious and dense as possible. When you are looking at the eroding river banks you are looking at a completely different type of soil and one that is most likely not even close to being as dense as a clay dike. Plus, why in the world would you want to introduce or maintain a constantly changing variable (the size, depth, and density) of the trees root system in a protective structure that is designed around known and constant parameters such as a dike?

[BeFree]

11. Yeah

Dikes are real successful. Ask New Orleans. And last year there were how many busted dikes? How many had trees on them at the busted areas?

You will see, this program will result in more failures and the corps will just go on screwing up nature just as it always has.

[kiranon]

10. Predict that future studies will show that removal of the trees will be a significant

reason for the levees to fail. The Corps does not have a good record for doing the right thing when it works with levees or building breakwaters.

[ro1942]

12. army corps

can anyone name one thing they did that turned out good?

[Strong Atheist]

24. Belated Welcome to DU!

:toast:

[webDude]

13. Ever see soil liquefaction? I have seen plenty of banks...

... that have shifted into the water due to no constraining tree roots. The argument is not valid.

On edit: I knew I was forgetting something. I live in Houston. They have levees that they put the dredge from the Houston Ship Channel into. They are about 40-50 feet high. Once, they started to "neaten" things up by thwacking down all vegetation, save grass. A lot of trees were felled. They have since had to re-fortify several places that have shifted from soil liquefaction. Did not have anywhere near that problem before, and looked a lot better.

[Jack_DeLeon]

15. IMO it would be better to keep the trees...

and have the people move if they so choose.

[Nihil]

18. No fair making a sensible reply!

Those people have the *right* to be stupid and stay on a flood plain dammit!

[burrowowl]

16. K&R

Should keep the trees!

"The corps' new edict was regarded as a major change in policy," said Ronald Stork, senior policy expert with California Friends of the River in Sacramento. "Something that is cheap and inexpensive is a chain saw. It was something to do that didn't cost a lot of money that made you feel better."

Shouldn't be to feel better, but be sensible, trees absorb water, slow down run-off, breath in Co2, provide habitat for animals, etc. Cut tem down so we can see "terraists" better!?

[mackerel]

17. Reverse thinking always gives way. Trees are actually

more useful along riverbanks and levees.

[WriteDown]

22. Anyone who's had a tree affect the foundation of their house...

may get a good guffaw out of some of these posts. :)

[Botany]

25. or anybody who works with trees and nature too

[HardWorkingDem]

26. No one is disputing some aspects of this thinking, but...

there are better ways to deal with these issues.

Not only that, what is going to happen when the tree roots start to rot and shrivel? These areas will allow new areas for water to cause erosion problems.

And a foundation to a house is much different than that of a levee. I assume some are having a good guffaw on you for your post.

[EndersDame]

27. One of the Jokes about belonging to the Environmental Corps was :

The constant chainsawing of trees. Sometimes yeah it is good we buzzed down alot of Ash Junipers that were invasive and killing the trees that provided homes to the endangered Golden Warblers.

[LeftHander]

28. Check the logging companies....who owns them....nt

[LeftyMom]

29. Valley Oaks are already threatened by Sudden Oak Death.

Cutting down healthy ones is a very bad idea.

The ACOE are incompetent assholes bent on CYA, not proper protection.

[KamaAina]

30. "Unwanted woody vegetation"

gotta be right up there with "food insecurity" for hunger. :eyes: