Jesus Could Have Walked on Ice, Scientist Says

[Tab]

Well, with global warming, this won't be happening again.

I wonder if the fundies realize that by denying global warming, they're preventing Jesus from returning?

Rare conditions could have conspired to create hard-to-see ice on the Sea of Galilee that a person could have walked on back when Jesus is said to have walked on water, a scientist said today.

The study, which examines a combination of favorable water and environmental conditions, proposes that Jesus could have walked on an isolated patch of floating ice on what is now known as Lake Kinneret in northern Israel.

Looking at temperature records of the Mediterranean Sea surface and using analytical ice and statistical models, scientists considered a small section of the cold freshwater surface of the lake. The area studied, about 10,000 square feet, was near salty springs that empty into it.

The results suggest temperatures dropped to 25 degrees Fahrenheit (-4 degrees Celsius) during one of the two cold periods 2,500 –1,500 years ago for up to two days, the same decades during which Jesus lived.

With such conditions, a floating patch of ice could develop above the plumes resulting from the salty springs along the lake's western shore in Tabgha. Tabgha is the town where many archeological findings related to Jesus have been found.
...
Nof figures that in the last 120 centuries, the odds of such conditions on the low latitude Lake Kinneret are most likely 1-in-1,000. But during the time period when Jesus lived, such “spring ice” may have formed once every 30 to 60 years.

Such floating ice in the unfrozen waters of the lake would be hard to spot, especially if rain had smoothed its surface.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/space/20060404/sc_space/jesuscouldhavewalkedonicescientistsays

[Xeric]

1. global warming Jesus

Jesus won't be walking. He'll be riding six white horses when he comes.
I think it says that in Revelation.
Maybe I'm thinking of someone else.

[Thor_MN]

6. Jesus has six butts?

That kinda ruins that whole "in his image" thing dosen't it? Or is that that Jesus so fat, when he rides horses, he needs six of them?

[Xeric]

14. I'm not sure

Are you asking if he has six literal butts or if they are metaphorical butts? I'm not good with these difficult theological questions. I'll leave it up to each believer to decide.

[kestrel91316]

43. Maybe we should debate how many cheeks can dance on

Jesus' derriere????

You know - like angels and heads of pins?

[Thor_MN]

79. Well, if he's going to be riding six horses...

Or is the six horses some kind of pony express relay system? Maybe he's going to be trick riding, leapng from horse to horse?

Dang, these literal interpretations get messy...

[htuttle]

19. "THAT WOULD BE AN ECUMENICAL MATTER!"

YES!

[Ignis]

36. GIRLS! DRINK!

Spot on. :)

[htuttle]

37. FECK! ARSE!!

KNICKERS!

[Nickster]

51. LoL, haven't heard that in awhile. FECK! ARSE! n/t

[Bridget Burke]

63. Among the posters used to protest Bush's Irish visit....

http://adamnieman.co.uk/posters/

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

34. I beleave it's call a

Mustang Six Pack!

[Make7]

28. He'll be coming round the mountain, when he comes?

<...cue music...>

He'll be driving six white horses, when he comes
He'll be driving six white horses, when he comes
He'll be driving six white horses
He'll be driving six white horses
He'll be driving six white horses, when he comes

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

49. Silliest Subthread Evarrr.

And now I'll have that damn song in my head all day. Earworm!

But it's not from the Book of Revelation. It's from the Book of Tarnation. Yee-ha!

[Teaser]

2. Why do scientists waste time with this

The story in the New Testament is a MIRACLE story. Either you believe it or you don't.

Of course it's possible that Christ was walking on ice (although you'd think he'd have mentioned it to his disciples -"Damn, Peter, my feet are COLD."). It's also possible that it's just a story. or that it's a real miracle (although most would probably exclude this possibility).

I can probably explain the parting of the red sea using force fields and the sun standing still with a change in the refractive index of the atmosphere. ugh.

[joeybee12]

3. After reading the article, I don't think the scientists were trying to

prove or disprove the story--they were just studying climate effects on that lake, and the person who wrote it saw the hook for the story.

[ronnie624]

54. I believe you are correct.

"We simply explain that unique freezing processes probably happened in that region only a handful of times during the last 12,000 years," said Doron Nof, a Florida State University Professor of Oceanography. "We leave to others the question of whether or not our research explains the biblical account."

A quick google search revealed two websites maintained by Florida State University, both featuring Doron Nof, the Professor of Oceanography quoted in the article, and of course there was no mention of Jesus on either site. This silly, deceitful article is an example of how the corporate media maintains their "matrix", the purpose of which is to divert attention from important issues.

[Tab]

4. Given that he was a carpenter

maybe he was just surfing on a sheet of plywood...

Of course, staying balanced on a sheet of wet ice (presumably, if it was floating, it was covered with a thin film of water) is no mean feat either - that would be a miracle in itself.







* Yes, I know there was no plywood back then.

[realisticphish]

5. nope

he was a tekton, Greek for "odd jobs guy," basically, not a carpenter ;)

[Tab]

9. I thought he was a son of a carpenter

but wasn't exactly sure, so I checked before I posted. A few sites listed him as a carpenter, so I went with that.

At any rate...

[realisticphish]

joseph was a tekton

at least that's what the earliest versions of the bible, in greek, say. But there I go again, fucking up jokes ;)

[blockhead]

21. If he was surfing on plywood,

don't you think that would be mentioned in the book of 'Dude-eronomy'?

[knight_of_the_star]

46. ROFL

This Californian is loving the reference lol!

[MountainLaurel]

67. Dude-eronomy

:spray:

[bananas]

7. A priest, a rabbi, and an atheist go fishing ...

[electropop]

8. Wouldn't the spring water be warmer and have a lower freezing point?

Groundwater would have a temperature more like the local average, presumably above freezing. Plus, the slat lowers the freezing point (this is why you put salt on your icy sidewalk).

[Tab]

12. I think the concept was

that the ice was formed elsewhere and was, in fact, a slab of ice.

But at the springs, where there's a higher concentration of salt, it has a lower freezing point. In this case, it means that the water around the springs can be below the normal freezing point of water (0 deg centigrade) and still be liquid.

Therefore, a slab of ice formed elsewhere could float into the extra-salty water, giving a block of ice in an environment otherwise liquid.

But it would seem to me that if it were to appear to be walking on water, then the ice would have to be at or slightly below (with the weight of Jesus on it) the surface level, so all the onlookers aren't saying "Hey, he's not walking on water - that's ice! It's a trick!". And if it's at or slightly below the surface, it's going to be wicked slippery, meaning just keeping your balance would be a miracle in and of itself (although maybe it was a big thick, though submerged, block of ice).

But I could see how you could have ice floating in salt water like that, if it was formed outside of the intense salt water area.

[electropop]

15. Ah, got it.

[eShirl]

10. In my experience it has to be a lot colder or a lot longer

than 25 degrees for two days to form ice thick enough to bear the weight of a walking human.

[FloridaPat]

11. More crap. Anyone every try to walk on ice on a lake? It has to be

rather thick. Floating ice tends to tip when you try to get on it. If it was under water it was slipperly as ice is known for. If it was big enough and on top of the water to walk on it wasn't invisible. Some of these people should actually try these things before they go around writing about them.

[theobscure]

13. why doesn't the scientist just tell people to go read

"The Age of Reason" by Thomas Paine. Maybe he needs to read it himself. He wouldn't have to waste time doing pointless research then.

[TrogL]

16. Jesus could have levitated

There's plenty of reports of levitation over the millenia in various cultures - just nothing recent.

[NIGHT TRIPPER]

39. some reptilians wouldn't buy that

just being sarcastic!
not serious-
-I'm sure levitation is no less possible than a plane flying--
but try and tell that to someone in 1899-
-(or tell that to someone who's partying like it's 1899!--sarcasm again--sorry)]

peace-

[bee]

53. Dont forget David Blaine. n/t

[GregW]

17. Oh, pulease - he just knew where the sandbar was

and how could he walk on water with holes in his feet!

Oh wait, that was later :eyes:

[kestrel91316]

44. Oh, bad you!

[GoddessOfGuinness]

18. I thought he used water skis.

[htuttle]

20. And this is more likely than the story just being made up, why?

?

I'm reminded of Velikovsky's explanation of the parting of the Red Sea (a close pass by an out-of-control Venus...).

[NashVegas]

27. Some People Are Desperate for External Proof of Jebus' Existence

Their faith is slipping in the face of so many doubters.

[no name no slogan]

68. Not so. Everybody knows that was Xenu-related (nt)

[donco6]

22. Well, that'd have been kinda shitty of him.

"Hey guys, look! I'm 'walkin' on water'! Yee haw."

"Uh, Jesus, that's just ice. You're walking on ice."

"No I'm not! Teehee. It's a MIRacle!"

"No, no, it's just ice. It's not a miracle, and you're making these guys in the boat really freak out. Peter, Peter, sit down, dude."

Peter walks out of the boat and almost drowns.

"Jesus, man, that is NOT cool. What are you thinking?"

"jus havin' a little fun - it's cool. Chill."

Pfft.

[bliss_eternal]

23. LMAO--ROFL!!! Hahahahahahaha....

:spray: Oh...oh...can't breathe...laughing...too hard. :spray: :rofl:

:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

[Der Blaue Engel]

42. "Jesus, man, that is NOT cool. What are you thinking?"

:rofl: I'm with bliss_eternal rolling on the floor trying to breathe! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Thor_MN]

81. Superman, you are one mean drunk...

[DanCa]

24. Well

Spiderman could walk up walls and Superman could fly. I guess Jesus could walk on water cause he's a super kind of guy. If anyone knows where I heard that one from please let me know. It's been running around my head since this thread first popped up.

[tatertop]

57. Is that from Bad Bad Leroy Brown?

Sounds like Jim Croce to meeeeeeeeeeee.

[DanCa]

59. I honestly have no clue.

That ear worm has been bugging me since I first read this thread. And now it's started in my ear again this after noon.

[mike_c]

25. occam's razor-- it's just a myth, it never happened....

Somebody made it up.

I mean, Jesus might have stayed up all night building a subsurface bouyancy controlled pontoon bridge, too, but I think it's more likely that somebody's retelling just got a little out of hand.

[PassingFair]

26. Apollo could have used an ELECTRIC CHARIOT! ...n/t

[bliss_eternal]

29. Isn't this a contradiction in terms...?

A "scientist" said something about "Jesus"?

[boobooday]

30. But could he do a double sowkow

or a triple lutz?

What would Brian Boytano do?

[kestrel91316]

45. (Um, I think that's "double Salchow")>>>>>>>>k shutting up now.......

[anotherdrew]

31. perhaps the FSM lowered a couple noodley tendrils and lifted him along

we KNOW the flying spaghetti monster can fly - or why else would it be called that?

[Retrograde]

32. not much of a miracle, then

I can walk on ice. At least until I slip, lose my balance and fall! Guess I'm not cut out to be diety.

As someone pointed out earlier, ice has to be rather thick to be able to walk on it. 25F doesn't seem to cut it, IIRC, unless its for several days in a row.

[superconnected]

33. I like the version where if you do actual bible study

you find out it was just a story added in the 600's and has metaphorical value.

Very little is actually known of Jesus. They have Pauls letters and supposedly a book of saying existed that are referred to as Q., and histories written from the 600's.

Since the walk on water, birth from a virgin, etc, are all recognized as added centurys later and remaining because of metaphorical value, I wouldn't dwell on it like it's fact.

Btw, at the time, the historians wrote a lot of fictious historys - for ceaser ect. It was common because so little was known of famous people whos names were past down. The higher scholars okayed the stories and they were put in to make up for gaps in history.

Originally the bible is considered an oral tradition. The new testament books are dated for between 60 and 80 years after Jesus' death.

Pauls letters - which he wrote to the Christian churches he and the diciples founded, and which make up half of the books of the new testament, are considered the most accurate accounts, and even then they are suspected of being tampered with.

Revelations - which some regard as Johns I had a dream speech, is also regarded by many scholars as written by another person than the apostle John, and is regarded as being about the fall of Rome, or another city, by many scholars. Not the fundy apoclypse it gets interpreted as today. You would also be hard pressed to figure out WHY the fundys intepret it that way, as it's vague and rarely mentions what they are saying. Ie Satan getting thrown out of hell with 1/3rd of the Angels - isn't there.

Another thing I want to mention is that in the old testament, Heaven doesn't show up until nearly the end. The beliefs were to live life as a good person and not for some after life reward.

Many Biblical scholars believe Jesus had credibility because he was a non-apocalyptic Christ. There were many people claiming to be the prophet from God before and after Christ existed - Including Mohammed. But they were nearly always apocalypse spreaders. The Old testament predicted that a Christ was coming - by the prophets Issiah, etc. They said he would not say he was the Christ, and in the new testament the wording often has Jesus asked if he is the Christ and him replying what do you think, what have you heard etc. instead of affirming.

Many biblical scholars believe it is highly unlike he Ever said he was the "son" of God, in any sense as being more the son than any one else would be.

Anyway, the Jews are still waiting for Christ to come. I don't care what religion you pick, someone will kill someone over it.

[woo me with science]

35. My brother suggested this when he was four. nt

[leesa]

38. Or he could have done nothing but had foolish sycophants like the ones

currently idolizing the boob in the White House turning his every move into a miracle.

[rooboy]

40. Or maybe someone just sent Bill Frist a video of Jesus swimming...

and the good senator proclaimed him to be walking on water??

[kestrel91316]

41. I don't suppose this rocket scientist ever considered the possibility

that Jesus "walking on water" is a MYTH???

[NVMojo]

47. Thanks for posting! I can't wait to share this!

[obreaslan]

48. Next up, proving the science behind a frog turning into a prince....

When kissed by a princess. More useless crap on the way.

[BiggJawn]

50. They were in a boat, and the sea was rough.

The men in the boat were fearful, and Jeebus got out and took a walk to show them it was OK, no worries, mate! In fact, "why not step out and join me?"

How does agitated water freeze?

[lavenderdiva]

58. this was my EXACT thought when I read the OP's headline for this thread...

the water was rough, and the men in the boat were scared. doesn't sound like conditions for ice to me.

[BiggJawn]

60. Maybe he jumped out and was riding an Iceberg?

Or jumping around on "pancake" ice?

The article is stretching it worse that the ID-iots stretch it.

[lavenderdiva]

62. well, He was known for His miracles...

and I guess anything is possible. However, the 'miracle' of icebergs in the Sea of Galilee was one that didn't make it into the New Testament! And, it sounds like that would have been a pretty good miracle, so I don't think they would have left it out. What it really sounds like to me, is that these 'scientists' haven't read the Scriptures concerning Jesus' miracle of walking on water, and the conditions that were going on at the time, according to those who wrote about it. :hi:

[BiggJawn]

65. Sure seems that way, don't it?

funny how an "evil old Atheist" would know that, isn't it? :evilgrin:

[Tabnoom]

76. There is always this version....

[Javaman]

52. Jesus starts his own hockey team...

"Jesus drives forward, moves to the left, sees his shot...SHOOTS!! SCORES!!!"

This thread is just sooooo ripe for jokes and satire.

I wrote a comic strip years ago called Aquaphobic Jesus. Afraid of water, he begs is Dad (god) to help him out. Jesus, portrayed as an ungrateful child, gets his wish. God gives him the ability to walk on water...all water. Needless to say, Jesus winds up smelling because he sits on top of the water in his bathtub.

Now wouldn't the real title of the above mentioned article, actually read, "Jesus slides on water"? I don't know about you, but unless you have ice cleats on, you won't be walking on ice.

Or perhaps, figure skating Jesus. I could just see it now, Jesus in his long robe throwing a triple spin. Now that is something I would pay to watch.

And given the fact that he was wearing sandles, wouldn't his feet be really cold? If that ice was subsurface, that water would be freezing. Talk about blue toes.

Shall I continue? I think I'm suddenly inspired for a new comic. LOL

[Lilith Velkor]

71. Charlie don't surf, but Jesus waterskis!

[LeftHander]

55. sandbar....nt

[gasperc]

56. yes but it was God that made the temperature drop

As a Catholic(liberal by all means, feed the poor, clothe the naked, old school) it's seems totally plausible that is was ice that Jesus actually walked on.

So the big question is of course is, was it God that created the conditions for Jesus, or was Jesus, in his infinite wisdom, able to see that ice had formed and thusly walked on water. And again, as a Catholic, I mean this in no way to sound like I think Jesus was a charloten. but I lean to my faith, God created the conditions for Jesus.

[fshrink]

61. Who?

[Bridget Burke]

64. Yes, let's talk about the miracles....

Many of which were adapted from stories found in the mystery religions so popular during the early Empire.

Concentrating on what Jesus (or other teachers conflated with him) said is a bit too subversive. Still.

[OKIsItJustMe]

66. Explaining "Miracles"

I'm often amused by people's efforts to explain the miracles recorded in the Bible. They say, for example, "Well, Jesus could have been walking on ice."

I don't think this rationalization holds up with the rest of the description in the story. Matthew says that the boat was "battered by the waves."

How much easier is it to just say, "It's a story." Then you can ask, "Why did the author of Matthew choose to include this story? What was the author trying to tell us about Jesus? about Peter's attempt to walk on the water? about the other disciples who remained in the boat?"

[Miss Chybil]

69. Ah, geez, Jeez. They're revealing all the tricks.

Maybe, you can still get a job in Vegas with the water and wine thing?

(Just a little joke. Amen.)

[Solly Mack]

70. Yeah? Think that's something? I can skate on ice

Just saying....

[Chovexani]

72. But could he land a Quad Axel in competition?

:P

[Bucky]

73. Maybe it was ice. or maybe he was wearing these things...!

[Rex]

74. So Jesus used elemental powers to freeze the water?

Or just happen to know exactly what year, month, day to be there at the lake?

[superconnected]

75. Show biz - it's all about timing.

Christ would have known that. Few well timed magic tricks and bam, famous for generations.

[SoCalDem]

77. BFD... I walk on concrete, asphalt, grass, you name it..

I am a multi-tasker...worship ME !

[OutsidetheBox]

78. BREAKING: Jesus broke bread, then broke wind 2000 years ago

[Buck Laser]

80. windbreaker

So Jesus farted. It happens