I don't think there is a single poster on DU who "hates" Obama

[Very_Boring_Name]

Apart from freeper spies or trolls, of course. I keep hearing this phrase, "Obama hater". This implies that I am critical of Obama, simply because he is Obama, rather than because of what he is doing. Firstly, I don't hate Obama. I supported him in 2008, and I will support him again in 2012. Yet I'm still called an Obama hater when I am critical of Obama for doing exactly the same things that I was critical of Bush for doing, and am told to support the president or risk President Palin in 2012. So let me clear a few things up:

-I would be against the treatment of Bradley Manning even if President Palin were in charge
-I would be against the continuing wars in Iraq and Afghanistan even if President Palin were in charge
-I would be for the public option/universal healthcare even if President Palin were in charge
-I would be against extending tax cuts for the wealthy even if President Palin were in charge
-I would still be against signing in a Patriot Act extension even if President Palin were in charge
-etc

[rfranklin]

1. I agree...

It seems you can't have any criticisms of President Obama without a horde of people accusing you of wanting to elect Republicans. Many of us here thought we were getting an FDR type of president, instead we got a Bill Clinton type of triangulator.

[Name removed]

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[Vinca]

3. I am very critical of Mr. Obama, but I do not hate him.

It's absurd to think that just because left-leaning people expect Democrats to uphold Democratic principles they are "haters." Quite honestly, it's offensive.

[Badfish]

5. explain the outright lies they post to slander the President.

[Very_Boring_Name]

7. Example of outright lies used to slander him?

[Dawgs]

11. +1. Which "lies"?

:shrug:

[Denzil_DC]

32. Disingenuous

That would be classed as a call-out, and the mods would no doubt step in.

[Badfish]

33. Like claiming the nation is not in a recovery.

Claiming losing 700,000 jobs a month is BETTER than gaining 200,000 a month ...cause when asked if the job market is heading in the right direction and recovering , they say NO.

Only a fucking idiot would claim the nation is not in a recovery.

When I post the usual indicators of a recovery , they tell me I can't look at those.

Obama is torturing Manning ? ...give me a break

[w4rma]

12. Examples. At least one example. Lies tend to get deleted, around here. (nt)

[BlueJazz]

6. What She said.

[connecticut yankee]

4. I don't hate the President

but I am very disappointed in him.

[Shiver]

8. Some days, I'm not so sure.

There do seem to be several people, and I won't name names, but they seem to revel in any negative story they can find, and are conspicuously absent whenever something positive comes up, or the negative is refuted.

[ClassWarrior]

18. Of course there are several people. They were addressed in the OP.

There are several people playing the other side of the fence as well.

NGU.

[NoTimeToulouse]

20. To the converse of that suggestion one could say that there is a

contingent of posters who are only on DU to revel in Obama in all ways positive.

[DrDan]

9. I agree - it is the same game the RWers play - "why do you hate our country?"

when no one hates the U.S. Some of the policies, perhaps. or a few bat-s**t crazy politicians. But no the U.S.

When I get that argument, I always ask "Are your kids perfect?" "Do you see improvement areas in your kids?" "Do you hate them?" Recognizing areas of improvement is not the same as "hating". It is simply naive and juvenile to think it is.

[Name removed]

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[TBF]

13. Agreed, I worked on his campaign. Have become very disillusioned in the three

years that I have been paying attention to politics again. It's true that Obama isn't doing much for workers, but I don't see anyone else in that role doing anything either. I'm convinced it's systemic and the capitalism has to go.

[Bluerthanblue]

14. hate is a subjective word. There are people on this board

who have a dislike for Pres. Obama that began before he even took office.

[Bluenorthwest]

16. And yet the President openly opposes equal rights and still

the ardents flinch if his homophobia is pointed out to them, and they demand that others honor his bigotry. If we stand up for our own damn civil rights, they call us haters, although he is the one holding prejudice and willing that prejudice to be born out in civil law, it is he who claims some people are Sanctified by God and that other groups are not, and that this unprovable sanctity should be the standard for who is allowed basic human rights and who is not.
Does it strike you as odd that the side of the argument that is against the rights of the other is coddled kindly, and the side that is simply asking for equal treatment under the law is called 'haters'? I find that to be flat out dishonest, a bizzaro, opposite sort of lexicon, in which love is called hate, and contempt is called 'faith'. Please explain how you work that our for yourself, to call the oppressed haters.

[Bluerthanblue]

76. I don't hate people I disagree with.

pity yes sometimes, but hate? no. I don't hate people who hurt me, or judge me less than themselves.

You ask how I work out calling the oppressed haters? I don't have to. Hatred is like cancer. It destroys.

"Hatred cannot drive out hatred" said a man who knew oppression all too well.

peace~

[Beam Me Up]

15. What I "hate" is that Obama is a puppet of the people and corporations that own and rule America

It has nothing to do with the man himself. I understand fully that he is where he is because he is beholding to forces beyond his control and I understand that his being an intelligent and articulate black man is supposed to dissuade me from a class analysis of our situation. On me it isn't working. The central problem we face is structural. We no longer live in a working Democracy and politics as usual can not extricate us from this situation. Now, if you could get a couple hundred thousand people or (preferably) more in EVERY state of the union to put their collective feet down and risk arrest through civil disobedience, we might begin to see some needed changes. Without that, its gona be the same old dog and pony show. Who do you vote for, the pony or the dog? Either one has the same master.

[travelingtypist]

17. That's a critical difference btwn us and them.

The double-standard of the RWnuts knows no bounds.

[Name removed]

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[Johnny_dollar]

21. Maximum Amens! n/t

[treestar]

22. But not accepting reality makes one look like a hater.

Like the public option could not go through. You can argue about it, but blaming Obama alone is stupid.

Obama was and still is for the public option. It's that it didn't go through the Senate. People look like haters when they refuse to deal with that.

As to Manning, no one knows what they are talking about. No one complained of the procedures in question before. And it's silly to claim our country should never have classified information, or to fail to accept that it is against the law to leak it. This Manning stuff makes me crazy. Does no one care about this country's security at all? It makes us look like the right wing is correct about us.

[Very_Boring_Name]

24. You got your basic facts wrong

Harkin said the public option had the votes to pass, it just would have taken some arm twisting. Instead, the Obama administration http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/10/24/leaderless-senate-pushes_n_332844.html">Lobbied against it behind closed doors

And as for Manning, you're missing the point. Does no one care about this country's security at all?: How does sleep deprivation, random naked spot checks, and suicide watch being used punitively, protect the security of the country?

[Badfish]

38. "Harkin said the public option had the votes to pass"

Ya , he is counting Baucus and hacks like him.

Baucus voted TWICE against a PO in his own committee , but Harkin counts him in ?

Nice try.

[ReggieVeggie]

69. correction: your version of reality

[Deep13]

23. But she isn't. nt

[BklnDem75]

25. It would really help your argument if you didn't use the term yourself

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=575797&mesg_id=576180

[Very_Boring_Name]

26. I didn't target anybody on DU as a "clinton hater"

Context is important.

[BklnDem75]

27. Your statement was broad

It targeted many

[Very_Boring_Name]

28. Broad statement made by 1 member, vs specific statement used several thousand times each week

Not to mention the fact that Clinton isn't president.

[BklnDem75]

29. Hardly one member

I only gave one example because it's your OP. Saying Obama supports dictators doesn't seem like a term of endearment either. Guess what? It's a message board. Hate and dislike has been used interchangeably long before Obama. Why so literal?

[Name removed]

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[jefferson_dem]

31. Uh-oh...

Busted. Thanks.

[great white snark]

44. Oops!

Glass houses and all that....

[jefferson_dem]

30. Not sure about the hate thing... I can't read a person's heart.

That being said, I do see hateful, unfair opinions expressed about this President on DU, on a fairly routine basis.

Here's an idea: Let's all work extra hard so you don't have to be against those things with a President Palin, or Romney, or Huckabee...

[great white snark]

43. "Let's all work extra hard so you don't have to be against those things with a President Palin"

:applause:

[jefferson_dem]

50. Hi great white snark!

:hi:

Thanks for the shout-out. :)

[craigmatic]

34. There isn't we just want him to fight.

[dionysus]

35. LOL, oh there's certainly some. that's not saying it's all or even a sizeable number of critics, but

there are certainly some.

[Autumn]

36. I don't hate him. I never will.

Since he took office I don't like him and I don't have to like him. To me, he has been a disappointment.I console myself with the indisputable fact he is 100 times better that the alternative.

I remain against

the treatment of Bradley Manning and the going after whistle blowers.
-I am against the continuing wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. By the way, 10 soldiers died in Iraq yesterday.
-I am for the public option/universal health care that Obama traded away in a back room deal.
-I am against extending tax cuts for the wealthy.'
-I am against balancing the budget on the backs of the poor and the elderly.
-I will always be against renewing the Patriot Act.

All I have to do is vote for him. That's it

[Name removed]

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[superduperfarleft]

39. LOL. Sure. n/t

[ReturnoftheDjedi]

40. can't handle the truth?

[superduperfarleft]

42. Yes, that's it.

:rofl:

[vaberella]

45. I don't see what the big deal is if people admit to it.

When people go as far as to use right wing talking points to misinterpret (and later found to be wrong) some of his policies. I think we can expect a sense of dislike---that they will go to any lengths to be angry at him. I have some issues with him myself. While as a candidate I was always critical of his position on the war. Now, I'm not so sure, but still a concern. And his position on off-shore drilling is not something I like at all. So I won't go on straight love for the man. However, I've seen people who ONLY criticize and see nothing good in his actions---even when actions are hailed by many on the LEFT as a good thing.

[superduperfarleft]

46. I think there's a huge difference between attitudes towards Obama

and the attitudes towards other posters here. Seems to me that both camps have more of an issue with each other than they do with Obama.

[vaberella]

52. Nope...the issue stems from Obama. Don't throw Obama in the mix and we're good. n/t

[ClassWarrior]

77. How right you are. Of course, there are some Dems who...

...are such devoted supporters that they refuse to see it.

NGU.

[vaberella]

41. No, there are a few. There were many before the elections and some are still around.

No one is expected to like everyone. And I'm sure on DU, he has a few people who really dislike him.

[ProSense]

47. "I don't think there is a single poster on DU who 'hates' Obama "

Some just spend all day comparing him to Bush and implying that he might be worse because they didn't hate Bush either. Really? By that logic, does that mean they would support Bush too? Oh, and don't overlook the less than endearing adjectives.

There are those who didn't vote for him in 2008 because they can't stand him. So the "single poster" claim isn't accurate.

-I would be against the treatment of Bradley Manning even if President Palin were in charge
-I would be against the continuing wars in Iraq and Afghanistan even if President Palin were in charge
-I would be for the public option/universal healthcare even if President Palin were in charge
-I would be against extending tax cuts for the wealthy even if President Palin were in charge
-I would still be against signing in a Patriot Act extension even if President Palin were in charge

Yeah, these are the things one would have to worry about if Palin were President. Seriously?

A public option?

Remember when Bush pushed health care reform?

[BklnDem75]

48. +1000

Excellent point

[CakeGrrl]

49. Wrong. You can't speak for everyone.

I'll say it again: The word "despise" has been used. Does that not rise to the level?

Some have said they now have the same sick reaction to hearing his voice as they did when Dubya spoke. People have openly expressed revulsion and disgust of him.

Maybe you missed those threads.

I wonder why there's some need to paint DU as a unilaterally well-intentioned, well-meaning place where everyone has only the most honorable of motivations? That's just not true of any group.

[Bluerthanblue]

54. you said it perfectly!

thank you for this.

:hi:

[Godhumor]

56. The worst I saw was

A poster calling him "Traitorous Scum".

That's not a response from someone open to "liking" this president.

[ClassWarrior]

71. I don't click on "those threads." Why give them attention they don't deserve?

:shrug:

NGU.

[27inCali]

51. I think a lot of people have made up their mind

and refuse to let it change.

[AtomicKitten]

55. Hate is easily discernible when the "criticism" is punctuated with vile recriminations.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[BlueRidgeProgressive]

59. I think some people may wonder why the President "hates" them.

I don't hate the President.

[Name removed]

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[creon]

61. disappointed

Disappointed? yes. hate ? No.

I am far more disappointed in the 111th Congress, especially, the Senate.

[Ramulux]

62. I think hate is appropriate

I dont know what other word to use to describe how I feel about a guy who is responsible for the deaths of dozens of women and children in Afghanistan.

Maybe if Obama wasn't such a war-monger and actually gave a shit about civilian deaths I would have a more positive opinion of the guy. But as of now, our military is just flat-out murdering people in the middle east with Obama's blessing. I literally don't understand how anyone could like the guy after everything he has done.

[CakeGrrl]

63. Blessing? Where do you even GET that?

You try stopping a couple of ongoing wars cold in their tracks, ZERO deaths, the day you take office. Otherwise, you're tagged as a hateful murderer if even ONE occurs on your presidential watch.

There doesn't seem to be much care to acknowledge the reality of the difficulty of bending global-scale events to one's will.

I really do wish there were some way that some of you could be teleported into the Oval Office with presidential powers and a "CiC-Cam" so we could be shown how it's done.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

65. He'll smash any mirror he's forced to look at.

[ClassWarrior]

80. So you've been in the Oval Office and "know how it's done?"

:eyes:

NGU.

[ProSense]

64. Hmmmm?

"I dont know what other word to use to describe how I feel about a guy who is responsible for the deaths of dozens of women and children in Afghanistan."

The Aghan war is tragic and needs to end. It was a war inherited by this President, and his administration is likely doing everything to limit civilian casualties.

When the attack on Afghanistan was approved by almost every member of Congress (including Kucinich) and launched by Bush, tens of thousands of Aghans lost their lives in the initial months.

<...>

The direct victims of American bombs and missiles have commanded most political and media attention, though no one is certain how many even of these there were.

A Guardian report in February estimated these casualties at between 1,300 and 8,000 deaths. A Guardian investigation into the "indirect victims" now confirms the belief of many aid agencies that they exceeded the number who died of direct hits.

As many as 20,000 Afghans may have lost their lives as an indirect consequence of the US intervention. They too belong in any tally of the dead.

The bombing had three main effects on the humanitarian situation. It caused massive dislocation by prompting hundreds of thousands of Afghans to flee from their homes.

<...>

It would be a good time to stop pretending that the "evil" President Obama simply took office and decided to start killing civilians. War is extremely ugly, but trying to label him as the most evil person ever over wars he inherited is absolutely bogus. It's not a sign of objectivity.

No one has any idea what anyone else would do as President, but one thing no one would have been able to do is end the wars without incurring more casualities. As the saying goes, one is too many. That's the nature of war.

[politicasista]

66. Some disrespect his allies and label them

as bought off, sell-out corporatists. (Just the ones who are actually liberal) JMO.

[mstinamotorcity]

67. Got what

you feelin!!!

[Clio the Leo]

68. No one need support the man but why would a supporter....

.... accept someone else's version of the facts as the gospel against his. I'm not saying his word should be the end of discussion, but it amuses me how we mock the right for swallowing what Fox news tells them whole cloth yet we do the same with Fire Dog Lake, or Ed Schultz, or .... whomever. Until my thread yesterday a whole lot of folks were still arguing that Manning was being forced to sleep nude when that was simply not the case (and I realize it's not just about that.)

Some are mocked for blindly following Obama and yet those that mock do the same with the press.

The death toll in Japan is expected to be as high as 10,000 before we're done. I enjoyed Rachel's show tonight.

[Name removed]

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[LaurenG]

70. There are certain posters in this thread that I don't even read anymore.

Not because I hate anyone but because I am sick to death of the trite bs being flung from all sides. Obama is a huge disappointment in some areas and has done well in others. Overall I just don't see that much hatefulness toward him. I do see rose colored glasses being handed out frequently by the same people over and over again. It gets really boring, really quickly to see both sides of this over and over again.

Obama is rarely going to give me what I want, I am too far left of him and that's because I've already migrated through this stage of the game years and years ago. In the meantime I'll wait for a Sanders or Kucinich to speak for me.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[genna]

74. I find myself feeling an extraordinary amount of disdain for Obama

I also feel extreme disappointment that he feels worse than Bill Clinton in defending basic Democratic ideals:

little guy laborer deserves protection from the monetary powerful

the people should not fear their government's intrusion into their lives (search and seizure, health care decisions, and civil rights)

the big guy should pay his fair share of taxes to support roads, schools, police, health and welfare, regulation

so on and so forth.


If no Nader shows up and the Supreme Court chooses to sit the next election out, I will probably vote for Obama again.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

75. i actually like both biden and obama. they seem nice enough.

i don't like a lot of their policy decisions.

[BlueIris]

78. I do not and never have hated Barack Obama.

But I feel he is doing any extraordinarily bad job.

[Imajika]

79. There are probably some that hate him...

Some people tend to lose sight of the big picture. Folks get bogged down in the weeds of specific polices or niche issues, they chose to stand and fight on those things and become extremely passionate about them - and when someone (Obama) they hoped would agree with them doesn't it can build feelings of rage and even hate.

This happens to people all the time. Families, friendships, etc, are destroyed by this thinking on a regular basis. Example of how it happens: let's say someone argues with you about some policy they insist Obama should be supporting but isn't, that person declares that Obama will lose if he doesn't support that policy because it is so important (at least to them it is), if the argument with you is intense enough, some part of that person may hope Obama loses to prove their point. They may come to hate Obama over it, and if he wins they may actually hate him more.

By and large you are right though. People are pretty savvy on a political forum like this. They know Obama is going to be better than the alternative. Almost everyone here will vote for Obama in 2012 despite some threats to the contrary.

I am one of those people that feel I have to defend the President. I think he's been, by and large, simply fantastic. I believe in the long run Obama will be viewed as one of our very best presidents. I understand people get frustrated with him and, quite frankly, a political forum is the place to argue about these things (even when I get frustrated) - but I have no doubt in the end 95% of the people here will support the President when the time comes.

[ClassWarrior]

81. Thank you for responding thoughtfully.

:hi:

NGU.

[mkultra]

82. ...and will admit it in the forum.

There. fixed.

[ClassWarrior]

84. Of course not. They're the handful pretending everyone else hates him.

NGU.

[Little Star]

85. I agree.

[Name removed]

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